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Cloud Mind is an Exceptional Power


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#1
lessthanjake9

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Bards are certainly amongst the best classes in NWN2, especially when you are talking epic levels with Song/Hymn of Requiem. However, they have so many different types of powers (songs, inspirations, AND spells) that some of them get a bit lost by people, I think.

Cloud Mind is one of these powers. It really is one of the best powers in the game.

As you almost certainly know, the effect of Cloud Mind is to immobilize one enemy for 10 rounds (15 with lingering song). If you attack this enemy, the effect is broken, so obviously it doesn't really have much use against single enemies (though it WOULD give you time to buff in this case if the battle took you by surprise). However, against more than one enemy at once, Cloud Mind is very very useful as crowd control. Obviously fighting 2 enemies at once, followed by 1 more is A LOT easier to live through than 3 at once. This is very powerful, though not fundamentally different in effect from a Hold Monster spell. So why, then do I say it is one of the best powers in the game? A few reasons:

1. The DC is quite good

The DC of Cloud Mind is listed as 14 + 1/2 Bard Level + Charisma Modifier. This is not actually what it is. Instead, it is 11 + 1/2 Perform. The vast majority of the time, this means the spell got a little bit gimped compared to what it should have been. However, 11 + 1/2 Perform is still a very good, and in the end, it allows a dedicated Bard to rival a well-made Wizard's enchantment spells in DC.

- Let me explain. Let's make a really powerful level 30 Wizard who focuses on getting a high DC from enchantment spells. I'm going to use this build as a guideline:

http://nwn2.wikia.co...,ASC(10),RWT(10)

Let's first take a pretty high magic environment:

The DC of the Wizard's Enchantment spells should be this: 10 + 7 (let's say Mass Hold Person is being used) + 2 (Greater Spell Focus: Enchantment) + 5 (Red Wizard's Enhanced Specialization) + 10 (Due to 30 INT) + 5 (Due to a +10 INT item) + 4 (Epic Bonus combined with Practiced Spellcaster exploitation to make effective level 34)  + 1 (Spellcasting Prodigy) 
=  44

In a low magic world, you'd get 39 because of the lack of the +10 INT item.

- Now let's figure out the DC for Cloud Mind. I could do this for a Level 30 Bard and get essentially the same results, possibly even better if certain feats were taken, but I am going to use my main Bard build as the guideline here:

http://nwn2.wikia.co...,_BG_(3),_PM_(1)

I am going to include debuffs, crucially Curse Song, as essentially adding to DC, which is essentially correct.

The DC of Cloud Mind in a high magic environment depends on Perform. Here's a good baseline of what perform can easily get to with this build: 33 (base) + 1 (Talent background) + 7 (due to base Charisma) + 5 (due to +10 Charisma item) + 6 (Inspire Competence) + 4 (Greater Heroism) = 56

The DC is calculated as 11 + 1/2 Perform. So here is what it would be: 11 + 28 (due to Perform) + 4 (Due to Curse Song debuff) + 2 (Due to Aura of Despair debuff) = 45

So there you go. In a high magic environment, Cloud Mind can easily hit a 45 DC compared to a well-made Wizard's 44. This is without taking into the account the fact that in a high magic environment, you'd likely be able to get +Perform items that would make the difference between the two even greater).

A low magic environment yields similar results. In this case, assuming Greater Heroism cannot be used, Perform is at 47. I believe (though am too lazy to check) that this would round down when halved. Thus, the DC of Cloud Mind would be 40. This is, again, better than the Wizard's 39.

- The point, then is that Cloud Mind has a potentially astronomical DC when Perform is high and debuffs are taken into account.


2.You get a ton of uses per day

Bards get a song per day per level. Thus, a Bard with 26 Bard levels will get 26 songs to use. Now, I will not argue that any bard would be best off using all 26 of those with Cloud Minds; there are certainly other uses. Legionnaire's March, Song/Chorus of Heroism, and Song/Hymn of Requiem should be used as much as possible. However, in almost any case, it will quickly become hard for the Bard to use up all of their songs per day. What this essentially means is that, in all but environments with very very high restrictions on resting, Cloud Mind can essentially be used for free. It doesn't take up valuable spell uses per day; it doesn't take up memorization slots, and you will virtually never run out of uses of it.  This is a big deal.

And even on environments with big restrictions on resting, where you MIGHT run out of songs, you get a huge advantage because you still will be able to cast Cloud Mind many, many battles after any mage would have run out of spells.

3. No spell resistance

This is really important. To go along with the high DC, Cloud Mind is unaffected by Spell Resistance. This, again, puts it above a Wizard's Enchantment spells, as even Wizards with the best spell penetration will still be susceptible to resistance from enemies with high spell resist.

4. Mind-Affecting Immunity Doesn't Work???

This one I am not sure of, and it isn't that straightforward to test. I seem to remember concluding some time ago that Cloud Mind is not affected by an enemy's immunity to mind-affecting spells. If this were true, I think it would be an oversight, but again make it a power that is infinetely better than a Wizard's enchantment spells.

5. Not a hostile action

It is not considered a hostile action to cast Cloud Mind. This sounds like a silly distinction but it is actually meaningful. Haven Song has the same DC as Cloud Mind, so if you've pumped up Cloud Mind's DC, then chances are nothing will be able to attack you while you're in Haven Song. Thus, you can sit in Haven Song and Cloud Mind multiple enemies to start a battle without fear of being killed by the mob before you can CC them and without losing concentration.

This is a really good strategy. Think about fighting a group of 6 or so enemies. If you runs in against them, and starts trying to cast some CC spells, it might be quite easy to get mobbed and killed before you can get the spells off/killed due to losing concentration on the spells. This essentially eliminates that. The fact that Cloud Mind is not a hostile action means that the combination with Haven Song allows you free CC to start a battle. Against 6 or so enemies, you could Cloud Mind 2 of them THEN start the battle. Big difference, though it is limited by Cloud Mind's cooldown time.

6. You get it early

This is obvious but you get Cloud Mind at Bard Level 6. This gives you a long time to make use of it in a game where you start at a low level.

Modifié par lessthanjake9, 26 février 2011 - 07:08 .


#2
Axe_Edge

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Ok! I'll do it. I'm going to run a bard through the OC and MOTB!

The first time I played through the OC (at NWN2 launch) and MOTB, I took a duel-wielding, Drow, Rogue through. I've always leaned toward the "Thief" class, but due to a rogue's advantageous skill not being able to overcome a characteristic of many, many enemies, ECL penalizing me at endgame, and my learning the details of 3.5(e), that playthrough was tough (but very fun). I pretty much took the same NPCs with me while leaving that bard behind.

Since then, I've been through the campaigns a few times playing different classes, but, I still left the bard behind. Ever since NWN1, I've continually heard how great bards are. On my last playthrough, I played a Stormlord/RDD (I pretty much ignored the slight taste of bard). I did take the NPC bard with me on several of those adventures. I couldn't figure out what the heck the new sounds I was hearing were, so, I started paying attention to how the OEI played him.

Now, you've pushed me off fence. I'm jumping in! I'm taking a bard!

(Now, I have to study up)

PS:  You may want to fix your hyper-link. It's missing the last " ) " and many may miss it.

Modifié par Axe_Edge, 27 février 2011 - 07:59 .