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[Wretched Gnu]

Drakonnen wrote...

Wretched Gnu wrote...

Drakonnen wrote...

Oh, yes, I should go look at some classical and neo classical art, because when I said classic beauty, clearly I meant throughout every era and area of human history, rather than referring to what the classic notions are as relates to the modern world.

Ah, I see... "classic beauty" as defined not by any known definition of the word "classic," but by the standards of teenage boys after, say, 1983 or so. 

I have to ask, again:  Who are these people -- people besides adolescents, I mean -- who find vacuous barbie-doll faces -- all with the same identical pin-button noses, the same identical Seventeen-magazine post-pubescent faces -- to be "classically beautiful"?

Yes, its all adolescent boys and their purchasing power who drive the entire market place to pick the people selected as models, be it for fashion and commercial work, mens magazines or even the girls in women's magazines.  I guess they're solely the reason too Victoria's Secret fashion shows always get high ratings, lol.

? Huh?  You're saying all these women look like your barbie doll, and that none of them look anything like Bioware's Morrigan?  Whut...?   No.  There are plenty of beautiful women who look like the in-game Morrigan.

This is what you won't be able to get.  The kind of sensibility that rejects faces with any kind of character -- explicitly calling them "unattractive", as you did the in-game Morrigan -- is not a sensibility at all.  It is a knee-jerk adolescent reaction against anything that does not look like the bland, characterless, cookie-cutter adolescent that the media has convinced you is "beautiful." 

The barbie-doll face has nothing to do with beauty.  It is simply the absence of any particular characteristic -- coupled with a heavy dose of that "vulnerability" and "innocence" which teenage boys require because real women scare them.

If you find the in-game Morrigan "unattractive" and the barbie-doll face "attractive," I'm afraid you're suffering from this syndrome.

Modifié par Wretched Gnu, 16 novembre 2009 - 09:33 .

[Drakonnen]

Jassper wrote...

I'm waiting for someone to correct the grass, it don't look the same as on the box.

omg, your sracasm is sooo funny!

Because the type of grass is just as pivotal as the main characters in the game, so its a perfect analogy!

[Thaladar]

I like your modded Morrigan face. Of course, I like the original one too! Funny how you get a very different perspective of the character with the two faces :-)



Like others, I am much more interested in seeing what you can do for Leliana. I almost didn't recognize her in-game after having watched the Sacred Ashes trailer! I thought her eyes were a light green.

[Drakonnen]

Wretched Gnu wrote...

? Huh?  You're saying all these women look like your barbie doll, and that none of them look anything like Bioware's Morrigan?  Whut...?   No.  There are plenty of beautiful women who look like the in-game Morrigan.

Yes, tons of real beautiful women look just like the in game Morrigan, with the overlong face, and tiny, high set non-reflective, bright yellow eyes.  I'm sure of it.

Wretched Gnu wrote...

This is what you won't be able to get.  The kind of sensibility that rejects faces with any kind of character -- explicitly calling them "unattractive", as you did the in-game Morrigan -- is not a sensibility at all.  It is a knee-jerk adolescent reaction against anything that does not look like the bland, characterless, cookie-cutter adolescent that the media has convinced you is "beautiful."

Because calling one face unattractive, means I must hate all faces with any character... Let me channel you for a moment:

Your adolescent over generalizations of adolescents and of the likes and thoughts of people you label as adolescents, while not realizing in your adolescent arrogance that you really have no idea what you're talking about in realtion to these people's tastes or even who you're talking about, is truly reflective of an adolescent personality and adolescent attitude toward others in general.

Wretched Gnu wrote...

The barbie-doll face has nothing to do with beauty.  It is simply the absence of any particular characteristic -- coupled with a heavy dose of that "vulnerability" and "innocence" which teenage boys require because real women scare them.

I'm confused.  Its absent of any particular "characteristic", but heavy on "vulnerability" and "innocence. "  Are you daft?  Are those not characteristics.  How adolescent of you to not realize such a thing.  Its the sort of thing teenage boys would do because putting consistent thoughts together scares them.  After all, no REAL woman could be vulnerable or innocent, right?

I'd love to know the psychological background which causes you to deny such beautiful women are in fact beautiful, while at the same time causing you such a vitriolic hatred toward adolescent teenage boys, and the need to label everyone as adolescent, coupled with the thought that real women can't be vulnerable or innocent, lol.

Modifié par Drakonnen, 16 novembre 2009 - 09:47 .

[Xanfyrst]

She looks cuter, which I don't think matches her persona. Nice work though.

[Nosuchluck]

I'm starting to wonder how much time the OP's actually spent over-anaiyzing the characters looks. I really don't get the reason of changing the characters from what the developers intended them to be, yes Morrigan doesn't look like her concept art - that's because her character, story and voice actor developed far past concept art which was done a long time ago.

