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My resigned thoughts on DA2 *Take Two*


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#126
Zenithan

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I agree with most of your points, OP, although perhaps not quite as vehemently. I don't particularly like voiced protagonists, as it makes me feel that I'm playing someone else's character rather than my own, but I think, given the framed narrative structure of the story, it makes sense for Hawke to be voiced and named. After all, the tale is not really from Hawke's point of view; it's from Varric's.

I personally think the graphics, other than the models, have somehow taken a turn for the worse; it might be a lighting thing, but I haven't really seen enough of the game to make a complete judgement on this. Also, I'm not a fan of the new darkspawn.

My main issue, though, is with the removal of the tactical camera. I played the entire first game with it, and I'm not sure how I'll be able play on Nightmare without it. I've played through the demo several times, and this, above anything else, is something I wasn't able to get used to. I can barely see enemies to target a fireball before they're right next to me; on Nightmare, this would murder half my party. I have to spend half the time screwing with the camera to be able to do anything. I understand the reasons for this, but this basically makes it an entirely different game from Origins for me.

Still, I have yet to play a Bioware game I didn't enjoy. I just fear that I won't enjoy it as much as I could have.

Modifié par Zenithan, 28 février 2011 - 08:54 .


#127
TwistedComplex

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distinguetraces wrote...

Rockpopple wrote...
What is it? Are you complaining that the graphics in the demo are too drab? Again, play DA:O again. It was a sea of brown and beige.


I am really appreciating the graphics on my current replay of Origins. Ostagar is lovely.

And you can't deny:

Posted Image


MEANWHILE IN REALITY 


Posted Image



I'm surprised people are dumb enough to keep using that pre-alpha screen shot when the DEMO IS OUT

#128
Solid N7

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TwistedComplex wrote...

distinguetraces wrote...

Rockpopple wrote...
What is it? Are you complaining that the graphics in the demo are too drab? Again, play DA:O again. It was a sea of brown and beige.


I am really appreciating the graphics on my current replay of Origins. Ostagar is lovely.

And you can't deny:

Posted Image


MEANWHILE IN REALITY 


Posted Image



I'm surprised people are dumb enough to keep using that pre-alpha screen shot when the DEMO IS OUT



only the trolls like op and distinguetraces

#129
TwistedComplex

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Buffy-Summers wrote...

I agree with the OP in all aspect and i pray to the Maker that this game has a LOWER metacric rating and sales worse then the original


I dont care if that kills any chance of a DA3, better to have no game then to have a hybrid rpg / action game when there are far more of those then real and true RPGs



Sorry all i saw was

"I'm not having fun, so no one should have fun"

Would you like to try again?

#130
SarahRhadis

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TwistedComplex wrote...

distinguetraces wrote...

Rockpopple wrote...
What is it? Are you complaining that the graphics in the demo are too drab? Again, play DA:O again. It was a sea of brown and beige.


I am really appreciating the graphics on my current replay of Origins. Ostagar is lovely.

And you can't deny:

Posted Image


MEANWHILE IN REALITY 


Posted Image



I'm surprised people are dumb enough to keep using that pre-alpha screen shot when the DEMO IS OUT



 I completely agree, I really thought the graphics that I saw in the demo were a step up from DAO. I was never impressed with DAOs spell effects... Well short of Walking Bomb :D. People will just use whatever they feel will prove their point including old old pre-release screens.

#131
0x30A88

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sycophantichallenger wrote...
Taking the following points as being true (from my position as they are my personal point of view):

1 - The changes to the dialogue system have effectively killed RP in the game for me.
2 - The poor/childish visual "redesign" have effectively killed immersion for me.
3 - The "push a button and something awesome happens" design philosophy has ruined the appeal of the gameplay.

1 - Well, it's just the same as the DAO dialogue, just differently set up. We haven't got any real choises in the part presented in the demo.
2 - Bar the silly Hurlocks and I can disagree. I think they did pretty well there, though the women in DA2 age quite well I must say.
3 - The animation is a bit bad, but it's basically the same as the previous game, but with faster animations. Even though I would have wanted a sweet spot between the two in terms of speeds, It's nothing infuriating.

#132
Swisspease

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Like I said before...

My opinion of the game is I can have no opinion until I've actually played the game. There are some things I like about the demo and sone things I don't like but playing a short demo does not give me enough information to formulate an opinion on a game that has not yet even been released.

