237 réponses à ce sujet

[Funny_chan]

TallBearNC wrote...

Look at the game as a sandbox, and you can play however you chose to play, and the character oritentations are whatever you want them to be

Now that I think of it, that's actually the only thing I dislike about making all the LI bi. It gives the player way too much power, IMHO.
Now Hawke has the power not only to become the champion Kirkwall, start a war, but also to change people's sexuality.

[RyuAzai]

To address, what I think, one of the points the OP was stating in his first post.... I don't believe just making a game and having all characters be bisexual for the sake of giving a player all the options they want is great storytelling. What you are sexually does define you, and effect your "character" so to speak. That can be taken a lot of different ways but basically I am going to use this example.

I love to write, and love to make story especially as a GM and role-play type of worlds. Often when I design characters they will 'feel' a certain orientation to me during the creation process. And that is who they are. Two of my favorite characters was two leaders of a nation, that they jointly ruled, and were both male lovers. That was who they were, it was a part of them. Now if I were to change them to just be bisexual or say straight just for the sake of my players... Or juts for the sake of anything, those two wouldn't be themselves anymore. They wouldn't be who I created them as.

Not all characters take this path though, sometimes when writing a character they start as straight, bisexual, or homosexual and end up as something different. But when that character is finally designed, written about, and "finished" so to speak their sexual orientation is as much of their character as their views, opinions, eye color, hair color, or desires.

Now to speak about the actually LI in the game. If they are all bisexual, then I believe the writers decided that from the start. And there is no problem with that. It -is- a part of who -they- are if bioware decided to design them as such.

[TheRevanchist]

TallBearNC wrote...

Solostran85 wrote...

This whole 'Everyone's bi!' thing seems like a giant fan service. And to be honest I don't like the idea of bioware endorsing this kind of crap in a video game.

You're right. It IS a fan service. And you have the right not to like it. But without fans.. they make no $$$. No $$$ no games. They had to make a choice to make the greatest # of gamers happy, and they made that choice based on feedback from DAO.

So do what I, and others did in DAO. MOD YOUR GAME. Mod them and remove the bi from people who you don't want to have it

Not to sound like a douche or anything but...not everyone plays PC.

[Eterna]

Well I've always thought of it like this:

They're not actually Bisexuals, you can simply decide if they're Gay or Straight.

As in, if your playing as Male Hawke and decide to go after Anders he's always been just gay, not bisexual.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is that them being bisexual is not cannon, rather you get to determine their sexuality for your story.

[Russalka]

I thought fan service only mattered when it catered to a majority.

[TallBearNC]

kylecouch wrote...

TallBearNC wrote...

kylecouch wrote...

Machines Are Us wrote...

True, but it does seem a little strange from a realistic point of view that the four people who have an interest in you all happen to be bisexual.

From a gaming perspective it is irrelevant, but from a design perspective it is fairly... odd.

This is my views on the matter...it's just weird that all the LI's just happen to be Bi...it feels fake to me...call me w/e you want...but it feels unbelievable.

Don't think of them as bi. Think of them however you chose to RP the game. If you think they are straight.. then they are straight as you interact with them in a hetro fashion and would never see their "other side" Same goes for gay. I'll be honest, I'm a gay male. Will I be playing as "gay" ? Hell no. Each character I make will have a specific gender and orientation and interact with the LIs accordingly. I may play a raging bull ****** in one play through, or a straight male. I'm just glad BW left the option open for us to do that.

Is it REALISTIC? No. You would be hard pressed to find this in RL... but look at it this way? Is the game realistic? NO. It's a work of utter fiction, in a fictional universe with fictional characters. So it doesn't have to be like ANYTHING we have an Earth. So don't look at them as "bi"

Look at the game as a sandbox, and you can play however you chose to play, and the character oritentations are whatever you want them to be

I understand this...but I am mentally unable to do that...once I learn somthing about a game...its always at the forfront of my mind when dealing with that issue in game...and its going to detract from my personal experience. I'm glad so many fans have these choices...but while I do find this immersion breaking personally...it dont really matter because I dont like any of the LI options anyway...I just wanted to share my thoughts on the matter...not that it matters.

