126 réponses à ce sujet

[Dragoro21]

Surfie wrote...

I soloed that on my mage on Nightmare.

liar, dont believe a thing you say.

[Zibon]

Oh and for extended boss battles you should expect to need to use potions... they are in the game for a reason.

[Dragoro21]

Surfie wrote...

armacham wrote...

Surfie wrote...

I soloed that on my mage on Nightmare.

Bad troll is bad.


Anyway, yea thats a tough encounter. Best way to overcome it is to take down all opposition besides the dwarf bish, leave her for last, also make sure she cant get to any of the lyrium.

Bad player is bad.

That encounter isn't tough at all unless you are a Warrior and don't know how to micromanage Wynn.

Tip: Have Lelianna use your stealth and set up a bunch of traps and then throw a grenade in.  Watch them all die.

Your a liar, no one believes you

[egervari]

newcomplex wrote...

This game isn't oblivion, if you played any bioware or dnd based rpg, realize it is pseudo-turn based. Meaning your going to want to pause every in game "turn" to issue commands on hard fights.

I'll even give you a basic strategy.   I did this with no healer and one nuker mage, I don't see how you could fail with both.    Lay a aoe disable like sleep at the beginning, and reposition near the door.   Have alistar tank the boss (who should have resisted sleep), and lay a aoe freeze/stun on the remaining targets while they are asleep.   Use backstabs, instant crits, and insta shatters to quickly shatter the frozen targets.    This leaves the main boss and a unshatterable elite henchmen.   Burn the henchmen down while wynn keeps heals on the tank.   This shouldn't be too hard.   Before switching to the main boss, send someone to trigger/disarm the traps.    Then, it should be a fairly ez tank and spank until the boss stealths.   Follow her up the ramps, quickly disable the two archer adds (nightmare/stone knockdown from wynne), and burn them with your dps.    Then, refocus on the boss.

What wont work

ZERG BOSS GOGOGOGOGOOGOGOGOGOGO

The difficulty is fine, you just need to start playing right.   Or turn it on easy.   The choice is yours

I know it's not oblivion... why would you think that for? I've played all the early bioware games and I can't say I've ever felt they were this difficult. I feel constrained so much. In BG2, you could have 1 mage and 5 other classes and do just fine. I picked a sorceror my first time through, and played as many types of characters. I don't recall the excessive potting, or characters feeling limited at all. Perhaps because we had 6 characters.

[egervari]

newcomplex wrote...

This game isn't oblivion, if you played any bioware or dnd based rpg, realize it is pseudo-turn based. Meaning your going to want to pause every in game "turn" to issue commands on hard fights.

I'll even give you a basic strategy.   I did this with no healer and one nuker mage, I don't see how you could fail with both.    Lay a aoe disable like sleep at the beginning, and reposition near the door.   Have alistar tank the boss (who should have resisted sleep), and lay a aoe freeze/stun on the remaining targets while they are asleep.   Use backstabs, instant crits, and insta shatters to quickly shatter the frozen targets.    This leaves the main boss and a unshatterable elite henchmen.   Burn the henchmen down while wynn keeps heals on the tank.   This shouldn't be too hard.   Before switching to the main boss, send someone to trigger/disarm the traps.    Then, it should be a fairly ez tank and spank until the boss stealths.   Follow her up the ramps, quickly disable the two archer adds (nightmare/stone knockdown from wynne), and burn them with your dps.    Then, refocus on the boss.

What wont work

ZERG BOSS GOGOGOGOGOOGOGOGOGOGO

The difficulty is fine, you just need to start playing right.   Or turn it on easy.   The choice is yours

Also, you're assuming I have an aoe disabling spell. I don't. To get a good disabling spell, I need 1 more level with wynn. I have 3 points saved up to try out an entire chain, but most of the good disabling spells are in the 4th rank. Now, if wynn didn't waste 3 points on dumb ass earth skills, perhaps I'd have them 3 levels ago, but whatever :/

[hexaligned]

egervari wrote...

relhart wrote...

Well I don't know what you are doing wrong, I just did the fight not 30 mins ago on nightmare. My party was Zev, Wynn, PC (DW tank) and Sten. Not even close to an ideal party, I had no CC or aoe, and still beat it first try. Just kill the white named mobs first, and either have zev disarm the traps or sacrafice someone to run through them.

See... that's what I've been doing. I've tried all sorts of combinations. Even having the tank "hold off" the orange boss while the rogue and sten finish out the white enemies too. The problem is the orange boss hits so hard that the character is threatened by death so easily, and there's not much a healer can do because it happens so quickly. Even if the heal gets through, it makes no difference because the heal itself heals for so little damage. So this means resurrecting party members it the only solution. Is that what you did while you took out all the white/yellow enemies?

Sounds like you are having tank issues then, without seeing your char sheet it's hard to say what, but it sounds like he isn't built like he "should" be.  I almost never directly control my healer, I have her tactics set up something like this :  party member health < 90% cast rejuv, party member health < 75 % cast heal, party member health <50% cast lifeward.  It's been enough for me to pretty much completely ignore micromanaging Wynn, I also focus fire with all my dps single targets, those whit named mobs go down in about 2 secs when focused.

edit : and yes Zev did die during the fight, he decided to run over a trap instead of disarming it, I just left him dead to teach him a lesson.

