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[Collider]

I've been wondering this since I haven't really been following the Dragon Age fandom until now. Is Anders a more popular love interest for female players than Fenris?

[Amondra]

Collider wrote...

I've been wondering this since I haven't really been following the Dragon Age fandom until now. Is Anders a more popular love interest for female players than Fenris?

Umm I think it is tied or Fenris wins, based off what happens at the end of the game, and that people as a whole don't seem to like Anders co-dependency. 

[Giggles_Manically]

Just a quick question to those who did the rival path for Anders.

Where would you say the real doubt starts to kick in for him?
Also I am really left wondering if its just Vengeance talking to Hawke on the rival path more and more.

[AndreaDraco]

Since it has been way too many pages without a good fan art...


by Sandara

[Lady Dino]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Just a quick question to those who did the rival path for Anders.

Where would you say the real doubt starts to kick in for him?
Also I am really left wondering if its just Vengeance talking to Hawke on the rival path more and more.

The "Questioning Beliefs" quest in Act 3, after you complete his "Justice" quest, is where he finally starts to doubt the whole "Violence is the only way" thing. 

And Justice only talks to Hawke directly (as in without Anders) in that last "Questioning Belifs". So, anytime before that no, it's not just the spirit talking to you, Anders himself really truely believes in mage's rights with, to quote Merrill, more fire than the sun.

Modifié par Lady Dino, 13 juin 2011 - 11:47 .

[BlueMew]

Collider wrote...

I've been wondering this since I haven't really been following the Dragon Age fandom until now. Is Anders a more popular love interest for female players than Fenris?

Based on the latest poll I saw they were sort of tied.

Meanwhile, *snickers* I love Anders. I love Merrill. I hit the kill button every time after duelling Loghain even if I planned not to. To some I must be doing everything wrong, but it sure doesn't feel that way.

My Warden's a Circle mage, who grew up in the Ferelden Tower from a very young age. Unlike Anders she sees the Circle mages as her family, be it an estranged one after the whole Jowan business - regardless of what he did or didn't do, she'd still make the choice of helping him escape. 
She and Alistair remained with the Wardens, but every now and then I wonder what would happen if she'd seen the Kirkwall mage situation. I imagine Alistair would have to physically restrain her while mumbling 'Grey Warden' like a mantra 

[berelinde]

Collider wrote...

I've been wondering this since I haven't really been following the Dragon Age fandom until now. Is Anders a more popular love interest for female players than Fenris?

Probably not. Anders's romance starts out as a cliche, trite and syrupy sweet. It puts a lot of people off. Others go into a fanrage at the end of Act 3.

Anders romance fans like the romance for a number of reasons. I'm running late for work, so this is going to be rushed. Some just like sappy, and either don't see or choose to ignore the breakdown of the relationship later on. Others enjoy the tragedy aspect. Friend or rival, Anders falls apart. The manner depends on the path chosen. Others consider the romance as deliberately tearing down preconceived ideas of storybook romance. Because one by one, those sappy cliches are stripped away to reveal something horribly broken.

There is a bit of overlap, players that play through either the Anders romance or the Fenris romance with equal enthusiasm, but for the most part, the Fenris romance attracts a different crowd.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

Collider wrote...

I've been wondering this since I haven't really been following the Dragon Age fandom until now. Is Anders a more popular love interest for female players than Fenris?

I find them both intriguing, but I end up slightly favoring Anders. I have a sort of ideal romantic progression, and I'm aware enough of it to analyze it properly, so I'm going to join in on the fun here.

I have a thing for guys who haven't gotten a fair shake in life. Find someone whose self esteem is unjustifiably low, and help them notice good things about themselves. Find someone who has learned to cope without a support system, and support them. Find someone who isn't used to having friends, and befriend them.

If they end up looking at you like you're the only soft thing in a sharp world, so much the better. If they can crack a joke, I'm practically lost.  And if there is something about them that fits into an ineffable mystical cosmology... well... that's the clincher. The impossible fictional clincher. 

Bioware is very, very good at making love interests whose romance follows that particular introductory cycle that is so tempting for me. Both Fenris and Anders do, as did Alistair and Zev. The female LIs don't tend to have that at all which is... interesting. Someone on the Dragon Age team understands something very fundamental about girls like me in a vaguely disconcerting way.

So it all comes down to the other three things - their relief at having found you, their sense of humor, and then that "something ineffable about them" you can only really get in Fantasy.  Both boys have the sense of humor, which is nice, but Anders takes it home by really seeming to appreciate what he has and by having a bloody crazed spirit inside him. That's where the magic happens, people. Literally.

