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[Yrkoon]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

The story of DA II seems to be one person's rise to power among the political intrigue of a single city. The impact of that story might be epic, but the story itself is not.

I like this.  I'm, frankly, tired of epic.  I'm not sure I ever liked it.
 

Agreed.  When I think back to my favorite games of all time... none of them had "epic" stories.

Planescape: Torment - was the very antithesis of Epic.  The Plot line was:  find out who you are, and what happened to you.  And  find out what your name is while you're at it.


BG2's story - not epic at all.  Plot: a mage took your soul.  Get it back.

Icewind Dale:  2 lesser demons invade a few small, insignificant  villages up north.  Stop them.

[GodWood]

Zulmoka531 wrote...

Persephone wrote...

My Avatar is Batman wrote...
My play through Took roughly 20 hours were as my Origins took about 30.

=to ME2

Your playthrough of what? DA2 isn't out yet?

Not trying to cause an issue, but I believe he's played a "leaked" version judging from several of his posts on the forums as of late.

Then again I could be 100% completely wrong!.

My DA2 playthrough was about 46 hours and by god was it awesome!
The build up of the conflict between the mages and the templars and than how that epic plot-twist was executed, it was fricking brilliant!

See, anyone can do it.

[mesmerizedish]

Yrkoon wrote...

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

The story of DA II seems to be one person's rise to power among the political intrigue of a single city. The impact of that story might be epic, but the story itself is not.

I like this.  I'm, frankly, tired of epic.  I'm not sure I ever liked it.
 

Agreed.  When I think back to my favorite games of all time... none of them had "epic" stories.

Planescape: Torment - was the very antithesis of Epic.  The Plot line was:  find out who you are, and what happened to you.  And  find out what your name is while you're at it.


BG2's story - not epic at all.  Plot: a mage took your soul.  Get it back.

Icewind Dale:  2 lesser demons invade a few small, insignificant  villages up north.  Stop them.

Icewind Dale was meh

Other than that, I absolutely agree on all counts. BGII had the most amazing story I've ever experienced in a game, and at the heart of it, it was just you going after a guy who had wronged you (whether this was for revenge, for power, or for love is entirely dependent on who your character is, another point that made it so great; I did it for love ).

[Vaeliorin]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...
The story of DA II seems to be one person's rise to power among the political intrigue of a single city. The impact of that story might be epic, but the story itself is not.

I like this.  I'm, frankly, tired of epic.  I'm not sure I ever liked it.

Agreed.  When I think back to my favorite games of all time... none of them had "epic" stories.

Planescape: Torment - was the very antithesis of Epic.  The Plot line was:  find out who you are, and what happened to you.  And  find out what your name is while you're at it.


BG2's story - not epic at all.  Plot: a mage took your soul.  Get it back.

Icewind Dale:  2 lesser demons invade a few small, insignificant  villages up north.  Stop them.

Icewind Dale was meh

Icewind Dale was the second best game made with the Infinity Engine.  The best was, of course, PS:T.

Anyway, I'm definitely okay with not epic.  But 12-15 hours I would consider too short.  That's like...Arkham Asylum length...if you do most of the Riddler puzzles (though I imagine I'll probably replay DA2...AA not so much.  Most boring boss design ever.)  Even my quickest run-through of DA (ESC through dialog, etc.) took 40+ hours.

[meeho]

a 12-15 hour playthrough wouldn't be surprising at all with the "direction" that BW is going in.

[mesmerizedish]

Vaeliorin wrote...

Icewind Dale was the second best game made with the Infinity Engine.  The best was, of course, PS:T.

Icewind Dale was the second worst game made with the Infinity Engine. The worst was Baldur's Gate. I LOVED Baldur's Gate. When I said "meh" I mean the story. The game itself was fun to all hell.

Since you bring it up, I rank the IE games as follows:

1. Shadows of Amn
2. Planescape: Torment
3. Throne of Bhaal
4. Icewind Dale II
5. Icewind Dale
6. Baldur's Gate

Did I miss any?

As Mr. Epler (who's my friend now ) mentioned, it's very possible to complete Origins in 12-15 hours if you rush through it and skip most of the side quests. He says the same about DAII. His playthrough took over 50 hours and he skipped through a lot of the conversations that he had done work on personally. Being able to blow through the main plot in 15 hours doesn't strike me as surprising.

[Yrkoon]

I'll go out on a limb and say that most of us will get between 40-50 hours out of our first playthrough of DA:2.

And this whole sparcing of the main plot from subplots, and then assigning length numbers to each,  is silly to anyone who's ever played a bioware game. A good story always intertwines subplots with the mainplot, to the point that its hard to even know, especially on a first playthrough,  which one you're doing

Modifié par Yrkoon, 27 février 2011 - 08:45 .

[Zulmoka531]

@Godwood
Ah yes. I see your point there.
Guess I must be doing something wrong as my playthrough was 25 hours. "Whistles and walks away"

[Yrkoon]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Vaeliorin wrote...

Icewind Dale was the second best game made with the Infinity Engine.  The best was, of course, PS:T.

