57020 réponses à ce sujet

[cmessaz]

Hmmm, excellent post....

I have often wondered if the reason so many people hate him is because he takes power from the PC. I guess I like it too. Also...boom. The boom impacts people differently. Had he say...idk....hired a gang of antivan crows or something and took all of the chantry out, people probably would have reacted differently. Or had the PC been given the choice to help do it.

Oh top...have sad Anders

http://cloud.steampo...BCC8C9EF531837/

Modifié par cmessaz, 22 février 2012 - 06:30 .

[Gyrefalcon]

Ooooh, hiring a bunch of Antivan crows to take out the Chantry? That does sound like a delicious storyline! It would have been quite shocking as well. Hmm, Crows rappelling from the rafters and taking everyone out with their daggers instead of the beam of light rising from the floor. Visually striking, but no one would realize what had happened from the outside right away. AND there would be no magic involved.

I agree it would be quite compelling and it would also have a different impact. I think that cut scene would have affected me as a player stronger, but it would not have been as obvious or striking to the npc's since the discovery would be well after the Crows had fled. (Otherwise, the person walking in on the scene would join it.)

What kind of chord does that idea strike in you?

[esper]

Personally I like it, that he takes power from the PC. I like that they don't always can save everyone and have their every way, I like that the NPC actually can suceeding in making a difference even if the PC disagree with them. Most often npc's (and sometime the PC too) are forced to conform to that wrecthed status quo and no matter how strongly they believe it is wrong (and how wrong it is) they can't change anything because they are in a game.

And I think that the boom was necessary for the killing too, if he had just murdered Elthina it would have been a personal attack on her, the building had to go as well.

[cmessaz]

Gyrefalcon wrote...

Ooooh, hiring a bunch of Antivan crows to take out the Chantry? That does sound like a delicious storyline! It would have been quite shocking as well. Hmm, Crows rappelling from the rafters and taking everyone out with their daggers instead of the beam of light rising from the floor. Visually striking, but no one would realize what had happened from the outside right away. AND there would be no magic involved.

I agree it would be quite compelling and it would also have a different impact. I think that cut scene would have affected me as a player stronger, but it would not have been as obvious or striking to the npc's since the discovery would be well after the Crows had fled. (Otherwise, the person walking in on the scene would join it.)

What kind of chord does that idea strike in you?

Yeah, he wanted to make a statement. The crow thing wouldn't have worked really, because of the lack of impact, Meredith wouldn't have been able to blame mages...etc. Yeah, I guess I like it as is. I just hate that people aren't able to see past the boom in order to see the grey area, that it's not all black and white. 

esper wrote...

Personally I like it, that he takes power from the PC. I like that they don't always can save everyone and have their every way, I like that the NPC actually can suceeding in making a difference even if the PC disagree with them. Most often npc's (and sometime the PC too) are forced to conform to that wrecthed status quo and no matter how strongly they believe it is wrong (and how wrong it is) they can't change anything because they are in a game. 

And I think that the boom was necessary for the killing too, if he had just murdered Elthina it would have been a personal attack on her, the building had to go as well.

Right.

And this comes back to this argument I've seen everywhere about Hawke not being the badass impressive hero/heroin some people want. I have thought about this. I like it. I mean I love my dragonborn in Skyrim, she's the ultimate hero...but I love that Hawke is a human being (with talent of course). I love the family centered stuff...and I know I get alot of crap for saying this...but I prefer Anders romance over the ones in DAO.  Although I wish they had given friendmanced Anders a QB in Act 3. *grumbles* And the complete FAILURE of an execution if you decide to go that route romanced. I think people tend to be upset that from what we see...Anders has more of an impact on history than Hawke, for good or ill. And some really hate that.

Anyway I shouldn't type posts when I'm tired, I tend to ramble. 

Modifié par cmessaz, 22 février 2012 - 08:47 .

[esper]

Uh... Me thinks you are a little tired, cmessaz there is a question belief for a friendsmanced Anders, the pillow thing is that. (And you can do it in your own home too). If you want Jucstice to freak out of you in the friend route it wouldn't work because you are supporting him and seens as being being pro-mage so Anders and Justice have no problem with you.

[Fiery Phoenix]

ladyofpayne wrote...


Anders is suit made my cheeks red.

WIN! 

[cmessaz]

esper wrote...

Uh... Me thinks you are a little tired, cmessaz there is a question belief for a friendsmanced Anders, the pillow thing is that. (And you can do it in your own home too). If you want Jucstice to freak out of you in the friend route it wouldn't work because you are supporting him and seens as being being pro-mage so Anders and Justice have no problem with you.

