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[Pseudo the Mustachioed]

signcherie wrote...

Weren't people talking about some "Save Anders" t-shirts a while back? I think we need some of those.

Nooo. Don't save Anders. Make it worse! I want an Anders cameo in DA3 that amounts to a single corpse in a camp in the middle of a frozen wasteland you can loot for a handful of feathers, a broken staff and the bones of a kitten. Perhaps accompanied by some papers you can click on to read his last insane nigh-unintelligible scribblings about injustices and hints that he might have snapped and killed "him/her" (depending on your Hawke--but is he referring to your Hawke? Is it even Anders? Who knows.) in a Justicey frenzy, maybe for not killing him back in Kirkwall.

If he catches a break after the events of DA2 even if you let him live and run off into the sunset with him I'll frown.

Modifié par Pseudocognition, 22 mars 2011 - 07:10 .

[Kim Shepard]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

ALL of the framed narrative stuff is both hilarious and kinda disturbing now that I've played the game and know what happens.  Just the hate in the way Cassandra says Anders' name...and Varric's response.  "Don't remind me, I introduced them."  Wow.

Yeah, I realized that one. Does Varric regret bringing two crazy mage revolutionaries together? D:

[Sable Rhapsody]

Kim Shepard wrote...

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

ALL of the framed narrative stuff is both hilarious and kinda disturbing now that I've played the game and know what happens.  Just the hate in the way Cassandra says Anders' name...and Varric's response.  "Don't remind me, I introduced them."  Wow.

Yeah, I realized that one. Does Varric regret bringing two crazy mage revolutionaries together? D:

He certainly does in my "canon."  My Hawke was always a somewhat ruthless person, but her concerns were a lot narrower before she met Anders.  As long as she, her family, and her friends were ok, she didn't give a damn about anything else.

Anders made her realize that the cause of freedom for the mages was not only worthy of her talents, it was possible to WIN.  Forget merely eluding the mighty templars; Anders gave her the hope and courage she needed to fight a bogeyman that plagued her since she was a little girl.  And that...ended in a continent-spanning war 

[Miri1984]

Pseudocognition wrote...

signcherie wrote...

Weren't people talking about some "Save Anders" t-shirts a while back? I think we need some of those.

Nooo. Don't save Anders. Make it worse! I want an Anders cameo in DA3 that amounts to a single corpse in a camp in the middle of a frozen wasteland you can loot for a handful of feathers, a broken staff and the bones of a kitten. Perhaps accompanied by some papers you can click on to read his last insane nigh-unintelligible scribblings about injustices and hints that he might have snapped and killed "him/her" (depending on your Hawke--but is he referring to your Hawke? Is it even Anders? Who knows.) in a Justicey frenzy, maybe for not killing him back in Kirkwall.

If he catches a break after the events of DA2 even if you let him live and run off into the sunset with him I'll frown.

You've caught Gaider disease. Are you feeding on our tears?? :crying:

[Pseudo the Mustachioed]

Miri1984 wrote...
You've caught Gaider disease. Are you feeding on our tears?? :crying:

No, I just think slowing or diverting the downward spiral just because he gets to live and be with his LI would be cheap, especially when they've already gone this far. At least to me, LI Hawke letting him live and then joining him on the run was a decision to go down with the ship, so to speak. I can't imagine he's going to get less crazy. Or maybe there's a tiny, tragic window of clarity before he goes to the Deep Roads or something. But what a last punishment if he doesn't even get to go out in a blaze of Wardeny darkspawn killing glory! Dying alone in the cold, even before his Calling. Yeup.

STOMP ON MY HEART MOAR. Do it do it do it.

Modifié par Pseudocognition, 22 mars 2011 - 08:02 .

[Naivor]

I actually thought Anders was a bit too silly in DA2. I mean, the kitten and flower talk is practically forced in there, so people who played Awakening would see it's still the same man, but it serves no other purpose.
Oh well. Good enough character, if you disregard the fact that you have to get Rivarly points by turning him down at some point.
Also if you disregard the fact that he was dead in my Awakening save. Which I imported.
One more thing to disregard; I killed him at the end of DA2. No one blows up my favourite chilling place, brah.

