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[CrimsonZephyr]

esper wrote...

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

esper wrote...

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

Anders should have been executed as an abomination. It would have been the genre savvy thing to do. When someone accosts you with a super-deep demonic voice, they're not commenting on the weather.

Only genre-sawvy person is Varric and perhaps Isabella a litte and he likes Anders. Also genre-savy is not realistic at all since real life very seldom to never form as a story, espcially fantasy stories set in a timeline way beefore ours.

Hawke has grown up with mages in his family, who doubtlessly told him what an abomination is. Hence why seeing a guy have a freak out, start talking with a demon voice, and threaten him with a spear and not responding to that by putting a rabid animal down is just stupid. All Hawke really needed were some maps of the Deep Roads, not his personal expertise.

My Hawke tend to value a grey warden when they are going into the deep road.
And also that is not being genre-savey.  Beieng genre-savey means knowing what often happens in story like the one the character participate in. Hawke does not so any sight of that.

Edit. Defintion of genre-savey aside, my hawkes are mostely (even if my main lost faith) raised by the chantrys defintion of spirit/demons which means that they think of a spirit as a good thing and don't really connect justice with being a demon untill act 2. even the one who rivalled him. My canon Hawke still don't think of Justice as a demon in act 3.

Yes, so the intimidating demon voice...totally normal, right?

Even if the spirit is benevolent, kill em all.

[esper]

Neither my Hawke nor I run around killing people for being not normal, and Anders never attacks my Hawke so they have no reason to even attempt it. My characters are simply not that trigger happy.

[CrimsonZephyr]

esper wrote...

Neither my Hawke nor I run around killing people for being not normal, and Anders never attacks my Hawke so they have no reason to even attempt it. My characters are simply not that trigger happy.

Yeah, but there are different types of abnormal. There's "still collects pogs" abnormal, and then there's "speaks with Satan's voice" abnormal. And in a setting where the mythology does speak of almost-stereotypically evil entities behaving like Vengeance!Anders, I would expect Hawke to have more prior knowledge. It's not trigger-happy, it's having good sense.

At the very least, Hawke should have axed Anders after he nearly killed that apprentice.

Modifié par CrimsonZephyr, 16 janvier 2012 - 06:17 .

[esper]

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

esper wrote...

Neither my Hawke nor I run around killing people for being not normal, and Anders never attacks my Hawke so they have no reason to even attempt it. My characters are simply not that trigger happy.

Yeah, but there are different types of abnormal. There's "still collects pogs" abnormal, and then there's "speaks with Satan's voice" abnormal.

Neither Satan nor a being like Sata exits in DA, and once again my Hawke simply takes his word for it being an perhaps twisted benevolent being and even if they didn't they wouldn't rob their fellow fereldan refugees of the only good thing they have. Living like rats in the sewer as they are they simply need a healer and he is the only one caring to do that for free. For that he can speak with whatever voice he likes.

[CrimsonZephyr]

esper wrote...

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

esper wrote...

Neither my Hawke nor I run around killing people for being not normal, and Anders never attacks my Hawke so they have no reason to even attempt it. My characters are simply not that trigger happy.

Yeah, but there are different types of abnormal. There's "still collects pogs" abnormal, and then there's "speaks with Satan's voice" abnormal.

Neither Satan nor a being like Sata exits in DA, and once again my Hawke simply takes his word for it being an perhaps twisted benevolent being and even if they didn't they wouldn't rob their fellow fereldan refugees of the only good thing they have. Living like rats in the sewer as they are they simply need a healer and he is the only one caring to do that for free. For that he can speak with whatever voice he likes.

Demons exist. My point is that Anders is speaking with the voice of a clearly malevolent being - a demon - and Hawke does nothing. Anders nearly murders a woman, and Hawke does nothing. Is it any wonder that Anders blows up a church and Hawke does nothing?

You don't let the criminally insane run amok.

If Anders had a face like Quentin, you'd want him strung up in a fortnight. The thing is, people have sympathy for the edgy, "troubled but cute" characters. If Anders looked like Quentin, who looks like he lives in a trash heap and spends his days fondling corpses and raping animals, people wouldn't think twice about killing him, even if he was actually a healer who tended to the needy.

Modifié par CrimsonZephyr, 16 janvier 2012 - 06:30 .

[esper]

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

esper wrote...

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

esper wrote...

Neither my Hawke nor I run around killing people for being not normal, and Anders never attacks my Hawke so they have no reason to even attempt it. My characters are simply not that trigger happy.

Yeah, but there are different types of abnormal. There's "still collects pogs" abnormal, and then there's "speaks with Satan's voice" abnormal.

