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[Deviant Ingredient]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Deviant Ingredient wrote...
Good thing he loves Hawke so much. I wonder what he thinks of a Blood Mage Hawke.

I romanced Anders on the friendship path with a blood mage Hawke.  I had to headcanon a justification considering Anders' in-game distaste for blood magic, even though no one mentions it when Hawke does it.  The game gives conflicting information on whether you need a demon to learn blood magic.

The way I imagined it, Natale Hawke spent a lot of time after Malcolm's death going through his spellbooks and other things from his past, and stumbled upon some notes on blood magic from his time under the Wardens' thumb in Legacy.  She hid it from her family and put it aside until the Blight--when that hit, she was terrified of losing her family, and started using it to soup up her spells.  

Natale and Anders didn't get off to a good start--she thought he was nuts for fighting the templars, and dangerous enough to bring their wrath down on her family.  The specialization description calls blood magic an art of the physical, the only discipline that resides purely in Thedas and does not require the powers of the Fade.  I'm not sure if that's true, but that's how she saw it and used it.  If Anders can love a Hawke who supports the templars, than I think he can love a blood mage too, especially one who is actually careful about her powers.

Personally, I think the blood magic did drive her a little batty.  Not because of demons or magical corruption, but because of the very principle of blood magic--sacrifice in exchange for power.   She started applying that principle to other aspects of her life, like fighting the templars in Act 3. I ended up with a ruthless and extremely powerful maleficar with views just as extreme as Anders', practically a Villain Protagonist.

My canon Hawke, Faline, is a blood mage and I headcanoned that when she first showed her magic as a child the village tried to kill her. Malcolm was away hunting/merchanting/whatever so he wasn't able to protect her. Needless to say she pulled a Conner and a Desire Demon got to her. She terrorized the village for a little bit until Malcolm showed up and knocked her out and managed to flee with Leandra and the twins. He kept Lil' Hawke unconscious and brought her to one person who could help, Flemeth, who I headcanoned helped Malcolm in his youth because lets face it, Flemeth meets all the cool people. She helps Malcolm enter the Fade and defeat the demon much like the Warden does. He saves Lil' Hawke's soul but according to Flemeth won't remember a thing unless she chooses to. So Hawke grows up never knowing that she had been possessed and it isn't aware until Act 2 when she's helping Sebastian and Allure tells her how she's already got the touch of a demon on her. That led to questions and confusion and with Anders help she remembers everything, including the knowledge the Desire Demon left behind.

She goes through a lot of confusion and grief and was terrified of judgement. Thankfully Anders understood and didn't blame her but he did hold some wariness when she starts to experiment with it. She's pretty cautious with it but gets more liberal with it as Act 3 progresses.

You do have a good point about Anders loving a pro-templar Hawke and so could love a blood mage Hawke.

Modifié par Deviant Ingredient, 11 novembre 2012 - 12:47 .

[Gyrefalcon]

Renmiri1 wrote...

Mages on 2012 ftw

That is hilarious, Renmiri!  Did you actually make/come across this page or is this a fun photoshop image?

[Sable Rhapsody]

Deviant Ingredient wrote...

You do have a good point about Anders loving a pro-templar Hawke and so could love a blood mage Hawke.

Anders says something to Hawke in Act 1:  "You look...something.  True.  Proud.  Like even if you don't agree with me, you'll be honest."

While being pro-mage and in line with his beliefs does help, I think strength of character matters more to Anders in terms of romancing him.  

[Deviant Ingredient]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Deviant Ingredient wrote...

You do have a good point about Anders loving a pro-templar Hawke and so could love a blood mage Hawke.

Anders says something to Hawke in Act 1:  "You look...something.  True.  Proud.  Like even if you don't agree with me, you'll be honest."

While being pro-mage and in line with his beliefs does help, I think strength of character matters more to Anders in terms of romancing him.  

It's funny how snippy he gets with Hawke when s/he's honest with him. If it wasn't for the fact the diplomatic line gets him to flirt first I would totally click the sarcastic line.

[Nilfalasiel]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

While being pro-mage and in line with his beliefs does help, I think strength of character matters more to Anders in terms of romancing him.  

To a certain point. Negotiating with Torpor is still a deal-breaker, after all.