Icewind Dale was the second worst game made with the Infinity Engine. The worst was Baldur's Gate. I LOVED Baldur's Gate. When I said "meh" I mean the story. The game itself was fun to all hell.

Since you bring it up, I rank the IE games as follows:

1. Shadows of Amn
2. Planescape: Torment
3. Throne of Bhaal
4. Icewind Dale II
5. Icewind Dale
6. Baldur's Gate

Did I miss any?

  You missed 3.

1) Tales of the Sword Coast.  (BG1's expansion, which contained  Durlag's Tower -   the single greatest dungeon every created in a computer game.)

2) Heart of Winter  (IWD expansion pack 1)
3) Trials of the Luremaster  (IWD expansion pack 2)

Modifié par Yrkoon, 27 février 2011 - 08:50 .

[mesmerizedish]

Yrkoon wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Vaeliorin wrote...

Icewind Dale was the second best game made with the Infinity Engine.  The best was, of course, PS:T.

Icewind Dale was the second worst game made with the Infinity Engine. The worst was Baldur's Gate. I LOVED Baldur's Gate. When I said "meh" I mean the story. The game itself was fun to all hell.

Since you bring it up, I rank the IE games as follows:

1. Shadows of Amn
2. Planescape: Torment
3. Throne of Bhaal
4. Icewind Dale II
5. Icewind Dale
6. Baldur's Gate

Did I miss any?

Tales of the Sword Coast.  (BG1's expansion, which contained  Durlag's Tower -   the single greatest dungeon every created in a computer game.)

I include TotSC with BG1 since it's integrated fully with the game, unlike ToB. I should also mention that I've not played any of the IWD expansions. And didn't IWD2 have an expac too?

Yeah, I know it looks bad for BG1 to be at the bottom of the list, but you must realize that every single game that uses the Infinity Engine is one of the greatest games ever made. It may be last among these six, but it's still brilliant and miles ahead of most anything else.

[EDIT] I loved Durlag's Tower, but I thought Watcher's Keep was better. Just my opinion, of course

Modifié par ishmaeltheforsaken, 27 février 2011 - 08:52 .

[0x30A88]

Even though I liked the combat system -- It deserves no 10/10. Around 8-9 with the con about it being a bit too fast for many weapons. If the slowed down 2H and staffs and fixed the stab through the air against large enemies like the ogre. -- it would be astetically perfect.

[Yrkoon]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

I include TotSC with BG1 since it's integrated fully with the game, unlike ToB.

Not sure what your point is.    A game is a game.    And You could do Throne of Bhaal's Watcher's keep  in Shadows of Amn.  The fact that you had to finish chapter 7  of SoA in order to go to Saradush and begin the rest of Throne of Bhaal does not mean TOB wasn't fully integrated into the main game.    The transition is so seamless,   that it's more accurate to say that it was merely chapter 8, 9 and 10 of SoA.  (which it literally was)

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
 I should also mention that I've not played any of the IWD expansions. And didn't IWD2 have an expac too?

No.  Black Isle went out of business before they could do an expansion for IWD2.  No matter, though, as  IWD2 was garbage  anyway  lol.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 27 février 2011 - 09:05 .

[Vaeliorin]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Vaeliorin wrote...
Icewind Dale was the second best game made with the Infinity Engine.  The best was, of course, PS:T.

Icewind Dale was the second worst game made with the Infinity Engine. The worst was Baldur's Gate. I LOVED Baldur's Gate. When I said "meh" I mean the story. The game itself was fun to all hell.

Since you bring it up, I rank the IE games as follows:

1. Shadows of Amn
2. Planescape: Torment
3. Throne of Bhaal
4. Icewind Dale II
5. Icewind Dale
6. Baldur's Gate

Did I miss any?

Tales of the Sword Coast.  (BG1's expansion, which contained  Durlag's Tower -   the single greatest dungeon every created in a computer game.)

I include TotSC with BG1 since it's integrated fully with the game, unlike ToB. I should also mention that I've not played any of the IWD expansions. And didn't IWD2 have an expac too?

Yeah, I know it looks bad for BG1 to be at the bottom of the list, but you must realize that every single game that uses the Infinity Engine is one of the greatest games ever made. It may be last among these six, but it's still brilliant and miles ahead of most anything else.

[EDIT] I loved Durlag's Tower, but I thought Watcher's Keep was better. Just my opinion, of course

I'm fairly certain IWD2 never had an expansion pack.  But I got fed up with the game when it bugged out on me (took the key to a door, but didn't unlock it) and I didn't have a save to go back to...so I never finished it, and never looked for an expansion.

If anyone cares, my ranking of IE games goes:

PS:T
IWD
BG
IWD2
BG2

That's including the IWD/BG/BG2 expansions.

Honestly, I've never really been able to get into BG2.  I have the Collector's Edition, got it when it first came out, so it's not like I picked it up late and just couldn't go back.  I think most of the blame lies with the fact that the game assumes I give a crap about Imoen.  I hated Imoen for the longest time...until I played BG1 with the NPC project mod.

