57020 réponses à ce sujet

[NRieh]

Really?! She is actively flirting with your Hawke since the moment you meet her. Not that I mind it ( jealousy scences for both Fenris and Anders are hilarious) but she does try to get into Hawkes pants

Hmm... MyHawke must be too focused..on Ande...eh..I mean task at hand. I really did not notice any active flirting, though there were few heart options avalible for Hawke.

Jealousy scene you say...hmmm...No-no-no, I can't make myself to load and flirt just to make poor Anders suffer and see some extra lines...or can I?... O:)

Tallis is supposed to be a Wonder-woman yet dies in every battle

And that's true. She dies more than anyone else who gets aggro. Hawke including, and Hawke is same rogue in same leathers... And she gets aggro A LOT.

As for Tallis hatred it's mostly about enforced rules: like inability to kill her, inability to change her weapons, inconsistency between plot and actual gameplay

She's a humble and harmless character comparing to Liara, really. Explosions do not throw her directly into Hawke arms, she does not make Big Sad Eyes, does not teach Anders how to cast spells and....well, I apparantely hate her much less. Not sure about how will it be at the very end - so far I'm in the Vault. Playing puzzles.

[LobselVith8]

Nrieh wrote...

While in "Tevinter Chantry Amulet," Anders says: "They did invade the Black City in their hubris and unleash darkspawn on us all."

A thought - Legacy is supposed to take place before "Tervinter Chantry Amulet" (which is from Fenris mission in chapter 2 - Slave caverns afair).

Then it makes perfect sense - in Legacy he's sure that mages are just blamed by Chantry, at the end of Legacy he has some evidence and reasons to hesitate and study more and then - he talks about Tervinter amulet. It fixes the inconsistency, though I doubt that it was an intention to build his story that way. More like writing plot glitch. Still, if you try to match his "Legacy" personality - it's more like 1-2 to me. He has some issues, but is not depressed and obessed as much as in 3. So, probably, I'm more or less right about it.

Anders seems willing to call mages out prior to that, though; especially given his views on blood magic. What I find odd is the Legacy dialogue from Anders (after confronting Corypheus) is about how the Chantry is right and what else they might know, even though they were wrong.

[Amirit]

May be, Chantry is right, may be! He is curious, nothing else. And that subject dyed within the Legacy anyway.

Nrieh actually, I am ok with Tallis (though inability to take the scroll surprised me to say the least). Still a lot of people are annoyed with her for so many different reasons.

Modifié par Amirit, 16 septembre 2012 - 04:54 .

[NRieh]

What I find odd is the Legacy dialogue from Anders (after confronting Corypheus) is about how the Chantry is right and what else they might know, even though they were wrong.

I'm talking about same dialogue, yes. And all he says after battle IS different from what he says 10 minutes back before battle, about same Chantry and First Blight. He changes his mind at this very moment, as he looks at Corypheus amulet. Or better say - gets serious reasons for reconsidering some things he thought he knew so well. Which is why only way to make sense here is keep events in order I mentioned.

Anders thinks mages are all cool and Chantry spreads anti-mage propaganda blaming them for blight ---> Legacy happens, where first he still thinks that Chantry lies and spreads legends and later he talks to Corypheus and sees his amulet ---->he has some studies, and Seeing Tervinter Amulet he says that those magisters were not actually soo good.

If we have "Tervinter amulet" chat before Corypheus battle - we result in some sudden and chaotic oppinion shifts (Magisters are bad they called blight-->Mages are good - it's chantry all propaganda--->oh wait...Chantry may be right). Which look pretty wierd even for our beloved posessed apostate.

[LobselVith8]

Amirit wrote...

May be, Chantry is right, may be! He is curious, nothing else. And that subject dyed within the Legacy anyway.

If the City turned black prior to the Magisters, then they were wrong. If it was already black, then it's possible the Magisters weren't the first darkspawn. And what was the point of Anders' pro-Chantry lines, if the plot is dropped entirely from Anders' character arc?