But yeah, it is amusing how huffy he becomes when you disagree with him, despite saying that he appreciates it.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Nilfalasiel wrote...
But yeah, it is amusing how huffy he becomes when you disagree with him, despite saying that he appreciates it.

He does get pretty huffy in acts 1 and 2.  By act 3, rivalry Hawke finally seems to be getting through to him.  Too late by then, though.  Even if Anders wants to throttle him/her sometimes, I think some part of him understands that rivalry Hawke really does just want to help him.

If you rivalry him without romance and get him to side with the templars, he gives this line: "Goodbye, Hawke.  You were a better friend than I ever knew."  

(Trust me, I only tried it out for science.  It's just too goddamn depressing.)

Deviant Ingredient wrote...
It's funny how snippy he gets with Hawke when s/he's honest with him. If it wasn't for the fact the diplomatic line gets him to flirt first I would totally click the sarcastic line.

I snark a lot at Anders, even in my friendship playthrough.  I'll take the occasional rivalry hit here or there to call him out on his paranoia.  And Hawke's expression and voice acting is always priceless.

Modifié par Sable Rhapsody, 12 novembre 2012 - 11:46 .

[Deviant Ingredient]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Nilfalasiel wrote...
But yeah, it is amusing how huffy he becomes when you disagree with him, despite saying that he appreciates it.

He does get pretty huffy in acts 1 and 2.  By act 3, rivalry Hawke finally seems to be getting through to him.  Too late by then, though.  Even if Anders wants to throttle him/her sometimes, I think some part of him understands that rivalry Hawke really does just want to help him.

If you rivalry him without romance and get him to side with the templars, he gives this line: "Goodbye, Hawke.  You were a better friend than I ever knew."  

(Trust me, I only tried it out for science.  It's just too goddamn depressing.)

Deviant Ingredient wrote...
It's funny how snippy he gets with Hawke when s/he's honest with him. If it wasn't for the fact the diplomatic line gets him to flirt first I would totally click the sarcastic line.

I snark a lot at Anders, even in my friendship playthrough.  I'll take the occasional rivalry hit here or there to call him out on his paranoia.  And Hawke's expression and voice acting is always priceless.

Oh sarcastic Hawke is defintely FTW and the fact Varric, Isabela, and Flemeth all love it makes it even more awesome. Oddly enough Fenris laughs at sarcastic Hawke more than Anders. It's funny how Carver shares a little bit of similar humor with Hawke at random times but then weirdly enough Hawke doesn't find it funny.

[berelinde]

A lot of the characters appreciate the sarcasm. Anders does, sometimes, when the subject is personal as opposed to important ("Want a sandwich?"), but you have to remember that a lot of what he talks about is his cause. Where that is concerned, he really isn't capable of taking it lightly.

[Sable Rhapsody]

berelinde wrote...

A lot of the characters appreciate the sarcasm. Anders does, sometimes, when the subject is personal as opposed to important ("Want a sandwich?"), but you have to remember that a lot of what he talks about is his cause. Where that is concerned, he really isn't capable of taking it lightly.

I know, but I still can't help but prod at him every once in a while.  Even with friendship Hawke, I think it does Anders some good to get taken down a peg sometimes.  Also, silly!Hawke's occasional fails in humor when dealing with Anders ("What's the worst that could happen?  You turn into an abomination and...not funny, actually.") are great.

[Nilfalasiel]

Sable Rhapsody wrote..

I know, but I still can't help but prod at him every once in a while.  Even with friendship Hawke, I think it does Anders some good to get taken down a peg sometimes.  Also, silly!Hawke's occasional fails in humor when dealing with Anders ("What's the worst that could happen?  You turn into an abomination and...not funny, actually.") are great.

Silly!Hawke is one of the best things about DA2. She/he just comes up with the darndest things sometimes. And it's just that much better when it fails.

Also, I know this was about 10 pages ago now, but I've figured out the condition for the semi-jealous banter between an unromanced Alistair and a romanced Zevran.

This one:

Alistair: So let me ask you something. What are your intentions with her?
Zevran: You speak of her as if she is not present. She is just right over there, you know...
Alistair: Don't dodge the question. I'm serious.
Zevran: Is this brotherly concern I detect? Or something else? Perhaps you are concerned for me, yes?
Alistair: I am just asking what your intentions are. You did try to kill us all, remember?
Zevran: And now I owe her a blood debt, as she has spared my life. It has brought us... closer together.
Alistair: Is that a smirk? Are you smirking at me? (Alistair sounds rather strongly aggressive here)
Zevran: I assure you, ser, that I am not smirking. No smirking here, no.
Alistair: Well, just... watch yourself, then. I'll be keeping an eye on you.