[ashyraine]

Collider wrote...

I've been wondering this since I haven't really been following the Dragon Age fandom until now. Is Anders a more popular love interest for female players than Fenris?

Pretty sure it's a tie. This thread just move a lost faster than the Fenris thread because we're more obsessed devoted  

I personally like them both and was alternating for awhile. And at least Fenris' rivalmance doesn't break him ><

Found out yesterday that Anders will beg you to kill him on the box of shame even if you side with mages. Haven't gotten to the gallows yet (sided with Templars first then reloaded) to see if he's still a sad panda there. Though he did seem to perk up when Pinky asked him to kill templars with her  

http://cloud.steampo...0A8060D85D408D/

Modifié par ashyraine, 13 juin 2011 - 01:03 .

[Collider]

AndreaDraco wrote...

Since it has been way too many pages without a good fan art...

It's a good piece, but I can't help but feel that there's something off with male Hawke's eyes.

Modifié par Collider, 13 juin 2011 - 02:23 .

[kromify]

fenris doesn't really draw me at all. he's too serious - i need humour in my boys. both zev and alistair had it.

now i'm thinking of sacrificing ali to the archdemon for pathos. i usually do the DR because morrigan's my best mage and highly useful. but i'm a pathos addict (obv since i like anders)
if only i wasn't simply trying to get the cameos in da2... youtube doesn't always satisfy

edit - seeing alistair so still is what makes me cry. okay so i know he's dead. but he was always full of life, always optimistic and lighthearted. i should go spend some time on an alistair thread instead of bugging you guys 

I NEED A HUG  

Modifié par kromify, 13 juin 2011 - 02:32 .

[kromify]

Collider wrote...

AndreaDraco wrote...

Since it has been way too many pages without a good fan art...

It's a good piece, but I can't help but feel that there's something off with male Hawke's eyes.

i can't help feeling that anders would never be pressed agaist the wall so defensively. he should be all over hawke  

[berelinde]

@ash: Forgive the OT, but I've been dying to ask. What mod do you use to get pink hair?

[Sialater]

kromify wrote...

fenris doesn't really draw me at all. he's too serious - i need humour in my boys. both zev and alistair had it.

now i'm thinking of sacrificing ali to the archdemon for pathos. i usually do the DR because morrigan's my best mage and highly useful. but i'm a pathos addict (obv since i like anders)
if only i wasn't simply trying to get the cameos in da2... youtube doesn't always satisfy

edit - seeing alistair so still is what makes me cry. okay so i know he's dead. but he was always full of life, always optimistic and lighthearted. i should go spend some time on an alistair thread instead of bugging you guys 

I NEED A HUG  

*hugs*

~whispers~ Stop killing Alistair.

Now, back to our tormented apostate.

[MG800]

BlueMew wrote...

Collider wrote...

I've been wondering this since I haven't really been following the Dragon Age fandom until now. Is Anders a more popular love interest for female players than Fenris?

Based on the latest poll I saw they were sort of tied.

Meanwhile, *snickers* I love Anders. I love Merrill. I hit the kill button every time after duelling Loghain even if I planned not to. To some I must be doing everything wrong, but it sure doesn't feel that way.

My Warden's a Circle mage, who grew up in the Ferelden Tower from a very young age. Unlike Anders she sees the Circle mages as her family, be it an estranged one after the whole Jowan business - regardless of what he did or didn't do, she'd still make the choice of helping him escape. 
She and Alistair remained with the Wardens, but every now and then I wonder what would happen if she'd seen the Kirkwall mage situation. I imagine Alistair would have to physically restrain her while mumbling 'Grey Warden' like a mantra 

Mmm, my Amell was a bigger extremist than Anders at the point when they met. In my headcanon, this crazy **** gave him more than a few ideas for his manifesto - though he probably censored them first. She would like to see the Tower burn, but she didn't want to see templars gaining even more control.  

Fenris. I like him - he gets annoying in rivalry but I could accept him as a Craver2, at least with a snarky Hawke. But as a LI? He somehow puts me off. I don't know why. Maybe I should try to hook him up with manHawke - and see if it makes a diffrence.

Anders managed to hit almost all my weak spots, and set a lot of "turn-off" buttoms at the same moment. And yes, I like tragic - thought I didn't realized that before. He wasn't my Hawke's LI in the first playthrough, so maybe that's a part of it.

Modifié par MG800, 13 juin 2011 - 02:57 .

