Maybe this game will convert people to Christianity, who knows...
Will your Hawke Believe in the maker?
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My Avatar is a Lizard
, mars 03 2011 12:54
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#302
Guest_Puddi III_*
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 06:40
Guest_Puddi III_*
Guest_Puddi III_*
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In the context of this fictional setting all of these fantastic things could yet have natural explanations. Hell, even if "magic" as such were to arise, or were always to have existed in our world, it could still be something with a natural explanation we simply haven't discovered yet. So if I were to transpose my own beliefs onto the game I would see no reason to abandon agnosticism.
Now, as for my Hawke? Well, depends on what Hawke I'm playing.
Now, as for my Hawke? Well, depends on what Hawke I'm playing.
#303
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 07:07
atheelogos
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a sensible approachFilament wrote...
In the context of this fictional setting all of these fantastic things could yet have natural explanations. Hell, even if "magic" as such were to arise, or were always to have existed in our world, it could still be something with a natural explanation we simply haven't discovered yet. So if I were to transpose my own beliefs onto the game I would see no reason to abandon agnosticism.
Now, as for my Hawke? Well, depends on what Hawke I'm playing.
#304
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 07:17
Lord_Caledore
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My mage Hawke will believe in the Maker (in part because I don't think it makes sense in the setting to not believe in any god), but will not be particularly devout nor care for the Chantry or their dogma - quite unlike my devout Grey Warden.
I'll kill any Templars who try to come after me, but if they leave me alone, I'll leave them alone. They can do whatever they want to the weak-willed Circle mages for all my Hawke cares, as long as they don't mess with him or his family.
I'll kill any Templars who try to come after me, but if they leave me alone, I'll leave them alone. They can do whatever they want to the weak-willed Circle mages for all my Hawke cares, as long as they don't mess with him or his family.
Modifié par Lord_Caledore, 04 mars 2011 - 07:18 .
#305
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 07:52
fighterchick
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It depends on the playthrough for me. More often than not, I don't think she will. I enjoyed the bits in origins that pissed people off when you said you didn't believe in the maker. LIke Human Noble origin with Mother Mallol, or in the Ostagar camp when the woman asked if you came to get the maker's blessing. My character told her no, and she nastily said, "be gone, heathen". Moments like that just make me laugh, so I'm hoping for some more this time around.
Modifié par fighterchicks, 04 mars 2011 - 07:54 .
#306
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:12
Medhia Nox
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Not only will I believe in the Maker - I'll join the Circle if my mage is an Apostate (which it looks like he is).
The Black City is real in the Fade - every mage knows this. The Tevinter Imperium is what happens when mages get to rule - and LONG before there was a corrupt Chantry, there was an evil Tevinter who enslaved everyone.
I think it's interesting how people ignore the lore of Dragon Age because of their own personal bias. Andraste liberated the world from mages - who presumably created (became) the Darkspawn by perverting the Black City.
It is a fact that there are spirits in the Fade - those spirits are based off emotions both good and bad. They're not myth in the Dragon Age universe - they're a reality. So too, I believe, is the Maker in the Dragon Age universe.
I'd love for them to go several games without providing a real answer - and then smacking everyone with a "Yes, the Maker is a fact."
It's so posh to be rebellious.
The Black City is real in the Fade - every mage knows this. The Tevinter Imperium is what happens when mages get to rule - and LONG before there was a corrupt Chantry, there was an evil Tevinter who enslaved everyone.
I think it's interesting how people ignore the lore of Dragon Age because of their own personal bias. Andraste liberated the world from mages - who presumably created (became) the Darkspawn by perverting the Black City.
It is a fact that there are spirits in the Fade - those spirits are based off emotions both good and bad. They're not myth in the Dragon Age universe - they're a reality. So too, I believe, is the Maker in the Dragon Age universe.
I'd love for them to go several games without providing a real answer - and then smacking everyone with a "Yes, the Maker is a fact."
It's so posh to be rebellious.
#307
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:38
atheelogos
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toolMedhia Nox wrote...
Not only will I believe in the Maker - I'll join the Circle if my mage is an Apostate (which it looks like he is).
The Black City is real in the Fade - every mage knows this. The Tevinter Imperium is what happens when mages get to rule - and LONG before there was a corrupt Chantry, there was an evil Tevinter who enslaved everyone.
