1560 réponses à ce sujet

[Kayden SiNafey]

MaxPayne37 wrote...

There is a performance hit of course, but because we are using DX10 effects, not DX11 effects that can't be used, just like how even a DX11 card would experience performance hits going from Medium to High to Very High.

I hate to sound rude or offensive but do you not understand that there is a physical and a software difference for video card certification for different direct x versions? I have yet to see your proof that Tessellation or other DX11 specific features are automatically disabled when High textures are enabled, because at this point it's a just one sides assumption (yours) and the others facts (mine). I have backed it up with 3rd party progs that the game still uses the DX11 textures engine at High and proven DX10 can use some DX11 features but you will have a significant performance drop, which if you read the many pages it will reflect (from many but not all) the info I have provided thus backing my facts up. I am probably coming off as rude but your telling me to take your word for something when we need hard facts to find what the problems are so they can be fixed by Bioware or the end user. Unfortunately at this point the evidence suggests it is just too many ppl not knowing the limitation of their hardware and expecting more when they shouldn't, such as yourself. I wish you happy gaming with Dragon Age 2 and hope you don't have any issues.

Niraj K wrote...

I'm on a pair of GTX260s with a GTS250
that I dedicated to SLI.  My rig consists of an eVGA 780i with a
Core2Quad 6600 OC'd to 3.2 GHz with 4 GB of RAM and an Intel
X-25M (G2) 80 GB SSD that the OS is installed on and that this game is
installed on as well.

I've already forced DirectX 9 to make the
game more stable b/c of force close issues that I encounter when I try
to use the "DirectX11 (If available)" settings, including high
resolution, etc., but I've noticed something odd.

If I enable SLI
for the 260s, I constantly get massive slowdown issues (framrates as
low as 0.5 FPS - seriously). If I don't enable SLI, it works perfectly
fine, although the single card powering the game gets a lot hotter
(~70degF with fan going 100%).

I have updated to the latest
266.58 nVidia drivers, including hte latest PhysX software and
Stereoscopic 3D software that came with hte install package.

Try the 267.59 at www.laptopvideo2go.com with the modified inf file. Many ppl have seen a great improvement with SLI. I would stick with DX9 as well since those cards don't support DX11 completely.  Hope this helps.

Modifié par Kayden SiNafey, 19 mars 2011 - 04:04 .

[MaxPayne37]

Kayden SiNafey wrote...

MaxPayne37 wrote...

There is a performance hit of course, but because we are using DX10 effects, not DX11 effects that can't be used, just like how even a DX11 card would experience performance hits going from Medium to High to Very High.

I hate to sound rude or offensive but do you not understand that there is a physical and a software difference for video card certification for different direct x versions? I have yet to see your proof that Tessellation or other DX11 specific features are automatically disabled when High textures are enabled, because at this point it's a just one sides assumption (yours) and the others facts (mine). I have backed it up with 3rd party progs that the game still uses the DX11 textures engine at High and proven DX10 can use some DX11 features but you will have a significant performance drop, which if you read the many pages it will reflect (from many but not all) the info I have provided thus backing my facts up. I am probably coming off as rude but your telling me to take your word for something when we need hard facts to find what the problems are so they can be fixed by Bioware or the end user. Unfortunately at this point the evidence suggests it is just too many ppl not knowing the limitation of their hardware and expecting more when they shouldn't, such as yourself. I wish you happy gaming with Dragon Age 2 and hope you don't have any issues.

Niraj K wrote...

I'm on a pair of GTX260s with a GTS250
that I dedicated to SLI.  My rig consists of an eVGA 780i with a
Core2Quad 6600 OC'd to 3.2 GHz with 4 GB of RAM and an Intel
X-25M (G2) 80 GB SSD that the OS is installed on and that this game is
installed on as well.

I've already forced DirectX 9 to make the
game more stable b/c of force close issues that I encounter when I try
to use the "DirectX11 (If available)" settings, including high
resolution, etc., but I've noticed something odd.

If I enable SLI
for the 260s, I constantly get massive slowdown issues (framrates as
low as 0.5 FPS - seriously). If I don't enable SLI, it works perfectly
fine, although the single card powering the game gets a lot hotter
(~70degF with fan going 100%).

I have updated to the latest
266.58 nVidia drivers, including hte latest PhysX software and
Stereoscopic 3D software that came with hte install package.

