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[YamiSnuffles]

Threeparts wrote...

ElleMullineux wrote...

^^ This was it! Don't forget the bit of dialogue with Cullen, where he basically says that Elthina is stringing the mages along and that it's cruel as she'll always side with the Templars. I know Anders was in my group when Cullen told me that (I love seeing his disapproving face in the background) so in my headcannon he knows that the mages will have no support from the Chantry.

I think we need to treat the things Cullen says or thinks cautiously.
He thinks Elthina will side with the templars, and Gaider also says that Cullen believes the Divine would refuse the Annulment that Meredith sent off for. His words may very well have affected Anders and his actions, but we can't, as players, say that Cullen's knowledge and opinions were right or well-informed. He is Meredith's second, so he has more insight than we do, but he's also trying to be rational. He may have been right about the Divine refusing to approve the Right, just as he may have been wrong about Elthina siding with the templars over the mages.

Just think! Cullen, as the rational one! Kirkwall, what have you done?

Although Elthina might not have been purposefully stringing the mages along, I don't think Cullen was wrong in any way when he said that Elthina would side with the Templars. She occassionally voices sympathy for what is done to mages, but that sympathy is always tempered with her essentially saying, "Well, it sucks but they're cursed and it has to be done." If it came down to it and she actually did openly pick a side (a miracle!) I really doubt it would have been the mages. The only way I can see her siding with the mages is maybe giving them some very minor freedom. She never would have made a big move to make things better for the mages. I sincerely doubt she ever would have even gotten rid of Meredith.

EDIT: Blah, my morning rants should not be on top. Here, have more madness with my rambling:

Modifié par YamiSnuffles, 02 mai 2011 - 11:39 .

[Threeparts]

YamiSnuffles wrote...

Although Elthina might not have been purposefully stringing the mages along, I don't think Cullen was wrong in any way when he said that Elthina would side with the Templars. She occassionally voices sympathy for what is done to mages, but that sympathy is always tempered with her essentially saying, "Well, it sucks but they're cursed and it has to be done." If it came down to it and she actually did openly pick a side (a miracle!) I really doubt it would have been the mages. The only way I can see her siding with the mages is maybe giving them some very minor freedom. She never would have made a big move to make things better for the mages. I sincerely doubt she ever would have even gotten rid of Meredith.

Oh, I'm not suggesting that he was wrong, just that he's not an objective onlooker in this situation. He's being written in character for him, so we can't take what he says or what he believes as the truth of what would or would not actually happen.
Sometimes we, the players, need a reminder that almost all our sources of information in this game - whether LI or NPC, Varric or Cassandra, conversation or codex entry - reflect someone's opinions, and not necessarily the truth.
We can't trust what our characters hear or see as no one is bound to tell Hawke the truth, and we can't trust our information as players given that the whole game is itself a story being told by a potentially unreliable narrator.

Sorry, just got done rewatching the latest Doctor Who, and I'm in the mood for more mind-bending.  THE WHOLE WORLD - EVERYTHING YOU EVER KNEW -  IS A LIE.



I should add that we should avoid posting any specifics on the latest episodes of Doctor Who or other shows in this thread for the sake of those that are not yet up to date with recent events. Good? Good.

Modifié par Threeparts, 02 mai 2011 - 12:31 .

[Ninche]

Threeparts wrote...

Sorry, just got done rewatching the latest Doctor Who, and I'm in the mood for more mind-bending.  THE WHOLE WORLD - EVERYTHING YOU EVER KNEW -  IS A LIE.

Myabe the Hawkes all died in the Blight and Kirkwall is like a purgatory? Would explain why almost everyone is horribly extreme and disfunctional or crazy or a blood mage. And it would explain wy the veil is so thin - Kirkwall is practically in the Fade. Oooh the irony. 

[kromify]

Threeparts wrote...

Sorry, just got done rewatching the latest Doctor Who, and I'm in the mood for more mind-bending.  THE WHOLE WORLD - EVERYTHING YOU EVER KNEW -  IS A LIE.

^ River Song is amazing

i wish hawke could have curly hair

Modifié par kromify, 02 mai 2011 - 12:24 .

[Dreaming-in-Shadow]

Threeparts wrote...

YamiSnuffles wrote...