As for old style RPG players, I've been playing CRPG's since Wizardry came out in 1981. They've changed alot since then and I've changed also. I have played many good ones, and several bad ones in that time, but I for one don't **** about the games these days not being like the old days. Technology changes, time changes, to not change with the times is to limit yourself. I am going to play this game, I will make an opinion on this game AFTER I have played it. It may be possible that I won't like the game, but honestly I think I'm going to like the hell out of it. I will also most likely get Witcher2 and Skyrim, and I will most likely replay DA2 many times over.

#133
Solid N7

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Swisspease wrote...

Like I said before...

My opinion of the game is I can have no opinion until I've actually played the game. There are some things I like about the demo and sone things I don't like but playing a short demo does not give me enough information to formulate an opinion on a game that has not yet even been released.

As for old style RPG players, I've been playing CRPG's since Wizardry came out in 1981. They've changed alot since then and I've changed also. I have played many good ones, and several bad ones in that time, but I for one don't **** about the games these days not being like the old days. Technology changes, time changes, to not change with the times is to limit yourself. I am going to play this game, I will make an opinion on this game AFTER I have played it. It may be possible that I won't like the game, but honestly I think I'm going to like the hell out of it. I will also most likely get Witcher2 and Skyrim, and I will most likely replay DA2 many times over.



^^^^^this

#134
AllThatJazz

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Swisspease wrote...

Like I said before...

My opinion of the game is I can have no opinion until I've actually played the game. There are some things I like about the demo and sone things I don't like but playing a short demo does not give me enough information to formulate an opinion on a game that has not yet even been released.

As for old style RPG players, I've been playing CRPG's since Wizardry came out in 1981. They've changed alot since then and I've changed also. I have played many good ones, and several bad ones in that time, but I for one don't **** about the games these days not being like the old days. Technology changes, time changes, to not change with the times is to limit yourself. I am going to play this game, I will make an opinion on this game AFTER I have played it. It may be possible that I won't like the game, but honestly I think I'm going to like the hell out of it. I will also most likely get Witcher2 and Skyrim, and I will most likely replay DA2 many times over.


Your post makes far too much sense. :wizard:

#135
asaiasai

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Sabresandiego wrote...

Do you know how many people complained that Modern Warfare 2 was a failure of a game for its lack of dedicated servers? It was the best selling FPS of all time and next years sale of Black Ops sales were even better.

The fact is this, DA2 is BETTER than origins. Gameplay sucked in origins, combat was totally imbalanced due to potions, invulns, and bad game mechanics. Origins was a great game due to story, art, writing, and fun factor, and had good combat animations. DA2 takes the good from Origins, and fixes what was wrong with it ----> the gameplay.

There are flaws with DA2. For example, I know for a fact that you can make fast responsive combat that is more appealing to a mature audience and doesnt suffer from ninja/anime teen appeal. I would prefer a more mature setting, with less cartoonish graphics, slightly more realistic combat without over the top moves, etc... BUT I am willing to accept the shortcomings of DA2 because they are far less than the games improvements. Responsive gameplay is absolutely essential for me, its why I loved ME2 and couldnt play origins more than once. DA2 is a HUGE improvement over origins.


The bolded parts there is not a single fact there, strong opinion yes but far from fact. The opinion you are entitled to but it is far from facts.  As far as the underlined part, my turn for an opinion, i could not stand ME2 more than once, well that was until i modifyied my coalesced.ini to remove the lousy heat sink ammo mechanic but even then i still could only get a few more plays in before i was soooooo bored. In order for Bioware to sell me on ME3 i will need something a bit more enticing than a few in game items, perhaps a ****** on Bioware's dime, while i play the game may be just the ticket but such was my disappointment with ME2 that she had better be a 6 at least and VERY enthusiastic about the job, i am talking like she has been poisoned and i have the antidote kind of enthusiasm.  

I played DAO 22 times, i have at least one of each origin and one of each solution like Architect lives or dies etc. I am not going to pan DA2 for i have not seen it in it's entirety yet, but so far i have come across a few things that i do not like. I am currently in a discussion concerning a game mechanic invoving the exhorbantly long heal cool downs that will IMHO pretty much limit the usefullness of the mage class entirely. As i have 22 characters in DAO, DA2 has REALLY big shoes to fill, and i have pre ordered DA2 but if the changes to the game are as onerous as they were ME to ME2 then another enthusiastic hooker or even two may not be enough to entice me to purchase another Bioware title, because IMHO they blew ME2 right down thier leg, i am hoping this is not the case with DA2, and we shall see in a few days, but what other titles does Bioware have to offer?

