111 réponses à ce sujet

[XX55XX]

I am six hours into the game so far.

Most of my criticisms are not about the voiced protagonist, the dialogue wheel, or even the "streamlined" gameplay. I actually liked all of those changes (though being unable to change your characters' clothing is a definite minus).

I am focusing on the narrative here. It feels weak. The characters feel so hollow - especially your sister, Bethany! These characters pale in comparison with Alistair, Morrigan, Oghren, hell, even Wynne was more three-dimensional than any of these characters I've met and seen so far.

Why does Hawke want to go to the Deep Roads so badly? I am having difficulty gauging he and his sister's motivation for wanting to do that. Apparently, it had something to do with money - but why can't they continue working for the Red Irons, then?

Additionally, what really kills the narrative so far is the lack of a strong antagonist. In DAO, it was the darkspawn, and it worked surprisingly well. Here... who is the antagonist? All of the missions I've done far feel like generic "go here and kill x number of enemies" type of quests. They don't integrate into the main storyline (if there is one) very well and I am having difficulty seeing how killing a bunch bandits advances the story besides giving Hawke enough money for an expedition to the Deep Roads with Varric.

Unfortunately, Dragon Age 2 is what Mafia 2 did to the original Mafia. Mafia 2 was a good game, but it just wasn't great compared to the original - and the unfocused narrative and lack of a strong antagonist really kills Dragon Age 2.

But, I am only six hours in, so my impressions may change. But, given that I care more about the story more than the actual gameplay for games like these, Dragon Age 2 doesn't bode well in my books.

Color me disappointed so far, BioWare. Gameplay changes I can accept - but at least give the game a decent story and some decent characters worth talking to.

[mesmerizedish]

I'm twelve hours in. I have no idea what the game's "main plot" is. And it's already better than that of Origins.

[17thknight]

There is no main plot.
Act 1: Run around getting money so you can go get money

[habitat 67]

I hate to say this... but I think I agree.
I'm 7.5 hours in and I don't know and don't care what's happening, except I feel terrible for my mom. I actually fell asleep for a moment playing last night at 9pm! I guess I was that bored.

Help! I really want to like this game.

[MassFrost]

I understand what you mean, I'm about 9 hours in myself and I have yet to really give a damn about any of these characters. That might change as the game progresses, of course.. But thus far they've all been rather boring, in my opinion.

[Aldaris951]

Poster above is a troll. Origins had a much better story.

[Purgatious]

Stories don't have to have antagonists. And in origins it was just a voiceless, mindless dragon.

Also he wants to go into the deep roads because the riches down there can (and will) get his family out of the slums and into a nice house.

[XX55XX]

Ugh. I cared more about Alistair's wish to reconnect with Goldanna more than my own mother's troubles. Yeah, yeah, we were once rich, get used to it. At least you escaped the darkspawn.

[XX55XX]

Aldaris951 wrote...

Poster above is a troll. Origins had a much better story.

Precisely. And even if it was cliched, at least it gave the gameplay some meaning - some real end-goal.

I don't know, but I am having a lot of difficulty connecting with any of the characters.

[17thknight]

Purgatious wrote...

Stories don't have to have antagonists. And in origins it was just a voiceless, mindless dragon.

Also he wants to go into the deep roads because the riches down there can (and will) get his family out of the slums and into a nice house.

Which is precisely why the whole story is inane.
You're accumulating a massive amount of wealth...to go on a brutally risky expedition...to accumulate a bit more wealth.

And buddy, if you think that an epic-journey story doesn't need some kind of antagonist/opposition, then Aristotle would like to have a word with you.

[wijse]

The only person i have met with personality is Varric. The game should have been about Varric and his adventures into the underworld of Kirkwall.

Modifié par wijse, 09 mars 2011 - 03:23 .

[habitat 67]

Why does Varric sound like He-Man?
Also, ALL the women sound the same, save for Merrill's wonderful accent.
I can't tell if it's Aveline, Bethany, my mom or me talking. Why?

[Pious_Augustus]

I had to go to sleep early yesterday maybe it was because I was tired that I thought the story was weak and the world was bland and that you couldn't interact with most things....I am hoping my reaction changes today

[AbsolutGrndZer0]

Aldaris951 wrote...