I see your point. Everyone's mind works differently. I was only offering you a different way to TRY to view things. If it doesn't work for you it doesn't.

And I DO agree with you that most of the LIs aren't  that appealing. I'm a gay male.. and I'd like to see more manly LIs.. and I'd like to see more more pretty female LIs.. but.. hey... that's what mods are for! watch the mod areas. You'll start seeing character mods for the LIs with in DAYS after the game comes out. It will be MUCH faster than DAO because this game is very similar to DAO. I'm a modder, but not a graphic artist... so I cant re do them.

I did mod zevron in DAO. I thought he was FUGLY. So I found a mod that gave him short, black hair, handsome face, and a goate. That made me happy

EDIT: AGAIN, appologies to ps3/xbox people. I forgot there are no sep forums for pc, consoles. So I understand some of the console player base frustrations.

Modifié par TallBearNC, 05 mars 2011 - 07:58 .

[IronVanguard]

Lennonkun wrote...

Bioware should just quit beating around the bush and do what they want to, a dating-sim. I'm sure it'll be right up there with Tokimeki and the others.

Dragon Effect 4, with 10 romancable characters.
Do jobs! Get money! Train skills! Become Champion of the brothel!

[Lord_Saulot]

Eterna5 wrote...

Well I've always thought of it like this:

They're not actually Bisexuals, you can simply decide if they're Gay or Straight.

As in, if your playing as Male Hawke and decide to go after Anders he's always been just gay, not bisexual.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is that them being bisexual is not cannon, rather you get to determine their sexuality for your story.

Personally, that is the last thing I would want.  I would much rather they just be bisexual, and as far as I am concerned, they are. 

Modifié par Lord_Saulot, 05 mars 2011 - 07:49 .

[Katreyn]

Doesn't bother me honestly. I can just imagine that whoever I am romancing isn't bi (as long as they aren't like Zevran was and was all "hey i slept with guys too" I could of lived without that being shared, but it was part of his character). Not that it is a huge deal anyways. And doubt it is entirely noticeable. It is strange to say that ALL of them are bi,but that is what they are. And I guess I can see case in point regardless.

[colejossart]

TallBearNC wrote...

colejossart wrote...

I don't care if they're bi, as long as the straight side of the romances didn't take a blow because all the romances were written "gender neutral." I felt that this was the case in Origins with Leliana and ME with Liara. Tbh, it felt that Leliana was a female romance with a male romance tacked on. I mean she talked about my eyelashes! With Leliana I felt like my Warden was a manikin listening to her life story and not a part of a relationship. This is opposed to Morrigan, who was written exclusively for males. Morrigan made references to the fact that, yes, my Warden is in fact male. I felt that Morrigan's romance was much more... interactive. I am of the opinion that this is because Morrigan was written for one gender, while Leliana was written for both.

I agree with you here... I did feel that some had the "gay" or the "straight" tacked on... and that bugged a bit. I HOPE that both sides of the coin got equal attention in DA2

It's not just that they were tacked on.  The Leliana romance wasn't REALLY a romance in my opinion.  Ask questions, listen to her life story, say nice things, and your Warden doesn't die a virgin.

Morrigan's was SO much more fleshed out.  I'd sit there for minutes at a time deciding exactly what I wanted to say to her.  I think the difference between the two is that Morrigan was written for one gender, while Leliana was written for two.  From what I understand, Alistair was much the same way.  Since he was only written for one gender there was a lot more interaction between Warden and Alistair than with femWarden and Leliana.

[Curlain]

Eterna5 wrote...

Well I've always thought of it like this:

They're not actually Bisexuals, you can simply decide if they're Gay or Straight.

As in, if your playing as Male Hawke and decide to go after Anders he's always been just gay, not bisexual.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is that them being bisexual is not cannon, rather you get to determine their sexuality for your story.

Hmm, I prefer to think of them as bi-sexual in this case then.  I dislike having that much power over my companion characters, it makes them seem less real ingame, same reason I really didn't like the harding mechanic in DA:O and never used it

[Russalka]

IronVanguard wrote...

Lennonkun wrote...

