803 réponses à ce sujet

[Pwener2313]

Zulu, each time you post, your opinion is degraded more and more. Everyone can see it, now it's your turn. Get a break and cool off. Your quotes don't even have integral points, just one liners of incredibly weak attempts at fighting everyone that thinks opposite to you.

[Robuthad]

Half the time I destroyed the base because I like BOOM.
But keeping it to mine it of all its resources is a damn sound idea. In the history of Cerberus, if they do ever actually muck it up and get: indoctrinated, eaten, destroyed, attacked ect this just evens it out again.
The whole Rachni, husk, creepers thing. Shep sorted that out.
The Gillian thing. Sorted itself out.
And the whole Paul Grayson/Reaper. Sorted out,..eventually.

So if anything ever did do awry with the base, I have no doubt we'd have the ability to end it in some way.

[emmanuelsieyes]

There are a lot of really good arguments in here on both sides. I know that this thread usually turns into a flamewar, but I'm glad that I got a chance to reconsider my decision.

Regarding Cerberus:

I feel that the success of the Lazarus Project was the 'author's saving throw' for Cerberus. With the exception of the Lazarus Project, and to a lesser extent, the development of EDI, all of the Cerberus-led research projects have been total screwups. The Normandy SR2 is a nice ship, but it's based off of the Normandy SR1. The R&D for the stealth systems/Tantalus drive core was already done. The intel on the Thanix Cannon/Shields was given by party members, not Cerberus.

I get the feeling that BioWare wanted to make ME2 darker, so they replaced the Alliance with Cerberus. They had to take a 180 degree turn and claim that all of the Cerberus mad science in ME1 was just rogue cells. But all this really proves is that the Illusive Man can't manage his operation worth a damn.

'I did what I had to do' doesn't really apply to TIM. For instance, the Pragia research to increase the strength of human biotics. Clearly, it worked. However, the only thing it produced is a psychopathic murderer. Hell, according to the 'Subject Zero Biotic Boost' information, jack is suffering neural damage. What's the odds on her surviving the next decade? Cerberus has an absolutely abysmal success rate when it comes to developing useful technology. Hell, even EDI was a near-miss. It's luck of the draw that she turned out okay. Imagine if the AI capable of remote-detonating fusion reactors (which makes the engineer in me rage) went rogue?

[Pwener2313]

Pwener2313 wrote...

Keeping the base, in simpler ways, is trump card. That Cerberus can produce weaponry or any kind of technology from it is 30% at best. The other 70% is the whole place backfiring horribly. But compared to the previous races that have been "reaped" before us, a 30% is a God send. All others before us didn't even have a chance to find out what was happening until their galaxy was in a state of mass chaos.

Keeping the base is actually a sound idea. What's the worse that could happen? Husks? Indoctrination of Cerberus personnel that people hate? Destruction? Isn't all that stuff still coming anyway....

Yes, it is. TIM helps the galaxy destroy the Reapers and then tries to use the base to take over the galaxy. At least we would have a galaxy to defend against an incredibly lesser foe compared to the Reapers. It's not like TIM alone with the base is more dangerous then the Reapers. Otherwise he would use the base to singlehandedly take out the Reaper threat.

Sacrifice a potential resource and throw the fate of the galaxy to further chance, or keep it and have a potential weapon to stop the Reapers with. Either way, it is actually worth the risk. You would destroy the base because you don't trust TIM/Cerberus? That is a very naive thing to do. If any of the previous races that were anihilated by the Reapers were here now, they would tell you to keep it. If Vigil were still active, he would tell you it's worth it. All of them would.

You have no idea what's coming and still would potentially doom the galaxy to extinction, ensuring that the Reapers continue their horrible cycle of destruction, dooming incalculable souls to death, and even worse, Reaperfication, because you hate Cerberus? i am sorry, but wathever may come out of that base that could be bad, would never compare to what the Reapers have done for who knows how long.

Really, you prefer a nuke dropped on your home then a dictatorship? If you do, you need to revaluate yourself.

[MadCat221]

Robuthad wrote...

Half the time I destroyed the base because I like BOOM.
But keeping it to mine it of all its resources is a damn sound idea. In the history of Cerberus, if they do ever actually muck it up and get: indoctrinated, eaten, destroyed, attacked ect this just evens it out again.
The whole Rachni, husk, creepers thing. Shep sorted that out.
The Gillian thing. Sorted itself out.
And the whole Paul Grayson/Reaper. Sorted out,..eventually.

So if anything ever did do awry with the base, I have no doubt we'd have the ability to end it in some way.

I'm more concerned for the case that nothing goes wrong... and Cerberus gains something.  Cerberus doesn't do what's necessary, they do what's convenient.  I doubt that whatever they make use of from there will be used on just the Reapers.

It is not a "trump card".  It is a tool for Cerberus to gain dominion over everyone they deem a threat, be it a mechanical eldritch abomination or a sapient starfaring species that isn't human.  And that's why it's just as dangerous to keep it as it is to destroy it.  Did you forget, this is Cerberus we're talking about?

"Cerberus... more like ICARUS, amirite?"

Modifié par MadCat221, 08 mars 2011 - 02:22 .

[Pwener2313]

MadCat221 wrote...

"Cerberus... more like ICARUS, amirite?"

[MadCat221]

Truth hurts, don'it?

[Pwener2313]

What? No. I meant it as it's a weak joke. I stand by my post and that it's worth a shot to keep the base. Did you even read the whole thing? I doubt it as you only posted "trump card". Read it please.