[Kim Shepard]

I hope Anders does live. It would seem a little pointless to say you can spare his life if he'll be dead by the beginning of the next game anyway. It should make some difference, even though it obviously can't be a plot-required event (unless they do like Oghren and Leliana and bring him back to life). I'd like Anders/Justice and Hawke to fight in the revolution... if your Hawke would go for that, of course.

Not that the "end" I imagined for them is a happy one. It involves Hawke being in a dungeon with the Warden and Maric, Anders already gone off to his calling, their son willingly possessed by the last parental figure he had - Justice, and an encounter with Flemeth. xD It's crazy, not sad. Okay, it's a little sad. But mostly crazy.

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

He certainly does in my "canon."  My Hawke was always a somewhat ruthless person, but her concerns were a lot narrower before she met Anders.  As long as she, her family, and her friends were ok, she didn't give a damn about anything else.

Anders made her realize that the cause of freedom for the mages was not only worthy of her talents, it was possible to WIN.  Forget merely eluding the mighty templars; Anders gave her the hope and courage she needed to fight a bogeyman that plagued her since she was a little girl.  And that...ended in a continent-spanning war 

Kaya Hawke is similar, except she was the type to help other mages before - just not out in the open.

She went from living in hiding to "kill all the templars" by the beginning of Act II. It was that templar who talked about what happens to tranquil mage girls. He's the one who really set off her rage. History should blame him. xD

[Naivor]

Kim Shepard wrote...

I hope Anders does live. It would seem a little pointless to say you can spare his life if he'll be dead by the beginning of the next game anyway. It should make some difference, even though it obviously can't be a plot-required event (unless they do like Oghren and Leliana and bring him back to life).
[

I just hope my choices import properly for the next Dragon Age. Anders is dead in my save, as dead as dead can be, and I don't want him running around in DA3 again. It would be nice if the DA universe would build itself up, one game at a time, until every single player would have a somewhat unique savegame when the franchise is killed.

Have to see what happens to Ander in the DA2 DLC. And there will be a DLC for Anders, because it would be damned nice to hear what exactly changed him so much. Justice/Vengeance is a good starting point, but forced gray area with his I'm-A-Kind-Of-Abomination-But-Not-Really feels... odd.
Although you could tell Wynne in DA: O that Abominations aren't abominations if they still retain free will, so I quess that could answer it.

[Kim Shepard]

Anders being alive had nothing to do with import problems, actually. He's required for the DA2 plot, so no matter what happened in Awakening, he's alive and a Warden. But the import system was messed up. It knew my Warden was Orlesian, but forgot that she's not a male... o_o She also saved both Vigil's Keep and Amaranthine, despite burning it down.

I hope any information about Anders and Justice comes in the form of an expansion pack, if not DA3. I'd rather not wait a year until DA2 gets an Ultimate Edition to play any DLC they come out with.

[Naivor]

I agree with him being important for the plot; that much is obvious. I just can't see why he was made so important. There must be dozens of ways to make it so that your choices in Origins regarding Anders keep up, but they would all require that Anders is a minor character.
Oh well, the ultimate ending was badly centered around him going bat****alqaeda-mode, so I shouldn't complain about something that can't be remedied anymore.

But true, Anders DLC, and be quick about it, please.
Oh wait, quick makes bad. Take your time, Bioware, and make it good and looooong.

[Dunizel]

Naivor wrote...


I just hope my choices import properly for the next Dragon Age. Anders is dead in my save, as dead as dead can be, and I don't want him running around in DA3 again.

To be completely honest I doubt the Murder Knife of Wonders can truly kill him. 
Or better, if the need to bring him back arises, it's isnt hard t say he didn't die there, we left him n the courtyard, no one knows what happened next. Sure, he probably just wanted to die at that point, but let's remember he had Justice. Wynne was kept alive, and was more tired and exhausted than Anders, by her spirit. Nothing says Justice couldn't heal him and keep him alive, maybe even control his body if Anders just wanted to fade.  If I am not wrong he was stabbed even in his introduction short story, and survived well enough. Really, he is in a strange condition that can allow whatever they decide for the plot.

