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[Anna Rardin]

I thought Meredith was already planning to use the Right of Annulment?? Doesn't Cullen say something about that? If so, who's to say she wasn't going to enact it regardless if Anders blew up the Chantry or not? Ugh, so much confusion @_@

[tmp7704]

SurelyForth wrote...

Instead, she does exactly what he knew she would do. She calls for the Right of Annulment. By jumping on that so quickly, despite Anders taking full responsibility and despite Orsino's protestations and offers of aid in hunting the blood mages in the Circle's ranks, she gives his act power, she proves that she cannot be rational when it comes to mages, that she would madly sacrifice a prison of people who are the MOST innocent in this whole fiasco, and THAT is what forces the confrontation, not merely the Chantry exploding.

Of course this is no surprise given at this point she truly is batsh-t crazy in general thanks to prolonged exposure to the dwarven idol. One could think that focusing on exposing state of her mental health could lead to similar decisive outcome but without the part when people get blown up just to show that yes, there's a crazy person at the helm. And thousands more deaths that followed.

[Aeowyn]

Kerras says that if you click on him when you go to the Gallows in Act 3. So yeah, she'd sent for it. The mages were doomed either way.

[Kawamura]

Anders is Revan?

[Herr Uhl]

Anna Rardin wrote...

I thought Meredith was already planning to use the Right of Annulment?? Doesn't Cullen say something about that? If so, who's to say she wasn't going to enact it regardless if Anders blew up the Chantry or not? Ugh, so much confusion @_@

Why does that matter? His intent was to force open confrontation.

I don't think that an anullment was going to happen at that date, but given the sword thing it is likely to happen soon.

[Herr Uhl]

Magaloo wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

silver-crescent wrote...

I had never really thought of this before, but Anders/Justice has a lot in common with another well loved Bioware character. Can you guess you?

Tiax?

How do you see Tiax in Anders is beyond me... He is crazy but not that crazy and he does not want to rule the world. 

I'm guessing at Wild Flower if I'm supposed to be serious.

[Sialater]

Kawamura wrote...

Anders is Revan?

That sort of actually would make sense.  But Herr Uhl needs to tell us.

[Anna Rardin]

Aeowyn wrote...

Kerras says that if you click on him when you go to the Gallows in Act 3. So yeah, she'd sent for it. The mages were doomed either way.

OHHHH. Okay. SO yea... Meredith just jumped the gun then. Anders was just an excuse for her to do it RIGHT then. I doubt she would've been given the go-ahead to do it, but I bet it would've happened anyways. Chantry explosion or not.

[Sialater]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Magaloo wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

silver-crescent wrote...

I had never really thought of this before, but Anders/Justice has a lot in common with another well loved Bioware character. Can you guess you?

Tiax?

How do you see Tiax in Anders is beyond me... He is crazy but not that crazy and he does not want to rule the world. 

I'm guessing at Wild Flower if I'm supposed to be serious.

Wild Flower?  But she had two spirits.  And no merging, just possession. 

[silver-crescent]

How do you insert images in these forums?

[Herr Uhl]

Sialater wrote...

Wild Flower?  But she had two spirits.  And no merging, just possession. 

What is the difference between merging and possession? It works the same.

[Sialater]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Sialater wrote...

Wild Flower?  But she had two spirits.  And no merging, just possession. 

What is the difference between merging and possession? It works the same.

Merging is the blending of the two entities.  Possession is the overwriting of the new entity over the original.  Anders merged, Wild Flower was possessed.

Modifié par Sialater, 30 mars 2011 - 06:27 .

[silver-crescent]

 

Both her and Anders dedicate their lives to an ideal of "justice". Both of them place it above their own wants/needs and both were willing to give up their worldly possessions for it. And also, they're both willing to kill innocents to achieve said justice.

Also, on a lighter note, both are serious, use magic and glow blue 

[YamiSnuffles]

silver-crescent wrote...

*snip*
 Both her and Anders dedicate their lives to an ideal of "justice". Both of them place it above their own wants/needs and both were willing to give up their worldly possessions for it. And also, they're both willing to kill innocents to achieve said justice.

Also, on a lighter note, both are serious, use magic and glow blue 

Funny thing is, I was just joking with my husband yesterday that Justice needed to leave Anders alone and go merge with Samara. Justice/Justicar ftw... or something.

[SurelyForth]

tmp7704 wrote...

SurelyForth wrote...

Instead, she does exactly what he knew she would do. She calls for the Right of Annulment. By jumping on that so quickly, despite Anders taking full responsibility and despite Orsino's protestations and offers of aid in hunting the blood mages in the Circle's ranks, she gives his act power, she proves that she cannot be rational when it comes to mages, that she would madly sacrifice a prison of people who are the MOST innocent in this whole fiasco, and THAT is what forces the confrontation, not merely the Chantry exploding.

