130 réponses à ce sujet

[Eternal Phoenix]

nijnij wrote...

I originally posted this on the Origins forum, but I believe it is related to DA2 as well, since I imagine the release plans for DLC and future editions are similar.


Like many people I suppose, most people perhaps, I bought Dragon Age Origins pretty much when it was new, which means at its highest price (49.99 €). Which is normal. I also got two free pieces of DLC (Stone Prisoner and Blood Dragon Armor) for buying it on Steam. Again, fair deal.

A while back, Bioware released the Dragon Age Origins ultimate edition, which also costs 49.99 € but contains every other DLC and the expansion. I would have liked to play all this content (and still would), but buying the whole package when I already have the biggest portion of it seems like a waste. Then again, if I buy the content I'm  missing separately (= 29 € worth of DLC + the 20 € expansion), the price is the same, 49 €.

That means whatever happens, I get my "114 $ worth of content" for... 98 € (= 135 $ !!).

Now, here is my question : how come the people who bought the game before everyone else, and therefore, probably allowed for the release of the Ultimate edition in the first place, still have to pay their DLC full price, while a cheaper edition is now available for those who skipped on the game ? Wouldn't it be logical for DLC prices to go down as well by now ? Seems to me it would be fair at least. Why priviledge the skeptical over the fans ?


If I get Dragon Age 2 new (and I probably will), I pay more than the people who will buy it in a year. It is normal since in a year, the game won't be "the new $#!t" anymore. However, the DLC will still be as expensive, while people who waited long enough to get the ultimate edition or whatever the new package will be called will also get the DLC for cheaper. Isn't that somewhat unfair ?

I brought DA:O for £30, sold it for £20 and brought the Ultimate for £30. All in all, I paid £40 for everything. Once I'm done with DA2 in some months, I may sell it for £20 and buy the Ultimate Edition for £40 (once it is annouced). This means I would have paid £60 for full game, expansion/s and DLC. That's not all bad.

[AlanC9]

hawat333 wrote...

I can agree.
First off, content made before the release should be free for everywhone who buys the game. Otherwise it's ripping off customers, which is not buying any symphaties. Feel free to look around on another forums discussing the Exiled Prince, you'll get the picture.

Can I just say "insert automobile accessory analogy here" rather than actually doing it? We all know the drill by now.

[nijnij]

Cozarkian wrote...

It's really not an issue of fair or unfair, it's just plain bad marketing.

I pre-ordered DA:O, but never finished. I think $7 for DLC is too high, so I didn't purchase any beyond what came with the game. With DA2 coming out, I started playing DA:O again. With DA2 around the corner, the value of that DLC is even less, but the price is still the same. If the marketing department had been smart and dropped the price of DLC, or sold DLC bundles, I might have been convinced to purchase some.

This. A lot of people are missing my point which is that I don't mind buying the game full price, I'm strictly talking about the DLC.

People seem to argue that if all the DLC is included for free in the ultimate edition, it is because it's "the only way to get those skeptical customers to buy the game". To which my reply is... Since when is Bioware's goal to make people buy the game ? Bioware's legitimate goal is to make money with whatever they can, otherwise there would be no DLC in the first place (and no T-shirts !). What if I am just like these skeptical customers who refuse to buy the game full price, except I refuse to pay DLC full price ? Aren't Bioware missing my money ?

Prices didn't go down just for Origins : they scaled down for Awakening as well. Why wouldn't they for DLC ? I'm not fancying myself as a spirit of justice, I'm actually pointing out that there's more money to be made ! I mean, it's not like they're still selling a lot of DLC for Origins, is it ? Clearly, people who've waited this long are not likely to get it.

I don't get all the hate here. It's like I'm being told to either get screwed and buy everything new, or to screw everyone and buy everything cheaper. What if I don't mind paying the main product full price but won't buy DLC as long as it's that expensive ? Aren't Bioware missing my money ? That's all I'm saying. Like I'm litterally suggesting a way to sell more DLC. If that makes me cheap, then I must be missing out on something.

[JrayM16]

I believe the OP made a very interesting point. Because most of the arguing I see on the dlc front is about Day-1 dlc bonuses for preordering and complaining that the Day-1 buyers are privileged over the skeptics. I guess this thread can act as an informal rebuttal of sorts.

