543 réponses à ce sujet

[Nathan Redgrave]

Well, he DID warn you...

[Zaros]

Anders was a total douche in this game.

Seriously, I would've understood if he had blown up the templar hall, but no, he didn't. He targeted an area filled solely with innocents and neutrals, and his last words? "The sooner I die, the sooner my actions can inspire others". Really, you'd think he had a pride demon in him as well.

That's also barring how much of an ass he is if you romance Merrill, between him claiming that she'd choose a demon over me, to him saying "the world is a poorer place with you left in it" right after the closest thing she had to a mother sacrificed herself for her, I really didn't have to think twice about killing him.

[elikal71]

Nathan Redgrave wrote...

Allison Hawke (my own warrior Champion) got into a romance with Anders pretty much the moment they met, but here's the trick: Allison starts out quite sympathetic toward apostates, but events throughout the game nudge her toward a more prudently neutral stance. Not least the murder of Leandra. So when Anders dupes her into helping him BLOW UP THE CHANTRY, she's not happy. At all.

But Allison's weakness for her friends is a force to be reckoned with. An entire clan of Dalish elves lies dead because Allison didn't have the spine to step in and stop Merril's attempts to restore the Eluvian before it was too late, for crap's sake. So she lets Anders go, and when she encounters Anders again before the final battle, she takes him back. Because she's hopelessly soft like that. Because she believes in second chances. It's going to get her killed someday. Ah, well.

So at some point they make up and stay together. My Champion is a hilarious moron, and much like my Warden before her, Allison's mistakes are probably going to lead to something horribly catastrophic in the relatively near future. I wouldn't be surprised if Anders joins forces with the Architect to force all Templars to perform the Nutcracker on the roof of the grand cathedral in Orlais...

Good grief. I never followed this Mirror restore quest to the end, because I had a bad feeling about it. Dealing with THIS mirror and a demon AND Blood Magic had a big NO written all over. So I stopped following the quest. Now reading it led to the annihilation of the tribe justifies my bad feeling about it.

But then: I feel also like tricked. As player you make quests to get XP and levels, so it's kinda questionable decision from Bioware to add even more disaster. *sigh*

[Brockololly]

The problem with Anders in Awakening was that while he was no fan of the Chantry/Templars, he wasn't some Crusader- he just wanted to be left alone, have a pretty wife and chuck the fireball at people.

And you don't really see that side to him at all in DA2- he's all Justice/Vengeance from the start. If we had been able to see a more gradual descent into his hardline views based on how we last saw him in Awakening, I think it would have made for a more profound conclusion in DA2.

[SnakeHelah]

Ahh, I wish Anders stayed that sarcastic little Mage he was, and also it would've been nice if he had the same VA as he had in Awakenings, the later isn't as good tbh.

[LobselVith8]

Zaros, he targeted a Chantry building, and it's the Chantry who have enslaved mages all these centuries. Did you expect him to write a strongly worded letter instead?

[TJPags]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Zaros, he targeted a Chantry building, and it's the Chantry who have enslaved mages all these centuries. Did you expect him to write a strongly worded letter instead?

He destroyed a building full of innocent worshipers, workers, delivery people, sightseers, some Sisters, and one Grand Cleric who was one of the most reasonable people in the game.

Maybe he should have blown up Meredith's office instead.

[cglasgow]

No kidding. When Andraste went to war against the Tevinter magisters and their army, she killed the Tevinter magisters and their army. She didn't go around killing temples full of noncombatants to try and provoke people to be even more pissed off at the Tevinter.

[MotoSkunkX]

TJPags wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Zaros, he targeted a Chantry building, and it's the Chantry who have enslaved mages all these centuries. Did you expect him to write a strongly worded letter instead?

He destroyed a building full of innocent worshipers, workers, delivery people, sightseers, some Sisters, and one Grand Cleric who was one of the most reasonable people in the game.

Maybe he should have blown up Meredith's office instead.

Considering most 'devout' andrasteans are also the ones who think mages are cursed scum, I'm not so sure I'd call them "innocent."

