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[TEWR]

Ryzaki wrote...

Frankly that irritated me. Stupid Chantry people. (And let's not get into that b**** who called you a heathen for not wanting her blessing. Ugh).

Oh no we are going to talk about that. I hated that ****. I hate the Chantry plain and simple because they feel the need to call everyone else a heathen because they don't want to be a part of their hive mind religion. Qunari? Heathens. Elves? Heathens. Dwarves? Heathens. Cats? Big time heathens.

[Sjofn]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Sjofn wrote...
All Sebastian is really saying is that no one is completely, utterly free to do whatever they want. And we aren't.

That's true, but some people in Thedas are a lot less free than others.  Sebastian comparing his situation to Anders or Hawke is IMO oversimplification.  Seb had a whole array options when that sack of gold hit his hand.  Anders' options upon entering the Circle were much more narrow; accept or resist, much like the qunari.

His point is simply "no one is as free as you think, Anders, it's a lot greyer than you realise." It's entirely possible he felt he didn't have any good options, too. His options were stay, or go start a war he wasn't sure he wanted to wage, as he sees it. Completely and utterly turn his back on the Chantry he was given to and found a place in or turn his back on his duty to his people. I don't blame him at all for thinking he had no choices there.

[Amondra]

I really wanted to see the Mr. Wiggums thing >.<

[Apollo Starflare]

Talking of Anders' time in the Ferelden Circle, ever since going through Origins again post DA2 I have wished there was an opportunity to bump into Wynne with him. Those two would have a lot to talk about heh. It's funny that we've never seen them together considering that they would have probably known each other outside of the events of the games.

Also on the subject of Anders' early life, it's a little strange that of all the Mages in Thedas the one to finally begin tearing everything down would be someone who was raised in a relatively laid back Circle. Judging by Gregoir and what we hear and see of the Circle outside of Uldred's mess it doesn't seem to be a particularly harsh example of that life. Certainly not compared to say Kirkwall.

But then I'm sure Anders' repeated escape attempts meant he had a less than friendly relationship with the Templars there.

[phantomdragoness]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Frankly that irritated me. Stupid Chantry people. (And let's not get into that b**** who called you a heathen for not wanting her blessing. Ugh).

Oh no we are going to talk about that. I hated that ****. I hate the Chantry plain and simple because they feel the need to call everyone else a heathen because they don't want to be a part of their hive mind religion. Qunari? Heathens. Elves? Heathens. Dwarves? Heathens. Cats? Big time heathens.

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait...she calls you a heathen? Oh, I've GOT to see this!

[Sable Rhapsody]

Sjofn wrote...
 It's entirely possible he felt he didn't have any good options, too. His options were stay, or go start a war he wasn't sure he wanted to wage, as he sees it. Completely and utterly turn his back on the Chantry he was given to and found a place in or turn his back on his duty to his people. I don't blame him at all for thinking he had no choices there.

Crap.  I should clarify.  I was talking about Sebastian's array of options presented in his background story.  You know, where he's given to the Chantry against his will, and Elthina gives him an out?  At that point, he didn't give two bits about Starkhaven.  He could've done a lot more with that gold than Anders could have locked up in the tower.

[Ryzaki]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
Oh no we are going to talk about that. I hated that ****. I hate the Chantry plain and simple because they feel the need to call everyone else a heathen because they don't want to be a part of their hive mind religion. Qunari? Heathens. Elves? Heathens. Dwarves? Heathens. Cats? Big time heathens.

 

I don't think she was stupid enough to call my dwarf PC a heathen (the one I played). Dwarves will cut a b****. She knew better. 

[Sjofn]

Apollo Starflare wrote...

Talking of Anders' time in the Ferelden Circle, ever since going through Origins again post DA2 I have wished there was an opportunity to bump into Wynne with him. Those two would have a lot to talk about heh. It's funny that we've never seen them together considering that they would have probably known each other outside of the events of the games.

Also on the subject of Anders' early life, it's a little strange that of all the Mages in Thedas the one to finally begin tearing everything down would be someone who was raised in a relatively laid back Circle. Judging by Gregoir and what we hear and see of the Circle outside of Uldred's mess it doesn't seem to be a particularly harsh example of that life. Certainly not compared to say Kirkwall.

But then I'm sure Anders' repeated escape attempts meant he had a less than friendly relationship with the Templars there.

Well, even a really nice prison is still a prison. And Anders definitely considered the place a prison.

[TEWR]

yup. Ostagar priestess. She says "Do you want the Maker's blessing?".

You say, "No I believe in a different religion" (might be a tad nicer than the actual option.)

She calls you a heathen. Makes you feel loved

[Ryzaki]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

yup. Ostagar priestess. She says "Do you want the Maker's blessing?".

You say, "No I believe in a different religion" (might be a tad nicer than the actual option.)