Try the 267.59 at www.laptopvideo2go.com with the modified inf file. Many ppl have seen a great improvement with SLI. I would stick with DX9 as well since those cards don't support DX11 completely.  Hope this helps.

There is a physical difference, not a software difference between DX versions. DX11 just happens to be backwards compatible with DX10 providing DX10 effects, but not DX11 ones. No emulation happens, try and get a DX10 card to run tessellation in a game, or a benchmark such as Unigine. Good luck. I don't mean to sound "rude" but look up your facts man. Get a DX10 card and try and run DX11 effects, you can't, lower performance or not. Ask anyone playing Dragon Age 2 right now with a DX10 only card and STOP MAKING ASSUMPTIONS.

Look at the High selectable graphics settings. Anyone with a DX10 card will know that Very High is not selectable. You're only given what you can use, not what you can't at a "performance hit", cause it's just not there on the hardware.

http://www.techspot....test/page3.html

Modifié par MaxPayne37, 19 mars 2011 - 04:20 .

[Kayden SiNafey]

MaxPayne37 wrote...

There is a physical difference, not a software difference between DX versions. DX11 just happens to be backwards compatible with DX10 providing DX10 effects, but not DX11 ones. No emulation happens, try and get a DX10 card to run tessellation in a game, or a benchmark such as Unigine. Good luck. I don't mean to sound "rude" but look up your facts man. Get a DX10 card and try and run DX11 effects, you can't, lower performance or not. Ask anyone playing Dragon Age 2 right now with a DX10 only card and STOP MAKING ASSUMPTIONS.

Look at the High selectable graphics settings. Anyone with a DX10 card will know that Very High is not selectable. You're only given what you can use, not what you can't at a "performance hit", cause it's just not there on the hardware.

http://www.techspot....test/page3.html

This is my last comment because your not listening or understanding the fundamentals of what is being discussed here. There is a software difference, the code used in games to support those features are software they have to be put in by the game developers thus the requirements for DX10 to DX11 are different from a hardware and software point of view. I did not say anyone with a DX10 card should have to put up with crappy performance at all I am saying is that ppl are using a mode that is not supported by their card for a 100% and thus should go to DX9 and if they are unhappy with that well it is the nature of the beast with PC's either lower your expectations or upgrade. There are MANY ppl here with problems that do not correspond to hardware compatibility issue and those should be taken more seriously like low fps in SLI mode, low fps with a top end card (for me that's a 470,480, 570 & 580 don't know ATI that well so stick with what I know) with any texture mode and etc, I could keep going but there is no point.

Also by your own article you post it says

We also tested using the Very High, High and Medium quality presets. The “Very High” preset allows for ambient occlusion, depth of field and blur effects. The “High” preset disables depth of field and blur, while “Medium” removes all the customizable DX11 features.

When the word customizable is used it tells me it's the feature YOU can control, but other DX11 specific features may still be in use that a DX10 card can not perform well with and that's what I have been saying all along. Please understand I see your trying to help and you do have good grasp of technology I will give you that but your are either confusing facts or allowing your judgment to be clouded because you want to be right. There is no assumption worse then to think you are right when you have no facts to back it up.

Again I hate sounding rude especially to people who are trying to help but this is just one time where you are wrong, if I was wrong and you could point out to me where I am I would admit it but this has gone on long enough in this thread so I am going to help those who need help with the game and not understanding how direct x works, there is another forum that at Microsoft I'm sure. Hope this helps. Stay frosty.

[Rafgat02]

Any news? I´ve been out for almost a week but I don´t see any patch nor new driver for me. And I am sad. I was hoping make my neighbours get up this morning with the game, slaying sounds are great for that,but they are still sleeping as babies.

I think i will get hard with them. I will just play some Justin Bieber song to awake them, and it will not be my fault at all.

After the joke,how is it going, any advance?


---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.

Windows Vista x64
Intel core duo 2 x 3.0 Ghz
Nvidia GTX570

Trying my best english, but i´m from spain, If I wrtie something strange...try to trasnlate.Thanks!

[MaaZeus]

Rafgat02 wrote...

Any news? I´ve been out for almost a week but I don´t see any patch nor new driver for me. And I am sad. I was hoping make my neighbours get up this morning with the game, slaying sounds are great for that,but they are still sleeping as babies.

