What are some potential reasons for not getting in game what you get in the cutscene preview window?
For instance, in cutscene preview, camera only goes to knees, in game camera goes to below feet.
In preview characters have feet on a bridge, in game they are floating a foot or so above bridge.
What you see is not what you get...?
Débuté par
Beerfish
, févr. 27 2011 03:41
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#2
Posté 27 février 2011 - 04:37
John Epler
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Snap to Walkmesh actions, height adjustment on characters.
On a more general note, have you refreshed the area in the cutscene? Sometimes, I move a stage around (if the cutscene's associated with a stage) and end up wrecking my cutscene because it's no longer where I originally placed it.
On a more general note, have you refreshed the area in the cutscene? Sometimes, I move a stage around (if the cutscene's associated with a stage) and end up wrecking my cutscene because it's no longer where I originally placed it.
#3
Posté 27 février 2011 - 04:52
Beerfish
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JohnEpler wrote...
Snap to Walkmesh actions, height adjustment on characters.
On a more general note, have you refreshed the area in the cutscene? Sometimes, I move a stage around (if the cutscene's associated with a stage) and end up wrecking my cutscene because it's no longer where I originally placed it.
I have both actors set to 'snap to walkmesh' for the cutscene preview they behave as intended. Once I test in game they float. Do these objects have to be set to 'snap to surface' or 'objects follow surface' in the actual area?
I normally refresh (F5) before I export to do any tests but I'll try that again.
Height adjustment on characters? I'm not sure what that is referring to.
#4
Posté 27 février 2011 - 05:26
John Epler
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Sorry - are you using a stage camera, or just a regular camera?
If the former, it may be that. Otherwise, I remember an issue we noticed in Witch Hunt where there was some discrepancy between the cutscene in-toolset and in-game. It seemed to be related to a stage pushing through a solid object (a bookcase, in this particular instance).
If the former, it may be that. Otherwise, I remember an issue we noticed in Witch Hunt where there was some discrepancy between the cutscene in-toolset and in-game. It seemed to be related to a stage pushing through a solid object (a bookcase, in this particular instance).
#5
Posté 28 février 2011 - 01:55
tmp7704
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The one source of such difference i'm aware of is the aspect ratio of the game/preview window -- if you set up your camera for widescreen, someone who is playing the game in 4:3 resolution like 1024x768 etc will see extra bits on top and the bottom.
#6
Posté 28 février 2011 - 03:24
Beerfish
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JohnEpler wrote...
Sorry - are you using a stage camera, or just a regular camera?
If the former, it may be that. Otherwise, I remember an issue we noticed in Witch Hunt where there was some discrepancy between the cutscene in-toolset and in-game. It seemed to be related to a stage pushing through a solid object (a bookcase, in this particular instance).
Just a regular camera. In this particular case there is nothing but air behind the camera (out door scene). I fiddle around with a few other things and carefully review all of my location keyframes and such.
#7
Posté 28 février 2011 - 03:28
Beerfish
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tmp7704 wrote...
The one source of such difference i'm aware of is the aspect ratio of the game/preview window -- if you set up your camera for widescreen, someone who is playing the game in 4:3 resolution like 1024x768 etc will see extra bits on top and the bottom.
That makes sense. I'll have to go back and look at how I have the cameras set up. In most cases though there is a difference 'in game' vs 'cutcene preview' it is not enough to cause a problem. I did not originally have this floating actor problem when I worked on the cutscene on my older desktop machine. i am now using my newer laptop and the strange occurence happens. I will go back over the cutscene with a fine tooth comb and see if I can find anything else that might cause the problem.
thanks for the comments
#8
Posté 28 février 2011 - 09:10
Yara C.
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What you see is not what you get...? - Interesting topic!
I have made the same experience recently but under different circumstances. I have combined some parameters irregularly for a 2p animation and the position of the two actors was (and still is) reciprocal in the cutscene preview window to their position in game. Because of the different height of the actors it was rather challenging to set cameras and lights, not seeing what you get...
After I coped with this task feeling half blind, spending a lot of time on it, I added finally another scene, moved the marker back from the new scene to the 2p animation and could suddenly see what I get in game.
(Sigh, if I would have known this before...)
But every time I open the cutscene I can still see the actors in the reciprocal position.
For me, it remains a riddle.
I have made the same experience recently but under different circumstances. I have combined some parameters irregularly for a 2p animation and the position of the two actors was (and still is) reciprocal in the cutscene preview window to their position in game. Because of the different height of the actors it was rather challenging to set cameras and lights, not seeing what you get...
