Aldandil wrote...
AngryFrozenWater wrote...
BioWare have removed all skills, reduced the number of talents/spells in the lower levels which reduced the overall number at higher levels by about 8, there seems to be only one type of healing potion that fits in the quick heal slot (I assume all other types are gone), the same goes for lyrium potions, no signs of stamina potions, the over the top combat animations seem to be designed for an age group which is not supposed to play the game, because that same age group wants action they have increased to cooldown times of healing spells and potions, the dialogue wheel was designed for people who are not willing to read text (they now can click on icons instead). So, no. I don't think they have succeeded at all. The word streamlined doesn't seem to come close. It is just dumbed down.
I'd say that most of your argument are mostly based in what you like or dislike, rather than in what is more or less complicated which must be the definition for what is or isn't "dumbed down". Furthermore, "dumbed down" is clearly a comparison, in this case to DA:O, so it's not really an issue of whether something is complicated or not, it's an issue of whether it's complicated in comparison to DA:O.
Here are some responses to your arguments in order of appearance:
1: The removal of skills: The lack of skills certainly gives you one less type choice in the game, no arguing about that. I would
like to question the impact the skills had on DA:O, though. It could be
argued that skills didn't really impact the game much, except for
possibly when you had to make a trade off between coercion and combat
skills for the main character. Apart from that, there were no tactical
ramifications to what skills you picked, considering the very low need
to use them. Saying that something is "dumbed down", less complex, just
because you have fewer choices isn't wrong, exactly, but that point
isn't really as good when those choices don't make much of a difference.
That's like saying that DA2 is infinitely more complicated than
Baldur's Gate, since there are thousands of different faces that you can
make for your character, where there are only about twenty different
portraits in BG.
2: Fewer talents on lower levels: This argument is pretty much pointless considering that we for one don't know what the leveling speed is. We gained two levels in the first two fights, basically, so even though you only start with one spell compared to DA:O's three, we quickly catch up. This could very well be a way of easing us into the game considering that the opening isn't as "cushioned" as several of the Origins openings were.
3: Only one type of health pot: That's true, that means less options. What level of impact does that have on combat in DA2 compared to DA:O? Practically none. There were always plenty of different health pots of different types. But I'll grant you that it's a bit less comlicated with one compared to several.
4: Over the top animations: That
doesn't effect game play one bit. That's like saying that chess is the
most complicated game in the world just because there are no animations
at all when you conquer a piece. It could be considered more complicated than DA2 or DA:O for other reasons, but not because of the animations.
5: Longer cooldown on pots and heals. That's nonsense. Less healing doesn't make things easier, it makes combat harder. The different levels of health pots in DA:O were on effectually made them independent of cooldowns, which certainly didn't give cause for any brain activity when trying to decide what time would be optimal for using a health pot - you could do that anytime.
6: Icons on the dialogue wheel: Here we have a yes and no. It's easier to gauge the tone of each answer now, that much is true. However, simply reading the tone of an answer is not enough to decide what that answer will be. To do that, you still need to be literate. Some would argue that it's very difficult (and therefore also complicated, requiring sincere afterthought) to pick an answer now that we only have paraphrases as a foundation when making a decision. I personally don't find it easier than before.
In response to other posters:
Since there aren't actually fewer talents to choose from (about ninety (6*10+3*10) for each class plus the companion specific specializatons), it's pretty silly to claim that that part of character creation has been simplified. Having upgrades for different talents creates a very interesting choics: Will I be more effective with one more talent or bing better at what I'm already doing. That's hardly less complicated.
Companion inventory is less complicated and therefore "dumbed down", same goes for companions being locked to a certain weapon style.
Whether or not something is "dumbed down" or not isn't entirely subjective. The words themselves clearly indicates that something must require less brainwork than something else. This is fairly quantifiable. Some subjectivity comes into play when deciding whether or not you actually have to think about something. I'm sure most people would agree with me when I say that DA2 isn't more complex than BG just because there are more appearance options in the character creator. The question is what difference the differences make. I don't see any evidence that DA2 is less complex tactically than DA:O, but if I'm able to auto-attack myself through Nightmare, I'll be willing to agree that it is.
Oh, where to begin on actual evidence of dumbing down...
During the demo, I never read any of the snippets of dialogue. I didn't have to. I just moused over to get the icon I wanted at the time and let it go. In Origins, I read through every response and chose the one that I thought best suited my character. Dumbed down. Period.
When equipping my characters in Origins, I looked through all of the available items that I had, weighed them against each other, and chose the ones I thought best suited that character. Now, the game will tell me outright which is better (even which is better for which class) removing any amount of thinking that was previously involved. Dumbed down. Period.
Outside of easy mode, every mode required proper positioning of your characters when planning to use AOE spells, unless you wanted to hurt them. I'd often try to set up my "tank" to hold "aggro", then have the mage drop the AOE on him, damaging him but also hitting a majority of the enemy's forces. Now, in all modes but the absolute hardest (which I never had an interest in playing, but would be forced to in order to use a feature that was previously available to me in a difficulty setting that I do like playing, normal mode) I can just spam away with the big spells with no thought at all to any sort of negative consequences to my team. This removes proper planning and strategy, as well as breaks immersion. I thought it was stupid when they removed this feature from Diablo 2, and I still think it is stupid now. It makes the game "easier" and requires less thinking. Even better, monsters have friendly fire in every difficulty, punishing them for using big spells and making the game even easier for the player. Dumbed down. Period.
The best reason for the third change being proof of "dumbing down" is the reason the debs gave for friendly fire not being an option that you can toggle on and off in any difficulty: someone would accidentally toggle it, not knowing what they did, and then would complain and quit the game because it was "too hard". They just told you what they think of the player base (or the intended one), so what more needs to be said on the subject?
Call it "streamlining" all you want. I'll call it how it is.
Modifié par Captain Sassy Pants, 28 février 2011 - 03:30 .
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