Neither Satan nor a being like Sata exits in DA, and once again my Hawke simply takes his word for it being an perhaps twisted benevolent being and even if they didn't they wouldn't rob their fellow fereldan refugees of the only good thing they have. Living like rats in the sewer as they are they simply need a healer and he is the only one caring to do that for free. For that he can speak with whatever voice he likes.

Demons exist. My point is that Anders is speaking with the voice of a clearly malevolent being - a demon - and Hawke does nothing. Anders nearly murders a woman, and Hawke does nothing. Is it any wonder that Anders blows up a church and Hawke does nothing.

You don't let the criminally insane run amok.

Anders is not a criminal at that point other than being a mage. Further he is still known as a warden which mean that being and mage outside of the circle no longer is a crime, he is also not running amok but are instead the most beneficial factor to the refugees which me Hawke is one of.
Also Hawke is not one for talking about the crime of mages being outside the circle with either their little sister or themself being one of said mages. 
Also they don't think that Justice sound like a malevoulent being, just like a Fade creatues who are angry at templars.
Edit: And demons are in no way comparable to satan. They are in a category uniqe to dragon age.

Modifié par esper, 16 janvier 2012 - 06:33 .

[Ryzaki]

esper wrote...

I don't know what I would done if I was Hawke... Properbly just leave Kirkwall when the family ran out of money. Definitly not venture down into a grotto filled with the monsters that killed my little sister.

I'm not sure. I probably wouldn't have gone to Kirkwall in the first place. Going to templar central when you or your sister is an apostate and expecting not to get caught is pretty foolish. Family or not. Especially once you get there and realize you'll have no wealth to shield you.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 16 janvier 2012 - 06:56 .

[CrimsonZephyr]

Yes, but Bethany is "incorruptible pure pureness" defined. Anders? Not even close. At any moment, the "voice of a vigilante" could compel him to murder a street full of people. He's not an everyday mage, he made a Faustian pact with an insane demon. Better to put him down. Everyone would have lived happier, safer lives had he been killed.

If someone acts like a loose cannon, chances are they are. And loose cannons get people killed.

^Yeah, come to think of it, Leandra sounds like a bit of a spoiled **** putting on airs. "Oh, look at me, I can be nobility here!" Never mind the daughter who got locked up in an Orwellian jail cell because you dragged the family to the lion's den.

Modifié par CrimsonZephyr, 16 janvier 2012 - 06:59 .

[esper]

Ryzaki wrote...

esper wrote...

I don't know what I would done if I was Hawke... Properbly just leave Kirkwall when the family ran out of money. Definitly not venture down into a grotto filled with the monsters that killed my little sister.

I'm not sure. I probably wouldn't have gone to Kirkwall in the first place. Going to templar central when you or your sister is an apostate and expecting not to get caught is pretty foolish. Family or not. Especially once you get there and realize you'll have no wealth to shield you.

Well the wealth is a pretty big factor when you have nothing and Carver (I play mage) set his foot down and insist that they get in and so does the mother. But I think that when the Hawke family started recieving letters from Lothering and the Blight was over I would be setting my foot down and saying:
Listen Carver, Mother. We have no money and no job. Aveline won't let Carver into the guards and while I love you both I am going crazy for being stuck here with the two of you and Gamlen. We are going back to fereldan, so Carver can apply to the army again since there is a new King.  Then at least one of us would have a job.

[esper]

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

Yes, but Bethany is "incorruptible pure pureness" defined. Anders? Not even close. At any moment, the "voice of a vigilante" could compel him to murder a street full of people. He's not an everyday mage, he made a Faustian pact with an insane demon. Better to put him down. Everyone would have lived happier, safer lives had he been killed.

If someone acts like a loose cannon, chances are they are. And loose cannons get people killed.

^Yeah, come to think of it, Leandra sounds like a bit of a spoiled **** putting on airs. "Oh, look at me, I can be nobility here!" Never mind the daughter who got locked up in an Orwellian jail cell because you dragged the family to the lion's den.

I doubt the templars care that Bethany is purity defined. Hawke can still not hold hold the moral high ground there and call Anders a criminal for being an apostate since Hawke is either shielding one or being one.
A lot of Fereldans would have died since living in the sewers are not healthy. They were safer with him around. and Hawke does not have to see Justice as insane.
Nor does Hawke wish to kill all the refugees considering that Anders first give Hawke the maps when he is back in the clinic where there will be witness to Hawke killing Anders. Even if they are not within earshot. If you killed Anders you would be fighting every refugge in there as they have already been proven to be protective of him.
Also I am firmly against killing people on a might. I don't care how much people might be dangerous, I will never accept might as a reason to punish them, not to mention kill.