[NRieh]

And what was the point of Anders' pro-Chantry lines, if the plot is dropped entirely from Anders' character arc?

it was not dropped from main character's arc - it was, actually, added to it. I mean it IS his extended character arc. In original game we never see anything but "tervinter amulet" talk, right? So - in Legacy we may see how he got to this point.

Or at least I'd love to think this way.... because other way to put it is "lazy inconsistent writing" 8P

[Renmiri1]

@Nrieh - Pity you will miss Carver. I have some of his best banters in this 12 min youtube if you wanna see some of his wonderful grumpy awkward self

Modifié par Renmiri1, 16 septembre 2012 - 06:16 .

[Caeleinn]

Okay, soo...I'm really new to the whole Anders love...I'm not even done with my first play through, having come to discover the joy that is Dragon Age only about 2 months ago.  But I just wanted to say hi to everyone.  It's nice to know I'm not alone in my adoration of the possessed mage.

[Enkidu]

Nrieh, and I was starting to feel like a genetic mutant, since Tallis really never bothered me too. And your point about Liara is spot on, that's a character-forced-on-player that really chives my spuds.
Also, joining in on the Carver love. He's such a little brother, I just can't help but love him, bad attitude and all. You really should try rolling at least one mage to see him, his character development is really well done, you won't regret it. And, as Renmiri has showcased, he's also pretty fun to have around.

Caeleinn, hi there, welcome~ You'll never be alone in your love for scruffy revolutionist vagrants. Not here, at least. Feel free to chime in any time, maybe with impressions of your playthrough or even screenshots *wink wink nudge nudge*

[erilben]

Nrieh wrote...

And what was the point of Anders' pro-Chantry lines, if the plot is dropped entirely from Anders' character arc?

it was not dropped from main character's arc - it was, actually, added to it. I mean it IS his extended character arc. In original game we never see anything but "tervinter amulet" talk, right? So - in Legacy we may see how he got to this point.

Or at least I'd love to think this way.... because other way to put it is "lazy inconsistent writing" 8P

It is just "lazy inconsistent writing". in Awakening Anders said that the mages shouldn't be punished for what the magisters did long time ago, so he always beleived the Chantry. Further this makes what happens in Legacy worse. After finding Corypheus's amulet, you can tell him the same thing he said in Awakening - That even if it's true, mages shouldn't be punished for it. Anders doesn't seem to agree.

Modifié par erilben, 17 septembre 2012 - 06:41 .

[Caeleinn]

Hi, MrFlipFlops! Thanks for the welcome! I would love to contribute screenshots, but right now, I'm playing on my 360 and can't get any.  However...I'm already planning a second play through and I have the game and the DLC ready and waiting on my computer.    I'm in Act 3 on my console now, and Anders has changed his coat.  Things are getting serious now, it seems.  I'm relatively spoiler free, so I may not be around for a few days until I finish my game...but I will be back!  Anders love is better when it's shared, right?

[NRieh]

Nrieh, and I was starting to feel like a genetic mutant, since Tallis really never bothered me too. And your point about Liara is spot on, that's a character-forced-on-player that really chives my spuds.

Yep. That's it. I finished yesterday night. Helped her and made a canon save, and then reloaded to check what's so different and wonderful about mentioned here leaving Tallis version (which I rarely do - I mean reloadings - but I was curious).

Can't say it changes that much, though Anders "saving banter" was nice indeed. I did not hear it with Tallis, so I don't know if it's choice-specific or not. Other than that - there are slightly more fights in her version. But not so annoyingly much of them.

With her Anders still had some banter priority (like talking to Fenris about qunari and intentionally ignoring Tallis). And according to his click-line, it must be him who hinted Varric that helping Tallis had something to do with "pretty elves" 8P Which confirmed my headcanon about Anders being a jealous guy. Come on, I thought my preferences should be obvious to him by the middle of chapter 3! And I did not even flirt with her once. Not even with save-load! 8P

My only concern about Tallis is that they are truly going to make her a companion (romancable, no doubt) in DA3...which is the easyest way to ruin her character and\\or to make another Liara out of her, imo. On the other hand - romancable elf following the Qun can be interesting to see, if written properly.