After I coped with this task feeling half blind, spending a lot of time on it, I added finally another scene, moved the marker back from the new scene to the 2p animation and could suddenly see what I get in game.
(Sigh, if I would have known this before...)
But every time I open the cutscene I can still see the actors in the reciprocal position.
For me, it remains a riddle.
#9
Posté 28 février 2011 - 09:29
DahliaLynn
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Kind of strange. I never experienced this, and have been working on many in game cutscenes. The only thing I could think of would be if you exported your area properly, and perhaps set a key for the master object, since all keying refers to it for reference.
I use windows XP if that tells you anything.
Edit: OH Wait!
Have you keyed your actors initial positions? (I know it's a trivial question but many errors occur if you forget to do that by chance. (Like the infamous error we get from setting GAD without keying for example)
(double edit
)
I use windows XP if that tells you anything.
Edit: OH Wait!
Have you keyed your actors initial positions? (I know it's a trivial question but many errors occur if you forget to do that by chance. (Like the infamous error we get from setting GAD without keying for example)
(double edit
)
Modifié par DahliaLynn, 28 février 2011 - 09:47 .
#10
Posté 28 février 2011 - 09:45
Beerfish
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DahliaLynn wrote...
Kind of strange. I never experienced this, and have been working on many in game cutscenes. The only thing I could think of would be if you exported your area properly, and perhaps set a key for the master object, since all keying refers to it for reference.
I use windows XP if that tells you anything.
Edit: OH Wait!
Have you keyed your actors initial positions? (I know it's a bad question but many errors occur if you set GAD without keying for example)
Bah! I always see that warning and ignore it! (As a rule I am pretty good at setting an intial keyframe, usually it's the 1st thing I do.)
I'll check that out this evening and see if that could be the problem. Thanks for the tip.
#11
Posté 01 mars 2011 - 12:27
Beerfish
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Hmph Dahlia was right, I did not have a starting key for either actor for some strange reason. However that didn't fix the problem. When I removed the 'snap to walkmesh' from the actors they looked like they do in game. So for some reason, in the cutscene editor snap to walkmesh seems to work but in game it isn't. I might have to just redo that section of the cutscene completely and see what happens.
#12
Posté 01 mars 2011 - 03:03
DahliaLynn
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I've also noticed a particular bug, where on occasion exporting a cutscene won't work properly, and only the *.cut file would be exported. It will cause you to view only the previous exported cutscene so, just as a backup, make sure both cut and cub files have the same export time.
I've suffered many an in-game preview not understanding why the scene wasn't updating.
In order to *almost* guarantee a good export, I literally closed the scene and exported from the palette and duly checked the export times on the *.cut & *.cub files themselves.
Maybe that could be the cause for the most recent problem as well? (just a hunch)
Edit: One other thing...when you allow for GAD without keying, the scene can be messed up for good, (happened to me) so redoing the sequence might be best.
I've suffered many an in-game preview not understanding why the scene wasn't updating.
In order to *almost* guarantee a good export, I literally closed the scene and exported from the palette and duly checked the export times on the *.cut & *.cub files themselves.
Maybe that could be the cause for the most recent problem as well? (just a hunch)
Edit: One other thing...when you allow for GAD without keying, the scene can be messed up for good, (happened to me) so redoing the sequence might be best.
Modifié par DahliaLynn, 01 mars 2011 - 03:11 .
#13
Posté 02 mars 2011 - 10:56
alschemid
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Now I am curious, because I'm having the same problem... in the toolset I get the character in the right position I want, but in game the character is a few inches up, even with the "snap to walkmesh" set.Beerfish wrote...
Height adjustment on characters? I'm not sure what that is referring to.
#14
Posté 03 mars 2011 - 02:21
DahliaLynn
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alschemid wrote...
Now I am curious, because I'm having the same problem... in the toolset I get the character in the right position I want, but in game the character is a few inches up, even with the "snap to walkmesh" set.Beerfish wrote...
Height adjustment on characters? I'm not sure what that is referring to.
Before you do anything, key your actors positions first and foremost, don't set GAD until you do, and don't ignore the error, cancel
The talk about height adjustment in characters in this thread refers to using stage cameras, and how they have an adjustment in the conversation editor where if you jump to a stage cam in your cutscene the camera may adjust itself depending on it's setting. If you are using a stage cam (jump to stage) in your cutscene, that's where height adjustment is applicable.