Zevran has to be at "Care" for it to occur, regardless of sleeping with him or kissing him (none of which my Tabris has done as of yet). I just had it pop up at +52 approval. I know it won't trigger any earlier, because I'd already run out of Alistair-Zevran banters beforehand, while he was still at "Interested". Then he gained 2 more points, which brough him into "Care", and poof! Banter.

Modifié par Nilfalasiel, 14 novembre 2012 - 01:59 .

[Sable Rhapsody]

Nilfalasiel wrote...
Silly!Hawke is one of the best things about DA2. She/he just comes up with the darndest things sometimes. And it's just that much better when it fails.

I was mixed on Tallis as a character, but damn if she doesn't bring out the best lines in Silly!Hawke.

"What do you call it when you kill people and take their stuff?"
"...adventuring!"

Something about Nicholas Boulton's sheer GLEE in that one word had me in stitches.  Personally, I slightly prefer male Silly!Hawke to female, but they're both fantastic.

[Nilfalasiel]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

I was mixed on Tallis as a character, but damn if she doesn't bring out the best lines in Silly!Hawke.

"What do you call it when you kill people and take their stuff?"
"...adventuring!"

Something about Nicholas Boulton's sheer GLEE in that one word had me in stitches.  Personally, I slightly prefer male Silly!Hawke to female, but they're both fantastic.

It's probably part of their desperate attempt to make Tallis likeable. "Look at me, I'm so funny and witty, and quirky! Look at all the awesome banter I trigger!"

Ugh. I'm always so glad to leave her standing in that cave.

As for Hawke's VA, I distinctly prefer Boulton, which is a shame, because I tend to play FemHawkes (probably a blowback from being forced to play male protagonists over years of gaming: my characters are now overwhelmingly female whenever possible). But something about Wyatt's voice just doesn't work for me.

[berelinde]

Nilfalasiel wrote...

As for Hawke's VA, I distinctly prefer Boulton, which is a shame, because I tend to play FemHawkes (probably a blowback from being forced to play male protagonists over years of gaming: my characters are now overwhelmingly female whenever possible). But something about Wyatt's voice just doesn't work for me.

Yeah, I get that, too. I did play a few female Hawkes, but mostly, they've been male. If I'm going to be looking at/listening to the same face/voice all game, it might as well be one I find attractive... which leads to a lot of eye rolling when my sister, who is much more conservative than I am, insists with perfect sincerity that the male LIs are happier and more "in love" with female Hawkes than they are with male Hawkes. It drives me nuts, but it's pointless to argue. It was written that way fore several reasons (women are less likely to react negatively to a guy saying that he wants to protect her, a lot of guys will talk about physical attraction with greater comfort than they talk about feelings), but none of those reasons involve a lack of emotion. Good luck trying to explain that to somebody who wants to believe that they chose "better" than somebody else, though.

[Deviant Ingredient]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Nilfalasiel wrote...
Silly!Hawke is one of the best things about DA2. She/he just comes up with the darndest things sometimes. And it's just that much better when it fails.

I was mixed on Tallis as a character, but damn if she doesn't bring out the best lines in Silly!Hawke.

"What do you call it when you kill people and take their stuff?"
"...adventuring!"

Something about Nicholas Boulton's sheer GLEE in that one word had me in stitches.  Personally, I slightly prefer male Silly!Hawke to female, but they're both fantastic.

I too was mixed on Tallis as a character. At times I was thinking she wasn't bad but then other times I was yelling at her to stop stealing Hawke's thunder. The Qunari thing is interesting but she said the word innocent WAY TOO MANY TIMES.

My favorite conversation between them is the pickle one. Plus all the lines where Anders is jealous. Anyone else notice how Hawke's flirt lines and sarcastic lines could actually be switched around and confuse unwary travelers. I always picture Hawke trying to flirt and no one can tell but when she's being simply funny (to her anyway) people think she's flirting.

