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Petition - Bioware please hear some of us (on PC)


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#1
DownyTif

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 Hi,

this is maybe a bold move or it will give nothing at all, but still I'm trying to provoke something here. If you agree with this post, please keep it alive by replying/agreeing to it.

I've been a huge fan of Dragon Age Origins and the tactical aspect of the game. I loved it. I played Nightmare (except Hard for the first) and the tactical aspect was plain fun. Many will argue that Dragon Age 2 is a step back from Origins, but unfortunately, this is Dragon Age 2 and we have to live with it, love it or not (if you bought it hehe).

So according to what I read on the forum, there are some features that are really missing, and bugs that's making some gamers (on PC) angry.


1- Feature: Please give us back the tactical view (zoomed out camera) or a detachable camera;
2- Feature: Please give us back the 2nd weapon slot;
3- Feature: Please have one queue for actions on all characters (or no broken action on hit);
4- Bug: Please fix the import problem (alond with the decision flags problem)

(Updated 10-03-2011)
5- The toolset!!!  <----- Probably the most important item of the list!
(Updated 11-03-2011)
6- Feature: The ability to tell party members, individualy, to hold position instead of a global setting;
7- Get rid of secuROM, as advertized prior to release; [REMOVED]
(Updated 28-03-2011)
8- Feature: Autolocking for targetting ON/OFF option (to help place AoE effects;

Explanations:
1- Explanation not needed;
2- A bummer to always go in the inventory and equip 2 melee weapons or weapong+shield;
3- If I order one character to take a potion or attack this enemy or move somewhere and it gets hit, the action is somewhat cancelled. In Origins, it was delayed, but was still active until it was done. That's REALLY annoying;
4- Explanation not needed;
5- Explanation not needed;
6- Explanation by TongueDar + Naitaka: let the melee guys be mobile and order the range guys to stay put. Better tactical experience.
7- Explanation not needed;
8- Explanaition by NetBeansAndJava: I would also like to add in the ability to remove autolocking for targeting. I want to play on nightmare, but the damn autolock is somewhat prohibitive when ff is on. However, I suspect this issue would be corrected if the camera were able to move around like DAO.


The list could be long and feel free to add comments, but keep in mind that no they can't change the graphic engine at this point, no they can't change the story at this point, no they can't change the combat system at this point, no they can't change the spawning system at this point and for all things mentionned before, no they can't make the game as strategic as Origins, etc. But from reading the posts all over the board, I feel that the above points are really frequent in the complains and are probably not really hard to implement.

Thank you Bioware for hearing us out.

PS: Moderators, Devs, please chime in and comment this thread if you feel it is constructive.

[EDIT]
As requested, I changed "Your PC fans" to "Some of us (on PC)". Sorry for that, I didn't expect those replies since the first thing I stated is to reply only if you agree. If you don't well, don't reply. I'm pretty sure that if they implement those changes and you are not part of this thread, it won't affect you in any way.

Modifié par DownyTif, 28 mars 2011 - 02:52 .


#2
Skilled Seeker

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Don't try to speak for all of us. You have legitimate points but I hate it when people do this. Its not 'Your PC fans', its DownyTif.

#3
Wolf_in_the_Meadow

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Skilled Seeker wrote...

Don't try to speak for all of us. You have legitimate points but I hate it when people do this. Its not 'Your PC fans', its DownyTif.


Agreed - I haven't played yet as I'm English, but it's perfectly possible I won't have a problem with any of this. 

Perhaps change the title to "some of your".?

#4
Lord_Saulot

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These are good reasonable suggestions. I would make the following comment:

In my opinion, the detachable camera is more important than the zoomed out camera. But one or another is a must. A fixed, limited camera is fine when the game is about controlling only one character, and I understand that the lower difficulties have that in mind on DA2 (I don't agree with that design choice, but I understand it). But, the game is still a party-based RPG, and the higher difficulties have party control in mind. With the addition of cross-class combos potentially improving the feeling of controlling your party as a cohesive unit, the ability to detach the camera and view the whole battlefield while considering your options is all the more important.

#5
Flunkorg

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Your points are legitimate (Well, I don't agree with the secondary weapon slot) But like skilled said, don't speak for the entire community.

#6
Edli

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Skilled Seeker wrote...

Don't try to speak for all of us. You have legitimate points but I hate it when people do this. Its not 'Your PC fans', its DownyTif.


I don't think any PC user is glad that iso view is removed and if you are then ...

Modifié par Edli, 09 mars 2011 - 02:59 .


#7
Lord_Saulot

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Wolf_in_the_Meadow wrote...

Skilled Seeker wrote...

Don't try to speak for all of us. You have legitimate points but I hate it when people do this. Its not 'Your PC fans', its DownyTif.


Agreed - I haven't played yet as I'm English, but it's perfectly possible I won't have a problem with any of this. 

Perhaps change the title to "some of your".?


Well, the third suggestion was a bug fix - that should speak for everyone, since there is no reason anyone should want import bugs to go unfixed.

#8
pkmn

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Pretty sure the majority of PC fans would appreciate those changes.

#9
Flunkorg

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Edli wrote...

Skilled Seeker wrote...

Don't try to speak for all of us. You have legitimate points but I hate it when people do this. Its not 'Your PC fans', its DownyTif.


I don't think any PC user is glad that iso view is removed and if you are then ...

I'm a pc user and it hasen't bothered me much. I'm perfectly capable with out it on nightmare.
But it would be nice to have it back.

#10
javierdmr1982

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dont speak for everybody unless for me

#11
DownyTif

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`Yeah I'm trying to change "Your PC fans" to "some" and it's not working...

#12
Loc'n'lol

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The thing is we were supposed to have the detachable camera for AOE targetting, but we don't and no-one cares.