The questioning belief is included in the post-justice quest talk friendly lol sorry typing at 2am is not good. Rivaled it's seperate so it seems like you get more.

Modifié par cmessaz, 22 février 2012 - 05:57 .

[BevH]

I still prefer Alistair as well as DA:O as a whole. DA2 feels like it was rushed out to me and I suppose in a way it was given that DA:O had lots of time for polish (despite some really irksome bugs in it that exists today). I won't go into the issues I have with the changes in Anders from Awakening to DA2 because in the long run, it didn't really matter to me. I firmly believe, though, the Ms Hepler did an excellent job writing the character of Anders because this character sparks so much debate. Otherwise, the talk would pretty much be: "blah, blah, he sucked." or 'blah, blah, he didn't suck." and then he would've been forgotten.

As for the Chantry thing, it never occured to me what the things were that Hawke was collecting for Anders potion. All I could think, and still do even though I now know what it's for, is "Ewww... you're actually going to drink that?!?" And yes, DA2 was a story about Anders. Does that bother me? Nope, not at all. In fact, in reading the summary of the game, I was rather excited to find out that the focus would be on Anders. I agree that the Chantry had to go; there needed to be a real impact statement made, and except for 2 "for science" runs, my Hawke always agreed with Anders.

[LT123]

Gyrefalcon wrote...

  Caught up in the writing and voice acting (or even the usual expectations from playing similar games), it is possible to utterly miss or to dismiss the clues being laid out about Anders plan. 

Mostly as an excuse to post this picture again-if this is not "I'm obviously lying" body language, I don't know what is.


I was spoiled about the Chantry thing (that's what I get for reading the forums before beating the game), but since I never paid much attention in chemistry, I probably would have been totally clueless about what he was actually planning. "You want sela petrae, Anders? Fantastic. I...have no idea what that is."

The pillow conversation set off all my alarm bells.



And since for some reason I'm a fan of getting to argue with my companions, I like the final Questioning Beliefs on rivalmance.

[wendolen]

Hello, Anderstians!  

I am pretty much brand-new to DA -- I finished DAO & its DLCs last Tuesday night, started DAII Wednesday morning, and since I had a lot of free time, raced through it to finish Saturday night. DAMN, but that plot has momentum. Since then I've been reading the thread -- probably less than 10% of the total here, but enough, I think. :happy:

I am a wiki/walkthrough addict, but I carefully avoided spoiling myself other than seeing that Anders would be in DAII, so my femme Hawke mage was already basically shouting "I am apostate, hear me roar!" BEFORE she met Anders. And, well, I'm posting here, so it's probably clear where things went from there. 

Act 3 is an ordeal. When Anders named the ingredients he needed for the "potion" I quipped, to myself, "Sheesh, Anders, what are we making, gunpowder?" But then I got distracted fretting over other purported used for saltpetre and whether he was actually planning to consume it. 

When he asked me to go distract Elthina, I still had no clue about the bomb, but I had a really bad feeling about it, and actually had to step away from the computer for a while, to fume about it while I did some chores. My Hawke really felt like her affection and social acceptability was being taken advantage of here, and I had to remind myself that he'd most likely be making this request even if we weren't lovers.   Then he came back dressed in black and talking all gloomy. I actually yelled at the computer: "When you said you'd break my heart, I thought you meant HAWKE'S heart, not mine!"

At that point I had to put the game down for a few hours, and I spent them ridiculously preoccupied with the choices I knew Hawke was going to have to make. Hawke has it easier here than the Warden does -- Hawke doesn't have any oaths to uphold. My Hawke had only made promises to one person, so at least the loyalties weren't so conflicted, as they can be in DAO. Consequently, I chided Anders for not trusting me, and we skipped off to defend the mages. (What is up with Orsino? That templar wave ended so fast I said, "That's it?" and then all the sudden he's moaning about how he's got no options left and slicing away.)

Aaaanyway... I spent the next day or so feeling like I'd been kicked by a horse, and have since begun another DAO playthrough mostly to stop myself from IMMEDIATELY playing DAII again, because I think I'll want another f!Hawke, and I want some distance from the voice of the last one before I start again.

Couple of random questions: What prompts the sandwich line in the topic of this thread? I didn't get it the first time through. 
Do I need to install a mod to have a custom Hawke with the red streak across the face? I didn't see that option in character creation, but I might have rushed through...
Earlier in the thread, a fic called Caring is Creepy was recommended. I googled it and mostly found references to the Shins song, but I found it in fragments on a tumblr. What I read was pretty excellent. Does anyone have a link to it in one piece?

Modifié par wendolen, 23 février 2012 - 06:33 .