I seem to be in the minority but I actually prefer Wyatt over Boulton. Don't get me wrong, I love Boulton (even more as Malcolm), but I simply prefer Wyatt's dilevery of the lines. Hers are more drawled where his is more fast paced.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Deviant Ingredient wrote...

I seem to be in the minority but I actually prefer Wyatt over Boulton. Don't get me wrong, I love Boulton (even more as Malcolm), but I simply prefer Wyatt's dilevery of the lines. Hers are more drawled where his is more fast paced.

I do too.  I slightly prefer Boulton's delivery of the silly lines, but I really love Jo Wyatt.  Especially aggressive!FemHawke, she's such a badass.

Now I need to go back and play Mark of the Assassin with Anders in tow.  I didn't play it when it first came out, so I'm a bit behind on the curve.  I do like how Hawke's snarky and flirty lines can sometimes get confused--it led to awkward man-flirting with Fenris in my last playthrough, which had me in stitches.

Modifié par Sable Rhapsody, 14 novembre 2012 - 09:55 .

[Deviant Ingredient]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Deviant Ingredient wrote...

I seem to be in the minority but I actually prefer Wyatt over Boulton. Don't get me wrong, I love Boulton (even more as Malcolm), but I simply prefer Wyatt's dilevery of the lines. Hers are more drawled where his is more fast paced.

I do too.  I slightly prefer Boulton's delivery of the silly lines, but I really love Jo Wyatt.  Especially aggressive!FemHawke, she's such a badass.

Now I need to go back and play Mark of the Assassin with Anders in tow.  I didn't play it when it first came out, so I'm a bit behind on the curve.  I do like how Hawke's snarky and flirty lines can sometimes get confused--it led to awkward man-flirting with Fenris in my last playthrough, which had me in stitches.

Flirty Fenris is even less subtle than Isabela's. He really likes the beautiful woman line (I have yet to flirt with him with Male!Hawke).

Sracastic Hawke's mind must be an interesting place.

[berelinde]

Huh. I always flirt with Fenris with male Hawke (and then move on to Anders), but I have never yet flirted with Fenris with a female Hawke. And probably never will, since I like Boulton doing the diplo lines so much. It's the delivery. He says the most ridiculous things in the most deadpan voice, it makes me LOL hard.

I've also never flirted with Tallis. I don't actually like the character, so I see no reason to flatter her with attention, but mostly, I was afraid that Anders would take it badly, like he does when Hawke flirts with Zevran. Maybe next time, I will. One thing I do like about flirting in MotA is when male Hawke flirts with Lord Cyril. He just looks so awkward when he leans in to whisper as if he's thinking "Wow, I haven't done this in ages. I really am out of practice. I hope Anders never finds out about it."

[Sable Rhapsody]

berelinde wrote...

I've also never flirted with Tallis. I don't actually like the character, so I see no reason to flatter her with attention, but mostly, I was afraid that Anders would take it badly, like he does when Hawke flirts with Zevran. Maybe next time, I will. One thing I do like about flirting in MotA is when male Hawke flirts with Lord Cyril. He just looks so awkward when he leans in to whisper as if he's thinking "Wow, I haven't done this in ages. I really am out of practice. I hope Anders never finds out about it."

I played MoTA in Act 1 with my ManHawke, before he and Izzy were really a thing, so I completed the Tallis mini-romance arc.  The flirt lines are extremely funny, even if the whole thing felt kind of shallow.  More like "Hey, kiss pixelated Felicia Day!" 

[berelinde]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

I played MoTA in Act 1 with my ManHawke, before he and Izzy were really a thing, so I completed the Tallis mini-romance arc.  The flirt lines are extremely funny, even if the whole thing felt kind of shallow.  More like "Hey, kiss pixelated Felicia Day!" 

Ugh. I would *definitely* not like to do that. That, in actual fact, is one of the main reasons I didn't like Tallis. They pushed the FD thing way too hard.

A long time ago, I took a creative writing class in high school. The teacher showed us some slides of passages from the classics and asked us to point out what was wrong with them from a writer's point of view. On quite a few of them, that "something wrong" was "telling, not showing". Instead of telling the reader that a character was amiable, let them say pleasant, friendly things. Instead of telling the reader that a character was lovable, write a lovable character. You probably know where I'm going with this.