I think i will get hard with them. I will just play some Justin Bieber song to awake them, and it will not be my fault at all.

After the joke,how is it going, any advance?


---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.---.

Windows Vista x64
Intel core duo 2 x 3.0 Ghz
Nvidia GTX570

Trying my best english, but i´m from spain, If I wrtie something strange...try to trasnlate.Thanks!

Here is a temporary fix.
http://social.biowar...71278/1#6572000

Combined with latest DA2 patch I can finally play with my overclocked GTX460 with Very High setting. SSAO is disabled (perfomance hog) as are DOF and HQ motion blur. Only in outdoors enviroments like Dalish camp FPS drops to 40fps region but rest is about stable 60fps.

In that guide I have to say that you dont have to uninstall your old drivers, installing new drivers already has a clean install checkbox which does the same process. Plus the whole operation is a relic from old Windows versions that was done if you suspected that old drivers were causing problems when installing new ones on top of them. Never encountered such myself, ever.

Modifié par MaaZeus, 19 mars 2011 - 11:16 .

[Baramon]

MaaZeus wrote...

In that guide I have to say that you dont have to uninstall your old drivers, installing new drivers already has a clean install checkbox which does the same process. Plus the whole operation is a relic from old Windows versions that was done if you suspected that old drivers were causing problems when installing new ones on top of them. Never encountered such myself, ever.

I have to agree there. Never have I had any trouble installing new/updated drivers, but I would think the new 'clean install' feature would take care of any (antiquated) driver installation problems.

Of course, I'm sure there are some who (will) could start arguing the case that -- especiall with Beta drivers -- it's better to be safe than sorry and make sure they're gone, but I just don't believe it.

[Baramon]

Niraj K wrote...
If I don't enable SLI, it works perfectly
fine, although the single card powering the game gets a lot hotter
(~70degF with fan going 100%).

Man, I wish my video card would run at ~70degF...mine's usually somewhere around 140! 70F is below my room temperature...you must have one frighteningly frosty cooling system in that bad boy.

[neil86]

Wtf? Everytime I step into a new area or the game has graphic intensive scenes, it crashes!! I installed the new 11.4 amd driver but it is still the same.

Intel Core2 3.0ghz
4gb ddr2-1066
Asus ROG Maximus formula
Asus Ati 3870x2
Windows 7 64 bit

I cannot believe Bioware would release this game in such a state...

[Miriel Amarinth]

For Nvidia users who are still experiencing bad performance with the High or Very High settings and missed the earlier pages in this thread:

I just want to point out once again the version 267.59 drivers released a few days ago

Most people who have tried these with various 4xx, 5xx and even older series cards have seen massive improvements running DX10 and DX11.

You can find more info about these drivers and how to install them on your card and OS here: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/300/index/6571278

Also I am keeping an eye on the Nvidia website and Guru3D forums for news on when we may see these drivers officially released for all cards. Until then using the 267.59 drivers with the workaround seems to be the best workaround for the nvidia card performance troubles.

Modifié par Miriel Amarinth, 19 mars 2011 - 01:57 .

[BTCentral]

Kayden SiNafey wrote...

There is a software difference, the code used in games to support those features are software they have to be put in by the game developers thus the requirements for DX10 to DX11 are different from a hardware and software point of view. I did not say anyone with a DX10 card should have to put up with crappy performance at all I am saying is that ppl are using a mode that is not supported by their card for a 100% and thus should go to DX9 and if they are unhappy with that well it is the nature of the beast with PC's either lower your expectations or upgrade. There are MANY ppl here with problems that do not correspond to hardware compatibility issue and those should be taken more seriously like low fps in SLI mode, low fps with a top end card (for me that's a 470,480, 570 & 580 don't know ATI that well so stick with what I know) with any texture mode and etc, I could keep going but there is no point.

Just going to cut in here, because honestly I think you are confusing the issue.

The DX11 API that BioWare will be using  is backwards compatible with DX9/10 too, this means that as they use the DX11 API the features of the DX9/10 API are included too.

Anything upto and including "Medium" only uses DX9 features, hence being able to run on the DX9 renderer.

Now, when we get to High/Very High, the difference is that features used are simply being toggled depending on/off what version of DX the card/software (High/Very High) tells it to use.

The "High" setting ingame will use both DX10 and DX9 features, so theoretically if you had a DX10 and DX11 card with the same number of cores, clock speeds, etc. it should work just as well on one as it does on the other assuming all drivers are equal. This is an unlikely real life senario, but I thought I should point it out.

