543 réponses à ce sujet

[Hay Julay]

MB123 wrote...

I felt like he really didn't have any grounds doing this, considering that Grand Cleric Elthina was one of the only people to remain neutral during the whole mage v. templar mess. And most of the game he rants about templars when it seems that the Kirkwall Chantry has little control over them.

I think that is why Anders did it, because Elthina was neutral and tried to keep the peace. Anders wanted a confrontation between Templars and Mages, and he felt as long as Elthina tried to compromise with both sides, it wouldn't go anywhere. So he took very, very drastic measures.

[Hay Julay]

Double post.

Modifié par Hay Julay, 13 mars 2011 - 05:01 .

[Templar_Avenger_1]

My reaction was saying WTF!!! For about 3 minutes. I didn't Kill him though. Anders was my favorite teamate from Awakening, excluding Justice who is technically part of Anders now. As well I was romancing Merill who suggested that I bring him along and redeem himself. What I want to know is this. WTF Did he do? Was it a bomb that tore open the fade!!!!? I am still so confused!!!!

[HarlequinKing]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Are they innocent when they belong to an organization that's involved in slavery?

Most humans in Thedas (and quite a few elves) belong to the Chantry since most humans are Andrastian, unless you're talking only about Chantry hierarchs, clerics and brothers/sisters. Most mages are also, by default, members of the Chantry. 

There are many good Andrastians that you have as companions; Alistair, Wynne, Leliana and Sebastian come to mind. It's simply not rational to view them all as pro-slavery people. Are you saying it's justified if they were all hanging out in the Kirkwall Chantry when it blew up? I think it's pretty safe to say Anders wouldn't care.


Added distinction: don't forget that there are actually two Chantries, since Tevinter has their own version. If I'm not mistaken, the Black Divine is a mage himself.

[mander83]

 Oh Anders, why oh why?

The blowing up of the Chantry came out of left field. My Lady Hawke was quite happily romancing him and very pro-mage. I honestly thought he was going to die when he tried to seperate from Justice- that's why he was so sorry. Little did I know...though it all makes sense now, looking back. 

Lady Hawke did not approve of Anders' actions. Not at all. She didn't kill him though. She loves him and ran away with him. I really don't think blowing the Chantry is something non-Justice Anders would have done. When they merged together I think they each damaged the other. 

I also don't think as many mages would resort to blood magic if they weren't living under such conditions (speaking specifically of Kirkwall). Perhaps if the Circle exsisted to help educate mages but not to completely control their lives. Wouldn't Bethany had been happier if she could have gone a worked/studied at the Circle during the day and come home to her family at night? That way blood magic can be watched for but the mage's have some freedom too. There has to be some compromise between the complete oppression and control of the Circle and the Magisters in the Tevinter Imperium.

[Element Zero]

I sort of suspected this would happen as soon as the bum got me to help him gather ingredients. I thought: "This potion sounds like BS, and these ingredients sound like the kind of stuff that would build a bomb". Sadly (in-game), I was right.

When it blew, I said out loud "Oh my god.... WTF, Anders?!" I continued grumbling "you f-ing idiot" for several minutes. That is damn good writing by the Bioware team.

I killed him. How could I not? He and Sebastien were the two least-used characters of my first playthrough, so I was not quite maxed in friendship with either of them. That said, Sebastien had the high ground, and I could only agree. When "Right of Annulment" came out of Meredith's mouth, I knew what had to be done.

Damn, this was a good game.

[Jimmy Fury]

MB123 wrote...

I felt like he really didn't have any grounds doing this, considering that Grand Cleric Elthina was one of the only people to remain neutral during the whole mage v. templar mess. And most of the game he rants about templars when it seems that the Kirkwall Chantry has little control over them.

This. 10 thousand times this.
I adore Anders. I've been 100% pro Anders since the moment he got announced. I never even considered any of the other romances thanks to Anders.
But I liked Elthina. The moment I pushed and she said "I support peace." I had instant respect for her. That was only amplified when she refused the order of the Divine and stayed. I honestly thought that there would be a path that ended in Elthina agreeing that Meredith had overstepped her authority. Thus causing Meredith to start the war by turning the Templars against the Chantry itself.

So... yeah as much as i like Anders, that couldn't go unpunished.

[The Ole Ultra Violence]

He wanted to be a symbol of hope and justice, so I made him one. Broke my heart, but I did it...

[CitizenSnips]

Gandalf il Bianco wrote...

Just one of the most idiotic game design i ever seen.
He's my only healer I wanted to kill him but i could not, cause doing would have left me without healing.
Really, really stupid game design.

This is pretty much how I feel. Anders seems too crucial to a well balanced party as the only companion in the game who can cast a heal past Act 1 besides a mage Hawke. He is also the only companion in the game who has more than just a single target long cooldown heal. So if I want to have a real healer and am not a mage, or want to focus on offensive/CC capabilities as a mage, Anders is my only option. Kinda pidgeonholes me into dealing with all of his bull****. I really liked Anders in DA:A as Alistair type comic relief and I don't think I would mind him as much if there was a legitimate alternative to having a party healer with strong healing spells like group heal, revival, gradual regen, etc. I like that we see how Anders is dealing with the choices he has made but I want to have to play along just because I am worried about group make up.

TLDR: I'd like to see at least one more companion with real healing capabilities.

[Jon abcd]

RosaAquafire wrote...

HawXV2 wrote...
It was the most...Idk how to describe. It just made me feel...dreamy. It's my favorite video game moment by far.

Between Anders's 9/11 moment and Leandra's horrific end, this game GOT to me in a way that none other ever has. 

This is exactly how I feel about it.