I think it's interesting how people ignore the lore of Dragon Age because of their own personal bias. Andraste liberated the world from mages - who presumably created (became) the Darkspawn by perverting the Black City.
It is a fact that there are spirits in the Fade - those spirits are based off emotions both good and bad. They're not myth in the Dragon Age universe - they're a reality. So too, I believe, is the Maker in the Dragon Age universe.
I'd love for them to go several games without providing a real answer - and then smacking everyone with a "Yes, the Maker is a fact."
It's so posh to be rebellious.
:P
#310
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:44
Ealos
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Aesieru wrote...
Maybe this game will convert people to Christianity, who knows...
Not sure how much Andrasteism and Christianity have in common in terms of teaching, tbh... in fact, what does the chant really say, other than magic not being made to rule man? And the maker coming back sometime?
#312
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:51
Medhia Nox
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@Attheelogos: Sorry man, I'm a Warhammer player - if I could start an Imperial Inquisition on Thedas I would.
So watch yourself apostate - Mage-Inquisitor Nox will find your rebellious arse and nail you upside down to a tree (that's what we'll do to apostate mages we capture).
We're supported by Irving - he's all for it. I asked him - he said apostates are butt-candy for demons of the Fade.
So watch yourself apostate - Mage-Inquisitor Nox will find your rebellious arse and nail you upside down to a tree (that's what we'll do to apostate mages we capture).
We're supported by Irving - he's all for it. I asked him - he said apostates are butt-candy for demons of the Fade.
#313
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:51
Bluto Blutarskyx
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some yes, some no.
my first char definately will, its part of his character.
he is a self hating mage that has numerous psycological disorders and is prone to physical outbursts and fits of violence leading him to forgo thought healing and magic skills in favor of using his staff vs certain enemies (not sure what enemies yet- maybe darkspawn but not if they are only in the beginning of the game).
im still working on some aspects of his psycological disorder(s) but self harm is one of them (not really able to bring into the game, but he constantly bangs his body with rocks in camp to punish himself for bieng an evil bieng- no cutting, just smashing his own hands, legs kneecaps, then healing them with magic), self loathing due to his mage status is another, inability to deal with people in a social setting (except family) is another.
basically hes a lunatic with stats to focus less on magic and mroe on showcasing his psycotic rage and durability.
and most of his problems probably stem from his extreme sense of devotion to the maker and the chantry and belief that all mages should be controlled or killed.
(yes the fact that his sister and he are apostates factor into that- thats what makes it so fun)
my first char definately will, its part of his character.
he is a self hating mage that has numerous psycological disorders and is prone to physical outbursts and fits of violence leading him to forgo thought healing and magic skills in favor of using his staff vs certain enemies (not sure what enemies yet- maybe darkspawn but not if they are only in the beginning of the game).
im still working on some aspects of his psycological disorder(s) but self harm is one of them (not really able to bring into the game, but he constantly bangs his body with rocks in camp to punish himself for bieng an evil bieng- no cutting, just smashing his own hands, legs kneecaps, then healing them with magic), self loathing due to his mage status is another, inability to deal with people in a social setting (except family) is another.
basically hes a lunatic with stats to focus less on magic and mroe on showcasing his psycotic rage and durability.
and most of his problems probably stem from his extreme sense of devotion to the maker and the chantry and belief that all mages should be controlled or killed.
(yes the fact that his sister and he are apostates factor into that- thats what makes it so fun)
Modifié par Bluto Blutarskyx, 04 mars 2011 - 08:52 .
#314
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:52
baddogkelevra
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Medhia Nox wrote...
Not only will I believe in the Maker - I'll join the Circle if my mage is an Apostate (which it looks like he is).
The Black City is real in the Fade - every mage knows this. The Tevinter Imperium is what happens when mages get to rule - and LONG before there was a corrupt Chantry, there was an evil Tevinter who enslaved everyone.
I think it's interesting how people ignore the lore of Dragon Age because of their own personal bias. Andraste liberated the world from mages - who presumably created (became) the Darkspawn by perverting the Black City.
It is a fact that there are spirits in the Fade - those spirits are based off emotions both good and bad. They're not myth in the Dragon Age universe - they're a reality. So too, I believe, is the Maker in the Dragon Age universe.
I'd love for them to go several games without providing a real answer - and then smacking everyone with a "Yes, the Maker is a fact."
It's so posh to be rebellious.