Poster above is a troll. Origins had a much better story.

Having a different opinion from you makes a person a troll?

[RicAlmighty]

I agree totally. This "game" is a complete and total letdown. This may be the worst game BioWare has ever released in terms of expectation vs. delivery. Everyone wondered how they would be able to do such a quick turnaround from DA:O to DA2 and now we know: they left out the story.

I'm so glad that I didn't open my signature edition until I had a chance to play the game. My SE hit eBay yesterday and will more than pay back what I spent on it.

DA2 has been nothing but one big astounding pile of disappointment.

[Dama]

It's true there isn't a "big huge evil guy threating to blow up Dantoinne" sort of plot but I like that. You scrape together a living doing less than reputable deeds and trying to reclaim your family name after your uncle crapped all over it.

I rather enjoy the rags to riches story myself. I do agree Bethany could have had a better voice actress but the others are top notch, especially Merril. She is so incredibly awesome that words cannot describe. I knew the second I met her that I had to marry her but romance with her has been beyond challenging.

Anyway, I have to say that I disagree with the darkspawn being the antagonist. Loghain fills that role in Origins so much better because if you get to know the man you can understand (if not agree with) his decisions. He at least had the greater good in mind although he had a messed up way of showing it.

[Elvenlon]

i just finished today..........As compared to Origins, this game is limited, narrow, and not epic at all. Worst of all it's been narrated through a man talking like a bard about hawk becoming the champion, and THAT'S IT!? I was so disappointed at the end..........I feel the game hasn't even started. Well I'm sure there's going to be expansions, DA3 or whatever comes afterwards, but this just isn't right way to make money man.........I mean the game is locked in just once city for god sake. Denerim alone is like Kirkwall and we've got the circle, the fade, the mountain peak, the deep roads, loads of things to explore in origins, how can u throw that epicness away !?!?!?!

[Daniteh]

Please play the entire game before you talk badly about it, he'll play it twice. Thanks.

[nikkylee]

I'd have to agree with most of the people here.... Act 1 was really REALLY boring. At least I thought so (and was totally heartbroken about it). Until I got into the expedition. And Act 2. Both of which I've really enjoyed.

I miss talking to people like in Origins, tons of possible conversations and stories and such... that's probably my biggest complaint. I hate the ME-style two-convo per "act" thing, but on the plus side, companions really comment on quests a lot more. It feels like they're part of the story, instead of just there watching Hawke do her thing.

[Wissenschaft]

I love the story. I have no clue how people say the characters don't get any development at all. They get plenty and theres plenty of banter with party member. You do have to visit your companions though to get to know them the best. But you do get to learn a lot about your companions if you visit them. About as much as chating with them in Origins.

People complained about always playing a game were your the great hero destinies to save the world from some terrible evil. DA2 is finally a game that does not follow that cliche formula and now people are complaining that the story isn't lame or not epic enough.

Bioware: Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Modifié par Wissenschaft, 09 mars 2011 - 04:38 .

[Barachiel]

People, the expedition plot is just Act One. The game is three acts. This game is supposed to cover a character's life over the span of a decade. So far, you've all seen one year.

Here's a breath of rationality: why don't we we *finish the game* before we start ripping apart, eh?

[JasmoVT]

Sounds to me you are looking for a black and white morality play and since DA2 was intentionally designed to not provide that you are calling it bad narrative. Bioware has been very clear this was designed around the reality of decisions nearly always being ambiguus with a mix of good and bad and no clear victory of good over evil. I find it a much more engaging narrative that the morality play approach.

As to deep roads, why do you have trouble with the explanation in the narrative. There are a noble family, robbed of their fortune by a disreputable uncle and the only way to reclaim their status is to garner great wealth through a great roads expedition. It really needs no more explanation. If you are looking for grand forces of good and evil, that is not what this is about.

While still being, in my mind a good role playing game it is done in a style of an interactive graphic novel. The moral ambiguity is also a reflection of modern graphic novel style. It is an evolution of rpg forms. I think it is a good one, but I can understand while others would not agree.

I really do no get all the "no dialog with companions" discussion. I seem to spend half my time in dialog with my companions. Just watch for the flags in your journal to go talk to folks at their home.