The "Very High" setting makes use of DX11/10/9 features hence needing a DX11 card.

Point being: If DX10 users are using the "High" setting, actually it is 100% supported by their card - because that setting only makes use of DX10 features.

Kayden SiNafey wrote...

When the word customizable is used it tells me it's the feature YOU can control, but other DX11 specific features may still be in use that a DX10 card can not perform well with and that's what I have been saying all along.

No. The High setting that DX10 cards can use will only make use of DX9/10 API features.

Very High is the only setting that will make use of DX9/10/11 API features.

Summary: There is no reason why someone with a DX10 card should not be making use of the "High" setting if it gives them playable framerates.

Modifié par BTCentral, 19 mars 2011 - 02:35 .

[foil-]

BTCentral wrote...

Just going to cut in here, because honestly I think you are confusing the issue.

The root problem here is unfortunately BioWare confused the issue and took a confusing issue (for most people) and turned it into an even more confusing issue by not including DX10 in their dropdown list.  This is a bit suprising since BioWare normally has their thumb firmly on the pulse of how to prevent confusion with mechanics.

They should patch in a DX10 menu item, even if it does still use the DX11 API but only calls the DX10 components.  People with DX10 cards will be so much less confused.  I bet you this will result in many DX10 card owners to run in DX9 because they think DX10 is not available at all in this game.

As for performance and compatibility, what's that line?: I'm not getting involved in this since it is obviously an internal family matter.

As for who is correct, I would probably say nVidia or AMD.  The interested parties involved in the debate might want to go ask on their forums and get an engineers opinion on the matter.  Anythings possible.  Even new drivers are not often compatible with old games even though they are supposed to be.  I could see some bonehead design decisions where using DX11 implementation of DX10 features on a DX10 card is problematic.  There's no gaurantee that microsoft didn't "optimise" certain DX10 features to run better on new video card architechture when they implemented them with the DX11 api.  However, I can't say who's correct, its just within the realm of possibility that either of them are.

Modifié par foil-, 19 mars 2011 - 03:00 .

[Kayden SiNafey]

BTCentral wrote...

Just going to cut in here, because honestly I think you are confusing the issue.

The
DX11 API that BioWare will be using  is backwards compatible with
DX9/10 too, this means that as they use the DX11 API the features of the
DX9/10 API are included too.

Anything upto and including "Medium" only uses DX9 features, hence being able to run on the DX9 renderer.

Now,
when we get to High/Very High, the difference is that features used are
simply being toggled depending on/off what version of DX the
card/software (High/Very High) tells it to use.

The "High"
setting ingame will use both DX10 and DX9 features, so theoretically if
you had a DX10 and DX11 card with the same number of cores, clock
speeds, etc. it should work just as well on one as it does on the other
assuming all drivers are equal. This is an unlikely real life senario,
but I thought I should point it out.

The "Very High" setting makes use of DX11/10/9 features hence needing a DX11 card.

Point being: If DX10 users are using the "High" setting, actually it is 100% supported by their card - because that setting only makes use of DX10 features.

Summary: There is no reason why someone with a DX10 card should not be making use of the "High" setting if it gives them playable framerates.

At this time there is no verifiable proof that High is ONLY using DX10 it is only theory and you just said. It is a theory and don't get me wrong it isn't a wild guess but there is no proof at this time to support that POV other then you can use High with a DX10 card. With what I have found DX11 (with 3rd party prog) is still being used with High like the game suggests and this means Tessellation, Multicore Threading and who knows what else is still running, also there is no way to turn these off in any verifiable way so this will effect DX10 cards because they are not DX11 certified. There obviously a performance hit, now how bad is it? Obviously from what ppl have said a very significant one. This is an assumption that all of the rest of DX11 features are disabled and it's a bad way to troubleshoot, because no one else used 3rd party to app verify if it was DX10 or DX11, or if they could be turned off, I did it and now that the data suggests different you guys want miracles with DX10 to run DX11 features and that just isn't going to happen. I'm not saying you can't be right but the data isn't supporting it with what I have found and until Bioware gives access to the dev consoles or another program comes out that scans the 3d world to say what Direct X API is being used in frame there is no way to prove your theory. I've been troubleshooting PC's for literally 15+ years and when I was in the Air Force I troubleshot and maintained the B1-B Jet Engines and secondary power systems. Now there is no way you can or could change anything in them with out proof too back up your claims, when your talking 4g for a fuel flow meter and at almost 9mil an engine supervisors want data to back up that kind of cost spending. The same goes for a PC owners if your talking more than $15 most ppl freak out and want to have a reason with data why you need to change something. Now understand this is the troubleshooter in me and for me to accept or at least seriously take your claims into consideration you need data, not your observations because when your only looking at the game as it is meant to be played with that view nothing else tells you what is going on in the background. Thus there is nothing to suggest in game from a screenshot perspective that High is DX10 with NO DX11 features running in the background and Very High is DX11 only, nothing. At the end of day you need data to properly troubleshoot and right now that data suggests DX11 is still in play and anyone with a DX10 card using DX11 is going to have a performance hit. Give me somthing to prove me wrong and I will recant my position and admit I am wrong because in troubleshooting you can't always be right and you have to learn from your mistakes but right now it's the same argument with nothing to back it up further.

