556 réponses à ce sujet

[The Fred]

Hmm, random travelling merchant wagon sounds cool. I had also wondered about the possibility of having enemy NPCs flee and end up on the OM, too.

[Eguintir Eligard]

I had wondered about the possibility of having boobies.

[Shallina]

And the possibility of if you push a button what ever it is then something happens !!!

Each time you hit the keyboard or the mouse, we'll need an explosion on screen !

[The Fred]

Eguintir Eligard wrote...

I had wondered about the possibility of having boobies.

Um, Eguintir, I know that some people do get these... wonderings... at a certain point in their life, and society nowadays is fairly tolerant of this sort of thing, but I'm not sure the BioWare discussion boards are really the place to be talking about it...

[M. Rieder]

  Trading the dagger for boobies, eh EE?

Modifié par M. Rieder, 07 avril 2011 - 03:57 .

[rjshae]

Not trying to steal the thread here, but it almost seems to be winding down a bit so I thought I'd throw out an idea.

What I'd really like to see is a fully developed town scape that feels fully occupied and "lived in". Even the best of breed, commercial computer role-playing games, the towns feel empty to me. Sure, some provide interesting moments and brief conversations, but it doesn't feel like a living, breathing, evolving environment. I'd like to see a town with every building having some useful purpose, every resident is fully developed and capable of in depth conversation, the locals are following daily schedules, random things are happening like a visiting trader or kids playing at noon, and periodic special days like a celebrations happen in the town square. Plus it should have that real medieval feel to it. The town should be a place where you don't mind visiting a few dozen times because it has so much depth.

What do you think?

Modifié par rjshae, 12 avril 2011 - 09:28 .

[UncleGerhardt]

*remembers the old ultimas*
Yeah, that would be nice - but also a lot of work and I guess not many people would appreciate it
In PJ156's modules the NPCs in the village have schedules; it's nice to watch at, but I guess most gamers would only be annoyed when the can't walk at 1.00 AM into the Smithy to drop their Loot

[Arkalezth]

Yep, I've just played PJ's modules and they are more or less as you described (well, without celebrations). They sleeping and go to the tavern, everyone has a name, there's no unknown "commoners", and almost everyone has a purpose and is related to a quest.

On the other hand, I believe a medieval version of The Sims has been just released...

[Kaldor Silverwand]

Ambience is not easy to do or test and most players are only going to run past the ambience anyway on the way to wherever they are going. With limited development time it doesn't make sense to spend a lot of time on ambience. It does look good though.

Regards

[Shaun the Crazy One]

rjshae wrote...

Not trying to steal the thread here, but it almost seems to be winding down a bit so I thought I'd throw out an idea.

What I'd really like to see is a fully developed town scape that feels fully occupied and "lived in". Even the best of breed, commercial computer role-playing games, the towns feel empty to me. Sure, some provide interesting moments and brief conversations, but it doesn't feel like a living, breathing, evolving environment. I'd like to see a town with every building having some useful purpose, every resident is fully developed and capable of in depth conversation, the locals are following daily schedules, random things are happening like a visiting trader or kids playing at noon, and periodic special days like a celebrations happen in the town square. Plus it should have that real medieval feel to it. The town should be a place where you don't mind visiting a few dozen times because it has so much depth.

What do you think?

Considering that no one has yet volenteared to do the area design for any of the cities, I think the type of work that whould be involved for what you suggested means it's pretty much out of the question.  As it stands it will probably more like SoZ where you interact with cites through the Overland Map and can then visit a few key buildings in that city directly from the OM, as far as I know as of right now, no exterior areas have been made for any of the cities.

[kamal_]

It's impossible to fill the city as has been suggested given the time frame and time restraints of people doing it in their spare time. I would suggest using one of the prefab cities on the vault. In fact the Seahorse Cove prefab is already completely prescripted and includes npcs with conversations etc. This is the prefab I used for Pros exterior in PoE. The Seahorse Cove prefab default conversations even imply quests (I changed them for my own quests).

You can, of course raid prefabs on the vault. Virtually every area from PoE I made is on the Vault for instance.

[The Cow King]

Having ambience in a city is all well and good, but I'd probably quit the module right there and then if I stumbled into a 16x16+ city with 50 named peasants, everyone with irrelevant boring conversations, and 50 non-plot relevant buildings with no purpose whatsoever other than to add clutter waste-of-my-time content into a module.

City exploring is by far the most grueling content a module can have, and to make a good city, it has to plot driven(!), awesome looking, and has to come with clear indication as to where the actual content is located.