Also the Grand Cleric could have stopped all of this by firing Meredith and replace her with someone saner.  She did not.

[LobselVith8]

You mean he destroyed a place with members of an organization that enslaved his people.

Also, we have little information on who was precisely targeted by Andraste and her armies besides the fact that she waged war against the Tevinter Imperium. Regardless, what Anders did worked.

[CitizenSnips]

I feel like I have to be complacent with whatever cake or bull**** Anders happens to throw at me because he is my only companion healer and whether or not I agree or disagree with his actions seems to be irrelevant in my nightmare run.

[MortalEngines]

MotoSkunkX wrote...
Considering most 'devout' andrasteans are also the ones who think mages are cursed scum, I'm not so sure I'd call them "innocent."

Also the Grand Cleric could have stopped all of this by firing Meredith and replace her with someone saner.  She did not.

Say...what?

Lily seemed pretty devote..yet she loved Jowan. Leliana had no issue with you being a mage. The Grand Cleric had no issue with you being a mage, many, many people in Origins had no issue with you being a mage. The citizens of Haven endorsed magic.

So please tell me, where are these andrasteans calling mages cursed scum?

They believe mages to be dangerous, and should be controlled. But scum? Hardly so, alot of mages are devote Andrastans themselves.

Modifié par MortalEngines, 13 mars 2011 - 07:19 .

[TJPags]

MotoSkunkX wrote...

TJPags wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Zaros, he targeted a Chantry building, and it's the Chantry who have enslaved mages all these centuries. Did you expect him to write a strongly worded letter instead?

He destroyed a building full of innocent worshipers, workers, delivery people, sightseers, some Sisters, and one Grand Cleric who was one of the most reasonable people in the game.

Maybe he should have blown up Meredith's office instead.

Considering most 'devout' andrasteans are also the ones who think mages are cursed scum, I'm not so sure I'd call them "innocent."

Also the Grand Cleric could have stopped all of this by firing Meredith and replace her with someone saner.  She did not.

Had a reply posted, but it seems to have gotten eaten.  I'll try to repeat:

So, now we kill people for following the teaching of their religion?  Because that's what most devout Andrastians do - believe the teachings of the Chantry.

Like my Apostate sister, Bethany.  Who expressed her thought that maybe she SHOULD have been sent to the Circle as a child.

Either way, what about the servants, delivery people, sightseers?  They also deserve to be blown to hell because of Meredith?

As for the Grand Cleric, I've said this in various posts, but maybe not in this one, so let me ask - where are these atrocities that we keep hearing rumors of?

[TJPags]

LobselVith8 wrote...

You mean he destroyed a place with members of an organization that enslaved his people.

Also, we have little information on who was precisely targeted by Andraste and her armies besides the fact that she waged war against the Tevinter Imperium. Regardless, what Anders did worked.

No, I mean he destroyed a place filled with innocent people.

Or do you honestly believe that EVERYONE in that Chantry when it went up deserved to die?

Or will you admit that it would have been better to have blown up Meredith's office?

[staldore13]

i couldnt bring myself to kill him, so i sent him away
he was a murderer and became a traitor to his own people by doing that, even if he didnt realize it

[MortalEngines]

TJPags wrote...
No, I mean he destroyed a place filled with innocent people.

Or do you honestly believe that EVERYONE in that Chantry when it went up deserved to die?

Or will you admit that it would have been better to have blown up Meredith's office?

My only issue with the whole, blow up Meredith's office solution is that well, seeing from the explosion at the Chantry, all the mages in the Templar building would die, along with all the templars. So again, you're still killing innocents (perhaps not as innocent as those in the Chantry).

The best solution is to not blow up anything at all! Stupid Anders.

[Darkannex]

I allowed him to live...but it was hard. Only understanding that he was as much a victim as others stayed my hand. I do not honestly believe Anders on his OWN would have resorted to such an act. He has made it clear too many times that the life of the innocent was paramount. Because of Vengeance, he is clearly out of his normal frame of mind.