To sum it up - I still think that MotA was built better from gameplay point of view - less filler fights, more various activity, and it also has some minor details to add about characters and relations. While Legacy has superb story arcs and setting...it's gameplay itself was too hack-n-slashy for me (and with ultimate Evil Big Boss, yes).

They are also different in mood - depressing dramatic and dark vs light, lovely and humorous(without falling into gag comic). But it does not make one better than other. It's good to see really different DLCs. I wish Legacy involved less killing darkspawn and demons and beasts and offered some Malcolm puzzles, may be...

It is just "lazy inconsistent writing". in Awakening Anders said that the mages shouldn't be punished for what the magisters did long time ago.

I played DAA just once and I could misremember something. What can I say... it's a pity.

[Renmiri1]

@Caelein - We will be here. Enjoy Act 3!

[esper]

Nrieh wrote...

Nrieh, and I was starting to feel like a genetic mutant, since Tallis really never bothered me too. And your point about Liara is spot on, that's a character-forced-on-player that really chives my spuds.

Yep. That's it. I finished yesterday night. Helped her and made a canon save, and then reloaded to check what's so different and wonderful about mentioned here leaving Tallis version (which I rarely do - I mean reloadings - but I was curious).

Can't say it changes that much, though Anders "saving banter" was nice indeed. I did not hear it with Tallis, so I don't know if it's choice-specific or not. Other than that - there are slightly more fights in her version. But not so annoyingly much of them.

With her Anders still had some banter priority (like talking to Fenris about qunari and intentionally ignoring Tallis). And according to his click-line, it must be him who hinted Varric that helping Tallis had something to do with "pretty elves" 8P Which confirmed my headcanon about Anders being a jealous guy. Come on, I thought my preferences should be obvious to him by the middle of chapter 3! And I did not even flirt with her once. Not even with save-load! 8P

My only concern about Tallis is that they are truly going to make her a companion (romancable, no doubt) in DA3...which is the easyest way to ruin her character andor to make another Liara out of her, imo. On the other hand - romancable elf following the Qun can be interesting to see, if written properly.


To sum it up - I still think that MotA was built better from gameplay point of view - less filler fights, more various activity, and it also has some minor details to add about characters and relations. While Legacy has superb story arcs and setting...it's gameplay itself was too hack-n-slashy for me (and with ultimate Evil Big Boss, yes).

They are also different in mood - depressing dramatic and dark vs light, lovely and humorous(without falling into gag comic). But it does not make one better than other. It's good to see really different DLCs. I wish Legacy involved less killing darkspawn and demons and beasts and offered some Malcolm puzzles, may be...

It is just "lazy inconsistent writing". in Awakening Anders said that the mages shouldn't be punished for what the magisters did long time ago.

I played DAA just once and I could misremember something. What can I say... it's a pity.

Tallis was always a hated character prior to Mark do to her being falsely labeled with Mary Sue (a term which have long since lost all meaning thanks to wide missuse on the internet).

For my part I disliked her because she: Took my Hawke for a fool, is arrogant and constantly one-upped my companions in the banters even, is a bloody hypocrite; just the way she winked at the crows as if it was just a game and then was all mushey eyed over the guard she killed, oh and childishly tried to cover up her betrayal with the whole nose thing when we were at the splitting point. She is a very fake person (notice I said person not characther)  and I am going to quote, I think Anders and say "Good riddance".  

[NRieh]

I think Anders and say "Good riddance".

He was just jealous.. 8P

And as for your dislike - it's not much like you dislike the character, but your Hawke dislikes her as a person (which (s)he has obvious reasons to do). Those are different types of "hate".

Same as myHawke dislikes Isabella or Merril. I admit those are good characters, but neither has a chance to make friends with myHawke.

Tallis did not annoy neither me nor her that much, I guess. That's why she helped. And Anders'd better think twice before saying anything about "helping blindly pretty persons without self-preservation instinct".

And as for mentioned before Liara - I know that it's me(player) who dislikes her character a lot. It has not much in-game reasons, and Shepard is ok with her as a person.