[Ryzaki]

esper wrote...
Well the wealth is a pretty big factor when you have nothing and Carver (I play mage) set his foot down and insist that they get in and so does the mother. But I think that when the Hawke family started recieving letters from Lothering and the Blight was over I would be setting my foot down and saying:
Listen Carver, Mother. We have no money and no job. Aveline won't let Carver into the guards and while I love you both I am going crazy for being stuck here with the two of you and Gamlen. We are going back to fereldan, so Carver can apply to the army again since there is a new King.  Then at least one of us would have a job.

Yeah my Hawke wouldn't have taken lip from Carver. He would've just had to deal with it.  He's not the one who'll get thrown in a circle. But yeah going back to Fereldan would've been nice. Wealth doesn't mean squat if you're thrown in a tower and have no use for it. I wouldn't have cared how much Leandra and Carver whined I would not have stepped foot near Kirkwall. If they wanted to go that bad they could've gone alone.

The most I would've did was deliever the amulet and then bounced.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 16 janvier 2012 - 07:35 .

[esper]

Ryzaki wrote...

esper wrote...
Well the wealth is a pretty big factor when you have nothing and Carver (I play mage) set his foot down and insist that they get in and so does the mother. But I think that when the Hawke family started recieving letters from Lothering and the Blight was over I would be setting my foot down and saying:
Listen Carver, Mother. We have no money and no job. Aveline won't let Carver into the guards and while I love you both I am going crazy for being stuck here with the two of you and Gamlen. We are going back to fereldan, so Carver can apply to the army again since there is a new King.  Then at least one of us would have a job.

Yeah my Hawke wouldn't have taken lip from Carver. He would've just had to deal with it.  He's not the one who'll get thrown in a circle. But yeah going back to Fereldan would've been nice. Wealth doesn't mean squat if you're thrown in a tower and have no use for it. I wouldn't have cared how much Leandra and Carver whined I would not have stepped foot near Kirkwall. If they wanted to go that bad they could've gone alone.

The most I would've did was deliever the amulet and then bounced.

Well My Hawke don't mind Kirkwall (But she is also very happy to get involved in everything), but I think I would have protested very loudly and insisted on going home once we had zero money 

[Ryzaki]

esper wrote...
Well My Hawke don't mind Kirkwall (But she is also very happy to get involved in everything), but I think I would have protested very loudly and insisted on going home once we had zero money 

XD I wouldn't blame you.

Who (if anyone) would you have recruited as Hawke? 

[esper]

Ryzaki wrote...

esper wrote...
Well My Hawke don't mind Kirkwall (But she is also very happy to get involved in everything), but I think I would have protested very loudly and insisted on going home once we had zero money 

XD I wouldn't blame you.

Who (if anyone) would you have recruited as Hawke? 

Again I wouldn't have made it so far and went home once the year of servitude was over, but provided that Carver + Mother somehow had managed to keep my from walking out of Kirkwall in protest they might if they guilt trip me enough. (I know that my Mother can still guilt trip me and I am not living home anymore, something I apperently never grow out of). I am presumng I have my Hawkes class.

I imagine that I would have met Merrill since I would keep my promise to Flemeth. (I would be too scared not to keep my promise to the dragon lady).
I would never had signed on to Batrands expedition: Dark grotto + monsters + what sound like a wild goose chase. Nope. So sadly no Varric
I would proberly insist on leaving home and hide amongst the other refugees to shield Carver and my mother from hiding me as a mage, and simply keep wokring for Athriel in this case. I don't know if I would come across Anders then, perhaps I would, but I don't know if he would ever tell me about Karl, me not needing anything from him. Provided he did, though. he would still have me convinced with the: I have a mage friend that needs to be freed. And since I am loyal and can't take my friend being... strange, I would not necessarily run from him being an abormination.
I wouldn't even talk to Isabella
I would help Fenris getting his mansion, but no more since he expresses such a dislike as he does.
I don't know if Aveline would wish to keep contact with me here, but provided she does I would stick around with her untill Leandras death. I would simply not being able to forive her for not following up on Emerics lead when I knew it was good and that would break our friendship.
I would also never talk to Sebastian beyond cashing in on his gold in act 1.
I think that covers everyone. (Carver can keep the marbari, I am afraid of dogs) 


.

 

[esper]

Edit. Double post


.

 

Modifié par esper, 16 janvier 2012 - 08:12 .

[The Librarian]

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

Demons exist. My point is that Anders is speaking with the voice of a clearly malevolent being - a demon - and Hawke does nothing. Anders nearly murders a woman, and Hawke does nothing. Is it any wonder that Anders blows up a church and Hawke does nothing?

You don't let the criminally insane run amok.