I'm not saying don't change them. I'm just stating my opinion, I don't think any of the characters are ugly enough to go to the effort of changing them. Even then I wouldn't want to change it, as they're the developers vision of what those characters should look like, not yours or mine.

[LyonVanguard]

I like it. I might use this to change th game up a bit in the future. However, I find the "final" morrigan to be much better looking than the concept art. I thinkts its the bright yellow eyes. Eitherway, great work.

[Drakonnen]

LyonVanguard wrote...

I like it. I might use this to change th game up a bit in the future. However, I find the "final" morrigan to be much better looking than the concept art. I thinkts its the bright yellow eyes. Eitherway, great work.

Since a lot of people seem to like the yellow eyes, which I only didn't include because the concept art piece had the blue eyes, I think maybe I'll upload a yellow eyed alternate for those who like the look of the eyes, and squint them up a little for those who think she is too "doe eyed" or what have you, lol.

My main annoyance with those eyes is they are oddly non reflective (notice how no line shines off them compared ot the eyes in the mod in the example screen shot), and possess no real texture similar to a real iris.

[Wylie222]

I personally think it looks great, as i am not a fan of morrigans looks in the game.

[MBirkhofer]

Knox1776 wrote...

Wretched Gnu wrote...

Sorry, but Bioware's version is far superior. It actually has character, as opposed to looking like a generic brunette barbie doll.

I have no idea why anybody over the age of 12 would think the bubble-eyed cheerleader look is attractive or interesting in any way.

I disagree.  While I too prefer the original version, I think this is an excellent rendition of the more sheltered and naive Morrigan.  I just prefer her to have a more calculating look.

Exactly. 
Its interesting if you look at it really.
The artwork is of her being fairly young.  Guessing 16-23 tops.

Claudia Black is of course 30+  Not sure on her actual age.

Now, when we've discussed her character, it is often mentioned that she acts like a child.  And that does describe her well.  A sheltered selfish child.
Pretend for a moment she wasn't voiced by a 30+ women, and her dialogue would likely sound correct for a 18yr old.

I suspect she was intended to be fairly young.  16-23.  They hired Claudia Black, and then remodeled the model in game to match her a bit more, while still giving her a unique face.   I have no doubt the "crow like" aspects weren't intentional.

[Jassper]

Drakonnen wrote...

Jassper wrote...

I'm waiting for someone to correct the grass, it don't look the same as on the box.

omg, your sracasm is sooo funny!

Because the type of grass is just as pivotal as the main characters in the game, so its a perfect analogy!

Relax, Just a game dude.

Modifié par Jassper, 16 novembre 2009 - 10:32 .

[Song of Wyrd]

Incredibly well made, but I like the current version better. This one makes her a bit too 'soft' and 'innocent' for Morrigan.

[InvaderErl]

Drakonnen wrote...


Since a lot of people seem to like the yellow eyes, which I only didn't include because the concept art piece had the blue eyes, I think maybe I'll upload a yellow eyed alternate for those who like the look of the eyes, and squint them up a little for those who think she is too "doe eyed" or what have you, lol.

Hey, thanks - I look forward to seeing it. Whatever controversy you've drummed up (guys - its just a little change!) its some very good work you've done.

[Wretched Gnu]

Drakonnen wrote...

Wretched Gnu wrote...

The barbie-doll face has nothing to do with beauty.  It is simply the absence of any particular characteristic -- coupled with a heavy dose of that "vulnerability" and "innocence" which teenage boys require because real women scare them.

I'm confused.  Its absent of any particular "characteristic", but heavy on "vulnerability" and "innocence. "  Are you daft?  Are those not characteristics.  How adolescent of you to not realize such a thing.  Its the sort of thing teenage boys would do because putting consistent thoughts together scares them.  After all, no REAL woman could be vulnerable or innocent, right?

Sure, there are plenty of real women who are vulnerable, innocent and look like barblie dolls -- a figure designed for children.  But that has absolutely nothing to do with Morrigan.  I can't think of a less innocent or vulnarable character.  (She didn't live a sheltered life with mommie, btw -- listen to her backstory.  She's "been around" much more than any of the other characters).

So finally we have an interesting female character with a complex backstory who looks slightly different from the Teen-Beat magazine conception of "beauty" -- which is really just the absence of anything distinctive -- and she provokes complaints because she doesn't look exactly like all the other identical, characterless drones that young boys think are "beautiful women".

I'm afraid the only kind of people who think the barbie doll is beautiful and Morrigan is not are people who think Brittany Spears is more beautiful than Ingrid Bergman.  These are also the kids who believe a Bugs Bunny cartoon is more artistic than a Carravagio painting because it moves and has more color.

[Jians]

First of all, thanks for taking the time to do the mod.

In my opinion, you should do a vid of the tent sex scene to truly showcase the difference between vanilla Morrigan and your modded one ... static images can only show so much.

If the scene looks much better and is less awkward with the modded model, you know it's solid gold

Modifié par Jians, 17 novembre 2009 - 12:01 .