But who told you that in game? It was the Chantry. We don't have any story of Andraste or the Fade that isn't based on the claims of the Chantry. The game starts by saying "the Chantry teaches us that it is the hubris of men which first brought the darkspawn." Wynne even says it may be an allegory. The point is, we don't know, because we've never been to the Black City in game. And about the Tevinter, any group of people who value power over liberty can become corrupt; their story is hardly unique to mages. I doubt Bioware would gov for the "lol Maker is truth" answer. I'd say the truth is somewhere in the middle: maybe the Maker exists, but I doubt that the Chantry got him/her right.
Modifié par baddogkelevra, 04 mars 2011 - 08:54 .
#315
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:53
Ealos
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I think I'll do my first run as an Andrastean, though with some quarrels with the chantry that are pretty much forced by the background (unless I want to go zealous enough to shop my sister - could be interesting for a later play).
Want to do one as a warrior who's just really quite shaken by what he's been through, and will reject a lot of things he grew up with - so he'll be more iconoclastic.
Want to do one as a warrior who's just really quite shaken by what he's been through, and will reject a lot of things he grew up with - so he'll be more iconoclastic.
#316
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:54
TheOneAndOni
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My Hawke will believe that the Maker is real, but that he would not have created Mages to be ruled by the Templar. If the Maker is real, then the existence of Mages is his will, and the corrupt Mages of the Tevinter Imperium are no different than the Templar of the Chantry; in both cases, mortals are abusing their Maker-given power to subjugate another group.
It's a very logical thought process that more or less mirrors my own.
It's a very logical thought process that more or less mirrors my own.
#317
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:54
Bluto Blutarskyx
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baddogkelevra wrote...
Medhia Nox wrote...
Not only will I believe in the Maker - I'll join the Circle if my mage is an Apostate (which it looks like he is).
The Black City is real in the Fade - every mage knows this. The Tevinter Imperium is what happens when mages get to rule - and LONG before there was a corrupt Chantry, there was an evil Tevinter who enslaved everyone.
I think it's interesting how people ignore the lore of Dragon Age because of their own personal bias. Andraste liberated the world from mages - who presumably created (became) the Darkspawn by perverting the Black City.
It is a fact that there are spirits in the Fade - those spirits are based off emotions both good and bad. They're not myth in the Dragon Age universe - they're a reality. So too, I believe, is the Maker in the Dragon Age universe.
I'd love for them to go several games without providing a real answer - and then smacking everyone with a "Yes, the Maker is a fact."
It's so posh to be rebellious.
But who told you that in game? It was the Chantry. We don't have any story of Andraste or the Fade that isn't based on the claims of the Chantry. The game starts by saying "the Chantry teaches us that it is the hubris of men which first brought the darkspawn." Wynne even says it may be an allegory. The point is, we don't know, because we've never been to the Black City in game. And about the Tevinter, any group of people who value power over liberty can become corrupt not just mages. I doubt Bioware would gov for the "lol Maker is truth" answer. I'd say the truth is somewhere in the middle: maybe the Maker exists, but I doubt that the Chantry got him/her right.
basically this^
i mean there is no verification of anything the chantry says and althugh its a fantasy game, the chantry has a reputaiton for manipulation as well,
thier entire system is based on creating an army of drug addicts loyal to them due to thier addiction to lyrium.
#319
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:58
Cyocide
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That has nothing to do with the question.Riloux wrote...
Not on my first playthrough. I always play evil first.
Beat me to it.
The Chantry teaches us... to do bad in the name of good. On that note...
"Because this is what I do. Every time. Every day. Every second. This. *slams his fist on the Protest button*"
#320
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 08:58
lx_theo
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The urn is a phenomenon, I'm sure. So no, just like the equivalent in real life, my characters and I have no belief in any of that. Its a matter of whether we're polite about it.
#321
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 09:02
JrayM16
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Bluto Blutarskyx wrote...
baddogkelevra wrote...
Medhia Nox wrote...
Not only will I believe in the Maker - I'll join the Circle if my mage is an Apostate (which it looks like he is).
The Black City is real in the Fade - every mage knows this. The Tevinter Imperium is what happens when mages get to rule - and LONG before there was a corrupt Chantry, there was an evil Tevinter who enslaved everyone.
I think it's interesting how people ignore the lore of Dragon Age because of their own personal bias. Andraste liberated the world from mages - who presumably created (became) the Darkspawn by perverting the Black City.