[Fox In The Box]

Welcome, wendolen! The sandwich line is actually by Anders' voice actor, Adam Howden, and is a reference to the sarcastic/purple dialogue choice Hawke gets right after Anders says "But I don't ever want to leave you" post sexy times. :3
There is a video of it here, if you want to see it!

Oh, and yes, you'll have to install a mod to get the nose-smear on custom Hawkes.

Modifié par Fox In The Box, 23 février 2012 - 09:12 .

[wendolen]

 Aha! I'd forgotten about "I'm hungry"! I didn't choose that at the time, despite Marian being VERY purple, because it reminded me a little too much of myself. :3

[phimseto]

What bothered me about Anders is that I didn't help him but then the event happened anyway, without me having any kind of opportunity to have stopped him or warn others that he was up to something. I found that incredibly frustrating.

As for his personality change, I always took that to be a result of being possessed by Justice. He was increasingly less himself and more a spirit of vengeance.

[CuriousArtemis]

New Anders fan ... *waves*

I think I am the only one who didn't get upset about Anders' plans for CHANTRY GO BOOM. ....Possibly because I got spoiled and knew he would do it xD Also, I had romanced Fenris a half-dozen times first. So when I romanced Anders, I played a rogue who was very devil-may-care, and so was pretty much with his lover 100%, even if said lover turned out to be a possessed crazy man. Ah, love.

[wendolen]

 I was more upset by the melodrama and shifty eyes that preceded it than by the BOOM itself. In fact, I now have this as my PC desktop: http://fc07.devianta...hia-d3e79oa.jpg

.... maybe someone will teach me how to embed a picture, I can't seem to figure it out. <3

Edit: I find myself daydreaming today about having a spirit healer boyfriend for more than just beauty and electrical tricks -- I bet he's really handy to have around on days when you wake up with a migraine, like I did today. 

Modifié par wendolen, 23 février 2012 - 10:06 .

[wendolen]

Also, to resurrect an old topic in this thread, I am (of course) pondering songs, since I am experiencing Anders NRE. 

To start, of course, Florence + the Machine's "I'm Not Calling You A Liar" was somewhat familiar to me before the game, so its appearance in the credits was a big WTF for me until I sat down and paid close attention to the lyrics. It's pretty clearly AndersxHawke (in fact, I would be surprised if it isn't in the credits due to Hepler), but I don't get people who think it's Hawke's perspective, or all Hawke's perspective. "I love you so much, I'm gonna let you kill me." ??? (Sorry if I'm retreading old news with that particular gem of insight -- I saw a couple discussions of the song in earlier pages and, while the other points I wanted to make about the song ("there's a ghost in my lungs," etc.) were addressed, I didn't see that particular line called out as relevant.)

By coincidence, I've been listening a lot to U2's The Joshua Tree this past week, and "Running to Stand Still" really hits me in the gut as descriptive of Anders in Darktown watching the situation deteriorate. (It's really about being a junkie in Dublin in the 80s, but... not really such a stretch, actually, now that I think of it.) The entire atmosphere of the song is one of helpless melancholy, but then we have...

Sweet the sin
Bitter, the taste in my mouth
I see seven towers
But I only see one way out [ <--- !!!!]
You got to cry without weeping
Talk without speaking
Scream without raising your voice
You know I took the poison from the poison stream
Then I floated out of here
Singing ha la la la de day
Ha la la la de day
Ha la la de day

etc.

Last of all, in a restaurant today eating lunch, I heard the original Stevie Nicks version of "Landslide," and was kind of internally mocking myself for looking for Anders in it, until she got to "I've been afraid of changing, 'cause I built my life around you. But time makes you bolder..." at which point I had to refrain from flailing like a freak.

I see I'm not very metal compared to lots of you. I hope you don't mind. 

Modifié par wendolen, 23 février 2012 - 10:34 .

[Fox In The Box]

wendolen wrote...

 I was more upset by the melodrama and shifty eyes that preceded it than by the BOOM itself. In fact, I now have this as my PC desktop:

.... maybe someone will teach me how to embed a picture, I can't seem to figure it out. <3

Edit: I find myself daydreaming today about having a spirit healer boyfriend for more than just beauty and electrical tricks -- I bet he's really handy to have around on days when you wake up with a migraine, like I did today. 

You simply need to put [ I M G ] before the link to the picture, and then [ / I M G ] after it, like this: [ I M G ] linktopicture  [ / I M G ]. Just without any of the spaces.

A walking, talking pain-killer would come in really handy. Also, in the incredibly unlikely scenario that you're ever stuck in a  desert, you'll never run out of food or drink - he could just summon ice and then melt it with fire to create water, and shoot circling vultures out of the sky that you could barbeque. With fire. Though salad and other assorted food would be a little harder to come by.

