57020 réponses à ce sujet

[beckaliz]

I feel the same way about the showdown vs soapbox execution. The dialogue in the showdown is so weak, it should have a lot more impact. "I loved you once, but I cannot watch you do this." Okay. ;; Then he dies in like two hits. wtf. And no dramatic cut scene. His body just fades. Weeeeeak.

@ademska I've had a strong infatuation for someone I really hated once. D: Took a long time to get over it too.

ETA for top, fresh off the dA presses...


Justice by Corbie

Modifié par beckaliz, 19 juillet 2011 - 04:34 .

[Sinaxi]

maxernst wrote...

ademska wrote...

Evilnor wrote...

He basically says Hawke will always be second place.  Something about Hawke is the most important thing in his life, but some things are more important than his life.  If it was just a choice between his own death and Hawke's, he'd choose his own, but between Hawke and his cause, the cause comes first.

bingo.

this is perfect.

Huh?  He's just said that he would sacrifice you to further his cause.  He couldn't possibly say it any more clearly.

But...but...that doesn't bother you guys?! Not in the least? I understand that freedom for Mages is more important but it's just kinda...crappy for Hawke..lol. :/

[maxernst]

Ryzaki wrote...

maxernst wrote...
Fair enough, though I do think that trying to trick Hawke into helping him blow up the chantry is a betrayal.  It's mostly this idea Anders loves Hawke so much no matter what, even if you don't romance him, more deeply and truly than any of the other companions that I take issue with.  To be honest, it would be a hard for a friend-path to be roleplayed consistently and still side with the Templars, and I don't find rivalmances very psychologically convincing.  I find it hard to comprehend Anders loving someone who doesn't share his commitment to his most cherished values.  

Just for clarification, my Hawke sided with the mages but was furious with Anders for putting him in that position and wanted nothing to do with him.  He didn't kill him on impulse, maybe because he thought Anders execution should be performed by the authorities after a trial, but was too angry to even talk to him when he showed up at the gallows.

I did feel the bolded was a betrayal. Especially since Anders tricked my Hawke into helping him with the one thing he knew would get him to help. Getting rid of Justice. Then he blackmails Hawke with that "if you loved me you'd help me." line. Once Hawke sees the Chantry go up...upmost betrayal. Mostly due to the fact that Anders used him to do that and lied about it. 

I manage to friendpath and then side with the templars just fine though it is a very invidiual YMMV sort of thing. 

Did you side with the Templars to punish Anders?  I can understand that psychologically, but it's awfully petty.  I think if my Hawke had known that it would be possible to spare the mages who surrendered, including Bethany, he might have sided with the Templars as the best option for Kirkwall's future, but without metagaming, I have to assume I'm going to have to kill ALL the mages. 

[Ryzaki]

maxernst wrote...
Did you side with the Templars to punish Anders?  I can understand that psychologically, but it's awfully petty.  I think if my Hawke had known that it would be possible to spare the mages who surrendered, including Bethany, he might have sided with the Templars as the best option for Kirkwall's future, but without metagaming, I have to assume I'm going to have to kill ALL the mages.  

Uh...no. I don't see how you got that from that. That Hawke sided with the templars because he never agreed with mage freedom (not the way Anders wanted) and he wasn't gonna let a bloody revolution start if he could help it. It wasn't about punishing Anders. It was about restoring order to the city as quickly as possible. Bethany was a warden and not even part of the equation. (or dead not sure which she should be for his canon). Anders knew he didn't agree with complete mage freedom especially not at the cost of civilian lives. They understood that about one another. So the gallows faceoff made sense for them. And the whole "Kirkwall is my home and I will defend it." convo line suits them perfectly. (Of course this is one of my few Hawkes that don't want to get the hell out of Kirkwall and are desperately pushing the boat trying to sail away.) Edit: That said this Hawke *does* spare every mage who surrenders because he's not trying to kill them merely avert a revolution (a doomed effort but he tried at least). 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 19 juillet 2011 - 05:36 .

[beckaliz]

maxernst wrote...

Did you side with the Templars to punish Anders?  I can understand that psychologically, but it's awfully petty.  I think if my Hawke had known that it would be possible to spare the mages who surrendered, including Bethany, he might have sided with the Templars as the best option for Kirkwall's future, but without metagaming, I have to assume I'm going to have to kill ALL the mages. 