EDIT: I'm not saying there is a compatability issue here far far from it. I am advocating it is a performance one because we can't see what is and is not being used in the background in engine. Thus something not certified for DX11 is not going to run the game the right way, you wouldn't put a water pump in to replace a fuel pump because it isn't certified for it especially if you want your car to run right. There are reasons certifications exsist and DX10 is not 100% compatable with DX11 which will cause a FPS drop and this is my point.





ANOTHER EDIT: Under the System Specs it says (don't know why I didn't think of this earlier)

ATI 3850 512 MB or greater (To run Direct X 11 - ATI 5850 or greater),  NVIDIA 8800GTS 512 MB or greater (To run Direct X 11 - NVidia 460 or greater)

It specifically says DX11 a 460/5850 or greater is required so the idea that DX10 is running High is looking more implausible and more then likely a problem with the engine allowing DX10 cards run DX11 features when it shouldn't and thus causing the performance issues for many people.

Modifié par Kayden SiNafey, 19 mars 2011 - 05:04 .

[Kayden SiNafey]

Miriel Amarinth wrote...

For Nvidia users who are still experiencing bad performance with the High or Very High settings and missed the earlier pages in this thread:

I just want to point out once again the version 267.59 drivers released a few days ago

Most people who have tried these with various 4xx, 5xx and even older series cards have seen massive improvements running DX10 and DX11.

You can find more info about these drivers and how to install them on your card and OS here: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/300/index/6571278

Also I am keeping an eye on the Nvidia website and Guru3D forums for news on when we may see these drivers officially released for all cards. Until then using the 267.59 drivers with the workaround seems to be the best workaround for the nvidia card performance troubles.

Just to add to that it has also helped ppl with SLI users as well, so if your getting low FPS with SLI enabled try this.

I am keeping an eye for new drivers as well.

If you go to www.laptopvideo2go.com it will also have those files if you are having troubles with any of the other sites in that link.

[moop1167]

The temporary fix is very nice to see, as I am getting 40-50 fps with SLI'd GTX 580's but performance isn't really where it should be. I hope the next WHQL drivers will fix this, or at least a new patch from Bioware will address the issues further.

[Kayden SiNafey]

moop1167 wrote...

The temporary fix is very nice to see, as I am getting 40-50 fps with SLI'd GTX 580's but performance isn't really where it should be. I hope the next WHQL drivers will fix this, or at least a new patch from Bioware will address the issues further.

I get about 50 to 60+ fps with mine @1920x1080, to try and narrow this down what cpu, resolution and ram (amount & speed) do you have?

Modifié par Kayden SiNafey, 19 mars 2011 - 05:07 .

[J-PV]

Miriel Amarinth wrote...

For Nvidia users who are still experiencing bad performance with the High or Very High settings and missed the earlier pages in this thread:

I just want to point out once again the version 267.59 drivers released a few days ago

Most people who have tried these with various 4xx, 5xx and even older series cards have seen massive improvements running DX10 and DX11.

You can find more info about these drivers and how to install them on your card and OS here: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/300/index/6571278

I'm not going to install a hacked driver.

Waiting for whql nvidia driver (and new da2 patch). Playing in dx9 in the meantime.

Dx9 = excellent  perormance, ok graphics quality.

[BTCentral]

Kayden SiNafey wrote...