[Amirit]

At least you can say to Isabella and Merrill how you feel, and here you are helpless. But never mind, it's just bubbling.

You are right, some people take their LI in games way to serious and get offended by over familiarity of Tallis and expectations of help from someone she betrayed and in general against her religion, her people and so on. Qunary treat mages worse then animals, your LI is a mage and she cheerfully jokes about sewing his mouth and stuff like this. Not to mention, Quinary are planning invasion, you (someone who saw how that invasion will look like) have the list of spies in your hands - and you let it go! Brilliant.

[Renmiri1]

Saw this picture on a site full of good articles about DA2



Here's one of the good articles
http://www.popmatter...gh-dragon-age-2

[NRieh]

your LI is a mage and she cheerfully jokes about sewing his mouth and stuff like this.

So does Fenris And not only during MotA. Why don't people hate Fenris so much?

you (someone who saw how that invasion will look like) have the list of spies in your hands - and you let it go! Brilliant.

That was...a strange move, may be. But that's a plot dead end. It can not resolve within DA2 and they can NOT make it any significant in DA3, because they'd put those who play DLC above those who did not. Even LotSB did not have any obvious results (besides few numbers in asset list). And if such a choice (keep scroll-give scroll) with no results would look very... poor. 

oh, and may be I'm not annoyed by Tallis because I appreciate non-herocentric characters. Everyone has his own buisness - why Tallis can't? 

Modifié par Nrieh, 17 septembre 2012 - 06:33 .

[Renmiri1]

Weeeeeeeeeeeee!!!

DA3: Inquisition Announced

Modifié par Renmiri1, 17 septembre 2012 - 06:46 .

[Amirit]

Nrieh wrote...
So does Fenris And not only during MotA. Why don't people hate Fenris so much?

He is charming (hot, actually, but nm) and part of the family. And if you look at the topic about "what would you say that game did not let you" - many players DO want to tell Fenris to back off

[NRieh]

Weeeeeeeeeeeee!!!

Too early for "weeee" I think, but I'm also glad it's happening. Learened hard way not to build expectations too high, but really hope they will make it worth both DAO and DA2.

And if you look at the topic about "what would you say that game did not let you" - many players DO want to tell Fenris to back off

I'd prefer to shut them both. Can not understand how a mage and a grown up two adult men can turn into kindergarten "I hate you you stole my toy horse" boys once you pout them in same party.... 8P

He is charming (hot, actually, but nm)

Aha. So Fenris is charming and hot, and Tallis is annoying. okeeey, I'll know it now. <-) 

 

Modifié par Nrieh, 17 septembre 2012 - 07:42 .

[Renmiri1]

Nrieh wrote...

I'd prefer to shut them both. Can not understand how a mage and a grown up two adult men can turn into kindergarten "I hate you you stole my toy horse" boys once you pout them in same party.... 8P

 

I just love it that it is 2 men acting like brats, not the usual trope of two women fighting for a man. 

[Amirit]

Nrieh wrote...
Aha. So Fenris is charming and hot, and Tallis is annoying. okeeey, I'll know it now. <-)

Varric is the best with his banter with Fenris "You could try wearing something that didn't scream: "I hate you all! I was a slave!"
But what can I say - he IS hot Unlike Tallis. And on a serious note - she did not suffer from mages yet finds it normal to treat them like this.

Renmiri1 , love the picture, but the article... Comparing mages with LGBT community?! Seriously?!!

[Renmiri1]

Well in her case is the oppressed minority that comes to her mind. But no minority on our world is treated exactly like mages are in Thedas. And no minority on our world can kill like mages can.

On a more indirect comparison. I can't say I don't see her point. LGBT are still forbidden to visit their loved ones at hospitals or are killed / beaten just for being what they are. And a leading cause of death for LGBT is suicide. No they aren't as oppressed as mages, nor as dangerous as mages, but they are still treated pretty badly.

Modifié par Renmiri1, 17 septembre 2012 - 09:09 .

[Amirit]

A lot of groups of people are treated badly in different countries and different societies. But to claim Bioware is making game about them... to me it's to be over-centric on yourself.