She calls you a heathen. Makes you feel loved

It's worse. She goes "begon heathen." like you're the scum underneath her shoe. 

I wanted to smack the s*** out of her. 

[TEWR]

Sjofn wrote...

Apollo Starflare wrote...

Talking of Anders' time in the Ferelden Circle, ever since going through Origins again post DA2 I have wished there was an opportunity to bump into Wynne with him. Those two would have a lot to talk about heh. It's funny that we've never seen them together considering that they would have probably known each other outside of the events of the games.

Also on the subject of Anders' early life, it's a little strange that of all the Mages in Thedas the one to finally begin tearing everything down would be someone who was raised in a relatively laid back Circle. Judging by Gregoir and what we hear and see of the Circle outside of Uldred's mess it doesn't seem to be a particularly harsh example of that life. Certainly not compared to say Kirkwall.

But then I'm sure Anders' repeated escape attempts meant he had a less than friendly relationship with the Templars there.

Well, even a really nice prison is still a prison. And Anders definitely considered the place a prison.

As Zev said: It's a cage, if a gilded cage. Pretty, but confining.

[Ashwraith]

So everyone's kissing everyone in here now?

But... but cooties. :c

[Sable Rhapsody]

Ryzaki wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
Oh no we are going to talk about that. I hated that ****. I hate the Chantry plain and simple because they feel the need to call everyone else a heathen because they don't want to be a part of their hive mind religion. Qunari? Heathens. Elves? Heathens. Dwarves? Heathens. Cats? Big time heathens.

 

I don't think she was stupid enough to call my dwarf PC a heathen (the one I played). Dwarves will cut a b****. She knew better. 

My mage got called a heathen.  Then turned, grinned at a very confuzzled Alistair, and skipped on her merry way.

I miss playing Soria Amell.  She was so fun and lighthearted and spunky.

[TEWR]

Sjofn wrote...

Apollo Starflare wrote...

Talking of Anders' time in the Ferelden Circle, ever since going through Origins again post DA2 I have wished there was an opportunity to bump into Wynne with him. Those two would have a lot to talk about heh. It's funny that we've never seen them together considering that they would have probably known each other outside of the events of the games.

Also on the subject of Anders' early life, it's a little strange that of all the Mages in Thedas the one to finally begin tearing everything down would be someone who was raised in a relatively laid back Circle. Judging by Gregoir and what we hear and see of the Circle outside of Uldred's mess it doesn't seem to be a particularly harsh example of that life. Certainly not compared to say Kirkwall.

But then I'm sure Anders' repeated escape attempts meant he had a less than friendly relationship with the Templars there.

Well, even a really nice prison is still a prison. And Anders definitely considered the place a prison.

As Zev said: It's a cage, if a gilded cage. Pretty, but confining.

[Sjofn]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Sjofn wrote...
 It's entirely possible he felt he didn't have any good options, too. His options were stay, or go start a war he wasn't sure he wanted to wage, as he sees it. Completely and utterly turn his back on the Chantry he was given to and found a place in or turn his back on his duty to his people. I don't blame him at all for thinking he had no choices there.

Crap.  I should clarify.  I was talking about Sebastian's array of options presented in his background story.  You know, where he's given to the Chantry against his will, and Elthina gives him an out?  At that point, he didn't give two bits about Starkhaven.  He could've done a lot more with that gold than Anders could have locked up in the tower.

I am not sure what that has to do with anything? He's never saying he is less free or as restricted as mages. He's more warning Anders that even if the Circles all fall tomorrow, Anders still won't be free. Because the freedom Anders wants does not exist.

[MelRedux]

Ryzaki wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

yup. Ostagar priestess. She says "Do you want the Maker's blessing?".

You say, "No I believe in a different religion" (might be a tad nicer than the actual option.)

She calls you a heathen. Makes you feel loved

It's worse. She goes "begon heathen." like you're the scum underneath her shoe. 

I wanted to smack the s*** out of her. 

Do you ever, you know, wanna hug someone?

[TEWR]

Ryzaki wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

yup. Ostagar priestess. She says "Do you want the Maker's blessing?".

You say, "No I believe in a different religion" (might be a tad nicer than the actual option.)

She calls you a heathen. Makes you feel loved

It's worse. She goes "begon heathen." like you're the scum underneath her shoe. 

I wanted to smack the s*** out of her. 

This is why the Chantry shouldn't be allowed to exist. Believing in The Maker is one thing, forcing it upon everyone who just wants to believe in their own way is abhorrent. Leliana at least respected and admired my Dalish Elf Warden's religion. She didn't try to convert him. If everyone was like Leliana, the world would be a much happier place. And everyone would love shoes.

[Dunizel]

yukidama wrote...

RinjiRenee wrote...

yukidama wrote...