[CroGamer002]

Cause nobody would buy a 1-2 year old game for same price as a new game without some extra content.

[nijnij]

Mesina2 wrote...

Cause nobody would buy a 1-2 year old game for same price as a new game without some extra content.

And nobody would buy 1-2 year old DLC without some discount. It's as simple as that.

[Lord_Saulot]

nijnij wrote...

Now, here is my question : how come the people who bought the game before everyone else, and therefore, probably allowed for the release of the Ultimate edition in the first place, still have to pay their DLC full price, while a cheaper edition is now available for those who skipped on the game ? Wouldn't it be logical for DLC prices to go down as well by now ? Seems to me it would be fair at least. Why priviledge the skeptical over the fans ?

Simple.

The market values new games higher than old games.  Game value degrades quickly.  You pay for the privilege of having the newest game and playing it when it comes out.  As demand decreases, prices go down and bundles like the Ultimate Edition are released so that those willing to pay lower prices will find the product more attractive.  The game company charge the high price to those willing to pay it, then decrease it for those who will pay the next lower price, and so forth.  It is reasonably good system of price discrimination sorted chronologically.

[Huntress]

nijnij wrote...

I originally posted this on the Origins forum, but I believe it is related to DA2 as well, since I imagine the release plans for DLC and future editions are similar.


Like many people I suppose, most people perhaps, I bought Dragon Age Origins pretty much when it was new, which means at its highest price (49.99 €). Which is normal. I also got two free pieces of DLC (Stone Prisoner and Blood Dragon Armor) for buying it on Steam. Again, fair deal.

A while back, Bioware released the Dragon Age Origins ultimate edition, which also costs 49.99 € but contains every other DLC and the expansion. I would have liked to play all this content (and still would), but buying the whole package when I already have the biggest portion of it seems like a waste. Then again, if I buy the content I'm  missing separately (= 29 € worth of DLC + the 20 € expansion), the price is the same, 49 €.

That means whatever happens, I get my "114 $ worth of content" for... 98 € (= 135 $ !!).

Now, here is my question : how come the people who bought the game before everyone else, and therefore, probably allowed for the release of the Ultimate edition in the first place, still have to pay their DLC full price, while a cheaper edition is now available for those who skipped on the game ? Wouldn't it be logical for DLC prices to go down as well by now ? Seems to me it would be fair at least. Why priviledge the skeptical over the fans ?


If I get Dragon Age 2 new (and I probably will), I pay more than the people who will buy it in a year. It is normal since in a year, the game won't be "the new $#!t" anymore. However, the DLC will still be as expensive, while people who waited long enough to get the ultimate edition or whatever the new package will be called will also get the DLC for cheaper. Isn't that somewhat unfair ?

You are missing a HUGE point: People rent games, subscribe it for 10 dollards new Code, this rented games comes without any cash towards bioware or EA mind you, this people buy DLC for 5-7 dollards, thats the money boiware and EA make: $10 code
                : $5 DLC
                :$ 7DLC  ect.

This is a Company, this people work for money to feed themself  is not volunters works.

[nijnij]

Lord_Saulot wrote...
The market values new games higher than old games. 

Then shouldn't the market value new DLC higher than old DLC ?

Lord_Saulot wrote...
Game value degrades quickly.

Doesn't DLC value degrade quickly ? Isn't DLC part of the game ?

Lord_Saulot wrote...
You pay for the privilege of having the newest game and playing it when it comes out. 

Same with new DLC, I never argued against that.

Lord_Saulot wrote...
As demand decreases, prices go down

Why not for DLC ?

Lord_Saulot wrote...
bundles like the Ultimate Edition are released so that those willing to pay lower prices will find the product more attractive.

Well, am I not willing to pay lower prices for my DLC ? Shouldn't the price be more attractive after a year + so that I can buy it, as opposed to not buy it ?

Lord_Saulot wrote...
The game company charge the high price to those willing to pay it...
 

And I'm not willing to pay it, as far as DLC is concerned anyway.

Lord_Saulot wrote...
...then decrease it for those who will pay the next lower price, and so forth.

No they don't (as far as DLC is concerned anyway).


We seem to have the exact same logic except you don't apply it to DLC.

[DJ0000]

I agree dlc should go down in price over time but it won't. The only dlc I've noticed go down is Awakening which I severly wish I had waited to buy.