[Drakonnen]

Okay, here is the test alternate version with the yellow, squintier eyes with the darkest purple lips instead of the rouge lips: http://i99.photobuck...MorriganAlt.jpg

If that is the alternate version people of the more traditional version want, let me know and I'll upload it in a bit after dinner.

Modifié par Drakonnen, 17 novembre 2009 - 12:08 .

[Drakonnen]

Wretched Gnu wrote...

Blah blah blah...

Tell you what, dude.  Since you over simplify everyone else's tastes, and think its stems from some sort of social epidemic, let me make simplify it further for you:

Don't use the mod, and stop worrying about what other people like.

[Twitchmonkey]

Drakonnen wrote...

Okay, here is the test alternate version with the yellow, squintier eyes with the darkest purple lips instead of the rouge lips: http://i99.photobuck...MorriganAlt.jpg

If that is the alternate version people of the more traditional version want, let me know and I'll upload it in a bit after dinner.

Not sure what is up with the lack of eye shine, as you pointed out, but I think I like the mod a little better with the yellow eyes.

While I still prefer the blue-blooded sophistication and scorn of the original over the doe-eyed maiden version here, I am anxious to see what you come up with making her look like a true bear-morphing witch of the wilds. Maybe she won't look quite as attractive as the previous versions, but giving her a wild edge would be nice.

[Jians]

Drakonnen wrote...

Okay, here is the test alternate version with the yellow, squintier eyes with the darkest purple lips instead of the rouge lips: http://i99.photobuck...MorriganAlt.jpg

If that is the alternate version people of the more traditional version want, let me know and I'll upload it in a bit after dinner.

Awesome!

The yellow eyes just helps so much with the transition from "Innocent Cute Morrigan" back to "Wild Sexy Morrigan". And the lip color change accentuates that sexiness very well imho.

Now I really would like to watch a vid of the model in all its animated glory! *Two thumbs up*

If I could also point out that the concept art seems to have the eyeshadow focused below the eyes (eyebags) instead of eyelids, so if that's possible to change ... you could consider that for a v3?

Modifié par Jians, 17 novembre 2009 - 12:38 .

[Drakonnen]

Jians wrote...

Drakonnen wrote...

Okay, here is the test alternate version with the yellow, squintier eyes with the darkest purple lips instead of the rouge lips: http://i99.photobuck...MorriganAlt.jpg

If that is the alternate version people of the more traditional version want, let me know and I'll upload it in a bit after dinner.

Awesome!

The yellow eyes just helps so much with the transition from "Innocent Cute Morrigan" back to "Wild Sexy Morrigan". And the lip color change accentuates that sexiness very well imho.

Now I really would like to watch a vid of the model in all its animated glory! *Two thumbs up*

If I could also point out that the concept art seems to have the eyeshadow focused below the eyes (eyebags) instead of eyelids, so if that's possible to change ... you could consider that for a v3?

There is no way to move the eyeshadow yet, unfortunately.  All we can do is change the color and intensity of it.  That did annoy me some too that I couldn't do anything about that.

[InvaderErl]

Yes, that is perfect.

[Saurel]

MBirkhofer wrote...



I suspect she was intended to be fairly young.  16-23.  They hired Claudia Black, and then remodeled the model in game to match her a bit more, while still giving her a unique face.   I have no doubt the "crow like" aspects weren't intentional.

I'm not sure, mr. Gaider (I just like saying that because in my mind it sounds like mr. Gator..anyway) said that Morrigan is intended to be late 20s to early 30s.

[Jians]

Drakonnen wrote...

There is no way to move the eyeshadow
yet, unfortunately.  All we can do is change the color and intensity of
it.  That did annoy me some too that I couldn't do anything about that.

Ah, don't mind it then. You've captured the essence of Morrigan's sexiness very well with this iteration from my perspective.

Thanks again for the great work. Round of applause for ya *claps*

Now I'm very interested to check out your redesign of Leliana if you're attempting it. Perhaps take that element of green eyed cuteness you did for Morrigan and apply it to her instead, see if it works?

Modifié par Jians, 17 novembre 2009 - 01:16 .

[Kwonne]

The "New" Morrigan looks too innocent and her look does not fit with her personality.



But it's an alternative to those who want a younger, cuter, more barbie-doll version of Morrigan.

[Drakonnen]

Jians wrote...
Thanks again for the great work. Round of applause for ya *claps*

Now I'm very interested to check out your redesign of Leliana if you're attempting it. Perhaps take that element of green eyed cuteness you did for Morrigan and apply it to her instead, see if it works?

Thanks.

Morrigan's eyes are Teal in my original version of the mod, which was the closest I could get to the concept art.

In the Sacred Ashes trailer, Leliana's eyes are either like a pale green or a pale blue, but definitely not the vivid teal.

There is no light green, unfortunately, so I may just give green a shot and run with it, since I like green with red hair anyway, lol.