523 réponses à ce sujet

[Bigdoser]

Ah I remeber david saying something like that if your hawke is normally diplomatic you will get special diplomatic options if your hawke is sarcastic most of the time you get charm and if you use intimidate tone you get intimidate options. If people are complaining about this it makes no sense because if someone is realisticly nice/diplomatic how would they be able to intimidate someone if they hardly ever do it? RPing wise I like this change.

[Dubya75]

BobSmith101 wrote...

Dubya75 wrote...

I can understand this, and yet we've only had the opportunity to have very short and somewhat insignificant conversations in the demo.
And as for people not reading the options when making a choice of response, one can only speak for oneself. Maybe most people will read the options and really think about how they want to respond.
The icons serve the purpose of allowing you to make sure you are choosing the intended tone of response. This is necessary because Hawke has a voice and will blurt something out you may not have expected.

It also means that Hawke is not your character. I know what I'm going to say before I say it. Even if the other party misunderstands the intent.

You only know what you're going to say based on the chioces presented to you, be it Origins, DA2 or ME2.
In DA2 these choices are presented to us differently, now its all dumbed down? I still fail to see it.

Modifié par Dubya75, 26 février 2011 - 06:36 .

[FieryDove]

TheCreeper wrote...

Personally I think the Demo was a bad idea because it locked out a bit too much and managed to convince a number of people on this forums that hawke's arrival in kirkwall is actually going to go down like it did in the demo

There is also the fact many fans saying the demo is months and months old and if true we have no way to know what's changed/improved/fixed now until the real deal arrives.

[Dubya75]

Bigdoser wrote...

Ah I remeber david saying something like that if your hawke is normally diplomatic you will get special diplomatic options if your hawke is sarcastic most of the time you get charm and if you use intimidate tone you get intimidate options. If people are complaining about this it makes no sense because if someone is realisticly nice/diplomatic how would they be able to intimidate someone if they hardly ever do it? RPing wise I like this change.

Thumbs up. 

[TheCreeper]

scootermcgaffin wrote...

It's simple: you see, Dragon Age 2 is not exactly the same as Dragon Age: Origins, therefore it is awful.

While that is the case with every game, this is even more extreme because DA2  does change things drastically in some respects compared to Origins.

[Archereon]

Bigdoser wrote...

Ah I remeber david saying something like that if your hawke is normally diplomatic you will get special diplomatic options if your hawke is sarcastic most of the time you get charm and if you use intimidate tone you get intimidate options. If people are complaining about this it makes no sense because if someone is realisticly nice/diplomatic how would they be able to intimidate someone if they hardly ever do it? RPing wise I like this change.

I dislike how it railroads us into taking a certain conversation path 99% of the time like in Mass Effect, or, assuming persuasion is as useful as it was in DA:O, suffering dire consequences.  The worst part is no visible meters, meaning we ABSOLUTELY have to go all the way with one path, since we can't be sure if we have enough "diplomatic/silly/aggressive" points.

[AlanC9]

Archereon wrote...
Gah!  That's even worse.  Now I can't be mean if I want to get the good ending...Either that or persuasion will be meaningless.

By "good ending," you mean the one where you succeeded at everything you tried? Or the most fun playthrough? Not at all the same thing.

[AkiKishi]

Dubya75 wrote...

You only know what you're going to say based on the chioces presented to you, be it Origins, DA2 or ME2.
In DA2 these choices are presented to us differently, now its all dumbed down? I still fail to see it.

In Orgins you have a full response in front of you. Now it may be taken the wrong way by the NPC but that does not matter.
In DA2 you have a key phrase and and an icon. You have to guess what the VO will be because there is no way to know in advance what the character will say.

You can't roleplay when you don't even know what your character is going to say before you say it. Sure you can choose, but making choices is not the same as roleplaying.

[AkiKishi]

TheCreeper wrote...

scootermcgaffin wrote...

It's simple: you see, Dragon Age 2 is not exactly the same as Dragon Age: Origins, therefore it is awful.

While that is the case with every game, this is even more extreme because DA2  does change things drastically in some respects compared to Origins.

I loved Killzone2 I love Killzone 3 even more. Why ?Because it improves on things, it does not simply dismiss what went before and start over.

Archereon wrote...
I dislike how it railroads us into taking a certain conversation path 99% of the time like in Mass Effect, or, assuming persuasion is as useful as it was in DA:O, suffering dire consequences.  The worst part is no visible meters, meaning we ABSOLUTELY have to go all the way with one path, since we can't be sure if we have enough "diplomatic/silly/aggressive" points.