I actually managed to take this position on my virgin PT with no chance for metagaming. I hate having killed Anders on a friendmance but for roleplay purposes it worked out absolutely perfectly. I got to the part where those mages surrender and I was like YAAAY!!!  And of course I got to have Bethany back.

Modifié par beckaliz, 19 juillet 2011 - 05:35 .

[Sinaxi]

Oh my god. If you break up with Anders on a rivalmance with a sarcastic Hawke she tells him "SORRY, YOU JUST WEREN'T THAT GOOD!"

HAHAH. Woooowww. That is HARSH.

The game is still relatively new to me so I didn't quite know about all these things, good thing for youtube videos.

[Jean]

Tidra wrote...

Oh my god. If you break up with Anders on a rivalmance with a sarcastic Hawke she tells him "SORRY, YOU JUST WEREN'T THAT GOOD!"

HAHAH. Woooowww. That is HARSH.

The game is still relatively new to me so I didn't quite know about all these things, good thing for youtube videos.

Hearing that for the first time was great.
A total "I shouldn't be laughing but I can't stop myself" moment.

[Arquen]

His face is priceless on that line. Im all "damn... that's so wrong hawke."

Are you guys back to the he never loved me he always loved me argument? I think that is full circle for this thread... like.. twice, lol. We really need a search thread function to help dig up old posts of relevance.

To me both sides have such good points. Anders does seem to go out of his way to keep hawke safe, but at the same time hawke takes a backseat to his goals. I often wonder if this isn't more a self preservation mechanism on Anders part. I mean, he does love hawke, but he becomes so entwined in the mage cause I think he feels in order to retain himself and preserve his own sanity he must fulfill that cause. Therefore one could say he is selfish for concentrating only on the cause and nothing else, or they could say he is actually trying to salvage what is left of himself for hawke because hawke deserves better, and he wants to be better. In the end though he probably feels like his betrayal to hawke isn't forgivable, and so he thinks death is the only just way out.

2 cents.

[Sinaxi]

That's probably my fault, I brought it up I think lol and I'm new to the forums...haha. I almost wish I hadn't joined, I feel like I'm becoming a total Fenris and Anders fangirl now I just wondered what people thought about the whole Hawke devotion vs. Mage Cause! Devotion and if Anders could ever be willing to put Hawke above it.

[PseudoEthnic]

I'm almost finished with my Andersmance playthrough, and I have to say that the Anders romance (The friendship one anyway) is actually pretty good if you skip past the uber cheesy lines(and you're playing a sarcastic Hawke.) I'm in Act 3, and I recently finished Anders's Justice quest. I'll come back once I finish the game to give you my final say on the romance.

[YamiSnuffles]

Well, I went over this ages ago, but, new people and all so here goes...

I won't speak for anyone else, but I wouldn't want Anders to put his relationship with Hawke ahead of his cause. He's trying to do something huge. Something way more important than any relationship he might be in. So he loves Hawke, but if he has to choose between being with Hawke or doing what he can to free the mages, he can't choose Hawke.

To me it would be sort of like if there was no Dark Ritual in Origins and the Warden was with Alistair. They have two options; 1) one of them can die to save the world, effectively ending their future together, or 2) they can run off together and hope that Riordan saves the day. It would be hugely irresponsible for them to put all of that on Riordan just so they could be happy together. Anders has a similar problem at the end of DA2. He can; 1) sacrifice his life and relationship in order to do something to hopefully free mages or at least give them a fighting chance, or 2) run off with Hawke and hope that someone else does something eventually to free mages.

If Anders chooses Hawke, he's saying that s/he's more important than the freedom of mages. Which, to me, is horrible. It's far worse if you put the order as Hawke> Mage Freedom> Everything Else, than if you put Mage Freedom first. Of course, this is why I pair a passionate, revolutionary Hawke with Anders. For one, it should mean that he won't have to choose between the cause or Hawke. For another, it means she wouldn't ever want him to put her before the cause.

So, maybe it's sad to some people. For me, it makes me think more of him that he has something he would put so far above his own personal happiness. If you want to be the center of the universe in a relationship, you probably shouldn't get involved with a crazy revolutionary.