[kromify]

 dancing mod with anders  

[ashyraine]

@berelinde think it's lotc's hair colors. I'm using a chargen file a friend made. I'll check when I get home (in approx 8 hrs if you're patient lol)

[Addai]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

I mostly played mages and consider elf mage my "official" Warden.  The characters I liked best were my Andrastian Tower mage and a Dalish mage I created via a mod and wrote quite a bit about.

I think playing different kinds of mages has shaped my outlook most.  It's given me the idea that they are not all alike, and therefore no one political viewpoint can claim to represent them, let alone one man (or man-spirit synthesis as the case may be).  I don't think either of my primary mages would be happy about the mage revolution.  Andrastian chancellor of Ferelden would be horrified.  Dalish mage would shake her head, but her clan was decimated by Merrill, so she'd have other issues.  She'd probably go to Rivain and let the rest of Thedas sort its own problems out.

I remember your Dalish Warden story, I replied to you once about it. I made the comment about the Warden being the kwisatz haderach at FF.Net. Your Dalish Warden would head to the semi-colony of clans on the border of Rivain?

Oh yeah, thanks for that.    The Dalish story did not get a lot of attention so all reviews were appreciated.

I had written that she spent a year with that semi-colony in Rivain to develop her magic- sort of a Mary Sue thing but I thought it might have been possible- so yeah I figure she goes back there anyway.

She also was my only character who annulled the Circle in Origins.  I figured that she saw Circle mages as more dangerous even than the templars, if they could not control their powers any better than they were.

[Addai]

ElleMullineux wrote...
I think the difficulty some people have with Anders and his character is that he isn't easy or simple. He doesn't fit in with the stereotypical good or bad guy, and I guess a lot of people feel betrayed by his actions and are taking it very personally, rather than viewing it as a majestic piece of writing. That and some people just don't like to delve into the delicious twistiness, they just don't want to look at the game any deeper than surface level (which is why the magical handwave of possessed by a spirit vs lyrium idol exists).

I definitely can appreciate an ambiguous character.  I am as bored by paladins as by evil villains.  However, the problems I have with the story are more that it's not subtle at all, and any ambiguity in Anders' character is overshadowed by the fact that "a devil made him do it."  So there's not enough of a complex moral situation.  I felt like a lot of things in the DA2 story were too hyped and hyper, too extreme, to be able to enjoy it much.

I always found the Dalish just didn't care about what anyone else did - they were very isolationist. Which is fine up to a point, but by not wanting to even interact (understandably to be fair) they seem to be dooming themselves to always be in conflict with anyone they meet. It's a bit like with the mages in that they keep/ are kept so seperate they have no way to educate people about what they really are and foster any sort of understanding. Not that they probably care.

A Dalish Warden was in an interesting position to either be a different sort of person- I played my Dalish rogue as being fairly politically savvy and progressive in wanting the Dalish to integrate- or to be confirmed in their shemlen hatred/ isolationism.  I do hope we get to play the origins again.

[Searska]

Wasn't sure if we were still doing songs for Anders, but I think Seether's "Country Song" may be a good addition:

The lyrics almost perfectly describe the rivalmance.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

Addai67 wrote...

ElleMullineux wrote...
I think the difficulty some people have with Anders and his character is that he isn't easy or simple. He doesn't fit in with the stereotypical good or bad guy, and I guess a lot of people feel betrayed by his actions and are taking it very personally, rather than viewing it as a majestic piece of writing. That and some people just don't like to delve into the delicious twistiness, they just don't want to look at the game any deeper than surface level (which is why the magical handwave of possessed by a spirit vs lyrium idol exists).

I definitely can appreciate an ambiguous character.  I am as bored by paladins as by evil villains.  However, the problems I have with the story are more that it's not subtle at all, and any ambiguity in Anders' character is overshadowed by the fact that "a devil made him do it."  So there's not enough of a complex moral situation.  I felt like a lot of things in the DA2 story were too hyped and hyper, too extreme, to be able to enjoy it much.

And there we go back to the devil again.

I think there is a very specific reason that Vengeance is called Vengeance and not Wrath (or Rage, or Pride, or Justice, for that matter, to be entirely fair.) He is neither good nor evil.

If you were truly Dalish you'd realize that Vengeance is not something to be scorned. It is something to be gently calmed and reasoned with, when it goes too far. For every Elgar'nan, there must be a Mythal. Without Elgar'nan, the earth would be nothing but a plain of ashes, but without Mythal the Sun would never shine.

I joke to some extent... those gods are long gone, but their stories are still useful. Still, if you cast aside Vengeance, then you cast aside the father of us all. Vengeance's wife is the Goddess of Justice and Protection and without that balance he can do a great deal of damage, but that does not mean he is always wrong, or bad. Heh, you'll have to excuse me. I'm afraid I may be getting my pantheon all over your dualism.