Although Elthina might not have been purposefully stringing the mages along, I don't think Cullen was wrong in any way when he said that Elthina would side with the Templars. She occassionally voices sympathy for what is done to mages, but that sympathy is always tempered with her essentially saying, "Well, it sucks but they're cursed and it has to be done." If it came down to it and she actually did openly pick a side (a miracle!) I really doubt it would have been the mages. The only way I can see her siding with the mages is maybe giving them some very minor freedom. She never would have made a big move to make things better for the mages. I sincerely doubt she ever would have even gotten rid of Meredith.

Oh, I'm not suggesting that he was wrong, just that he's not an objective onlooker in this situation. He's being written in character for him, so we can't take what he says or what he believes as the truth of what would or would not actually happen.
Sometimes we, the players, need a reminder that almost all our sources of information in this game - whether LI or NPC, Varric or Cassandra, conversation or codex entry - reflect someone's opinions, and not necessarily the truth.
We can't trust what our characters hear or see as no one is bound to tell Hawke the truth, and we can't trust our information as players given that the whole game is itself a story being told by a potentially unreliable narrator.

Sorry, just got done rewatching the latest Doctor Who, and I'm in the mood for more mind-bending.  THE WHOLE WORLD - EVERYTHING YOU EVER KNEW -  IS A LIE.

Doctor Who reference is WIN.
(I miss the Daleks. They were cute and cuddly in comparison to the silence. 
While we're at it, I'm still recovering from the loss of David Tennant, though I like Matt Smith, too.)

How very true. And infuriating.
I mean the story is told by a self confessed liar. (Varric for DA3.)

I wonder how much Cullen has changed since DA:O.
I don't think it's coincidence that a relatively minor character is seen again in the sequel...

...Bioware, what are you up to...? <_<

[YamiSnuffles]

Threeparts wrote...
Sorry, just got done rewatching the latest Doctor Who, and I'm in the mood for more mind-bending.  THE WHOLE WORLD - EVERYTHING YOU EVER KNEW -  IS A LIE.

Haha. Fair enough. I'll get in on this mind bending then and repost this:


ANDERS HAS NO BUTT! THE BUTT IS A LIE!

I post this because it somehow came up when I was looking for reference pictures of Chantry robes. This leads me to believe that the noandersbutt is actually a Chantry conspiracy. He actually has the finest butt ever. So fine it would make everyone leave the Chantry to worship it.

*probably should wait to wake up more before typing*

[Dreaming-in-Shadow]

Ninche wrote...

Threeparts wrote...

Sorry, just got done rewatching the latest Doctor Who, and I'm in the mood for more mind-bending.  THE WHOLE WORLD - EVERYTHING YOU EVER KNEW -  IS A LIE.

Myabe the Hawkes all died in the Blight and Kirkwall is like a purgatory? Would explain why almost everyone is horribly extreme and disfunctional or crazy or a blood mage. And it would explain wy the veil is so thin - Kirkwall is practically in the Fade. Oooh the irony. 

Kirkwall = Silent Hill

[MG800]

YamiSnuffles wrote...
Although Elthina might not have been purposefully stringing the mages along, I don't think Cullen was wrong in any way when he said that Elthina would side with the Templars. She occassionally voices sympathy for what is done to mages, but that sympathy is always tempered with her essentially saying, "Well, it sucks but they're cursed and it has to be done." If it came down to it and she actually did openly pick a side (a miracle!) I really doubt it would have been the mages. The only way I can see her siding with the mages is maybe giving them some very minor freedom. She never would have made a big move to make things better for the mages. I sincerely doubt she ever would have even gotten rid of Meredith.

EDIT: Blah, my morning rants should not be on top. Here, have more madness with my rambling:
*snip*

 I think so too.  She could let her get killed, leave her without support, but she would not oppose her directly. As crazy and paranoid Meredith is, she's also doing her job, hunting blood mages, keeping "order" - Elthina may perceive her as dangerous but necessery. It would take something brutal to change this "necessery".
 

[kromify]

i would gladly worship his boots, but a boots and butt combo would definitely cause mass conversion!

[Dreaming-in-Shadow]

YamiSnuffles wrote...

ANDERS HAS NO BUTT! THE BUTT IS A LIE!

Anders has boots and feathered pauldrons! And a cat!
He needs no butt! If he had one, the world would explode from awesomeness.

[YamiSnuffles]

kromify wrote...

i would gladly worship his boots, but a boots and butt combo would definitely cause mass conversion!

I would so worship those boots. I already do.