[Heidenreich]

YamiSnuffles wrote...

Well, I went over this ages ago, but, new people and all so here goes...

I won't speak for anyone else, but I wouldn't want Anders to put his relationship with Hawke ahead of his cause. He's trying to do something huge. Something way more important than any relationship he might be in. So he loves Hawke, but if he has to choose between being with Hawke or doing what he can to free the mages, he can't choose Hawke.

To me it would be sort of like if there was no Dark Ritual in Origins and the Warden was with Alistair. They have two options; 1) one of them can die to save the world, effectively ending their future together, or 2) they can run off together and hope that Riordan saves the day. It would be hugely irresponsible for them to put all of that on Riordan just so they could be happy together. Anders has a similar problem at the end of DA2. He can; 1) sacrifice his life and relationship in order to do something to hopefully free mages or at least give them a fighting chance, or 2) run off with Hawke and hope that someone else does something eventually to free mages.

If Anders chooses Hawke, he's saying that s/he's more important than the freedom of mages. Which, to me, is horrible. It's far worse if you put the order as Hawke> Mage Freedom> Everything Else, than if you put Mage Freedom first. Of course, this is why I pair a passionate, revolutionary Hawke with Anders. For one, it should mean that he won't have to choose between the cause or Hawke. For another, it means she wouldn't ever want him to put her before the cause.

So, maybe it's sad to some people. For me, it makes me think more of him that he has something he would put so far above his own personal happiness. If you want to be the center of the universe in a relationship, you probably shouldn't get involved with a crazy revolutionary.

This, and its why I love you so very hard, Yami.

It's also why 90% of my Hawkes romance Fenris. I've had three successful playthroughs with Anders romanced, one is currently in progress. My very first playthrough was an over-the-top-blinded-by-adoration-for-Anders Hawke, and she was utterly blindsided by his extreme mesures at the end... When he said "I need your help with something" in act three, she said "Alright love, point the way!" no questions asked. Which made it BEAUTIFUL, because despite everything she was actually very faithful. She had to murder knife him, in the end, but only out of a sence of duty to Kirkwall and not because she wanted to.

I've never murder knifed him since, because I've had no Hawkes be so blindly faithful to him. My second Anders Playthrough was rivalry, and it was pre-patch so in the end I sided with the templars and he refused to side with me.

My third one is a friendmance, but unlike the first she's smarter, more cunning, and not terribly faithful. She believe's in his cause, and when I get to act 3 and he asks for help, she'll call him on his BS and then help him anyway ;p


Other then these three though, I doubt very much that I'll romance Anders again, because at the end of the day, my Hawkes like to be #1, and Anders can never give Hawke that. He tells you so himself 5 minutes after meeting him.

[beckaliz]

Have some morning Anders.


Rawr by Szu-Yu

Hee hee hee. Anders's trademark is a cat. Fenris's trademark is a bottle of Aggregio Pavali...

[SurelyForth]

For those that care! New prompt is up at Manifestos Welcome.

Modifié par SurelyForth, 19 juillet 2011 - 02:49 .

[YamiSnuffles]

SurelyForth wrote...

For those that care! New prompt is up at Manifestos Welcome.

Ooh, maybe I'll actually finish this one. Recently, I keep starting the last few hours before it's due and thus never finish in time.

I guess on the plus side, if I ever finish those I'll have a bunch of Anders drawings and fics to dump on everyone at some point. Just not now. Now I am drawing Garrus and Shepard. 

[SurelyForth]

I want to stop working and write now. It's one of those words that I always hear in Alistair's "lullllled into complacency" voice and I have an idea that involves him and it will be great.

@Elle...there ain't nothing wrong with NSFW.

Modifié par SurelyForth, 19 juillet 2011 - 03:12 .

[YamiSnuffles]

ElleMullineux wrote...

NSFW Anders is for tumblr... I'd feel like I was flashing in the chantry posting it here.

That sounds like a good time. All the more reason for you to post it, haha. Just warn any poor Chantry sisters and brothers that might have to go... pray if they read it accidentally.

"Warning: The following fic might blow up your Chantry, if you know what I mean."

[SurelyForth]

ElleMullineux wrote...

