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[Miri1984]

Not to bring the mood down here, but I found an interesting radio show about the effects of solitary confinement - interviews with people who have been through it. here.

Depressing, but very interesting.

Appropriate TOP:

Modifié par Miri1984, 02 mai 2011 - 06:58 .

[aquaticidioticus]

Miri1984 wrote...

All I want for christmas is an Anders-unique body model .

A *little* late to the party, but... seconded. The mods are much too... non-Anders.  

[aquaticidioticus]

Miri1984 wrote...

Not to bring the mood down here, but I found an interesting radio show about the effects of solitary confinement - interviews with people who have been through it. here.

Depressing, but very interesting.

Appropriate TOP:

The music threw me off in the beginning.   But, very interesting interview! And very sad.
And... I absolutely love that picture.  That sounds morbid considering its subject matter.  

[Amondra]

GailRana wrote...

Amondra wrote...

*snip epic ruffle cake*

OMG YES!

it's a cake worthy of an Anders and m!hawke wedding

That it is!  Anders would cry tears of joy.

[aquaticidioticus]

And I found this on solitary confinement which is particularly interesting.
http://www.newyorker...e#ixzz1LB1gW1cu

These two paragraphs made me think of Anders especially.

"He was stiff from lying in bed day and night, yet tired all the time. He dozed off and on constantly, sleeping twelve hours a day. He craved activity of almost any kind [...] He observed himself becoming neurotically possessive about his little space, at times putting his life in jeopardy by flying into a rage if a guard happened to step on his bed. He brooded incessantly, thinking back on all the mistakes he’d made in life, his regrets, his offenses against God and family.
His captors moved him every few months. For unpredictable stretches of time, he was granted the salvation of a companion—sometimes he shared a cell with as many as four other hostages—and he noticed that his thinking recovered rapidly when this occurred. He could read and concentrate longer, avoid hallucinations, and better control his emotions. 'I would rather have had the worst companion than no companion at all,' he noted.
'I find myself trembling sometimes for no reason,' he wrote. 'I’m afraid I’m beginning to lose my mind, to lose control completely.'"


Depressing stuff. 

Modifié par aquaticidioticus, 02 mai 2011 - 07:14 .

[Miri1984]

The interesting thing about it is that they all talk about rage, feeling uncontrollable rage nearly all the time, which kind of fits with what happens with Justice.

[Amondra]

 No wonder why Anders and Justice are so intent on what they were doing.  I would too!  Also poor Justice if he got any snips of those memories.  That spirit is scared for life.  Also furthers the whole Anders didn't want to be alone...Oh now I just need to hold him!

Anders really has been through alot and from the way he talks has seen alot too.  

[Ryzaki]

Miri1984 wrote...

The interesting thing about it is that they all talk about rage, feeling uncontrollable rage nearly all the time, which kind of fits with what happens with Justice.

That is interesting. 

[aquaticidioticus]

Amondra wrote...

 No wonder why Anders and Justice are so intent on what they were doing.  I would too!  Also poor Justice if he got any snips of those memories.  That spirit is scared for life.  Also furthers the whole Anders didn't want to be alone...Oh now I just need to hold him!

Anders really has been through alot and from the way he talks has seen alot too.  

I vote for major huggage (it's a word now) for Anders.  Poor fella.  

[Threeparts]

Guys. The Enigma of Kirkwall stuff. A thought.

From the wiki...

Studies of the Veil have never been thorough. The Tevinters once theorised that the Veil is thin in places that have seen great bloodshed. As the Chantry is so fond of reminding us, the magisters of the Imperium only once crossed physically into the Fade, the catastrophe that blackened the Golden City. As the story goes, the ritual consumed a vast quantity of lyrium and the blood of a hundred slaves. But was it the deaths that bridged the worlds, or simply the blood and lyrium? Or both?

Demons seize every opportunity, every tear in the Veil, to enter our world. Once the Veil is torn, it is extremely difficult to mend, some say impossible.

--From The Lectures of First Enchanter Wenselus

Do you think they were trying it again in Kirkwall? It might be too much to suggest that it was the original site of the ritual that created Darkspawn, but it might hint towards what they needed so much blood for.

[Amondra]

Ryzaki wrote...

Miri1984 wrote...

The interesting thing about it is that they all talk about rage, feeling uncontrollable rage nearly all the time, which kind of fits with what happens with Justice.

That is interesting. 