Bioware should just quit beating around the bush and do what they want to, a dating-sim. I'm sure it'll be right up there with Tokimeki and the others.

Dragon Effect 4, with 10 romancable characters.
Do jobs! Get money! Train skills! Become Champion of the brothel!

I grow so tired of this dating sim complaint or the bad joke.

It is an optional thing only blown up by the fans, which may or may not add depth to a storyline. Storylines are important in roleplaying games, I hear.

[colejossart]

IronVanguard wrote...

Lennonkun wrote...

Bioware should just quit beating around the bush and do what they want to, a dating-sim. I'm sure it'll be right up there with Tokimeki and the others.

Dragon Effect 4, with 10 romancable characters.
Do jobs! Get money! Train skills! Become Champion of the brothel!

LOL !

[tomas819]

It seems like it'd be simplest to choose your character's sexual orientation during character creation with a UI option checkbox, thereby turning on or off various in-game romance possibilities accordingly.

It sounds like what Bioware has done is going to be just fine, though.

[TheRevanchist]

Eterna5 wrote...

Well I've always thought of it like this:

They're not actually Bisexuals, you can simply decide if they're Gay or Straight.

As in, if your playing as Male Hawke and decide to go after Anders he's always been just gay, not bisexual.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is that them being bisexual is not cannon, rather you get to determine their sexuality for your story.

Anders was a poor example for "pretending he was always gay" personally...because he obviously hits on female wardens in Awakening.

[colejossart]

kwoods88 wrote...

Doesn't bother me honestly. I can just imagine that whoever I am romancing isn't bi (as long as they aren't like Zevran was and was all "hey i slept with guys too" I could of lived without that being shared, but it was part of his character). Not that it is a huge deal anyways. And doubt it is entirely noticeable. It is strange to say that ALL of them are bi,but that is what they are. And I guess I can see case in point regardless.

I could have gone without Zevran hitting on me as well.  But being a nice Warden, I nicely refused him.  Then later, still being a nice Warden, I said something nice and got

[TallBearNC]

InvaderErl wrote...

I don't think anyone's asking for Thedas to have sexual labels, but people naturally have varying sexual orientations.

Origins had two bisexual characters and two straight characters and it felt completely natural. I was hoping that they'd take that further and have a completely gay or lesbian character but now the party is entirely bisexual.

I could live with that two. I think they "tested the waters" so to speak in DAO.. and they got a LOT of flaming and backlash from the gaming community as well as constructive feedback. What we are seeing now is a result of all that. My GUESS is they feel this is the only way to make the majority of gamers happy.

If there is a DA3, then sexuality there will be based off responses from DA2 This will also effect the ME series. All the company can do is TRY to grow their games and put out what THEY think gamers will want

[Curlain]

tomas819 wrote...

It seems like it'd be simplest to choose your character's sexual orientation during character creation with a UI option checkbox, thereby turning on or off various in-game romance possibilities accordingly.

It sounds like what Bioware has done is going to be just fine, though.

That would be quite an interesting idea actually, maybe we'll see it in the another game 

[colejossart]

TallBearNC wrote...

InvaderErl wrote...

I don't think anyone's asking for Thedas to have sexual labels, but people naturally have varying sexual orientations.

Origins had two bisexual characters and two straight characters and it felt completely natural. I was hoping that they'd take that further and have a completely gay or lesbian character but now the party is entirely bisexual.

I could live with that two. I think they "tested the waters" so to speak in DAO.. and they got a LOT of flaming and backlash from the gaming community as well as constructive feedback. What we are seeing now is a result of all that. My GUESS is they feel this is the only way to make the majority of gamers happy.

If there is a DA3, then sexuality there will be based off responses from DA2 This will also effect the ME series. All the company can do is TRY to grow their games and put out what THEY think gamers will want

I highly doubt that this will affect ME3.  ME3 is made by a different development team.  And ME has time and time again stated that Shepard is straight.

[TallBearNC]

kylecouch wrote...

TallBearNC wrote...

Solostran85 wrote...

This whole 'Everyone's bi!' thing seems like a giant fan service. And to be honest I don't like the idea of bioware endorsing this kind of crap in a video game.