Modifié par DahliaLynn, 03 mars 2011 - 02:26 .
#15
Posté 03 mars 2011 - 08:58
alschemid
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Do I need to set the positions even if I use the stage and the "jump to stage" action?
Let me try to explain what I'm trying to do: I am doing an interaction animation between two characters and I need them to be in a exact position otherwise the interaction doesn't work. So I go the Alistair kissing cutscene and changed the animation to mine, but it didn't worked in game since my character always was a few inches up than Alistair and instead of him touching my PC shoulder he was fiddling with her boob.<_<
So I thought the problem was with my animation and got the kissing cutscene again and tried to match their mouths by setting key positions on the PC, worked wonderfully in the toolset, but not in game, where the PC was eating his nose or cheeks. I have created a new stage and used the "jump to stage" and didn't worked, the "snap to walkmesh" was even worse because in camp the ground level doesn't help.
Any ideas? Thanks.
Let me try to explain what I'm trying to do: I am doing an interaction animation between two characters and I need them to be in a exact position otherwise the interaction doesn't work. So I go the Alistair kissing cutscene and changed the animation to mine, but it didn't worked in game since my character always was a few inches up than Alistair and instead of him touching my PC shoulder he was fiddling with her boob.<_<
So I thought the problem was with my animation and got the kissing cutscene again and tried to match their mouths by setting key positions on the PC, worked wonderfully in the toolset, but not in game, where the PC was eating his nose or cheeks. I have created a new stage and used the "jump to stage" and didn't worked, the "snap to walkmesh" was even worse because in camp the ground level doesn't help.
Any ideas? Thanks.
Modifié par alschemid, 03 mars 2011 - 09:43 .
#16
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 04:55
DahliaLynn
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Yes. So happens I created a kissing mod for Alistair which has a perfectly synchronized visible kiss, and I broke my back for ages trying to solve the discrepancy between the toolset and in game.
My own reason for the difference was how the cutscene was triggered.
In the actual conversation where you ask Alistair to kiss you, (kiss him) your PC is set to a pose and shift position in the conversation where this takes place.
That means, that your PC's starting point could be either right left or center as a starting point. This will affect the starting point in the cutscene as well.
The way I got around it was to try and synchronize the best out of all possible options by keying the animations keeping in mind the possible displacement. I chose the most centralized keying to get the best results.
I tested various starting positions in game and came to the conclusion that it has less to do with where your PC is standing when initiating the conversation, (they jump to their relative positions once cutscene is triggered) but in fact where the PC stands (leans) at the exact moment you click, i.e. left, right center, in the shift animation prior to triggering.
If you are using this conversation to trigger, or any other, you will want to take note of the pose set for the character in the actual conversation. (shift left or right, etc) This will have much to do with the variable starting position of the PC when entering the cutscene.
Also, if you set "snap to walkmesh" then depending on where your PC is standing when triggering (a hill) you may have a problem because the key positions will never be consistent. So I wouldn't recommend snapping to walkmesh when you need synchronization.
Edit: By the way all this applies when you are using the dynamic "anywhere" stage. If you are setting the scene in one area only, then you can set snap to walkmesh and expect the results to be the same aside from the conversation starting position.
My own reason for the difference was how the cutscene was triggered.
In the actual conversation where you ask Alistair to kiss you, (kiss him) your PC is set to a pose and shift position in the conversation where this takes place.
That means, that your PC's starting point could be either right left or center as a starting point. This will affect the starting point in the cutscene as well.
The way I got around it was to try and synchronize the best out of all possible options by keying the animations keeping in mind the possible displacement. I chose the most centralized keying to get the best results.
I tested various starting positions in game and came to the conclusion that it has less to do with where your PC is standing when initiating the conversation, (they jump to their relative positions once cutscene is triggered) but in fact where the PC stands (leans) at the exact moment you click, i.e. left, right center, in the shift animation prior to triggering.
If you are using this conversation to trigger, or any other, you will want to take note of the pose set for the character in the actual conversation. (shift left or right, etc) This will have much to do with the variable starting position of the PC when entering the cutscene.
Also, if you set "snap to walkmesh" then depending on where your PC is standing when triggering (a hill) you may have a problem because the key positions will never be consistent. So I wouldn't recommend snapping to walkmesh when you need synchronization.
Edit: By the way all this applies when you are using the dynamic "anywhere" stage. If you are setting the scene in one area only, then you can set snap to walkmesh and expect the results to be the same aside from the conversation starting position.