It seems simple enough to me that like with the addition of hardcore mode to Fallout New Vegas it is possible to cater to two seperate yet distinctive player types in the same title. If you want snappy graphics and characters flying all around the map like some Honk Kong choy suey flick you should have that, but also still provide a more deliberate game play style as well. Many months ago a poster asked a question on these boards. "what does Fallout New Vegas mean for DA2", my answer was and i still say, it shows it is still possible to make ONE game that includes a few different options that cater to different play styles, and that despite the expense and risk the developers took the game was still successful i think in large part because of this. The developers did not tell the player how to play, or what tactics to use, they said in a sense here is the world go nuts, tell me a story.

For all intensive purposes, a good story does not make a good game. What makes a good game is good gameplay, a story can be secondary to good game play and the game can still be good. I will use Left 4 Dead both one and two. Both are short on story but long on gameplay, mechanics and modes and both are still great games. Team Fortress 2 is another game that has NO story but excellent game play mechanics, the trick is finding that balance if you want to be a game developer, other than that you just make interactive movies. Interactive movies are ok to but they are NOT games i think Bioware might need to decide which side of the aisle they want to sit on.

Asai

Modifié par asaiasai, 28 février 2011 - 09:23 .


#136
TwistedComplex

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asaiasai wrote...

Sabresandiego wrote...

Do you know how many people complained that Modern Warfare 2 was a failure of a game for its lack of dedicated servers? It was the best selling FPS of all time and next years sale of Black Ops sales were even better.

The fact is this, DA2 is BETTER than origins. Gameplay sucked in origins, combat was totally imbalanced due to potions, invulns, and bad game mechanics. Origins was a great game due to story, art, writing, and fun factor, and had good combat animations. DA2 takes the good from Origins, and fixes what was wrong with it ----> the gameplay.

There are flaws with DA2. For example, I know for a fact that you can make fast responsive combat that is more appealing to a mature audience and doesnt suffer from ninja/anime teen appeal. I would prefer a more mature setting, with less cartoonish graphics, slightly more realistic combat without over the top moves, etc... BUT I am willing to accept the shortcomings of DA2 because they are far less than the games improvements. Responsive gameplay is absolutely essential for me, its why I loved ME2 and couldnt play origins more than once. DA2 is a HUGE improvement over origins.


The bolded parts there is not a single fact there, strong opinion yes but far from fact.


No it definatly was a fact that Origins was a heal/potion spam fest

Modifié par TwistedComplex, 28 février 2011 - 09:28 .


#137
Lotion Soronarr

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Agree with Op. I shall vote with my dollars too. Buy used..or just borrow a copy from a friend.

at this point, I'm interested in the story, not the game anymore.

#138
TwistedComplex

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Sabresandiego wrote...

 I will use Left 4 Dead both one and two. Both are short on story but long on gameplay, mechanics and modes and both are still great games. Team Fortress 2 is another game that has NO story but excellent game play mechanics
Asai


It's kind of hard to mess up FPS mechanics....

Modifié par TwistedComplex, 28 février 2011 - 09:31 .


#139
soteria

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TwistedComplext wrote...
No it definatly was a fact that Origins was a heal/potion spam fest

Not really. I guess you could play that way, but to claim the the game was universally "a heal/potion spam fest" is false. Other tactical options worked fine--I'd say better, even.

#140
SarahRhadis

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TwistedComplex wrote...



Sabresandiego wrote...

 I will use Left 4 Dead both one and two. Both are short on story but long on gameplay, mechanics and modes and both are still great games. Team Fortress 2 is another game that has NO story but excellent game play mechanics
Asai


It's kind of hard to mess up FPS mechanics....


  Not to mention.. Team Fortress 2 is built on entirely different gaming concepts than any Bioware game that I've ever played. Its a fantastic game, but this is really comparing apples to oranges. Yeah they are both games but not at all the same. Team Fortress 2 is built entirely around a balanced class system to work in multiplayer teams. The Game relies entirely on multiplayer to bring the fun.

 In my opinion DAO's gameplay was fun but not absolutely amazing, it was the Story, and the Characters that kept me hooked.

#141
Syrellaris

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TwistedComplex wrote...



Sabresandiego wrote...

 I will use Left 4 Dead both one and two. Both are short on story but long on gameplay, mechanics and modes and both are still great games. Team Fortress 2 is another game that has NO story but excellent game play mechanics
Asai


It's kind of hard to mess up FPS mechanics....


Yet Call of Duty Developers managed to do it 3 times in a row.

#142
Mad-Max90

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How can something be true and or factual foreverybody if they are your opinions, I personally like all that they have done so far, that does not make it fact, it is merely my opinion, and I don't try to force it down people's throaghts by making threads, live and let live you can't always get what you want

#143
TwistedComplex

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Syrellaris wrote...