RinjiRenee wrote...

Yeah, Anders is a super catty biatch. Fierce.

Hhfhgrhg when I read this post a cat meowed outside my window. DENSITY.

I think you should have this.

I.... I'm not sure that I want that, but thanks.

I know I'm late, I'm catching up with the thread (it's like a drug, I always have to read everything I missed)

This flash is looping in my head. Can't stop.
Meow.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Sjofn wrote...
I am not sure what that has to do with anything? He's never saying he is less free or as restricted as mages. He's more warning Anders that even if the Circles all fall tomorrow, Anders still won't be free. Because the freedom Anders wants does not exist.

Yes, it does.  Anders himself says earlier in that banter that he only ever wanted "the freedom that every man, woman, and child in Thedas is born with" or somesuch.  Sure, there are always restrictions.  No one can do whatever the hell they want.  Anders doesn't want anarchy.  He just wants mages to be able to have families, fall in love, travel...all things that your average Thedas citizen can do without a templar breathing down their spine.

[Dreaming-in-Shadow]

Sjofn wrote...

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Sjofn wrote...
All Sebastian is really saying is that no one is completely, utterly free to do whatever they want. And we aren't.

That's true, but some people in Thedas are a lot less free than others.  Sebastian comparing his situation to Anders or Hawke is IMO oversimplification.  Seb had a whole array options when that sack of gold hit his hand.  Anders' options upon entering the Circle were much more narrow; accept or resist, much like the qunari.

His point is simply "no one is as free as you think, Anders, it's a lot greyer than you realise." It's entirely possible he felt he didn't have any good options, too. His options were stay, or go start a war he wasn't sure he wanted to wage, as he sees it. Completely and utterly turn his back on the Chantry he was given to and found a place in or turn his back on his duty to his people. I don't blame him at all for thinking he had no choices there.

That's true.
But at the end of the day, Chantry initiates aren't basically eternally confined to a tower (or something of the like) with extremely limited freedom beyond the tower, while being placed under the watch of an army of well equiped (potentially unstable) people, who have been trained to hunt and kill their kind, and I'd guess over 50% of Templars hate mages, giving a lovely atmosphere.

Not to mention Templars can pretty much get away with anything, it would appear.

They're ripped from any chance of a normal life at a very young age (and as Jowan pointed out, with anti-mage feelings being so widespread, a young child could find their own family turning against them. Wynne's story supports this, and the fact that the Amell family lost so much standing after their child was taken...).

Then they're raised to understand that the world hates them, and that in the eyes of many people, they're basically monsters simply for being born.

They're not normal. They're not right.
They can't have lives like everybody else. In fact the Chant informs them that they're basically servants. (It seems people have taken it this way, anyhow.)

"Magic exists to serve man, never to rule over him."

That's what I like about the Fereldan Circle. It was so much calmer in comparison to a place like Kirkwall.
Thank the Maker for Greagoir and Irving! 

Here's an idea! Make Hawke First Enchanter and Carver Knight-Commander and build some kind of magic Academy (where they will be allowed to experience the real world, maybe?) in Fereldan where the Chantry, mages and normal people are taught to co-exist alongside each other! :happy:
(Yeah, too idealistic, but still a nice idea.)

Of course I pity the Templars too. Going crazy from Lyrium poisoning does not sound fun...

Modifié par Dreaming-in-Shadow, 07 avril 2011 - 11:45 .

[Sjofn]

Religious organizations like the Chantry are how humans roll, yo.

[YamiSnuffles]

Ashwraith wrote...

So everyone's kissing everyone in here now?

But... but cooties. :c

Magic protects us from the cooties. Or, if that fails, Anders can cure us of them later.

[Amondra]

Mel_Redux wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

yup. Ostagar priestess. She says "Do you want the Maker's blessing?".

You say, "No I believe in a different religion" (might be a tad nicer than the actual option.)

She calls you a heathen. Makes you feel loved

It's worse. She goes "begon heathen." like you're the scum underneath her shoe. 

I wanted to smack the s*** out of her. 

Do you ever, you know, wanna hug someone?

I wanna hug Anders, Alistar, Wynne(because she remind me of my grandmother) Merrill...

[Amondra]

Mel_Redux wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

yup. Ostagar priestess. She says "Do you want the Maker's blessing?".

You say, "No I believe in a different religion" (might be a tad nicer than the actual option.)

She calls you a heathen. Makes you feel loved

It's worse. She goes "begon heathen." like you're the scum underneath her shoe. 

I wanted to smack the s*** out of her. 

Do you ever, you know, wanna hug someone?

I wanna hug Anders, Alistar, Wynne(because she remind me of my grandmother) Merrill...

[AnniLau]

Ashwraith wrote...

So everyone's kissing everyone in here now?

But... but cooties. :c

*licks you*