Modifié par DahliaLynn, 04 mars 2011 - 05:27 .
#17
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:46
alschemid
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Your Alistair's kiss is perfect! *bows down before you*
So the main problem is not where the PC is standing when you click to start the conversation but how the animation it is performing changes the PC stance?
I had made another synchronized animation before, using a dynamic stage with "jump to stage" and "snap to walkmesh" on a specific area, the PC and follower were loaded in their positions by a script and the dialogue was triggered by the script too, so I had no problem with the conversation start position, when the cutscene was triggered everything worked nice.
This one should happen anywhere, so I should not use the "snap to walkmesh", obviously, I should take care with the pose/animation they are performing when the dialogue is triggered, and I need to key their positions taking into account any possible displacement, even if it doesn't look nice in the toolset, kind of animating without seeing it....it seems my weekend will be very long...
Hope I got it right, if not I'll let you know.
Thank you!
So the main problem is not where the PC is standing when you click to start the conversation but how the animation it is performing changes the PC stance?
I had made another synchronized animation before, using a dynamic stage with "jump to stage" and "snap to walkmesh" on a specific area, the PC and follower were loaded in their positions by a script and the dialogue was triggered by the script too, so I had no problem with the conversation start position, when the cutscene was triggered everything worked nice.
This one should happen anywhere, so I should not use the "snap to walkmesh", obviously, I should take care with the pose/animation they are performing when the dialogue is triggered, and I need to key their positions taking into account any possible displacement, even if it doesn't look nice in the toolset, kind of animating without seeing it....it seems my weekend will be very long...
Hope I got it right, if not I'll let you know.
Thank you!
Modifié par alschemid, 04 mars 2011 - 08:49 .
#18
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 09:53
DahliaLynn
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Thanks 
I think you got it right. This would really depend on the pose within the conversation itself. If the pose is lean left or lean right or shift weight (I forget the names) then you're in for a bind. On the other hand, if you are alright with changing the settings in the conversation itself (Alistair_main.dlg in my case which I dare not touch to maintain compatibility with other mods) then you can feel free to leave the pose as standing neutral and hope that neutral won't move the PC left or right in the slightest. But even standing neutral isn't completely still :S
good luck !
I think you got it right. This would really depend on the pose within the conversation itself. If the pose is lean left or lean right or shift weight (I forget the names) then you're in for a bind. On the other hand, if you are alright with changing the settings in the conversation itself (Alistair_main.dlg in my case which I dare not touch to maintain compatibility with other mods) then you can feel free to leave the pose as standing neutral and hope that neutral won't move the PC left or right in the slightest. But even standing neutral isn't completely still :Sgood luck !
#19
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 11:23
alschemid
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oh my! it worked!!
The problem was the "look at" in the conversation, it was set to look at each other and it was carrying out to the cutscene animation that is why the PC was eating his nose in the kiss animation...now I think what I have in the cutscene is almost like what I see in game, the standing still is not perfect but much much better than before and I got my arm animation working as it should. Yay!
And I'm fine changing the conversation settings since I have lost the compatibility already... but I suppose adding an animation to make the characters look straight ahead in the first frame of the cutscene and add a fade in it could do the trick... and the same to clear the arm pose....*ponders*
Thank you very very much!!
The problem was the "look at" in the conversation, it was set to look at each other and it was carrying out to the cutscene animation that is why the PC was eating his nose in the kiss animation...now I think what I have in the cutscene is almost like what I see in game, the standing still is not perfect but much much better than before and I got my arm animation working as it should. Yay!
And I'm fine changing the conversation settings since I have lost the compatibility already... but I suppose adding an animation to make the characters look straight ahead in the first frame of the cutscene and add a fade in it could do the trick... and the same to clear the arm pose....*ponders*
Thank you very very much!!
#20
Posté 05 mars 2011 - 01:07
DahliaLynn
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You're totally welcome )
I completely forgot about the headtracking issue which also if done right helps "initialize" their heads:) I set it to a speed of around 5 and very short span before fade in in one of the scenes, and that guaranteed their initial relative head positions for the most part
In another scene (elf race) I actually manipulated headtracking to follow through up until they got within a certain distance of one another, again to guarantee their alignment.
I'm very happy it worked out for you. Guess the weekend won't be as long as you thought
) I completely forgot about the headtracking issue which also if done right helps "initialize" their heads:) I set it to a speed of around 5 and very short span before fade in in one of the scenes, and that guaranteed their initial relative head positions for the most part
In another scene (elf race) I actually manipulated headtracking to follow through up until they got within a certain distance of one another, again to guarantee their alignment.