At this time there is no verifiable proof that High is ONLY using DX10 it is only theory and you just said. It is a theory and don't get me wrong it isn't a wild guess but there is no proof at this time to support that POV other then you can use High with a DX10 card. With what I have found DX11 (with 3rd party prog) is still being used with High like the game suggests and this means Tessellation, Multicore Threading and who knows what else is still running

Does DA2's High Mode use the DX11 Renderer? Yes - Proof:


Does this mean that the "High" mode uses DX11 features when running a DX10 card?
No. There is simply no way for this to be possible - it means that the DX11 renderer is falling back to DX10 mode.

If a DX10 card was issued a DX11 command via the API, it simply could not process it - a card can not do more than it was designed to - if you have a DX10 card it can not run DX11 commands, it will only accept DX9/10 commands - this is a hardware limitation and nothing to do with software programming.

You can argue all you like but it is simply not possible for a DX10 card to process DX11 commands - It's not a wild guess, it's not something that can not be verified - it's simply the cold hard facts.

If you want to continue arguing, then be my guest - but the fact is you are wrong, and I will not be posting about this subject again (though I will still be offering advice to help out anyone else here that needs it).

moop1167 wrote...

The temporary fix is very nice to see, as I am getting 40-50 fps with SLI'd GTX 580's but performance isn't really where it should be. I hope the next WHQL drivers will fix this, or at least a new patch from Bioware will address the issues further.

You get that performance from SLI'd 580s? That seems low to me unless you are using every option enabled and are running at a very hight resolution with maximum AA or something?

I can run DX11 Very High, High Quality Blur, 4x AA and 16x AF at a 1920x1080 resolution and still get 40-60 FPS on a single overclocked GTX 460.

Modifié par BTCentral, 19 mars 2011 - 05:25 .

[Brocklar]

Well, I explain my case to have if anyone can help me.
I let the game auto-detect the quality of graphics, the game is fine for me for about 2-3 minutes, but immediately afterwards I slowed, then returns to normal, and the cycle repeats. I autoconfigure the graphics on high quality.
I have installed the latest graphics drivers (9800GTX) and the fact is that all the other games I go wrong. I have directx 11 installed in the windows7 Home Premium. The game does not happen that, when I run under directx 9 and the graphics are automatically lowered me in the middle. But if my graphics will not support the graphics up, directly, could not run, however, it's going very well the game up (removing the slowdown). Anyone have a solution?. It happens to someone else?

Modifié par Brocklar, 19 mars 2011 - 05:41 .

[Kayden SiNafey]

BTCentral wrote...

Kayden SiNafey wrote...

At this time there is no verifiable proof that High is ONLY using DX10 it is only theory and you just said. It is a theory and don't get me wrong it isn't a wild guess but there is no proof at this time to support that POV other then you can use High with a DX10 card. With what I have found DX11 (with 3rd party prog) is still being used with High like the game suggests and this means Tessellation, Multicore Threading and who knows what else is still running

Does DA2's High Mode use the DX11 Renderer? Yes - Proof:


Does this mean that the "High" mode uses DX11 features when running a DX10 card?
No. There is simply no way for this to be possible - it means that the DX11 renderer is falling back to DX10 mode.

If a DX10 card was issued a DX11 command via the API, it simply could not process it - a card can not do more than it was designed to - if you have a DX10 card it can not run DX11 commands, it will only accept DX9/10 commands - this is a hardware limitation and nothing to do with software programming.

You can argue all you like but it is simply not possible for a DX10 card to process DX11 commands - It's not a wild guess, it's not something that can not be verified - it's simply the cold hard facts.

If you want to continue arguing, then be my guest - but the fact is you are wrong, and I will not be posting about this subject again (though I will still be offering advice to help out anyone else here that needs it).

The cold hard fact is that you can't prove it is using DX10 only commands and that is the point it says DX11 in the requirements to use DX11 features and it says so in 3rd party apps showing what mode the game is running in. This has happened before with Splinter Cell Chaos Theory where you could enable a shader model the game should not have allowed older video cards and the performance was horrendous and it wasn't fixed until the 2nd one came out iirc. Specifically ppl were enabling shader model 3 when the card only supported 2.1. This is a problem with the game and it does need to be resolved on Bioware's end not Nvidia. I know what you are saying but you have no fact proving it is DX10 (official or with the info you provided) I'm sorry you proved it and you can't see the error in your theory because there are no facts to back it up. With you just saying your wrong and I'm not going to listen anything else you say and saying I am arguing is ludicrous. I am trying to provide a contradictory pov and you are not accepting the FACTS your accepting only your assumptions because it works this way (when it shouldn't based on the facts) and that isn't productive to troubleshooting.

moop1167 wrote...