[MadCat221]

And you didn't read my response.

Whatever Cerberus finds on there won't be just used on the Reapers, or even stored for a rainy day. If it secures human dominance, whatever fruits of science come off that base WILL be used against whoever Cerberus deems a threat to humanity. That's their way.

Which threat do you perceive as more dire, the giant eldritch abomination before you, or the crazy survivalist in all likelihood hiding a dagger behind his back behind you?

[Pwener2313]

MadCat221 wrote...

Which threat do you perceive as more dire, the giant eldritch abomination before you, or the crazy survivalist in all likelihood hiding a dagger behind his back behind you?

This is the crap that Im talking about. Really? TIM is a bigger threat then the Reapers? Really? You know what, Im not gonna argue with you. Read my *whole* post, and *then* revaluate yourself.

TIM more dangerous then the Reapers? wtf

[Rekkampum]

MadCat221 wrote...
It is not a "trump card".  It is a tool for Cerberus to gain dominion over everyone they deem a threat, be it a mechanical eldritch abomination or a sapient starfaring species that isn't human.  And that's why it's just as dangerous to keep it as it is to destroy it.  Did you forget, this is Cerberus we're talking about?

Perhaps you don't know what a "trump card" is, since it is also a figure of speech for any key resource that can be used at an opportune moment. Based on your response, the term, as it applies to the Collector Base, fits a group like Cerberus perfectly.

Modifié par Rekkampum, 08 mars 2011 - 02:48 .

[Sajuro]

Pwener: I think you are seriously underestimate the amount of fracking up that can happen if the Base backfires. It could very prove catastrophic to the cause of fighting the Reapers (The use of seeker swarms to immobilize strike teams, hell a swarm could carry people off) The base's tech could also supplement the power of the Reaper's ground forces assuming the Reapers don't carry the best weapons and armor around with them. They could use it as an area to create Reaper grade viruses without an actual Reaper of Avatar present.

[Pwener2313]

It's worth it. The previous races did not have acest to "Pure Reaper Tech" and they got anihilated. We have the chance to do stuff that they couldn't. We can go out of the stablished sistem and take the biggest chance in galactic history. It may backfire, yes, but the it's wirth it to stop the Reapers. Forget cerberus, forget the Alliance. Forget about everything, the reapers are too dangerous to fight without having something we can rely on.

Yes, the Base may backfire (30% against 70%) but it's worth it. Every previous race would give anything for a second chance. We have one, we should not do what they did, fight them ourselves. We have a chance and no matter how small it may seem, Im taking it. Wathever happens, happens.

[J. Finley]

I destroyed the base. I want a challenge.

[Pwener2313]

Jayman1337 wrote...

I destroyed the base. I want a challenge.

People like this should be forced into a Reaper victory ending.

[J. Finley]

Pwener2313 wrote...

Jayman1337 wrote...

I destroyed the base. I want a challenge.

People like this should be forced into a Reaper victory ending.

What's the fun in playing a game if you know it's going to be easy? A game like Mass Effect especially.

Modifié par Jayman1337, 08 mars 2011 - 03:19 .

[Pwener2313]

I take the Mass Effect war against the Reapers very seriously. More fun? Oh my God.....

[J. Finley]

All I'm saying is it might be more entertaining for the player to put their character in a situation like that. It also makes them look even better if they still manage to win without that Reaper garbage.

[Pwener2313]

Im gonna be the first here yelling "TOLD YOU SO" when ME3 is released.

[Sajuro]

Pwener2313 wrote...

Jayman1337 wrote...

I destroyed the base. I want a challenge.

People like this should be forced into a Reaper victory ending.

It's called the power of friendship, deal with it.

[Sajuro]

Pwener2313 wrote...

Im gonna be the first here yelling "TOLD YOU SO" when ME3 is released.

and probably the first crying on the forums when Paragons aren't punished for everything they do.

[Pwener2313]

Sajuro wrote...

Pwener2313 wrote...

Jayman1337 wrote...

I destroyed the base. I want a challenge.

People like this should be forced into a Reaper victory ending.

It's called the power of friendship, deal with it.

Unlike Miranda's loyalty powered latex suit, friendship isn't bulletproof. Things are gonna get from bad to worse in ME3. Im not taking any chances with this. I'll do wathever it takes and sacrifice anything to stop the Reapers. Im guessing a lot of people are gonna lose this war. Paragon choices and being friendly only gets you so far.

[J. Finley]

You honestly think those who destroy the base are going to automatically lose?



Why not instead of destroying the base have a "Shoot yourself" option?

Modifié par Jayman1337, 08 mars 2011 - 03:40 .

[Pwener2313]

Sajuro wrote...

Pwener2313 wrote...

Im gonna be the first here yelling "TOLD YOU SO" when ME3 is released.

and probably the first crying on the forums when Paragons aren't punished for everything they do.

You have that right. If it were realistic, all of you would be pleading the "machine gods" to spare you. But BW likes to make everyone a winner. That's not how a choice based RPG is done. Some choices should get you killed, others would get *others* killed and there are some that *should* get the galaxy blown up.

[Pwener2313]

Jayman1337 wrote...

You honestly think those who destroy the base are going to automatically lose?

No, Im not saying that. Im saying that destroying it is incredibly foolish and naive. It may be the moral thing to do, but canocally, it should be the correct thing to do.

Correct and morally correct aren't the same thing.