I'm very happy it worked out for you. Guess the weekend won't be as long as you thought
#21
Posté 05 mars 2011 - 11:08
alschemid
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It seems my weekend won't be long into the cutscene editor... but I still have a gift handler script to fix. *headdesk*
oh! headtracking... I'll remember it next time for sure.
After playing with the kissing cutscene for a while I have no idea how you got it looking so nice only using the cutscene editor ... I'm amazed! *bows deeply*
oh! headtracking... I'll remember it next time for sure.
After playing with the kissing cutscene for a while I have no idea how you got it looking so nice only using the cutscene editor ... I'm amazed! *bows deeply*
#22
Posté 05 mars 2011 - 01:52
DahliaLynn
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Consider yourself lucky It took me what I thought would be a few hours, to a few days to literally weeks of looping and testing to figure out the whys, and get everything to look and work properly with all the possible variables involved -not to mention the 3 dimensional nightmares minor key tweaking for each separate animation would cause. *sigh*. But the lessons learned were totally worth it !
It took me what I thought would be a few hours, to a few days to literally weeks of looping and testing to figure out the whys, and get everything to look and work properly with all the possible variables involved -not to mention the 3 dimensional nightmares minor key tweaking for each separate animation would cause. *sigh*. But the lessons learned were totally worth it !
#23
Posté 18 mars 2011 - 06:59
alschemid
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Oh.... more questions, still related to the topic...
I'm working on a cutscene followed by a dialogue and I would like the characters to start the dialogue at the same positions they are at the end of the cutscene, so I've thought a stage could do it... and then all my problems started...
I am using an area from the single player game, which means I can not place a stage in the area and export them,
so my question is: do the area settings in the stage objetc inspector only works when I place the stage into an area and export the area and the stage? And do the area and the stage settings of the cutscene object inspector only works when I place the stage into an area and I export the area and the stage?
Because I've loaded the area in the stage, inserted places and cameras to the stage, used the stage in the cutscene, and made everything jump into their positions, in the toolset it works, but in the game all the characters and cameras appears at 0,0,0.
So I have removed the area from the stage and placed all my characters and cameras near the center of the stage, in the cutscene added the area and the stage, and placed the stage at 75,2,5, again it worked in the toolset but in game everything goes to 0,0,0 as if there is no stage at all.
hmmm... should I forget the stage for the cutscene and use a dynamic stage only for the dialogue? [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/uncertain.png[/smilie]
Thanks.
I'm working on a cutscene followed by a dialogue and I would like the characters to start the dialogue at the same positions they are at the end of the cutscene, so I've thought a stage could do it... and then all my problems started...
I am using an area from the single player game, which means I can not place a stage in the area and export them,
so my question is: do the area settings in the stage objetc inspector only works when I place the stage into an area and export the area and the stage? And do the area and the stage settings of the cutscene object inspector only works when I place the stage into an area and I export the area and the stage?
Because I've loaded the area in the stage, inserted places and cameras to the stage, used the stage in the cutscene, and made everything jump into their positions, in the toolset it works, but in the game all the characters and cameras appears at 0,0,0.
So I have removed the area from the stage and placed all my characters and cameras near the center of the stage, in the cutscene added the area and the stage, and placed the stage at 75,2,5, again it worked in the toolset but in game everything goes to 0,0,0 as if there is no stage at all.
hmmm... should I forget the stage for the cutscene and use a dynamic stage only for the dialogue? [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/uncertain.png[/smilie]
Thanks.
Modifié par alschemid, 18 mars 2011 - 07:01 .
#24
Posté 18 mars 2011 - 07:37
Beerfish
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I've never used a stage for a cutscene, seems to defeat the purpose if you ask me. (Though I don't have tons of experience with stages and thus might be misinformed.)
Someone who as done what you are asking I'm sure will chime in on this. If it was me I'd run the cutscene and just script the actors to jump to a location at the end of the scene if that is possible.
Someone who as done what you are asking I'm sure will chime in on this. If it was me I'd run the cutscene and just script the actors to jump to a location at the end of the scene if that is possible.
#25
Posté 19 mars 2011 - 08:25
alschemid
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Since I want the npc to perform some animations while talking its lines I need the stage for the dialogue, because it seems I can not assign an animtation to the character if I'm not using a stage..., unless it can be done with script too? But I'll forget the stages for the cutscene for sure.
Thanks.
Thanks.