NSFW Anders is for tumblr... I'd feel like I was flashing in the chantry posting it here.

Challenge accepted!

[beckaliz]

SurelyForth wrote...

For those that care! New prompt is up at Manifestos Welcome.

I'm gonna do it this time! *pumps fist*

And it's gonna be NSFW too. When I do more prompts they probably will be too. XD

Modifié par beckaliz, 19 juillet 2011 - 03:37 .

[Sinaxi]

YamiSnuffles wrote...

Well, I went over this ages ago, but, new people and all so here goes...

I won't speak for anyone else, but I wouldn't want Anders to put his relationship with Hawke ahead of his cause. He's trying to do something huge. Something way more important than any relationship he might be in. So he loves Hawke, but if he has to choose between being with Hawke or doing what he can to free the mages, he can't choose Hawke.

To me it would be sort of like if there was no Dark Ritual in Origins and the Warden was with Alistair. They have two options; 1) one of them can die to save the world, effectively ending their future together, or 2) they can run off together and hope that Riordan saves the day. It would be hugely irresponsible for them to put all of that on Riordan just so they could be happy together. Anders has a similar problem at the end of DA2. He can; 1) sacrifice his life and relationship in order to do something to hopefully free mages or at least give them a fighting chance, or 2) run off with Hawke and hope that someone else does something eventually to free mages.

If Anders chooses Hawke, he's saying that s/he's more important than the freedom of mages. Which, to me, is horrible. It's far worse if you put the order as Hawke> Mage Freedom> Everything Else, than if you put Mage Freedom first. Of course, this is why I pair a passionate, revolutionary Hawke with Anders. For one, it should mean that he won't have to choose between the cause or Hawke. For another, it means she wouldn't ever want him to put her before the cause.

So, maybe it's sad to some people. For me, it makes me think more of him that he has something he would put so far above his own personal happiness. If you want to be the center of the universe in a relationship, you probably shouldn't get involved with a crazy revolutionary.

Like others have already said...Very well said! And I hadn't thought about comparing it to the end of DA:O, (also, I would cry if Alistair had sacrificed himself for my warden....thank God for Morrigan and her beautiful friendship with my Warden and her ulterior motives).

My favorite Hawke is a passionate Mage, so regardless the fit with Anders is really strong. My first playthrough I romanced Fenris but in the end I just felt a little odd about it, (though I completely love him) because he will never feel the same way my Hawke feels about Mages.

Modifié par Tidra, 19 juillet 2011 - 04:25 .

[Reflection Muse]

YamiSnuffles wrote...

Well, I went over this ages ago, but, new people and all so here goes...

I won't speak for anyone else, but I wouldn't want Anders to put his relationship with Hawke ahead of his cause. He's trying to do something huge. Something way more important than any relationship he might be in. So he loves Hawke, but if he has to choose between being with Hawke or doing what he can to free the mages, he can't choose Hawke.

To me it would be sort of like if there was no Dark Ritual in Origins and the Warden was with Alistair. They have two options; 1) one of them can die to save the world, effectively ending their future together, or 2) they can run off together and hope that Riordan saves the day. It would be hugely irresponsible for them to put all of that on Riordan just so they could be happy together. Anders has a similar problem at the end of DA2. He can; 1) sacrifice his life and relationship in order to do something to hopefully free mages or at least give them a fighting chance, or 2) run off with Hawke and hope that someone else does something eventually to free mages.

If Anders chooses Hawke, he's saying that s/he's more important than the freedom of mages. Which, to me, is horrible. It's far worse if you put the order as Hawke> Mage Freedom> Everything Else, than if you put Mage Freedom first. Of course, this is why I pair a passionate, revolutionary Hawke with Anders. For one, it should mean that he won't have to choose between the cause or Hawke. For another, it means she wouldn't ever want him to put her before the cause.

So, maybe it's sad to some people. For me, it makes me think more of him that he has something he would put so far above his own personal happiness. If you want to be the center of the universe in a relationship, you probably shouldn't get involved with a crazy revolutionary.

Exactly this. Everyone is defined by something. For Anders, it's his purpose/cause and his conviction. He has the strongest conviction out of anyone else in DA2, imo, and I do find that incredibly admirable, endearing, and something worth supporting and protecting.