I also wonder now does Justice feel/felt he was being confined by all Anders hate?  And now feels that the death of the circle and everything that is Anders rage will free him of his? 

Or am I going way to into this...

[Amondra]

Threeparts wrote...

Guys. The Enigma of Kirkwall stuff. A thought.

From the wiki...

Studies of the Veil have never been thorough. The Tevinters once theorised that the Veil is thin in places that have seen great bloodshed. As the Chantry is so fond of reminding us, the magisters of the Imperium only once crossed physically into the Fade, the catastrophe that blackened the Golden City. As the story goes, the ritual consumed a vast quantity of lyrium and the blood of a hundred slaves. But was it the deaths that bridged the worlds, or simply the blood and lyrium? Or both?

Demons seize every opportunity, every tear in the Veil, to enter our world. Once the Veil is torn, it is extremely difficult to mend, some say impossible.

--From The Lectures of First Enchanter Wenselus

Do you think they were trying it again in Kirkwall? It might be too much to suggest that it was the original site of the ritual that created Darkspawn, but it might hint towards what they needed so much blood for.

With the Tevinter anything is possible.  We more then likely will never know as well sadly.

I sorta feel the the writers haven't decided how the Fade and all that fun works...I mean the Dailish can send none mages there and from the looks without lyrium...why arn't they running the circle?

[Herr Uhl]

Amondra wrote...

I sorta feel the the writers haven't decided how the Fade and all that fun works...I mean the Dailish can send none mages there and from the looks without lyrium...why arn't they running the circle?

Jowan can send mages into the fade without Lyrium. Why isn't he running the circle?

And for reference, they didn't enter spiritually, it was a physical entry they alledgedly achieved.

[Miri1984]

Amondra wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Miri1984 wrote...

The interesting thing about it is that they all talk about rage, feeling uncontrollable rage nearly all the time, which kind of fits with what happens with Justice.

That is interesting. 

I also wonder now does Justice feel/felt he was being confined by all Anders hate?  And now feels that the death of the circle and everything that is Anders rage will free him of his? 

Or am I going way to into this...

No, no! Of course not, that's what this thread is for after all. Another thought I had - Mr Wiggums was possessed by a rage demon, and Anders said that he was in solitary and Mr Wiggums used to visit him there. I wonder if he was possessed by a rage demon that was trying for Anders? And maybe the Templars Wiggums killed were the ones who were guarding him?


THIS IS NOW CANON IN MY HEAD.

[Ryzaki]

Amondra wrote...
I also wonder now does Justice feel/felt he was being confined by all Anders hate?  And now feels that the death of the circle and everything that is Anders rage will free him of his? 

Or am I going way to into this...

The more I think about it the less I feel that Chanty explosion was about freeing mages. I'm seeing it as more and more of a take that to the Circle and the Chantry. As vengeance for everything they did to him and other mages.It explains why his plan didn't go beyond 1. Blow Up Chantry 2. Meredith calls Annullment 3. ??? 4. Profit!  

Though...perhaps they do think their rage will vanish once the Circles are destroyed and mages can live as freely as other people.  

It's good food for thought though. 

[Herr Uhl]

Miri1984 wrote...

No, no! Of course not, that's what this thread is for after all. Another thought I had - Mr Wiggums was possessed by a rage demon, and Anders said that he was in solitary and Mr Wiggums used to visit him there. I wonder if he was possessed by a rage demon that was trying for Anders? And maybe the Templars Wiggums killed were the ones who were guarding him?


THIS IS NOW CANON IN MY HEAD.

Or he made it up because he thought it'd be a funny story. Just saying.

[Miri1984]

The blowing up of the Chantry is definitely to some extent about Vengeance, but if you look into reasons behind terrorism, the main thing terrorists want is to bring others into the conflict. Meredith, despite the fact that she's bat**** insane, states it quite clearly "The grand cleric is dead, killed by a mage, the people will demand retribution". He needed the target to be a symbol both of the authority of the chantry AND something that every day people thought was sacrosanct.

If it was just about revenge he would have been killing Templars left right and centre (more than he already was), not blowing up chantries.

[Herr Uhl]

Miri1984 wrote...

If it was just about revenge he would have been killing Templars left right and centre (more than he already was), not blowing up chantries.

This depends on if his beef was with templars or the chantry as a whole.

[Ryzaki]

Miri1984 wrote...