On the brightside the option should not even show up for people who don't meet the requirements it won't be like ME's greyed out choices.

Modifié par BobSmith101, 26 février 2011 - 06:43 .

[The Elder King]

Archereon wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

Purgatious wrote...

Bigdoser wrote...

Arch how is the paragon and renegade system in da2? I don't see any bar or + paragon points or renegade when a conversation is over.

There isn't one.

Dave said diplomatic people will get more persuasion options. That means even if you can't see it, it's there.

For the love of...

Gah!  That's even worse.  Now I can't be mean if I want to get the good ending...Either that or persuasion will be meaningless.

It's not like he said. If you use most of the time the sarcastic options (even, for example, 2 sarcastic, 1 diplomatic and 1 aggressive, it was like that in the demo) you will have a sarcastic main personality, that can hel you in certain situation (it will give an additional dialogue line to resolve the dialogue). The same will be for the diplomatic and aggressive options.

[Purple People Eater]

It isnt dumbed down at all. Its just faster. When the full version comes out, and the ability to auto-attack can be used, I think it'll feel more similar than most people realize.

[JrayM16]

BobSmith101 wrote...

Dubya75 wrote...

You only know what you're going to say based on the chioces presented to you, be it Origins, DA2 or ME2.
In DA2 these choices are presented to us differently, now its all dumbed down? I still fail to see it.

In Orgins you have a full response in front of you. Now it may be taken the wrong way by the NPC but that does not matter.
In DA2 you have a key phrase and and an icon. You have to guess what the VO will be because there is no way to know in advance what the character will say.

You can't roleplay when you don't even know what your character is going to say before you say it. Sure you can choose, but making choices is not the same as roleplaying.

I see you subscribe to the 'Sylvius the Mad' theory of dialogue selection.  However, when an NPC "misinterprets" your intent, that's because the writers wrote that response with a tone for your selection in mind.  That's the idea.

[Archereon]

hhh89: I can live with that. But I'm still annoyed by the fact that I'll either have to wait for one of Hawke's variable dialogues to figure out her current persona, or count carefully.

[Dubya75]

r2dr wrote...


Amount of work put into level design. There's been a statement to the effect of how they're no longer focusing on creating beautiful backgrounds, and only focusing on the hacking and slashing in the foreground.

Please! That was coming from the marketing director. You really should not take anything coming out of his mouth seriously. Besides, we already know that's a load of hog-wash because the demo has already demonstrated otherwise.
Backgrounds and environments are visually striking and not at all secondary to the foreground.

[Bigdoser]

Archereon wrote...

Bigdoser wrote...

Ah I remeber david saying something like that if your hawke is normally diplomatic you will get special diplomatic options if your hawke is sarcastic most of the time you get charm and if you use intimidate tone you get intimidate options. If people are complaining about this it makes no sense because if someone is realisticly nice/diplomatic how would they be able to intimidate someone if they hardly ever do it? RPing wise I like this change.

I dislike how it railroads us into taking a certain conversation path 99% of the time like in Mass Effect, or, assuming persuasion is as useful as it was in DA:O, suffering dire consequences.  The worst part is no visible meters, meaning we ABSOLUTELY have to go all the way with one path, since we can't be sure if we have enough "diplomatic/silly/aggressive" points.

How do you know this will happen in DA2 if the game is not out yet? Have you seen the choices? have you seen the concequences how do you even know that we will need the persuasion options? So you want every single option avaible to you?

[The Elder King]

Archereon wrote...

Bigdoser wrote...

Ah I remeber david saying something like that if your hawke is normally diplomatic you will get special diplomatic options if your hawke is sarcastic most of the time you get charm and if you use intimidate tone you get intimidate options. If people are complaining about this it makes no sense because if someone is realisticly nice/diplomatic how would they be able to intimidate someone if they hardly ever do it? RPing wise I like this change.

I dislike how it railroads us into taking a certain conversation path 99% of the time like in Mass Effect, or, assuming persuasion is as useful as it was in DA:O, suffering dire consequences.  The worst part is no visible meters, meaning we ABSOLUTELY have to go all the way with one path, since we can't be sure if we have enough "diplomatic/silly/aggressive" points.

Itsi based on which option you use most, not of a bar. At least, this is how I understand it worked. At elast this worked for choosing the main personalitiy (I try this on the demo, choose 2 sarcastic, 1 diplomatic and 1 agggressive, I have a sarcastic personality), I think it willbe the same of the "persuasion" option.

[Bara Rockfall]

FieryDove wrote...