Modifié par Fox In The Box, 24 février 2012 - 12:14 .

[MageTarot]

Hello, all!

I just have a quick question - I had Anders as my LI for my M!Hawke rogue. Chose to side with mages and broke up with Anders inside Gallows (chose the "This is the end, Anders" response) just before the templar/Orsino battle. However, when Varric goes through the epilogue, he states that 'circumstances forced us to leave the Champion's side...that is, everyone except Anders."

Have any of you received this as well? I wasn't sure if it was a known issue or if the flag system for DA2 convo choices is as wonky as DA Awakening's. Any info you can provide would be really helpful. Thanks!

Modifié par MageTarot, 24 février 2012 - 04:18 .

[hobbit of the shire]

It's plushie Anders!  My brain will explode from cuteness!

by Eitanya

Modifié par hobbit_of_the_shire, 24 février 2012 - 04:37 .

[Mizushimo]

I want a plushie Anders....
My Male Hawke just started 'dating' Anders. He's so cute! This is my first playthrough so I will try not to read this thread too closely. I know something bad is going down near end game with Anders, but I've been avoiding spoilers.

*sigh* I hope I can forgive him.

[Dunizel]

MageTarot wrote...

Hello, all!

I just have a quick question - I had Anders as my LI for my M!Hawke rogue. Chose to side with mages and broke up with Anders inside Gallows (chose the "This is the end, Anders" response) just before the templar/Orsino battle. However, when Varric goes through the epilogue, he states that 'circumstances forced us to leave the Champion's side...that is, everyone except Anders."

Have any of you received this as well? I wasn't sure if it was a known issue or if the flag system for DA2 convo choices is as wonky as DA Awakening's. Any info you can provide would be really helpful. Thanks!

I think this is just some bug as you guessed. I heard people didn't get that line even though they romanced Anders and never broke up. So well...maybe your Anders kept stalking you xD

[ladyofpayne]

[ladyofpayne]

BevH wrote...

I still prefer Alistair as well as DA:O as a whole. DA2 feels like it was rushed out to me and I suppose in a way it was given that DA:O had lots of time for polish (despite some really irksome bugs in it that exists today). I won't go into the issues I have with the changes in Anders from Awakening to DA2 because in the long run, it didn't really matter to me. I firmly believe, though, the Ms Hepler did an excellent job writing the character of Anders because this character sparks so much debate. Otherwise, the talk would pretty much be: "blah, blah, he sucked." or 'blah, blah, he didn't suck." and then he would've been forgotten.

As for the Chantry thing, it never occured to me what the things were that Hawke was collecting for Anders potion. All I could think, and still do even though I now know what it's for, is "Ewww... you're actually going to drink that?!?" And yes, DA2 was a story about Anders. Does that bother me? Nope, not at all. In fact, in reading the summary of the game, I was rather excited to find out that the focus would be on Anders. I agree that the Chantry had to go; there needed to be a real impact statement made, and except for 2 "for science" runs, my Hawke always agreed with Anders.

I love Anders more than Alistair because he is strong man, who saw woman in HAwke, not mother like Alistair did. I respect Anders because he has his own life even without Hawke.

Modifié par ladyofpayne, 24 février 2012 - 03:52 .

[CuriousArtemis]

Dunizel wrote...

I think this is just some bug as you guessed. I heard people didn't get that line even though they romanced Anders and never broke up. So well...maybe your Anders kept stalking you xD

Oh Anders would NEVER do that.  NEVER EVER.  NEVER.

*snorts* 

ladyofpayne wrote...

I love Anders more than Alistair because he is strong man, who saw woman in HAwke, not mother like Alistair did. I respect Anders because he has his own life even without Hawke.

 

I agree; Alistair was a bit of a wet blanket, wasn't he?  Though I confess I never carried through with romancing him; got a bit bored halfway through, despite the fact that I loved my female Warden.  I wish we'd had another male option for her; I'd already romanced Zevran with my male Dalish and City elf Wardens so it just felt wrong to throw her his way, too.  

Why couldn't we romance sten 

Anders is totally all man though.  Sure, he whines and rages, but he has conviction.  He does what he wants to do!  Okay, I don't like my use of the term "all man" there; surely a woman could and should act in a similar fashion; I respect a woman who acts with conviction (hello, ALL DA2 WOMEN; you rock, ladies).

[CuriousArtemis]

 Aieeee, Managed to catch a sweet moment between my Hawke and Anders 



Sorry for the terrible quality  Old Panasonic TV is from 2003 and the camera is a couple years old, too.