TwistedComplex wrote...



Sabresandiego wrote...

 I will use Left 4 Dead both one and two. Both are short on story but long on gameplay, mechanics and modes and both are still great games. Team Fortress 2 is another game that has NO story but excellent game play mechanics
Asai


It's kind of hard to mess up FPS mechanics....


Yet Call of Duty Developers managed to do it 3 times in a row.


No they didn't

You point your crosshair at someone, and pull the trigger, that's the FPS mechnic

#144
RosaAquafire

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Buffy-Summers wrote...
I agree with the OP in all aspect and i pray to the Maker that this game has a LOWER metacric rating and sales worse then the original

I dont care if that kills any chance of a DA3, better to have no game then to have a hybrid rpg / action game when there are far more of those then real and true RPGs


You would honestly rather see hardworking, decent people who brought you many games that you love lose their jobs and have their lives in shambles, than have one game that you personally didn't care for be a success?

This blew my mind more than anything else in this thread.

#145
TwistedComplex

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RosaAquafire wrote...

Buffy-Summers wrote...
I agree with the OP in all aspect and i pray to the Maker that this game has a LOWER metacric rating and sales worse then the original

I dont care if that kills any chance of a DA3, better to have no game then to have a hybrid rpg / action game when there are far more of those then real and true RPGs


You would honestly rather see hardworking, decent people who brought you many games that you love lose their jobs and have their lives in shambles, than have one game that you personally didn't care for be a success?

This blew my mind more than anything else in this thread.


That's what happens with fan bases

They're too blinded by disappointment to see all the great games Bioware brought them in the past and how Bioware changed RPG development forever

#146
Aldandil

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TwistedComplex wrote...

RosaAquafire wrote...

Buffy-Summers wrote...
I agree with the OP in all aspect and i pray to the Maker that this game has a LOWER metacric rating and sales worse then the original

I dont care if that kills any chance of a DA3, better to have no game then to have a hybrid rpg / action game when there are far more of those then real and true RPGs


You would honestly rather see hardworking, decent people who brought you many games that you love lose their jobs and have their lives in shambles, than have one game that you personally didn't care for be a success?

This blew my mind more than anything else in this thread.


That's what happens with fan bases

They're too blinded by disappointment to see all the great games Bioware brought them in the past and how Bioware changed RPG development forever

Well, I consider myself to be a fan who doesn't complain too much about the new demo (because I though it was great fun to play) and generally think that most people posting criticism towards DA2 are biased against it and mostly spouting nonsense, but I wouldn't mind it if the sales for DA2 encouraged BioWare to make the next sequel more similar to DA:O. I disapprove of most changes, but that doesn't change the fact that DA2 looks like it'll be a damn fun game to play. Saying that no game at all is better than DA2 seems pretty idiotic though.

#147
Zigzaggy

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BobSmith101 wrote...

I have very little sympathy for people who claim to hate the game that much but will still play it.


Agreed..it's insanity

It achieves nothing..like a protest rally where nobody shows up.

Modifié par Zigzaggy, 28 février 2011 - 11:50 .


#148
Ellestor

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I fully expect that being able to better personalize Hawke than is possible in the demo (visually through character creation, mechanically through unlocked trees) will sweep away the weak connection I felt to my character.

If I had been required to play Mass Effect as soldier Sheploo, I probably wouldn't have finished Eden Prime.

Modifié par Ellestor, 28 février 2011 - 12:13 .


#149
PinkShoes

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TwistedComplex wrote...

Buffy-Summers wrote...

I agree with the OP in all aspect and i pray to the Maker that this game has a LOWER metacric rating and sales worse then the original


I dont care if that kills any chance of a DA3, better to have no game then to have a hybrid rpg / action game when there are far more of those then real and true RPGs



Sorry all i saw was

"I'm not having fun, so no one should have fun"

Would you like to try again?



Is this is what you was like when buffy the vampire slayer was cancelled? Its been years move on!

Anywhozle, i love the game and so do so many people and i also know ALOT of my friends are getting DA2 and they have been telling their friends because DA2 looks better than DAO and im sure this is the same with other people. I think DA2 will do better than DAO because everything good is still in there and they made a lot of good improvements. If anything, i want it to do good just to ****** off you annoying hater that think its bad because the combat is faster. :D

#150
Evolution33

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How is pressing a button and having something happen a bad thing? IN DAO you hit a button and shuffled to an enemy that might be dead by the time you got there or got the attack off. Now when the button is pushed the move happens. I really don't get how this is a bad thing.