There is also the fact many fans saying the demo is months and months old and if true we have no way to know what's changed/improved/fixed now until the real deal arrives.

This is a very interesting statement.  Is the demo an old build?  This would have a large impact on the view of the game created by many players.  Did you get this from a dev?  Thanks. 

[Ziggeh]

Dubya75 wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

It also means that Hawke is not your character. I know what I'm going to say before I say it. Even if the other party misunderstands the intent.

You only know what you're going to say based on the chioces presented to you, be it Origins, DA2 or ME2.
In DA2 these choices are presented to us differently, now its all dumbed down? I still fail to see it.

I would say that it's not binary. That it's always a collaboration between the reader and author, even in something like a film. I would say that the voice and paraphrase lends somewhat more (or perhaps "different" would be a better term) control to the author than the DA:O system, but obviously it's not true they had none in origins.

[Archereon]

Bigdoser wrote...

Archereon wrote...

Bigdoser wrote...

Ah I remeber david saying something like that if your hawke is normally diplomatic you will get special diplomatic options if your hawke is sarcastic most of the time you get charm and if you use intimidate tone you get intimidate options. If people are complaining about this it makes no sense because if someone is realisticly nice/diplomatic how would they be able to intimidate someone if they hardly ever do it? RPing wise I like this change.

I dislike how it railroads us into taking a certain conversation path 99% of the time like in Mass Effect, or, assuming persuasion is as useful as it was in DA:O, suffering dire consequences.  The worst part is no visible meters, meaning we ABSOLUTELY have to go all the way with one path, since we can't be sure if we have enough "diplomatic/silly/aggressive" points.

How do you know this will happen in DA2 if the game is not out yet? Have you seen the choices? have you seen the concequences how do you even know that we will need the persuasion options? So you want every single option avaible to you?

I'd rather have my ability to influence NPCs be determined by something somewhat seperate from how the character acts, thank you very much.  If persuasion isn't important, then this is a moot point, but I'm assuming it is.

[Purple People Eater]

Bara Rockfall wrote...

FieryDove wrote...

There is also the fact many fans saying the demo is months and months old and if true we have no way to know what's changed/improved/fixed now until the real deal arrives.

This is a very interesting statement.  Is the demo an old build?  This would have a large impact on the view of the game created by many players.  Did you get this from a dev?  Thanks. 

Rumor is the demo build is as old as back in October. No I cant prove this, but ive read it in many places, in different threads. The Gamespot video from last week would go to helping prove this, as it looked more polished, and refined than the demo does.

[The Elder King]

Archereon wrote...

hhh89: I can live with that. But I'm still annoyed by the fact that I'll either have to wait for one of Hawke's variable dialogues to figure out her current persona, or count carefully.

You can check by the response Hawke will give without dialogue. For example, the phrase Hawke said when they meet Aveline, to choose where to go. But I believe that if you, for example, have first choose 7 diplomatic and 5 sarcastic, you'll have a diplomatic personality. If then after a while the full responses will be 11 diplomatic and 15 sarcastic, you'll have a sarcastic personality, and still have a persuasion bonus. But this is only my opinion, maube a dev could clarifiy that.

[LightningSamus]

Because they think the demo is the full game and were disapponted wha wha wha.



I'll be having fun in DA II while they sulk in a pool of their own tears.

[Archereon]

hhh89 wrote...

Archereon wrote...

hhh89: I can live with that. But I'm still annoyed by the fact that I'll either have to wait for one of Hawke's variable dialogues to figure out her current persona, or count carefully.

You can check by the response Hawke will give without dialogue. For example, the phrase Hawke said when they meet Aveline, to choose where to go. But I believe that if you, for example, have first choose 7 diplomatic and 5 sarcastic, you'll have a diplomatic personality. If then after a while the full responses will be 11 diplomatic and 15 sarcastic, you'll have a sarcastic personality, and still have a persuasion bonus. But this is only my opinion, maube a dev could clarifiy that.

That's exactly what I meant by "variable dialogue." 

[AkiKishi]

JrayM16 wrote...
I see you subscribe to the 'Sylvius the Mad' theory of dialogue selection.  However, when an NPC "misinterprets" your intent, that's because the writers wrote that response with a tone for your selection in mind.  That's the idea.

I don't mind misunderstandings, that's a part of life. Removing the ability to be misunderstood is just more dumbing down. What I do mind is not knowing what is coming out of MY characters mouth before MY character says it. Because if that is the case it's as clear as day thats not MY character but some pre-generated thing made by Bioware.