The temporary fix is very nice to see, as I am getting 40-50 fps with SLI'd GTX 580's but performance isn't really where it should be. I hope the next WHQL drivers will fix this, or at least a new patch from Bioware will address the issues further.

BTCentral wrote...
You get that performance from SLI'd 580s? That seems low to me unless you are using every option enabled and are running at a very hight resolution with maximum AA or something?

I can run DX11 Very High, High Quality Blur, 4x AA and 16x AF at a 1920x1080 resolution and still get 40-60 FPS on a single overclocked GTX 460.

I am running the game with everything turned on with 4xaa and 16x AF at 1920x1080 my self with 580 sli and I'm getting 50 to 60+ FPS. I have been trying to nail this down as to why this is happening but we need more info like your CPU, RAM, and MB at this point it could be a chipset detection problem to. I agree it is unreasonable to use hacked drivers to get results but NVidia does have to pass WHQL cert from Microsoft so that will delay them and thus beta should be provided but I'm not sure they know for sure what is causing the issue. When running hacked drivers you do run the risk of them damaging your hardware and I don't like that thought either but others have done testing with it and with no i'll effects so I would take a gamble if you want to try everything the community has figured out so far.

Modifié par Kayden SiNafey, 19 mars 2011 - 05:55 .

[BTCentral]

Kayden SiNafey wrote...

This has happened before with Splinter Cell Chaos Theory where you could enable a shader model the game should not have allowed
[snipped]
I am trying to provide a contradictory pov and you are not accepting the FACTS your accepting only your assumptions because it works this way (when it shouldn't based on the facts) and that isn't productive to troubleshooting.

I said I'm not going to say anything else on the topic however, as it's nothing to do with that topic I can say that the Shader Model is a hardware limitation and DA2 is not Slinter Cell Chaos Theory. You might also want to read "The Technology of Dragon Age II - Part 2" on the BioWare blog.

Plus, the pot calling the kettle black much?

Kayden SiNafey wrote...

BTCentral wrote...
You get that performance from SLI'd 580s? That seems low to me unless you are using every option enabled and are running at a very hight resolution with maximum AA or something?

I can run DX11 Very High, High Quality Blur, 4x AA and 16x AF at a 1920x1080 resolution and still get 40-60 FPS on a single overclocked GTX 460.

I am running the game with everything turned on with 4xaa and 16x AF at 1920x1080 my self with 580 sli and I'm getting 50 to 60+ FPS. I have been trying to nail this down as to why this is happening but we need more info like your CPU, RAM, and MB at this point it could be a chipset detection problem to.

Modifié par BTCentral, 19 mars 2011 - 06:14 .

[MPerlo9]

Hey guys-

My first post here.  I just wanted to chime in as I've been following this thread for the past week or so.  I too have been having issues playing the game on Very High despite having capable hardware (i7-930, 6 GB RAM, EVGA gtx480 SC, etc).  I read about the nVidia drivers for the 550 but was reluctant to install them because, well, I didn't think they were safe to use with my card.

This morning I took the jump after reading numerous personal accounts of how much better DA2 runs with them installed.  Those accounts are absolutely true.  On the 267.24 beta drivers I was getting a very choppy 20-25 fps.  With the 267.59 drivers installed the game is absolutely playable on very high with everything maxed.  We aren't talking 60 fps but anywhere from a smooth 35-40 fps.

Hopefully BioWare and nVidia will sort this all out and get a proper fix to market soon, but in the meantime I think that the 267.59 drivers are the best solution for players experiencing poor performance.

-Mike

PS sorry if this post was redundant, just wanted to give those who are hesitant to upgrade some insight

[fastidiou5]

Hope ATI users can get working drivers soon, can't enjoy any of the cinematics at the point I'm at in the game without it turning into a slideshow.

[Kayden SiNafey]

BTCentral wrote...
I said I'm not going to say anything else on the topic however, as it's nothing to do with that topic I can say that the Shader Model is a hardware limitation and DA2 is not Slinter Cell Chaos Theory. You might also want to read "The Technology of Dragon Age II - Part 2" on the BioWare blog.
Plus, the pot calling the kettle black much?