[naledgeborn]

I knew it. I didn't know during the collection of items part. But when he started acting all suspect like and he wanted to go to the chantry I knew it. I mean his obsession with freedom for mages would eventually culminate in a terrorist act. He even had a manifesto. I didn't kill him (I was a mage) but I did tell him to leave... twice. I had a neutral Hawke so he never really took things seriously except for mage freedom, but terrorism is a line that shouldn't be crossed.

[Rhys1984]

I gay man loved Anders but didn't finish it properly for whatever reason, didn't get the achievement. But yeah, his gather stuff quest that fizzled left me wondering, cause like what a waste of time i thought. But when he goes all blue eyes glow and nutso, it was awesome.

[Weskerr]

What happens if you don't distract the grand cleric for him? Is he still able to do whatever it is he did if you do distract her?

[IvarElessar]

On the topic of the ending - at the gallows, Orsino makes the offer to surrender, even suggesting that the templars can search the tower, ect. Meredith refuses.

However, after you clear the first room in the gallows 2-3 mages attempt to surrender. Meredith tries to have them killed, but Hawke intervenes and Cullen sides with hawke and takes them away. Where the hell was he 5 minutes earlier!

Also, it really annoys me that I couldn't just assassinate Meredith. Obviously the templars had a point, and mages need to be controlled (through obviously the chantry-controlled circles have failed), or else you'll end up with the imperium again (which seems inevitable, given the actions of mages in the two games), but Meredith took it way too far, pushing the mages into a corner.

Orsino didn't even suggest killing her, nor did Thrask. I guess from Bioware's perspective, the war has to happen.

[Fangirl17]

I knew he planted some kind of bomb but I didnt know THAT was going to happen!Holy crap my jaw hit the floor like everyone else's. I was shocked an appalled that he killed innocent people but he was a really good friend to my mage Hawke and she let him live but she was definitely not pleased.It was the most shocking moment in DA2 for me with Hawke's mother's death a close second.

[AbsolutGrndZer0]

I was like OMFG WTF BBQSAUCE!?!?  I mean he told me he was making a potion to get rid of Justice, and I helped him and then it turns out he was making a bomb to blow up the Chantry???  He was my romance so I didn't kill him, but I was like very very mad at him, and tried to pick the answer that made that very clear while not picking the "DIE, ANDERS" option.

[AbsolutGrndZer0]

Alpr wrote...

I was in a gay romance with him (to get the trophy, which apparently it has to be straight or I did it wrong. I got him to live with me and we made out on the bed but I couldn't go any further). Anyways, I ended up killing him even though I was playing the Hero of Kirkwall but being bias and siding with mages every time.

 

You have to let him live and still love him to get the trophy.

[Kentuckan]

One thing that bothered me about Anders was that he was always a radical even back in Awakening. I mean him, my Warden, and Wynne all grew up in the same circle, but he thought it was some awful place of torture and malice, while Wynne and The Warden had a pleasant time. Hell I remember having fond talks of the circle, and Wynne even trying to convince my Warden to return to become a senior enchanter or something like that.

[badassnewbie]

PantheraOnca wrote...

I didn't kill him cause he was my healer! But I was shocked as all hell and thought it was a really stupid thing to do.

So true.  I wanted to kill him for playing me like that but he was my healer.

[SuperMedbh]

I was so mad. But then I remembered Ser Pounce-a-lot and I just couldn't kill him.

I'll give DA2 this: they made me sympathize with a blood mage and a terrorist.

[thegoldfinch]

I basically reacted exactly like Sebastian, but with minimal screaming and a substantially less cool accent.

Anders was awesome. He and my Hawke were best buddies, but I just loved Elthina. She was so kind and sweet. Killing her was like seeing him kill a kitten. I knew something awful was going to happen, but I sure wasn't expecting THAT.

[cystemic]

Well, this taught me a lesson actually. I didn't really connect with Hawke at the beginning (she sounded too much like Morrigan) so I went through the entire game choosing the sarcastic neutral options and whenever my companions asked me to do something, I helped them do it. It was not till late in the game that this became evidently worse and than doing the bad thing. First Fenris kills his sister because I didn't care, then Merril murders the keeper and I have to wipe out all of the dalish and finally tararaboomdiyay Anders blows up the Chantry, and I was romancing him so of course I sided with him. From now on, I'm going to be more decisive, for better or worse. I can't believe how much he changed from awakening, he used to be my absolute fave and now I'm just really confused. This entire game is so morally and ethically confusing that my brain is now full of f***. And I was really angry because Fenris left and he was my tank for the entire game, had to replace him with Aveline D:<

[crapmonster13]

This was definitely one of the highlights of the game narrative-wise. Often when I play videogame rpgs, I try to utilize the traditional rpg mindset, of which one makes choices based on what you think your character would do, not what one would personally do. Often times this overlaps because in the end, the character you envision will always mirror yourself in certain degrees but this isn't always the case.

Playing as a rogue, which I usually associate most with a chaotic good alignment, I made choices that were usually morally good but individual and companion concerns always took precedent even at the cost of others. For example, I let Isabella take the relic and helped Merrill with her crazy blood magic.

So when it came to Anders, while both my character and I disagreed with Ander's actions, I ultimately let him live. Of course this came at the cost of Sebastian but I figured the help I would get from Anders with the current threat was greater in value to any threat Sebastian would provide in the future.

Last but not least, there was admitedly a bit of metagaming involved as well. If I had let Anders die, I would have been without a healer which would have been a serious handicap with the battles to come. Of course I didn't know I'd get Bethany back at the time until I had already made the call.

On a future playthrough as a mage or warrior, I will probably make a different choice. At the very least, rethink it.

[Evil Asch]

He was my love interest but he lied to me and murdered an innocent woman that was actually sympathetic to his cause. So I stabbed him.