Of course this is no surprise given at this point she truly is batsh-t crazy in general thanks to prolonged exposure to the dwarven idol. One could think that focusing on exposing state of her mental health could lead to similar decisive outcome but without the part when people get blown up just to show that yes, there's a crazy person at the helm. And thousands more deaths that followed.

But what do you suggest? Elthina, who was the one person in Kirkwall who could have done something, was obviously content to not see it or deal with it on any level. Orsino was just a mage and Hawke was being repeatedly shunted out of the conversation by Meredith, who would then be politely chastised by Elthina.

From the way the game presents it, had Anders not blown up the Chantry, things would have quickly escalated to the point where the Divine would intervene. With an army, and an indiscriminate army at that.

[Herr Uhl]

Sialater wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Sialater wrote...

Wild Flower?  But she had two spirits.  And no merging, just possession. 

What is the difference between merging and possession? It works the same.

Merging is the blending of the two entities.  Possession is the overwriting of the new entity over the original.  Anders merged, Wild Flower was possessed.

Thought you meant in a DAO sense.

Anyways, he is possessed (or merged or whatever) by what he thinks of as two different spirits, Vengeance and Justice. One he sees as benevolent and the other as less so. He gets a blackout when the spirit does the talking.

How is he like Revan?

Edit: Maybe not as two different, but he sees them as different enough that he calls one vengeance and the other justice.

Modifié par Herr Uhl, 30 mars 2011 - 06:39 .

[Sialater]

YamiSnuffles wrote...

silver-crescent wrote...

*snip*
 Both her and Anders dedicate their lives to an ideal of "justice". Both of them place it above their own wants/needs and both were willing to give up their worldly possessions for it. And also, they're both willing to kill innocents to achieve said justice.

Also, on a lighter note, both are serious, use magic and glow blue 

Funny thing is, I was just joking with my husband yesterday that Justice needed to leave Anders alone and go merge with Samara. Justice/Justicar ftw... or something.

Seconded! 

Now... how do we cross universes?

[Pseudo the Mustachioed]

I just had a terrible mental image of Anders in Samara's outfit.

/cries

[Kawamura]

Pseudocognition wrote...

I just had a terrible mental image of Anders in Samara's outfit.

/cries

A terribly awesome one?

[SurelyForth]

Pseudocognition wrote...

I just had a terrible mental image of Anders in Samara's outfit.

/cries

Why do you hate us, Pseudo? Why?

[silver-crescent]

 If Justice possessed Samara... she probably wouldn't change a bit 

[mellifera]

Pseudocognition wrote...

I just had a terrible mental image of Anders in Samara's outfit.

/cries

You want to draw it now, right?

[Luridel]

... Justice merging with Samara would be scary. She's had a long, long time to get incredibly good at what she does; I'd say she's significantly more dangerous than Anders. She's got her Code and she sticks to it, which might be the only saving grace - no Vengeance conversion... if she's lucky.

[Sialater]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Sialater wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Sialater wrote...

Wild Flower?  But she had two spirits.  And no merging, just possession. 

What is the difference between merging and possession? It works the same.

Merging is the blending of the two entities.  Possession is the overwriting of the new entity over the original.  Anders merged, Wild Flower was possessed.

Thought you meant in a DAO sense.

Anyways, he is possessed (or merged or whatever) by what he thinks of as two different spirits, Vengeance and Justice. One he sees as benevolent and the other as less so. He gets a blackout when the spirit does the talking.

How is he like Revan?

Pre- mindwipe Revan:  Driven to his mission at all costs, no matter what that mission is.  Falls to the Dark Side through outside influences.  (I don't care what LucasArts said the reason was, in game evidence/hints gave the Star Forge as the ultimate reason for the fall.)  Post-mind-wipe/blowing up Chantry: driven by redemption with the possiblity of falling all over again.

And Justice becomes Vengeance through the crucible of Anders' rage, not an entirely different entity. 

[tmp7704]

SurelyForth wrote...

But what do you suggest? Elthina, who was the one person in Kirkwall who could have done something, was obviously content to not see it or deal with it on any level. Orsino was just a mage and Hawke was being repeatedly shunted out of the conversation by Meredith, who would then be politely chastised by Elthina.

From what i saw Elthina was the one person who was keeping Meredith from going overboard, and she was hoping for the sides to work out their differences instead of being forced into a corner (what Anders essentially did; he admits his main incentive in blowing up the Chantry was to remove that one thing which was stopping the excrements from getting in the fan)  Given that, i'd expect Elthina to actually act if situation deteriorated to the point where Meredith could no longer be reasoned with. I.e. in few weeks, tops.

Meaning, overall similar outcome minus the blown up Chantry and minus the Circle War.