He's not a freak. He's a man carrying a freak on his back.

Still...it was mind-boggling hard. Only when I was able to seperate REALITY from this fantasy world was I able to make this distinction. In real life-there is no such thing as a demon of Vengeance. And the devil doesn't really make people do things.

[Doc Faust]

TJPags wrote...

MotoSkunkX wrote...

TJPags wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Zaros, he targeted a Chantry building, and it's the Chantry who have enslaved mages all these centuries. Did you expect him to write a strongly worded letter instead?

He destroyed a building full of innocent worshipers, workers, delivery people, sightseers, some Sisters, and one Grand Cleric who was one of the most reasonable people in the game.

Maybe he should have blown up Meredith's office instead.

Considering most 'devout' andrasteans are also the ones who think mages are cursed scum, I'm not so sure I'd call them "innocent."

Also the Grand Cleric could have stopped all of this by firing Meredith and replace her with someone saner.  She did not.

Had a reply posted, but it seems to have gotten eaten.  I'll try to repeat:

So, now we kill people for following the teaching of their religion?  Because that's what most devout Andrastians do - believe the teachings of the Chantry.

Like my Apostate sister, Bethany.  Who expressed her thought that maybe she SHOULD have been sent to the Circle as a child.

Either way, what about the servants, delivery people, sightseers?  They also deserve to be blown to hell because of Meredith?

As for the Grand Cleric, I've said this in various posts, but maybe not in this one, so let me ask - where are these atrocities that we keep hearing rumors of?

Another little disturbing tidbit to think about: the Chantry is explicitly modeled on the christian church. This particular chantry building is a truly massive cathedral that we only see a little of, in a city with a truely prodigious poor, unemployed and homeless population. How many homeless people do you think were sleeping there when Ander's blew it up?

[The Baconer]

Anders is a selfish lunatic, and he essentially crapped on everything my Hawke (and my warden, in ways) was working toward. I killed him on the spot. The Anders I knew from Awakening was pretty much dead already.

[cglasgow]

MortalEngines wrote...

My only issue with the whole, blow up Meredith's office solution is that well, seeing from the explosion at the Chantry, all the mages in the Templar building would die, along with all the templars.

Well, the 'blow up Meredith's office' solution generally assumes that Anders builds a smaller bomb, yes.    But hey, he's the guy designing the bomb; the blast radius is going to be what he wants it to be.

[OmegaBlue0231]

It was a crappy move, personally I would have just used a smaller bomb.......placed in the Knight Commanders officer.

[TJPags]

cglasgow wrote...

MortalEngines wrote...

My only issue with the whole, blow up Meredith's office solution is that well, seeing from the explosion at the Chantry, all the mages in the Templar building would die, along with all the templars.

Well, the 'blow up Meredith's office' solution generally assumes that Anders builds a smaller bomb, yes.    But hey, he's the guy designing the bomb; the blast radius is going to be what he wants it to be.

Yea, this is kind of what I'm driving at.  Smaller bomb, Meredith dies, maybe a few other Templars too, but to Anders, they're all evil, so it should be his aim - kill Templars.

Instead, he goes after the Chantry with a building buster bomb. 

And yes, let's add some homeless to the list of "evil" and "corrupt" people killed in that explosion, thank you for pointing that out, Doc Faust.

[LobselVith8]

Anders freed the mages with his actions, Baconer. How is the emancipation of the enslaved selfish?

[cglasgow]

Yes, DA3 will open on happy mage utopia where the civil war has already been won and the mages are perfectly fine and everything is hugs and puppies. /sarcasm

[MortalEngines]

OmegaBlue0231 wrote...

It was a crappy move, personally I would have just used a smaller bomb.......placed in the Knight Commanders officer.

I assumed it hard for someone like Anders, a well known apostate and mage rebellion supporter by that point to sneak into Meredith's office and plant a bomb. 

Really, smart thing would be gather the willing templar, the willing mages and strom her out of office.

Modifié par MortalEngines, 13 mars 2011 - 07:44 .