It is a fact that there are spirits in the Fade - those spirits are based off emotions both good and bad. They're not myth in the Dragon Age universe - they're a reality. So too, I believe, is the Maker in the Dragon Age universe.
I'd love for them to go several games without providing a real answer - and then smacking everyone with a "Yes, the Maker is a fact."
It's so posh to be rebellious.
But who told you that in game? It was the Chantry. We don't have any story of Andraste or the Fade that isn't based on the claims of the Chantry. The game starts by saying "the Chantry teaches us that it is the hubris of men which first brought the darkspawn." Wynne even says it may be an allegory. The point is, we don't know, because we've never been to the Black City in game. And about the Tevinter, any group of people who value power over liberty can become corrupt not just mages. I doubt Bioware would gov for the "lol Maker is truth" answer. I'd say the truth is somewhere in the middle: maybe the Maker exists, but I doubt that the Chantry got him/her right.
basically this^
i mean there is no verification of anything the chantry says and althugh its a fantasy game, the chantry has a reputaiton for manipulation as well,
thier entire system is based on creating an army of drug addicts loyal to them due to thier addiction to lyrium.
Indeed, the Black CIty could be something entirely different than what the Chantry teaches. Heck, the opening lines where Duncan says "THe Chantry teaches us..." could be a deliberate implication that the information is false or alterred in some way.
THe Catholic CHurch of Medieval Europe certainly hid information about biblical history from the people. THe Bible was in a language that no peasant could read or understand so they just had to take the Chruch's word that they were being completely honest. ANd that's even without mentioning the massive revisionsit history approach taken on teh standard Catholic Bible. Tons of recorded information was cut out because priests deemed this history to not be fitting with the Church's message.
#322
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 09:03
Ealos
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lx_theo wrote...
The urn is a phenomenon, I'm sure. So no, just like the equivalent in real life, my characters and I have no belief in any of that. Its a matter of whether we're polite about it.
Heh, reminds me of the Indiana Jones films where every quest seems to begin with "I'm just an archaeologist, you know that, I don't believe an any hocus pocus. Especially not like all that stuff I've, um, seen. Yeah".
Remember that you've seen the urn, but Hawke hasn't - at most it'll be a story from far away.
#323
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 09:08
DalishRanger
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Male rogue Hawke will believe there probably is a Maker, but if He's abandoned the world, why worry about it/worship him? Male mage will be agnostic, and would rather rely on himself and his friends than a deity that may or may not exist. Female warrior will believe, but not be particularly devout.
#324
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 09:29
Ealos
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Actually, been having a look at the wiki, Andrastians believe in
A single deity responsible for the world, who "abandoned" it after the Black City incident.
A prophet who attracted the attention of the deity, and left behind the chant.
The idea that once the chant is universally believed, the maker will return.
What's in the chant? The only details I can find are about the fade and mage-control. Nothing about instruction for day to day living, or even personal involvement with the maker. What do priests do exactly? Is it just chanting? Some characters have been seen praying, and blessing, but there's no indication that the Maker is expected to listen, save when the whole world does. Not too sure what Hawke's to believe in/not believe in really. Other than angst over magic. Yay, more party angst!
A single deity responsible for the world, who "abandoned" it after the Black City incident.
A prophet who attracted the attention of the deity, and left behind the chant.
The idea that once the chant is universally believed, the maker will return.
What's in the chant? The only details I can find are about the fade and mage-control. Nothing about instruction for day to day living, or even personal involvement with the maker. What do priests do exactly? Is it just chanting? Some characters have been seen praying, and blessing, but there's no indication that the Maker is expected to listen, save when the whole world does. Not too sure what Hawke's to believe in/not believe in really. Other than angst over magic. Yay, more party angst!
#325
Posté 04 mars 2011 - 10:58
IronVanguard
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Probably at least a bit, depending on the play through.
Who need Templars when you have Daemonhunters and Witch Hunters?
Yes.Medhia Nox wrote...
@Attheelogos: Sorry man, I'm a Warhammer player - if I could start an Imperial Inquisition on Thedas I would.
So watch yourself apostate - Mage-Inquisitor Nox will find your rebellious arse and nail you upside down to a tree (that's what we'll do to apostate mages we capture).
We're supported by Irving - he's all for it. I asked him - he said apostates are butt-candy for demons of the Fade.
Who need Templars when you have Daemonhunters and Witch Hunters?