Anyway...we'll see how long it is when it comes out, I suppose.  The record for Fallout 1 is under 7 minutes, and you can finish BG2+TOB in an hour, so I'm sure it'll have more content than those games did. 

Edit:  Durlag's Tower I found a bit tedious, actually.  Hunt for the place that makes the cursor change (so you can activate with grape press) annoyed me, and the chess battle wasn't fun at all in real-time.  Would have been awesome if the game was turn-based, though.

Edit 2:  If anyone's interested, DA was done in 35:30.

Modifié par Vaeliorin, 27 février 2011 - 09:22 .

[Merced652]

Covi wrote...

How long is ME2's main quest? 6 hours?

Well to be fair before they patched it just scanning planets probably took 6 hours, but technically i guess you didn't even have to do that much to get fully upgraded for suicidez.

[AllThatJazz]

Altima Darkspells wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

snip 

I don't think the 'dark' excuse is valid for an unsatisfactory ending.

KotOR2 managed a rather open ending, but at the same time, it resolved the story in a satisfactory sort of way.

If, however, the ending to DA2 is some hamfisted attempt to sell an expansion in five months or a sequel in eighteen months, I will be rather irritated.  It is, after, an entertainment median, and cutting the game off in the middle is inexcuseable.

Although at the time (and even in a fair number of retrospectives) KoTOR2 was considered to have a dreadful ending, one of the worst in videogames EVAH if all the fuss was anything to go by. I actually rather liked the ending, though would have liked Malachor V to be longer, and the companions' stories to be wrapped up.

I'm all for non-Epic, I think the 'save the world' plot is very tired, and most of my favourite games (yes, the ones that everyone else has already posted, plus Mask of the Betrayer - I know, not a IE game, but still) are personal rather than world-shattering. But I totally agree - A non-ending for future-game purposes would be aggravating. Cliffhangers have to be 'Empire Strikes Back' level of good for me not to be really pissed off. And even then, I think I would be a little bit. x

[Persephone]

Zulmoka531 wrote...

Persephone wrote...

My Avatar is Batman wrote...

My play through Took roughly 20 hours were as my Origins took about 30.

=to ME2

Your playthrough of what? DA2 isn't out yet?

Not trying to cause an issue, but I believe he's played a "leaked" version judging from several of his posts on the forums as of late.

Then again I could be 100% completely wrong!.

:o:o I hope that isn't true. 

[Hawke92]

Well i beat Origins for exatcly 22 hours with Awakening and Witch Hunt.The Awakening took me only six hours and the Witch Hunt 30 mins.So i bet DA2 i 1-2 hours shorter 14-15 hours possibaly

[Maleficent]

is that even a review seems more like a predicted/presumed/assumed list!

[Maleficent]

how did they rush the game its been in dev since march 2009!

[Mick301981]

Hawke92 wrote...

Well i beat Origins for exatcly 22 hours with Awakening and Witch Hunt.The Awakening took me only six hours and the Witch Hunt 30 mins.So i bet DA2 i 1-2 hours shorter 14-15 hours possibaly

I can't really fathom how someone could beat Origins that fast.

My fastest playthrough took me 57 hrs.

No matter, I expect I'll get at least 50 hrs from DA2, most likely more.

[Maleficent]

the remark about the characters depth is very subjective indeed considering Alistair was dopey,leilana ok,oghren eh wtf there,sten gives a us a conversation lol,only morrigan and zev were truely decent,oh and wynne was ok I guess need a healer right.Isabella from what I've seen looks interesting.

[Gibb_Shepard]

Mick301981 wrote...

Hawke92 wrote...

Well i beat Origins for exatcly 22 hours with Awakening and Witch Hunt.The Awakening took me only six hours and the Witch Hunt 30 mins.So i bet DA2 i 1-2 hours shorter 14-15 hours possibaly

I can't really fathom how someone could beat Origins that fast.

My fastest playthrough took me 57 hrs.

No matter, I expect I'll get at least 50 hrs from DA2, most likely more.

I will never understand how this is at all possible.

I went through origins doing the majority of side quests, reading every codex i found, sometimes just walking around and exploring, and i got 36 hours total. I can't comprehend 57 hours, at all.

My guess is those who get this amount of hours are the PC players who pause throughout combat constantly and leave it paused, for a long time, while they figure out a strategy. Amirite? Are you a PC player? Because that is the only thing i can think of that can bolster someone up to a 57 hour playthrough.

And those who claim 100hrs? Get outta here.

Modifié par Gibb_Shepard, 27 février 2011 - 10:27 .

[Rzepik2]

AllThatJazz wrote...

I'm all for non-Epic, I think the 'save the world' plot is very tired, and most of my favourite games (yes, the ones that everyone else has already posted, plus Mask of the Betrayer - I know, not a IE game, but still) are personal rather than world-shattering.

Attacking god's city and possibility to turn into god-eating squid is IMO pretty epic 

[TheRealJayDee]

Skilled Seeker wrote...

I don't trust Germans.