The blowing up of the Chantry is definitely to some extent about Vengeance, but if you look into reasons behind terrorism, the main thing terrorists want is to bring others into the conflict. Meredith, despite the fact that she's bat**** insane, states it quite clearly "The grand cleric is dead, killed by a mage, the people will demand retribution". He needed the target to be a symbol both of the authority of the chantry AND something that every day people thought was sacrosanct.

If it was just about revenge he would have been killing Templars left right and centre (more than he already was), not blowing up chantries.

That's very simplistic  basic revenge and I personally would never get revenge in such a matter. It's fleeting and it does no true damage. Templars can be replaced. Then again I'm a vindictive b****. 

Edit: simplistic is a wrong word...basic would probably be better. 

No. I'd want to destroy the whole Chantry. Not just a few templars. I see Anders as pretty much the same. 

That said it isn't completely out of vengeance. But I personally see it as far more about revenge than mage freedom. But that's just me. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 02 mai 2011 - 07:59 .

[Amondra]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Amondra wrote...

I sorta feel the the writers haven't decided how the Fade and all that fun works...I mean the Dailish can send none mages there and from the looks without lyrium...why arn't they running the circle?

Jowan can send mages into the fade without Lyrium. Why isn't he running the circle?

And for reference, they didn't enter spiritually, it was a physical entry they alledgedly achieved.

What I meant was simply they did it without blood or lyrium and to bring none mages in.  That is a feat to be hold.  Stuff like that the circle could benifit from.

Also I don't think it was physical as the Keeper says "your friend woke up some time ago."

[Miri1984]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Miri1984 wrote...

If it was just about revenge he would have been killing Templars left right and centre (more than he already was), not blowing up chantries.

This depends on if his beef was with templars or the chantry as a whole.

He's grumpy with Elthina because she won't take sides, not because she was the one who did stuff to him. I suppose he could be objectively blaming the chantry as an institution for allowing what was done to him to be done to him, but that's a little removed for Vengeance. I always thought of Vengeance as more personal - "You did this to me so I'll do it back to you" not "you're a representation of the institution that allowed this to happen to me, therefore I'll do this to you". 

Just my opinion though.

Modifié par Miri1984, 02 mai 2011 - 07:56 .

[Amondra]

Ryzaki wrote...

Miri1984 wrote...

The blowing up of the Chantry is definitely to some extent about Vengeance, but if you look into reasons behind terrorism, the main thing terrorists want is to bring others into the conflict. Meredith, despite the fact that she's bat**** insane, states it quite clearly "The grand cleric is dead, killed by a mage, the people will demand retribution". He needed the target to be a symbol both of the authority of the chantry AND something that every day people thought was sacrosanct.

If it was just about revenge he would have been killing Templars left right and centre (more than he already was), not blowing up chantries.

That's very simplistic revenge and I would personally would never get revenge in such a matter. It's fleeting and it does no true damage. Templars can be replaced. 

No. I'd want to destroy the whole Chantry. Not just a few templars. I see Anders as pretty much the same. 

That said it isn't completely out of vengeance. But I personally see it as far more about revenge than mage freedom. But that's just me. 

I see it as equal amounts of both?  He wants the world to pay for what he has been through no matter what he has said in game saying it isn't about him.  It is about him!  He is a mage and he has seen and experienced some horrid things.  But also about the freedom.  So some little boy for girl right now hiding in her parents basement praying the templars never find her, will not go through what he did or worse.  I see his vengeance as the batman kind.  

I swear I will always see Anders as a type of Batman >_< only difference is Anders is willing to kill.

Also OMG about the cat basically saving Anders from the Rage Demon is...just... It is canon for me too, I hope you don't mind.

[Ryzaki]

Amondra wrote...
I see it as equal amounts of both?  He wants the world to pay for what he has been through no matter what he has said in game saying it isn't about him.  It is about him!  He is a mage and he has seen and experienced some horrid things.  But also about the freedom.  So some little boy for girl right now hiding in her parents basement praying the templars never find her, will not go through what he did or worse.  I see his vengeance as the batman kind.  

I swear I will always see Anders as a type of Batman >_< only difference is Anders is willing to kill.

Also OMG about the cat basically saving Anders from the Rage Demon is...just... It is canon for me too, I hope you don't mind.

Yeah I see that. Though didn't the original Batman do some pretty morally grey things? I believe he watched someone get killed so he could prove a crime. I can't really remember though...

Modifié par Ryzaki, 02 mai 2011 - 08:06 .