The problem is that the Ultimated Edition is a hard copy. No matter what the original price is eventually the shop has to get rid of it and will sell it for cheap to do so.

DLC though, is not a hard copy, it is just a file and can't be bought anywhere else, except Awakening, which means they will always make more money from it and won't bring the price down for that very reason.

[Phoenixblight]

DJ0000 wrote...

I agree dlc should go down in price over time but it won't. The only dlc I've noticed go down is Awakening which I severly wish I had waited to buy.

The problem is that the Ultimated Edition is a hard copy. No matter what the original price is eventually the shop has to get rid of it and will sell it for cheap to do so.

DLC though, is not a hard copy, it is just a file and can't be bought anywhere else, except Awakening, which means they will always make more money from it and won't bring the price down for that very reason.

No, DIgital Distributors sell it too I bought it from steam for 30$. 

Modifié par Phoenixblight, 02 mars 2011 - 09:19 .

[Cobrawar]

the longer a game is out the less likely people will buy the game. So normally the price goes does to entice people still on the fence. This game isn't worth paying the full price for anyway and is a better deal if you wait or get a hacked copy.

[Huntress]

DJ0000 wrote...

I agree dlc should go down in price over time but it won't. The only dlc I've noticed go down is Awakening which I severly wish I had waited to buy.

The problem is that the Ultimated Edition is a hard copy. No matter what the original price is eventually the shop has to get rid of it and will sell it for cheap to do so.

DLC though, is not a hard copy, it is just a file and can't be bought anywhere else, except Awakening, which means they will always make more money from it and won't bring the price down for that very reason.

DLC are NOT a must HAVE, is the extra cash for new DLC, expantions, you name it.

People rent games, the shop from where they rent do not pay anything to bioware or EA, Bioware is a COMPANY not a chairty, they need money to feed themselves.

People who rent games, will buy/pay for dlc thats when Bioware make the money. DLC are very cheap.
You want a win win situation? do NOT buy the new game, buy them 1 year after problem solve.

[AlanC9]

Actually, I think Bio's leaving money on the table. I never bought WK, RtO, or GA, as I don't figure they're worth the price. Cut that in half and I'd buy them.

Well, not really -- since I never bought DAA either, I'm better off picking up the UE anyway. But I'm sure there are some folks who'd buy them at a lower price.

[Huntress]

Cobrawar wrote...

the longer a game is out the less likely people will buy the game. So normally the price goes does to entice people still on the fence. This game isn't worth paying the full price for anyway and is a better deal if you wait or get a hacked copy.

Hey! you are unhappy the way DA2 is going, thats just fine, I am too!! now stop asking people to get hacked copy, it won't help. Please?

[Phoenixblight]

AlanC9 wrote...

Actually, I think Bio's leaving money on the table. I never bought WK, RtO, or GA, as I don't figure they're worth the price. Cut that in half and I'd buy them.

Well, not really -- since I never bought DAA either, I'm better off picking up the UE anyway. But I'm sure there are some folks who'd buy them at a lower price.

Bioware, PSN and XBL have done many sales for the DLC for half off some even going for a week.  Its actually how I bought all my DLC for ME2 and Dragon Age: Origins for the 360. 

Modifié par Phoenixblight, 02 mars 2011 - 09:37 .

[Lord Gremlin]

Huh. OP, here's the thing - game's value diminishes with time. It's like fashion... Anyway, this is something I've come to accept. I've bought DAO on occasion, new copies were on sale for a relatively small price. It was right after Awakening release. Then I've bought all DLC and Awakening on PSN at full price, because I loved DAO. Here's the thing, I've recently bought Assassin's Creed 2 GOTY, very cheap. With all DLC on disk. And this game sucks so hard...
When it comes to Dragon Age, I think it's worth it. I'll buy DA2 and all it's DLC just because I enjoy it.

[Hathur]

Maybe it's cus I'm getting old... but games today cost basically the same as they did 20 years ago... 50 dollars Canadian for a PC game (although EA & Activision are hiking up their games to 60... though I get around this by buying digital download versions.. I.e. I got Dragon Age 2 for 45 bucks by preordering digitally during Christmas from direct2drive ).