Boots and butt combo sounds like a strange fast food item. Or, in this case, something you would order from the Blooming Rose. That's obviously why they're always trying to hire Anders. The boots and butt combo is in high demand.

[kromify]

boots + butt + spicy shimmy dance = world implodes

[YamiSnuffles]

kromify wrote...

boots + butt + spicy shimmy dance = world implodes

boots + butt + spicy shimmy dance - all other clothes = world implodes and explodes

It's a supernova of awesome!

[Threeparts]

 It... it may be blasphemy around here, but I really don't think Anders' rear would be anything to write home about.
A lot of us agree that he's the tall, lean type, yes? And living in the sewers with no money and a Grey Warden appetite probably leaves him on the skinny side. He probably doesn't do all that much physical labour, and swinging a staff around seems to rely on upper-body strength more than anything. And we know he's pale.

So. Bony, pale, not particularly toned, maybe a couple of moles and a dusting of gingery-blonde hair for realism's sake...

I think I'll stick to the boot worship. 

Modifié par Threeparts, 02 mai 2011 - 12:47 .

[kromify]

minus the moles; he doesn't get into the sun that much
i think he might have a little butt but it's hidden by the robes

[sassperella]

Please no Dr. Who spoilers, we're several weeks behind in Aus.

[YamiSnuffles]

Yes, it's almost definitely a scrawny, pale thing but it's Anders' butt, and that makes it awesome. Plus it's a mystery. The allure of the invisible andersbutt mystery.

Anyhoo, I feel it is my duty to balance out the many times that I have brought up andersbutt. Thus I shall pose a real question:

If he could do it without endangering her in any way, do you think Anders would ever try to visit his mother again? If she is still alive, I would think it would be a possibility. His pillow shows that he still cares about her a lot and cherished memories of her. He probably wouldn't care to see his dad, but it seems like, if he could do it safely, he might like to see his mom again.

Modifié par YamiSnuffles, 02 mai 2011 - 12:54 .

[kromify]

sassperella wrote...

Please no Dr. Who spoilers, we're several weeks behind in Aus.

can you not get to the british bbc iplayer? http://www.bbc.co.uk...ible_Astronaut/

it's creepy and awesome. 

[kromify]

YamiSnuffles wrote...

Yes, it's almost definitely a scrawny, pale thing but it's Anders' butt, and that makes it awesome. Plus it's a mystery. The allure of the invisible andersbutt mystery.

Anyhoo, I feel it is my duty to balance out the many times that I have brought up andersbutt. Thus I shall pose a real question:

If he could do it without endangering her in any way, do you think Anders would ever try to visit his mother again? If she is still alive, I would think it would be a possibility. His pillow shows that he still cares about her a lot and cherished memories of her. He probably wouldn't care to see his dad, but it seems like, if he could do it safely, he might like to see his mom again.

if he found out his dad was dead he might visit. on the other hand he might think he doesn't deserve to see his mum again, or that she might be put in danger if people make the connection

[Threeparts]

kromify wrote...

sassperella wrote...

Please no Dr. Who spoilers, we're several weeks behind in Aus.

can you not get to the british bbc iplayer? http://www.bbc.co.uk...ible_Astronaut/

it's creepy and awesome. 

Nope, most BBC videos are blocked in Australia, as is Hulu. We're a week behind with Doctor Who and, since it was brought up last week, there's no confirmed air date here for A Game of Thrones. So, yeah, mind the spoilers.

Yami, on visiting his mother: I reckon that's probably were he tried to go the first time or two he escaped.
You're a young teen who's been ripped away from your family and taken to a distant tower where you're locked up and told you're unlikely to ever see the outside world again unless you're very, very good. I'd want my mum, too.
He was probably caught fairly easily: I think templars would assume that anyone escaping would probably be trying to find a way to get back to their family or friends, and would probably send out messages to any Chantries along the likeliest route to keep an eye out. Anders might be more canny when he's older, but a boy making his first escape from a place like a Circle mightn't think that far ahead - just get out and run home.

Modifié par Threeparts, 02 mai 2011 - 01:06 .

[sassperella]

kromify wrote...

sassperella wrote...

Please no Dr. Who spoilers, we're several weeks behind in Aus.

can you not get to the british bbc iplayer? http://www.bbc.co.uk...ible_Astronaut/

it's creepy and awesome. 

well we watch it as a family on saturday nights so don't really want to get ahead. We've only seen the first episode so far, not sure how many have aired in the uk, so not even sure the bbc site would have all the ones we've missed.