You're right. It IS a fan service. And you have the right not to like it. But without fans.. they make no $$$. No $$$ no games. They had to make a choice to make the greatest # of gamers happy, and they made that choice based on feedback from DAO.

So do what I, and others did in DAO. MOD YOUR GAME. Mod them and remove the bi from people who you don't want to have it

Not to sound like a douche or anything but...not everyone plays PC.

No offense taken. I keep forgetting this is an xbox / ps3 game also. They also don't have PC/PS3/Xbox forums like they did for DAO. So I keep thinking this is the PC forum.

So I do appologize to the console gamers as you do not have the mod ability PC people do.

Normally I'd get this for my ps3. I'm MUCH rather play it on a 80" HDTV. However my desire to mod the game overrides that. Plus the game looks MUCH better on a PC if you have a good DX10 or 11 card

Modifié par TallBearNC, 05 mars 2011 - 07:56 .

[Russalka]

Shepard is either straight or a discount lesbian.

Modifié par Russalka, 05 mars 2011 - 07:56 .

[TheRevanchist]

TallBearNC wrote...

InvaderErl wrote...

I don't think anyone's asking for Thedas to have sexual labels, but people naturally have varying sexual orientations.

Origins had two bisexual characters and two straight characters and it felt completely natural. I was hoping that they'd take that further and have a completely gay or lesbian character but now the party is entirely bisexual.

I could live with that two. I think they "tested the waters" so to speak in DAO.. and they got a LOT of flaming and backlash from the gaming community as well as constructive feedback. What we are seeing now is a result of all that. My GUESS is they feel this is the only way to make the majority of gamers happy.

If there is a DA3, then sexuality there will be based off responses from DA2 This will also effect the ME series. All the company can do is TRY to grow their games and put out what THEY think gamers will want

See heres the thing about Fan Service...the Devs...Mr Gaider in particular on MANY occasions. Have said that "what people THINK they want in theory tends not to be well recieved when they actually get it" So...maybe this is Biowares way of showing us this since no one ever believes them.

[TallBearNC]

IronVanguard wrote...

Lennonkun wrote...

Bioware should just quit beating around the bush and do what they want to, a dating-sim. I'm sure it'll be right up there with Tokimeki and the others.

Dragon Effect 4, with 10 romancable characters.
Do jobs! Get money! Train skills! Become Champion of the brothel!

HELL YEAH! My kind of game. Sleep with everyone! Seriously. I LOVE being a complete and utter HO in DA. That's why I like the way Da2 is set up and I sure HOPE they have a brothel. I'm not a ho in RL (happily married), but I sure can be in fantasy...

This doesn't mean that's ALL I do. I need the rich world, story lines, and character personalities too heheh

Modifié par TallBearNC, 05 mars 2011 - 08:00 .

[Lurid Jester]

Have individual characters that are gay, have some that are bi, have some that are straight...  but turning everyone omnisexual is overwhelmingly ridiculous.  First of all, having the in-game sexual diversity parallel real life just a bit more promotes replay-ability.  Why have a game where you can 'Bang' every NPC you meet in one playthrough?  

If you want that then play the game at least twice, once as male Hawke and once as female Hawke.  

I personally don't want to accidentally romance any NPCs like I did in DA:O with Zevram.  I was playing a rogue so I never used him in the group and 'X' button sped through his dialogues trying to complete his NPC Quest.  Next thing I knew, he was in Love.  

Being a pragmatist, I saw an opportunity for an easy achievement that I wouldn't have otherwise gone for...  

Still, the argument that making everyone omnisexual is not realistic is a valid argument regardless of what you "There are dragons and magic, is that realistic?" naysayers may expound upon.  

Making NPC characters within a fantasy game/book/whatever behave as you would expect real people to behave makes it easier to suspend your disbelief and to lose yourself within the mythology and tapestry of the narrative.  

[Montana]

Unless you flirt with same sex companions you'll probably never know what their sexual preferences are.
As I understand, flirting is the ONLY way to start a romance.
Dont' flirt = as far as you know they're straight, problem solved.

I tink it's nice to have options for different playthroughs.