The cost of food, gas, hydro, toilet paper, water etc... has all gone up since then... yet games stayed the same price. I don't begrudge developers or even the publishers wanting to make a few extra bucks off me with DLC... especially considering that I don't have to buy their DLC (I bought 1 DLC for DA:O ... hated it, never bought another because their first paid DLC was sheer crap... MAss Effect 2 on the other hand, I've bought every single piece of DLC because the quality justified the expense to me).

I'm not even overly bitter about PC games costing $60 lately rather than 50... considering that I was paying 50 for some 20 years.... a 10 dollar jump over 20 years is nothing to cry about... and DLC is optional.

As for DA2, I currently am skeptical / doubtful I will buy DLC for it... the DA / ME teams are different and have different concepts / standards of quality when it comes to DLC.... The Dragon Age team was happy to put out inferior DLC, the Mass Effect 2 team put out quality DLC (Kasumi, Shadow Broker, Overlord).

So for DA2 it will be wait and see... I'll wait several weeks after the first paid DLC is released, read if they've cleaned up their act about how they make DLC, then decide.... the Mass Effect team on the other hand gets the benefit of the doubt from me... they've put out great quality DLC and I will not hesitate to buy any and all DLC made by them without waiting for reviews from other players.

Modifié par Hathur, 02 mars 2011 - 09:45 .

[nijnij]

Lord Gremlin wrote...

Huh. OP, here's the thing - game's value diminishes with time. It's like fashion...

I aknowledged that in all my posts, I'm just asking whether it should be the same for DLC. I don't see what's so hard to understand about it. If anything, this proves this state of things hasn't been questioned enough yet.

[DJ0000]

Huntress wrote...

DJ0000 wrote...

I agree dlc should go down in price over time but it won't. The only dlc I've noticed go down is Awakening which I severly wish I had waited to buy.

The problem is that the Ultimated Edition is a hard copy. No matter what the original price is eventually the shop has to get rid of it and will sell it for cheap to do so.

DLC though, is not a hard copy, it is just a file and can't be bought anywhere else, except Awakening, which means they will always make more money from it and won't bring the price down for that very reason.

DLC are NOT a must HAVE, is the extra cash for new DLC, expantions, you name it.

People rent games, the shop from where they rent do not pay anything to bioware or EA, Bioware is a COMPANY not a chairty, they need money to feed themselves.

People who rent games, will buy/pay for dlc thats when Bioware make the money. DLC are very cheap.
You want a win win situation? do NOT buy the new game, buy them 1 year after problem solve.

I went down the root of just buying the ones I thought were worth it. No Golems of Amgarrak, No Darkspawn Chronicles, No Lelian's Song. I never even bothered to watch a video to see what happened in them.

I know in business terms it is their perogitive to price it, and I don't blame them I just think it should go down in price over time, that's just my opinion. That way they could squeeze a little more money out of people like me who don't want to pay that much for them.

[borelocin]

DLC stays up because each subsequent purchaser of a game that is resold has to buy it separately.

[nijnij]

DJ0000 wrote...
I know in business terms it is their perogitive to price it, and I don't blame them I just think it should go down in price over time, that's just my opinion. That way they could squeeze a little more money out of people like me who don't want to pay that much for them.

Here you go, I thought I was alone here for a while.

[DJ0000]

nijnij wrote...

DJ0000 wrote...
I know in business terms it is their perogitive to price it, and I don't blame them I just think it should go down in price over time, that's just my opinion. That way they could squeeze a little more money out of people like me who don't want to pay that much for them.

Here you go, I thought I was alone here for a while.

I'm right here with you buddy

[Mage One]

I generally agree, and I have found the phenomenon both annoying and odd. It's also rather irritating that Dragon Age DLC has gone on sale a number of times on Xbox Live, which would have been great, except I don't have Dragon Age for my Xbox, I have it for my PC.

[nijnij]

Mage One wrote...

I generally agree, and I have found the phenomenon both annoying and odd. It's also rather irritating that Dragon Age DLC has gone on sale a number of times on Xbox Live, which would have been great, except I don't have Dragon Age for my Xbox, I have it for my PC.

Me too. Which is ironic, since digital versions (= can't be resold) happen to be on PC. So saying DLC's purpose is to compensate from people buying hard copies second hand instead of from EA doesn't make that much sense.