If Anders had a face like Quentin, you'd want him strung up in a fortnight. The thing is, people have sympathy for the edgy, "troubled but cute" characters. If Anders looked like Quentin, who looks like he lives in a trash heap and spends his days fondling corpses and raping animals, people wouldn't think twice about killing him, even if he was actually a healer who tended to the needy.

Well said and I agree. When I play I usually try to get friendship with all companions, but Anders always ends up in rivalry thanks to that I don't support his actions through out the game. But then again I always kill him at the end no matter what Hawke I'm playing with. I simply can't excuse his actions. Bloody terroris/demon *shakes head*

[slyborg]

Demon & Spirit... different creatures. Just because Justice/Vengeance's voice has a deep cadence, doesn't mean he is a demon! Anders blows up the Chantry to wake people up not because he has a desire for pride, hunger, sloth etc. like other demons. While his actions may seem evil to some, they are not motivated by evil, which is the whole point of a demon.

[CrimsonZephyr]

slyborg wrote...

Demon & Spirit... different creatures. Just because Justice/Vengeance's voice has a deep cadence, doesn't mean he is a demon! Anders blows up the Chantry to wake people up not because he has a desire for pride, hunger, sloth etc. like other demons. While his actions may seem evil to some, they are not motivated by evil, which is the whole point of a demon.

Creature of the Fade = evil. Kill em all.

[slyborg]

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

slyborg wrote...

Demon & Spirit... different creatures. Just because Justice/Vengeance's voice has a deep cadence, doesn't mean he is a demon! Anders blows up the Chantry to wake people up not because he has a desire for pride, hunger, sloth etc. like other demons. While his actions may seem evil to some, they are not motivated by evil, which is the whole point of a demon.

Creature of the Fade = evil. Kill em all.

That's your opinion. Did you also kill Wynne who had a spirit inside her?

[CrimsonZephyr]

slyborg wrote...

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

slyborg wrote...

Demon & Spirit... different creatures. Just because Justice/Vengeance's voice has a deep cadence, doesn't mean he is a demon! Anders blows up the Chantry to wake people up not because he has a desire for pride, hunger, sloth etc. like other demons. While his actions may seem evil to some, they are not motivated by evil, which is the whole point of a demon.

Creature of the Fade = evil. Kill em all.

That's your opinion. Did you also kill Wynne who had a spirit inside her?

After she had outlived her usefulness? Absolutely, though I had no such opportunity.

In fact, teams of mages should enter the Fade and kill every spirit they see. "Good" or "bad." Neither is safe for the living or the dead.

Modifié par CrimsonZephyr, 16 janvier 2012 - 10:52 .

[CuriousArtemis]

Well, I am a nice person, and a curious person, so I would pretty much done everything Hawke does in canon (explore the Deep Roads, etc.) and definitely have recruited everyone. Yes, even Sebastian, who annoys me to high heaven. I would feel pretty damn betrayed when he leaves me just when I need him, before the final battle in The Last Straw.

And of course I wouldn't kill anyone, especially my friends whom I love (with all their faults as well as their good points).

As for Anders, I would feel sorry for him and want very badly to help him. He made a bad decision, same as Merrill. But he can't run away from his bad decision the way she can. It's really quite very sad. I'd feel compelled to help him in any way I could. I doubt we'd hook up because he's a little too emo for me

I'd help all the others, of course.

The world is made up of different people; some are more empathetic than others. Also, some have little else to do other than troll a thread made up entirely of Anders lovers. But that is neither here nor there.

[slyborg]

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

slyborg wrote...

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

slyborg wrote...

Demon & Spirit... different creatures. Just because Justice/Vengeance's voice has a deep cadence, doesn't mean he is a demon! Anders blows up the Chantry to wake people up not because he has a desire for pride, hunger, sloth etc. like other demons. While his actions may seem evil to some, they are not motivated by evil, which is the whole point of a demon.

Creature of the Fade = evil. Kill em all.

That's your opinion. Did you also kill Wynne who had a spirit inside her?

After she had outlived her usefulness? Absolutely, though I had no such opportunity.

In fact, teams of mages should enter the Fade and kill every spirit they see. "Good" or "bad." Neither is safe for the living or the dead.

Well, it is refreshing to see where an Anders troll's loyalties lie. As long as things are useful, okay. After that, murder knife. Just start an Anders hate thread/group and get it over with.

[ladyshamen]

motomoto, I have your back on this one. Haters aren't happy unless they're hating.

[Melca36]

This is why I don't care what happened to the Chantry









How many physicians are in Thedas? Healing mages are needed.

To oppose killing a group of people just because you are scared of them is xenophobic and racist.

It makes me wonder is some of these mage haters in real life stereotype Muslims and other people.

[Melca36]

Delete

Multiple post



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Modifié par Melca36, 16 janvier 2012 - 11:15 .