[Sable Rhapsody]

berelinde wrote...
On quite a few of them, that "something wrong" was "telling, not showing". Instead of telling the reader that a character was amiable, let them say pleasant, friendly things. Instead of telling the reader that a character was lovable, write a lovable character. You probably know where I'm going with this.

Yep.  I know exactly what you mean, and it's why I ended up in sort of a weird spot with Tallis.  On one hand, I think she's conceptually interesting and she does have a lot of great dialogue.  On the other hand, it smacks of telling rather than showing.  TBH I think she really could've used more time than a few hours in a DLC starring her--her characterization felt rushed and one-note.

Modifié par Sable Rhapsody, 14 novembre 2012 - 11:50 .

[Nilfalasiel]

berelinde wrote...

Yeah, I get that, too. I did play a few female Hawkes, but mostly, they've been male. If I'm going to be looking at/listening to the same face/voice all game, it might as well be one I find attractive... which leads to a lot of eye rolling when my sister, who is much more conservative than I am, insists with perfect sincerity that the male LIs are happier and more "in love" with female Hawkes than they are with male Hawkes. It drives me nuts, but it's pointless to argue. It was written that way fore several reasons (women are less likely to react negatively to a guy saying that he wants to protect her, a lot of guys will talk about physical attraction with greater comfort than they talk about feelings), but none of those reasons involve a lack of emotion. Good luck trying to explain that to somebody who wants to believe that they chose "better" than somebody else, though.

Oh geez. Funny thing is, I don't actually like the "protective" vibe. Heck, when you compare Hawke to Anders, I'd say he needs protecting much more than she does. And that's what she ends up doing anyway. I do like that reversal of roles though, so that might be another reason why I prefer having a FemHawke, despite liking Boulton's voice better. Plus I'm one of the people who perceived Awakening Anders as straight, which also affected my choice.

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Now I need to go back and play Mark of the Assassin with Anders in tow. I didn't play it when it first came out, so I'm a bit behind on the curve. I do like how Hawke's snarky and flirty lines can sometimes get confused--it led to awkward man-flirting with Fenris in my last playthrough, which had me in stitches.

Ack! You're missing out on Anders' rescue fantasy banter! That alone is worth playing MotA for, regardless of the annoyingness of Tallis. Silly!Hawke at the party is also worth it. As are Prosper's dig at ME2's Jacob, and Hawke's impromptu Horatio Caine impression after the battle with him.

Modifié par Nilfalasiel, 15 novembre 2012 - 08:46 .

[Sable Rhapsody]

Nilfalasiel wrote...
As are Prosper's dig at ME2's Jacob, and Hawke's impromptu Horatio Caine impression after the battle with him.

OK, I got the Horatio moment, which is so much win, but where's the dig at ME2?

[Nilfalasiel]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

OK, I got the Horatio moment, which is so much win, but where's the dig at ME2?

It's right at the beginning of the party, when Prosper makes a speech about the wyvern Hawke caught. He'll say "to hunt a wyvern on its own ground is a terrible risk, but the prize...". Here's a vid.

I got the comment on all my playthroughs, but it may depend on the size of the wyvern, I'm not sure. Mine were always alphas.

Modifié par Nilfalasiel, 15 novembre 2012 - 12:10 .

[smallwhippet]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Deviant Ingredient wrote...

I seem to be in the minority but I actually prefer Wyatt over Boulton. Don't get me wrong, I love Boulton (even more as Malcolm), but I simply prefer Wyatt's dilevery of the lines. Hers are more drawled where his is more fast paced.

I do too.  I slightly prefer Boulton's delivery of the silly lines, but I really love Jo Wyatt.  Especially aggressive!FemHawke, she's such a badass.

Now I need to go back and play Mark of the Assassin with Anders in tow.  I didn't play it when it first came out, so I'm a bit behind on the curve.  I do like how Hawke's snarky and flirty lines can sometimes get confused--it led to awkward man-flirting with Fenris in my last playthrough, which had me in stitches.

..and it's SO satisfying to play an aggressive!Hawke in MotA: loved being able to get really angry with Tallis. 

[Sable Rhapsody]

Nilfalasiel wrote...
I got the comment on all my playthroughs, but it may depend on the size of the wyvern, I'm not sure. Mine were always alphas.

LOL.  Thanks.  I think I missed it because on my playthroughs I was too busy going, "Hawke, WTF ARE YOU WEARING WHYYYYYYYY"