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 13 juin 2011 - 04:56 .

[GailRana]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

ElleMullineux wrote...
I think the difficulty some people have with Anders and his character is that he isn't easy or simple. He doesn't fit in with the stereotypical good or bad guy, and I guess a lot of people feel betrayed by his actions and are taking it very personally, rather than viewing it as a majestic piece of writing. That and some people just don't like to delve into the delicious twistiness, they just don't want to look at the game any deeper than surface level (which is why the magical handwave of possessed by a spirit vs lyrium idol exists).

I definitely can appreciate an ambiguous character.  I am as bored by paladins as by evil villains.  However, the problems I have with the story are more that it's not subtle at all, and any ambiguity in Anders' character is overshadowed by the fact that "a devil made him do it."  So there's not enough of a complex moral situation.  I felt like a lot of things in the DA2 story were too hyped and hyper, too extreme, to be able to enjoy it much.

And there we go back to the devil again.

I think there is a very specific reason that Vengeance is called Vengeance and not Wrath (or Rage, or Pride, or Justice, for that matter, to be entirely fair.) He is neither good nor evil.

If you were truly Dalish you'd realize that Vengeance is not something to be scorned. It is something to be gently calmed and reasoned with, when it goes too far. For every Elgar'nan, there must be a Mythal. Without Elgar'nan, the earth would be nothing but a plain of ashes, but without Mythal the Sun would never shine.

I joke to some extent... those gods are long gone, but their stories are still useful. Still, if you cast aside Vengeance, then you cast aside the father of us all. Vengeance's wife is the Goddess of Justice and Protection and without that balance he can do a great deal of damage, but that does not mean he is always wrong, or bad. Heh, you'll have to excuse me. I'm afraid I may be getting my pantheon all over your dualism.

Beautifully put. that's such a cool idea, how vengeance isn't bad necessarily, but it's more of the lack of balance that is causing suffering. 

Modifié par GailRana, 13 juin 2011 - 05:07 .

[Addai]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...
And there we go back to the devil again.

I think there is a very specific reason that Vengeance is called Vengeance and not Wrath (or Rage, or Pride, or Justice, for that matter, to be entirely fair.) He is neither good nor evil.

If you were truly Dalish you'd realize that Vengeance is not something to be scorned. It is something to be gently calmed and reasoned with, when it goes too far. For every Elgar'nan, there must be a Mythal. Without Elgar'nan, the earth would be nothing but a plain of ashes, but without Mythal the Sun would never shine.

Yeah, I'm not going to get into that debate, I was speaking metaphorically.  I could call Justice a deus ex machina, that's what I meant by the comment.

Although, Elgar'nan is not a happy god by any means.  The elves pray to be protected from him.  And I don't buy that Fade spirits= elven gods.

[Toastyblue2]

berelinde wrote...

Collider wrote...

I've been wondering this since I haven't really been following the Dragon Age fandom until now. Is Anders a more popular love interest for female players than Fenris?

Anders romance fans like the romance for a number of reasons. I'm running late for work, so this is going to be rushed. Some just like sappy, and either don't see or choose to ignore the breakdown of the relationship later on. Others enjoy the tragedy aspect. Friend or rival, Anders falls apart. The manner depends on the path chosen. Others consider the romance as deliberately tearing down preconceived ideas of storybook romance. Because one by one, those sappy cliches are stripped away to reveal something horribly broken.

There is a bit of overlap, players that play through either the Anders romance or the Fenris romance with equal enthusiasm, but for the most part, the Fenris romance attracts a different crowd.

I like this discussion. *delurks*

I have always been the type of person that doesn't find 'happily ever after' to be very compelling. I like romance with problems; no matter how much the problems might be set in another world, it's very much part of our world to have a romance with problems in the first place. I also have been a fan of fictional romances where one partner has serious issues of some type. What might be even more attractive to me is one where the partner who's in a better state of mind/body/circumstances just can't fix the problems of his or her love interest and instead is either forced to deal with those issues or leave him or her behind.

I like the idea that after Hawke and Anders walked away from Kirkwall, they had to face, on a relationship level, what happened to Kirkwall and to Anders himself. It had to have changed their relationship forever if it survived it at all. You just can't forget what Anders did, even if you can justify it, and I think it would certainly change how Hawke looked at Anders as a lover and a human being in general.

I haven't played a Fenris romance yet, so I can't talk about that, but I do find Fenris compelling on his own.