Filler content = bad. Nothing kills my motivation to play a module faster than a quest to buy carrots in the local market for 100 xp and 10 GP.

Keywords of a good module = FUN, EXCITING

Modifié par The Cow King, 13 avril 2011 - 04:33 .

[kamal_]

Other than as a homebase or npc meeting point ala white plume mountain, the plot as described on these forums doesn't seem to require a city.

[kamal_]

I did make a city thread somewhere for discussing cities, on my phone though so I can't link it.

[MokahTGS]

 I echo the sentiment for staying away from sprawling cities...they are boring and really time consuming for builders.  Bang for buck they are just not worth it.

Centaur Bridge has 6-7 houses...that is it.  Each one has a purpose, each one makes sense.  Anything more is not needed.  I appreciate how cities were done in SoZ and even the OC to some extent.  You just don't need that much stuff in a home brew module.

Get in, get out, get on with the adventure...

[Shaughn78]

I agree with MokahTGS and Kamal.

If a module was set in a single city, then yes it should have a lot detail and depth. But, if it is like this camapgin it si set in a large area, the cities need to be present but are a supporting role for the overall story and area. If they are over done they will take away from the game as a whole.

The larger cities need to be segmented into smaller areas or even just individual building that the player can visit that are plot relevent.

[Arkalezth]

Also, since this is a multiple builder module, I guess not everyone would do the same, so you could end with a very alive city next to a "static" one.

[kamal_]

Arkalezth wrote...

Also, since this is a multiple builder module, I guess not everyone would do the same, so you could end with a very alive city next to a "static" one.

Hush, Bioware's not participating in this and Kirkwall isn't in Faerun.

Modifié par kamal_, 14 avril 2011 - 11:02 .

[Kaldor Silverwand]

Just to state my own preference, I find towns that only have the minimum buildings and people required for primary plot to be bland and tasteless. Like tepid water. And they definitely seem unpolished to me and usually make me wonder what else did the modder not bother to polish. I think that a small amount of ambience should be done (people standing around chatting at the least.) Ambience is difficult to do a lot of but fairly easy to do a little of. There is a point of diminishing returns though. The danger is that it can become addictive to the modder. You start with "just some people standing around", and then you think, "well maybe at night there should be fewer people", and then "maybe the daytime people should walk home at night", and then "maybe some people should take out torches at night", and then "maybe certain merchants should behave differently", and then ... ad infinitum. Before you know it you have sunk a significant amount of time animating a world that no player will really appreciate very much because they are just passing through.

I also don't think it makes sense that plot characters are always named and others are always unnamed. How would you know a person's name without first speaking with them? There is neither spell nor app for that. So I prefer everyone remain named generically until spoken to. There should be other hints given as to who is significant and who is not, rather than name.

Buildings that are significant should have signs and probably map points. Not all buildings that are insignificant should be static. Allow people to explore a bit and find minor items or even have minor quests if they want to spend their time that way. Like ambience exploration ability gives the town more depth and color.

Just my 2 cents.

Modifié par Kaldor Silverwand, 14 avril 2011 - 04:28 .

[PJ156]

I'm with Mr Silverwand on this, though how this might translate in the cptt I don't know.

It is not  big deal to add a little ambience and it makes a huge difference IMO if applied in small doses. I have, and will build my towns around a central square. That's where the ambience is focused, where the shops are and where any action takes place. the town may have lots of buildings outside of this area but  simple Z key will tell you if they are fluff or not.

I have a preference for some ambience, empty streets don't work for me, nor do lots of people standing in the same place 24/7 with nothing to say but the same barkstring.

PJ 

[rjshae]

The Cow King wrote...

Having ambience in a city is all well and good, but I'd probably quit the module right there and then if I stumbled into a 16x16+ city with 50 named peasants, everyone with irrelevant boring conversations, and 50 non-plot relevant buildings with no purpose whatsoever other than to add clutter waste-of-my-time content into a module.

City exploring is by far the most grueling content a module can have, and to make a good city, it has to plot driven(!), awesome looking, and has to come with clear indication as to where the actual content is located.

Filler content = bad. Nothing kills my motivation to play a module faster than a quest to buy carrots in the local market for 100 xp and 10 GP.

Keywords of a good module = FUN, EXCITING

Well I did say town, rather than city. But I understand your position. A nice approach is in games like Dragon Age where the plot specific individuals are clearly identified. I'm not sure how you'd do that in NWN2 though. The filler can then be for people who like to explore and experience the ambiance.

Modifié par rjshae, 14 avril 2011 - 10:48 .

[M. Rieder]

Can you use tags in the charater's name field to make their name appear a different color? That would set them apart as important.