Anders for someone died defending the keep, they took Justice to kill the Mother (or viceversa)...but yeah, we know how it ended.

[Kim Shepard]

Yeah, Anders was stabbed right through with a sword in the short story. Even if Justice didn't prevent the murder knife in-game, there could be a Wynne situation going on.

Justice always "dies" at least by the epilogue in Awakening, doesn't he? Mine said that after the body was decaying too much, he left and returned to the Fade. He would probably still be alive in the Fade even if Anders was killed.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Kim Shepard wrote...

I hope Anders does live. It would seem a little pointless to say you can spare his life if he'll be dead by the beginning of the next game anyway. It should make some difference, even though it obviously can't be a plot-required event (unless they do like Oghren and Leliana and bring him back to life). I'd like Anders/Justice and Hawke to fight in the revolution... if your Hawke would go for that, of course.

I'd also like to see Anders and my Hawke fight in the revolution they helped spark.  He really did have a positive impact on my Hawke in terms of her morals.  He taught her to be less selfish, more generous and idealistic.  And...well...the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

For my Hawke, the turning point was an Act 1 conversation that you get with Anders if you don't pick the early flirt options.  He basically asks if Hawke would like to be imprisoned in the Circle, if every mage didn't deserve the freedom she's had.  That got her thinking.  And by the end of Act 2, she was totally in his camp.

[Naivor]

Still feels wrong. The old "It's magic, we ain't gotta explain anythin'!" approach is a bit archaic and doesn't really work these days. I would assume Justice would fade away when Anders dies.
Plus, we've killed enough abominations in this game to know that they die when stabbed.
Though I have to admit, he might not have died, since Justice is more like a mutation these days, and mostly represent Anger if anything, and that might give him more juice to go with.
I just really, really, -really- want him to be dead in DA3, so we don't have to see the same character over and over again, even though we quite clearly stabbed him with murderknife.

But please, illuminate me in the introduction short story. I've never seen anything like that, and would like to know.

[Aeowyn]

Well, nobody knows what happens to Justice after he leaves Kristoff's body. Maybe he found another corpse to occupy for the time being?
Additionally, in regards to Anders being dead in Awakenings, they have an explanation for that in game.

[Threeparts]

I'm almost certain that Anders, if stabbed in the courtyard, is perma-dead. He was pretty much the main character in this game, not just a minor NPC in a DLC, so finding him somehow magically resurrected in a later game or expansion would cheapen the whole thing. It would be akin to Alistair or the Warden dramatically dying to kill the Archdemon, and then popping up again in DA2 to have a chat with Hawke.
Yes, we could import a US Warden into Awakening or the DLCs, but that was the player's choice and not how the story was intended to play out. I believe it was intended for an Orlesian Warden to have accomplished the events of Awakening in DA2, if the player chose that kind of import.

I would love love love to see Anders again in a DLC or expac, but I don't want him to be forced onto people that killed him in this game. I can't imagine he'll show up in any major roles set in the timeline after Hawke's seventh year, simply because it would require the same lines/plot to be written twice to accommodate a replacement for him if he's dead.

It breaks my heart to say it, but I'm not sure we'll ever see him again.

[Threeparts]

Naivor wrote...

But please, illuminate me in the introduction short story. I've never seen anything like that, and would like to know.

The short story can be found here. It's written by Ms Hepler, who wrote Anders in DA2, so she'd know best what is going on with his character.

[Dunizel]

You can find it here

A short extract, I was reading it again now and wondered...

And then his sword is level with my chest, and I let it come, because it is only steel and cannot hurt me, for I am not of mortal men. And when it sinks hilt-deep in my flesh with no reaction, that's when he gives up.

I still think, considered the scene, that Anders this time wanted to die...but who knows what they can decide really happened.

Threeparts wrote...

I'm almost certain that Anders, if stabbed in the courtyard, is perma-dead. He was pretty much the main character in this game, not just a minor NPC in a DLC, so finding him somehow magically resurrected in a later game or expansion would cheapen the whole thing. 

It breaks my heart to say it, but I'm not sure we'll ever see him again.