All I did was point that there have been previous problems with games allowing something it shouldn't. Also I read that article (even when it came out) but it just proves my point more so then yours if you know a little more then what you read there, such as go to these places

http://www.tomshardw...870,2422-6.html

http://www.tomshardw...ctx,2019-7.html

http://en.wikipedia....t3D#Direct3D_11

How does it prove my point by showing the Tessellation is supported in DX11 with FULL support and the previous cards had it but was never used it and not fully flushed out (on a hardware or software level) to be supported because of Ati & Nvidia. This tells me it's like a beta of the tech compared to what DX11 uses, it like ver 0.5 and DX11 hardware & software have ver 1.0, the old one may work but it doesn't mean it has all the features as 1.0. The articles also go on to say DX11 supports DX10 & DX9 which means you can have either of those cards in your machine and it will run them but with only those features unless it is DX10 or DX10.1 for DirectCompute 10.1 (DX10.1 only), DirectCompute 10 (DX10.x only), Multi-Threading (DX10.x only) with these older cards only, of course DX11 has all that and more. There is no direct support for ANY DX10 for Tessellation and that is what I have been saying this whole time. Thus if Bioware put that into the game to run on DX10 hardware then DX10 owners are going to have a performance drop and they will have to go to DX9 so they don't have such a problem. If you keep advocating this theory of yours ppl are still going to believe that DX10 can run all of DX11 stuff when that is not the case. It also not the case the game uses DX10 only for rendering High it uses DX11, thus any features used by DX11 will slow down a DX10 card even though you can select it. This is a problem Bioware needs to fix, to turn off any remaining DX11 features for High and make it possible for DX10 to be selected in this mode if this was their intent. If they don't then that answers the question it is DX11 not DX10 don't expect it to work well if you do use it, but if it's not suppose to be there it should be taken out so DX10 card owners can only use DX9.

Also this is my final word on this because 1 your using insulting comments when there is no need for it, 2 you need to do more research into this stuff to know how it works not what Bioware tells you will work when it obviously does not. I had to provide this for you, if you believed you were so right you shouldn't bring me 1 article and say that's the only reason for it and say your gonna drop it. That is just immature, a horrible troubleshooting mentality and not how you do research in a scientific way to problem solve either, you deal with facts not just observations. I hate to be rude but in all of this you are not willing to admit there is a problem with your theory when you did not know all the facts. Have fun with DA2.

Modifié par Kayden SiNafey, 19 mars 2011 - 10:38 .

[Kayden SiNafey]

MPerlo9 wrote...
PS sorry if this post was redundant, just wanted to give those who are hesitant to upgrade some insight

Hey any feedback where poitive or negative with your results helps every one. I for one appreciate you taking the time to let us know, Thanks!

[moop1167]

BTCentral wrote...

Kayden SiNafey wrote...

This has happened before with Splinter Cell Chaos Theory where you could enable a shader model the game should not have allowed
[snipped]
I am trying to provide a contradictory pov and you are not accepting the FACTS your accepting only your assumptions because it works this way (when it shouldn't based on the facts) and that isn't productive to troubleshooting.

I said I'm not going to say anything else on the topic however, as it's nothing to do with that topic I can say that the Shader Model is a hardware limitation and DA2 is not Slinter Cell Chaos Theory. You might also want to read "The Technology of Dragon Age II - Part 2" on the BioWare blog.

Plus, the pot calling the kettle black much?

Kayden SiNafey wrote...

BTCentral wrote...
You get that performance from SLI'd 580s? That seems low to me unless you are using every option enabled and are running at a very hight resolution with maximum AA or something?

I can run DX11 Very High, High Quality Blur, 4x AA and 16x AF at a 1920x1080 resolution and still get 40-60 FPS on a single overclocked GTX 460.

I am running the game with everything turned on with 4xaa and 16x AF at 1920x1080 my self with 580 sli and I'm getting 50 to 60+ FPS. I have been trying to nail this down as to why this is happening but we need more info like your CPU, RAM, and MB at this point it could be a chipset detection problem to.

I am on 1920x1200 with all settings max, including 8xAA.  If I drop it down to 4xAA, yeah, I get 50+ at all times.