Modifié par _Loc_N_lol_, 09 mars 2011 - 03:03 .


#13
DownyTif

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As requested, I changed "Your PC fans" to "Some of your PC fans". Sorry for that, I didn't expect those replies since the first thing I stated is to reply only if you agree. If you don't well, don't reply. I'm pretty sure that if they implement those changes and you are not part of this thread, it won't affect you in any way.

Modifié par DownyTif, 09 mars 2011 - 03:06 .


#14
Lord_Saulot

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DownyTif wrote...

As requested, I changed "Your PC fans" to "Some of your PC fans". Sorry for that, I didn't expect those replies.


I hope that keeps people on topic.  I think your suggestions are good ones, and I hope they get the attention they deserve.

#15
Skilled Seeker

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_Loc_N_lol_ wrote...

The thing is we were supposed to have the detachable camera for AOE targetting, but we don't and no-one cares.

Hopefully it gets patched like the autoattack on consoles since these things were said to be in the game so I'll give Bioware the benefit of the doubt there.

Modifié par Skilled Seeker, 09 mars 2011 - 03:07 .


#16
Senzen Sumnor

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Add no fixed player character and I may sign.

#17
Edli

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Flunkorg wrote...

Edli wrote...


I don't think any PC user is glad that iso view is removed and if you are then ...

I'm a pc user and it hasen't bothered me much. I'm perfectly capable with out it on nightmare.
But it would be nice to have it back.


That's the point. Maybe you didn't use it in DA:O but a lot of peoples that played it in PC used and loved it. It was one of the features that made the pc version vastly superior and enjoyable. There is no reason why any pc users should be against it, you were not forced.
The truth is that DA2 butchered the PC features for the serie and I as a great DA:O fan cannot just accept it and say it's fine, we can do without it. 

#18
HMR Greg

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I respect the wants of PC fans, but I hope BioWare retains the console-specific changes for Dragon Age III, as I personally hate playing games on the PC. I work 9 hours a day glued in front of a computer monitor, so the last thing I want to do is come home and relax in front of another damn computer monitor.

That said, I would really like to see DA3 open up the world and feel more "epic," rather than stay in one general area. Diversity in world design really makes the experience more enjoyable and feel more grand and, well, epic.

#19
Flunkorg

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Edli wrote...

Flunkorg wrote...

Edli wrote...


I don't think any PC user is glad that iso view is removed and if you are then ...

I'm a pc user and it hasen't bothered me much. I'm perfectly capable with out it on nightmare.
But it would be nice to have it back.


That's the point. Maybe you didn't use it in DA:O but a lot of peoples that played it in PC used and loved it. It was one of the features that made the pc version vastly superior and enjoyable. There is no reason why any pc users should be against it, you were not forced.
The truth is that DA2 butchered the PC features for the serie and I as a great DA:O fan cannot just accept it and say it's fine, we can do without it. 

And this is where we don't agree.
You see, I just see the iso view as a luxery. Not something that i actually NEED.
That bieing said, I wouldn't mind having it...

In conclusions, its not that big of a deal to me, I still extremely enjoy da2 and I'm glad I pre-purchased it.

#20
cgoodno

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 First of all, thank you for at least being level-headed and constructive in approaching what you believe to be limitations to DA2 over DAO.

As to your points:

1.  I completely agree with a free-moving camera option.  I know they didn't go with the isometric for technical reasons relating to the graphics.  But, I don't see why we wouldn't be able to freely move the controller around while paused and holding the shift key or similar.

2.  I do agree that swapping between 2h and s/b as well as dual and bow would be really nice.  As it is, makes me feel like I should only focus on one or the other.  I would also agree with this addition.

3.  So far, I like how it is.  I had the same issues with queueing abilities in the first game and some of them being cancelled out by my other actions.  I really like the increased timers on potion uses so far.

4.  I have no opinion on this matter as I haven't used it yet, but any and all bugs should be fixed.

Again, thank you for the, currently, rare level-headed approach.

#21
DownyTif

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cgoodno wrote...

Again, thank you for the, currently, rare level-headed approach.


Much appreciated :)

#22
Poison_Berrie

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I second those changes. At least the first and last wholeheartedly, though the second isn't that big a deal to me.

EDIT: on second thought, the second point becomes bigger when you want your switch your weapons during combat, especially on an rogue how also invested in dual wield.

Modifié par Poison_Berrie, 09 mars 2011 - 03:46 .


#23
soteria

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When I played the demo, I said that I wasn't sure I really needed a detachable camera. Now I feel differently--not having one is extremely frustrating, especially inside. Just try targeting an aoe ability right behind three enemies with your own warriors fighting them, without hitting them. Sometimes it works, and other times I have to unpause, move my character, and try again--and I'm less than 10 yards away. I consider that unacceptable.

Point number two I agree with as well. It's not a huge issue, but c'mon, we had it in Origins and a number of other Bioware games. Switching to sword 'n shield or a bow in the middle of combat feels as clunky as a '72 chevy pickup.

#24
Thalandor21

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I agree with all of the OP comments. There is so much potential for this game to have good tactical combat (every ingredient is there, from a wide choice of skill build and cross-class combos).

However, with everything happening so fast (compared to DA:O) and enemies poping from everywhere, the lack of a camera that gives you an ensemble view of the battlefield makes managing the party a tedious chore and many situations become very frustrating because bad things happen before you can see them... No amount of pausing will prevent the fact that you can't react to something you can't see !

At this point I prefer to just put the difficulty on Normal and just blow my way through fights...

#25
DownyTif

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One thing I forgotten in the original post, but I'm not sure if it is missing (I'm at work, I can't check) or I just haven't found it. Is it me or the "Select All Characters" button is also gone? It was helpful a lot (for me again) in Origins...