Yes, as much as I would like to see him again because I think it is one of the most interesting characters story-wise, I doubt we will see him again if he is dead. He will probably get a mention if he is alive and on the run...but not much more I suppose. 

Modifié par Dunizel, 22 mars 2011 - 08:52 .

[MaglorArcanist]

I have the hope in da3 if it worth the bucks, we find the bones of anders in the deep roads.
It's a grey warden, his destiny is a horrible death consumed by corruption anyways.
I haven't kill him, but i have kicked it out my party, if i see him again i kill him.

[GailRana]

Naivor wrote...
I just hope my choices import properly for the next Dragon Age. Anders is dead in my save, as dead as dead can be, and I don't want him running around in DA3 again. It would be nice if the DA universe would build itself up, one game at a time, until every single player would have a somewhat unique savegame when the franchise is killed.

let me guess, arrow through the neck, body badly burned, in robes. Do all mages look the same to you?

[Kaioku]

Hahaha, ninja'd

Modifié par Kaioku, 22 mars 2011 - 08:58 .

[GailRana]

Dunizel wrote...

You can find it here

A short extract, I was reading it again now and wondered...

And then his sword is level with my chest, and I let it come, because it is only steel and cannot hurt me, for I am not of mortal men. And when it sinks hilt-deep in my flesh with no reaction, that's when he gives up.

I still think, considered the scene, that Anders this time wanted to die...but who knows what they can decide really happened.

Well, he was in Vengeance form for the Sword through the chest thing, but not for murder knife. maybe that could make a difference.

[Dunizel]

To be honest, his dead at the keep was something really epic. Killed hundreds of darkspawn around him before going down. That was something...

I didn't get that dialogue with Nate (my Anders survived and stayed with the Wardens), it was awkward...

Not the "I ran" explanation he gave Nate. I know it is just an excuse, he was probably dead there and somehow Justice jumped from corpse to corpse to him >.> (the more I try to explain it, the more it sounds ridicolous)

Edit: Not to mention I think Nate would recognize Ander's body, if it wasn't in ashes. He is not that stupid...and there weren't many mages at Vigil's Kepp who could pull out that killing spree on darkspawn.

Modifié par Dunizel, 22 mars 2011 - 09:09 .

[GailRana]

Threeparts wrote...

I'm almost certain that Anders, if stabbed in the courtyard, is perma-dead. He was pretty much the main character in this game, not just a minor NPC in a DLC, so finding him somehow magically resurrected in a later game or expansion would cheapen the whole thing. It would be akin to Alistair or the Warden dramatically dying to kill the Archdemon, and then popping up again in DA2 to have a chat with Hawke.
Yes, we could import a US Warden into Awakening or the DLCs, but that was the player's choice and not how the story was intended to play out. I believe it was intended for an Orlesian Warden to have accomplished the events of Awakening in DA2, if the player chose that kind of import.

I would love love love to see Anders again in a DLC or expac, but I don't want him to be forced onto people that killed him in this game. I can't imagine he'll show up in any major roles set in the timeline after Hawke's seventh year, simply because it would require the same lines/plot to be written twice to accommodate a replacement for him if he's dead.

It breaks my heart to say it, but I'm not sure we'll ever see him again.

Yeah, for those that killed him i suppose the only way to have him in a sequel would be if it were justice walking around in a brand new Anders suit.

Modifié par GailRana, 22 mars 2011 - 09:06 .

[erilben]

GailRana wrote...

Naivor wrote...
I just hope my choices import properly for the next Dragon Age. Anders is dead in my save, as dead as dead can be, and I don't want him running around in DA3 again. It would be nice if the DA universe would build itself up, one game at a time, until every single player would have a somewhat unique savegame when the franchise is killed.

let me guess, arrow through the neck, body badly burned, in robes. Do all mages look the same to you?

that makes no sense. Anders says he left the Wardens when the Keep fell, so how do the Wardens make him get rid of the cat? How does he meet Stroud? You can't say he leaves and meets Stroud later either. Stroud says to Anders in the Deep Roads "I thought you were dead". How is that even possible? Anders had to meet Stroud after Awakening.

And if that sthort story is to be believed, Anders killed some Wardens and they know he is an abomination. But no Warden in the game seems to care or know.