[kromify]

sassperella wrote...

kromify wrote...

sassperella wrote...

Please no Dr. Who spoilers, we're several weeks behind in Aus.

can you not get to the british bbc iplayer? http://www.bbc.co.uk...ible_Astronaut/

it's creepy and awesome. 

well we watch it as a family on saturday nights so don't really want to get ahead. We've only seen the first episode so far, not sure how many have aired in the uk, so not even sure the bbc site would have all the ones we've missed.

we're only up to the second episode

edit; hopefully this link might be helpful if anybody wants to watch it http://www.channelcu...ay-of-the-moon/

Modifié par kromify, 02 mai 2011 - 01:13 .

[YamiSnuffles]

Threeparts wrote...

Yami, on visiting his mother: I reckon that's probably were he tried to go the first time or two he escaped.
You're a young teen who's been ripped away from your family and taken to a distant tower where you're locked up and told you're unlikely to ever see the outside world again unless you're very, very good. I'd want my mum, too.
He was probably caught fairly easily: I think templars would assume that anyone escaping would probably be trying to find a way to get back to their family or friends, and would probably send out messages to any Chantries along the likeliest route to keep an eye out. Anders might be more canny when he's older, but a boy making his first escape from a place like a Circle mightn't think that far ahead - just get out and run home.

This is about what I figured he did the first time. Although, I kind of wonder where he went all the other times. HIs early attempts I would think maybe he'd just strike off in some random direction, perhaps, but later maybe he'd be a bit more strategic about it. He's well enough educated to figure out which cities might be easiest to hide in based on Chantry presence and the sort. Although, his trip to the Pearl also suggests he wasn't always thinking about how to stay hidden the longest. Sometimes he seemed to just be trying to maximize fun while he was out. A bit like a more savvy Emile de Launcet.

[sassperella]

kromify wrote...

sassperella wrote...

kromify wrote...

sassperella wrote...

Please no Dr. Who spoilers, we're several weeks behind in Aus.

can you not get to the british bbc iplayer? http://www.bbc.co.uk...ible_Astronaut/

it's creepy and awesome. 

well we watch it as a family on saturday nights so don't really want to get ahead. We've only seen the first episode so far, not sure how many have aired in the uk, so not even sure the bbc site would have all the ones we've missed.

we're only up to the second episode

edit; hopefully this link might be helpful if anybody wants to watch it http://www.channelcu...ay-of-the-moon/

ah right so not too far behind then

Ah well time for bed in Aus after a day of systematically destroying minor celebreties through the medium of graphite (my husband is giving me drawing lessons lol) 

So g'night Anders thread, don't talk about anything interesting while I'm asleep 

[Threeparts]

YamiSnuffles wrote...

This is about what I figured he did the first time. Although, I kind of wonder where he went all the other times. HIs early attempts I would think maybe he'd just strike off in some random direction, perhaps, but later maybe he'd be a bit more strategic about it. He's well enough educated to figure out which cities might be easiest to hide in based on Chantry presence and the sort. Although, his trip to the Pearl also suggests he wasn't always thinking about how to stay hidden the longest. Sometimes he seemed to just be trying to maximize fun while he was out. A bit like a more savvy Emile de Launcet.

In Awakening, he has his special Fox's Pendant, which reads, "After Anders first escaped from the Circle Tower, he saved the life of Bann Ferrenly. This enchanted amulet was a reward for Anders's service and friendship."
It's not clear whether "first escaped" is referring to his first attempt, or if it's when he first escaped on this attempt. Gives us plenty to speculate about, though!

I figure later on - once he's a bit more savvy about how the templar's can subdue him, how they pass infomation, what kind of places are more apostate-friendly than others - he might make a sort of game of it.
He jokes about the templars catching him in Awakening, and states that he'll only escape again before Rylock says she wants to execute him, but at the same time he's had Namaya looking for his phylactery. So it seems that while he's resigned to the fact that he'll always be hunted down anyway and wants to have his fun while he can, he's willing to take the risk of getting caught to ensure that they won't have such an easy job of finding him in future. He definitely comes across as a bit of an opportunist, and maybe one who's sick of getting dragged back and is starting to take his escapes a bit more seriously.

Modifié par Threeparts, 02 mai 2011 - 01:31 .