[Jaulen]

Only get two convos with each companion per act?. That's not a whole lot of getting to know your companion time. Although I will say I like that the conversations are a little more inquisitive and converstaion like.

I do like the upped party banter, and that they will interact with each other during banter, and that Hawke may also join in.

I also like that they have more to say when you are interacting with Kirkwallers.

But....this is how I described the game so far. "I feel like I'm playing a character through a story instead of role-playing a character through a story." I just didn't get instantly gripped by the game. Heck, when I picked up DA:O I stayed up two and a half days straight until I finished it (for the first time) on the PS3 (I actually did a double fist pump in the air and CHEERED at 5am when I killed the AD the first time). I was so gripped, that when I had to leave town for work, I went and picked up a copy of DA:O for my laptop so I could continue playing. When I played DA2 yesterday....I easily decided to put the game down and go to bed. And even right now I'm 'meh' about getting off work and getting right to the game.

But so far, I don't care all that much about the characters. May change as I get further into it. But like a book, I'd rather be gripped right away...or I'm just going to feel like I'm torturing myself to get through it.

[jokingking]

For me, i think Chantry and Templars are antagonist especially Chantry.. whenever my quest has something to do with them, i just wanna screw them over. If i got a chance to kill one, i will be happy to take that option.

Modifié par jokingking, 09 mars 2011 - 06:09 .

[Elvenlon]

JasmoVT wrote...

Sounds to me you are looking for a black and white morality play and since DA2 was intentionally designed to not provide that you are calling it bad narrative. Bioware has been very clear this was designed around the reality of decisions nearly always being ambiguus with a mix of good and bad and no clear victory of good over evil. I find it a much more engaging narrative that the morality play approach.

As to deep roads, why do you have trouble with the explanation in the narrative. There are a noble family, robbed of their fortune by a disreputable uncle and the only way to reclaim their status is to garner great wealth through a great roads expedition. It really needs no more explanation. If you are looking for grand forces of good and evil, that is not what this is about.

While still being, in my mind a good role playing game it is done in a style of an interactive graphic novel. The moral ambiguity is also a reflection of modern graphic novel style. It is an evolution of rpg forms. I think it is a good one, but I can understand while others would not agree.

I really do no get all the "no dialog with companions" discussion. I seem to spend half my time in dialog with my companions. Just watch for the flags in your journal to go talk to folks at their home.

The game itself has many commendable improvements, visual, gameplay, combat. But it is very obvious that the game seems rushed and less polished it should have been. Personally I'm not a fan of "tale within a tale" style, I think that's just cliche, but this is just a personal opinion, no offence. However, I think when you finish the game once and look back, it doesn't give me that many memorable moments like DAO did. (warewolves, abomination at the circle, fade puzzle & maze, sacred ashes, etc.)

The development of the story dived in too quickly for me to establish a strong emotional bond with the characters. Many of the maps and dungeons are repeated, only with enemies and blockage changed, very often you find yourself exploring the same old dungeon again and again. Also most of the story is contained within the city which gives me a very limited sence of scale and a narrow perception of the world. 

Even for the epilogue, it felt more like a prologue because the game finishes right after the "tale telling". Which left the players unsatisfied from so many questions in their head. Obviously this is for the sequeals, expansions, DLC stuff, but I think they should not leave so many things unexplained just so there will be more coming in the future for marketing stunts.  

The story is rather linear and predictable, with some parts relatively detached from it. When the game had so many screenshots and artworks of Flemeth before it launched, I thought she would play a more important part of this story. She just showed up, saved the day and then revived from a ritual and flies away!? 

Comparing the DA2 story to DAO, I'm totally okay with no "grand evil" behind the whole, but DA2 is much less intricatly interwoven as compared to DAO. DAO started from a task to gather three races, but then branched into so many sub-story/plots, and then related them well back into the main plot. For DA2, you can really pull out some of the plots and make them a stand alone story, which overall leads to a less impactful experience. 

But hey, this is only my first playthrough, maybe when I play it for 2,3 times, I may be wrong, but i don't think I'm speaking rubbish either. Just some humble and honest opinions.