Modifié par relhart, 16 novembre 2009 - 03:43 .

[lazorexplosion]

egervari wrote...

I made a topic yesturday about game balance here:
http://social.biowar.../9/index/197068

Everything I said still holds true today. I'm at the point in the game where I am in the dwarven section of the game and I'm taking out the carta boss at level 16. 

I have to say, the battle is near impossible with just a healer mage. I mean, how come wynn sucks so much as a healer? Her heals do squat. Seriously... Alistair has 350 health and her heals only heal up 1/4 of that. With such long cooldowns and getting hit so hard, Wynn is freaking worthless. How is one suppose to get through this encounter with wynn as the only mage and your hero character is a dps rogue?

I'm not saying it's impossible... but it requires substantial potting, and some luck. I've died about 8 or 9 times already. I almost beat it, but I lost the tank (alistair) and I raised him from the dead, but the game didn't recognize my heal so nothing happened... which I have to say, happened a few attempts ago as well. There's nothing like a raise dead failing at a critical time because I might not have target the corpse exactly? I thought I did... but whatever.

When the enemies are critical attacking your warriors with tier 6 magical gear and doing 90% damage, and then criting again with a follow up attack... it just makes me think the entire game balance is broken. Seriously... we have sten in tier 6 gear and he gets dead in 2 attacks. There's no time for a mage to react, and even if she does, the second hit does so much damage that the first heal doesn't do squat. Really, healers in this game are terrible, and so are warriors.

I could lower the difficulty down, but I refuse to. I've gotten this far without lowering it - damn if I'm going to lower it now.

There really needs to be a patch. I have no idea how to get reliably get through this encounter without luck and patience. And if I had a second mage that didn't hate me so much, I might not be posting this right now. Totally imbalanced. There's no way it should be this hard.

"Boohooohoo Bioware needs to make every difficulty mode easy because I suck and I won't learn to play and I won't change the difficulty"

Jesus H Christ just lower the goddam difficulty already and stop crying.

And yes, Wynn is my only mage and I'm playing on hard and it's fine.

[fairandbalancedfan]

OP killed it. It's I reject the difficulty and substitute it with my own.

[Inarai]

egervari wrote...

Inarai wrote...

Frankly, I don't get much play out of Wynne's healing. You don't NEED it, and if it's wrong for the fight, perhaps you should be adjusting the party - maybe use Morrigan for damage and control, instead.

Also, what difficulty/system are you on? How are you playing? And besides that... What the hell makes you think that the difficulty isn't something a lot of us are quite pleased with?

Also, there's a couple threads with tactics tips around... I'll link to one in a second.

EDIT:  http://social.biowar.../9/index/167510

Perhaps. The problem is that I do fine for awhile, and then when I need someone like morrigan, I'm so deep in the dungeon that going back to camp just to get her is a bit tedious.

Also Morrigan hates me. I managed to get -27 approval in like an hour with her at the beginning of the game, and I figured if I keep this up, she'll start attacking me.

On the first count, tedious beats banging one's head against a brick wall.

On the second, you do realise that the gifts are bribes for, in part, that exact circumstance, correct?  Morrigan likes jewlery...

And yeah, a lot of the more do-gooder options, she dislikes...  But anything which implies you agree with the Chantry's policies on magic, she HATES you for.  And never, ever ask why she's still there. 

[Zibon]

egervari wrote...
Also, you're assuming I have an aoe disabling spell. I don't. To get a good disabling spell, I need 1 more level with wynn. I have 3 points saved up to try out an entire chain, but most of the good disabling spells are in the 4th rank. Now, if wynn didn't waste 3 points on dumb ass earth skills, perhaps I'd have them 3 levels ago, but whatever :/

You know you could get Earthquake... plus she gets Petrify + Stonefist to instant kill an enemy, so it's hardly a waste.

Modifié par Zibon, 16 novembre 2009 - 03:48 .

[Raisthlin Arckon]

Dragoro21 wrote...

Surfie wrote...

I soloed that on my mage on Nightmare.

liar, dont believe a thing you say.

hes not lying. i did it too. piece of cake

[Blindandbloody]

Ah, do not listen to the nay sayers, I find most combat encounters in this game to be frustrating head aches with little pay off.

I think bioware should redo the combat system so that ALL OF MY KILLS ARE FATALITIES AND NOT JUST SOME AS IT INCREASES STRESS AFTER A TOUGH FIGHT TO NOT GET ONE!



*cough* Excuse the outburst, as I was saying. Nothing in this game is impossible as I was able to to many things without anyone in my party as a mage.

As far as I can tell aswell, lightning spells are completely useless. And once you level beyond a certain point almost all enemies will use you as fodder. The A.I. can be one of the most unresponsive path-finding challenged bastards ever.

Some players may in fact enjoy such a head ache I simply play for a good time and prefer not to dedicate myself to all the random skirmishes as much as others.

[kab]

Is it really so hard to pick up Mind Blast and Force Field on Wynne? You can make it through the entire game with any class, but if you build your main character or your companions poorly it can become impossible. About the only valid "this is impossible" gripe I've seen is that Wynne and Morrigan are the only Mage companions and it is not difficult to end up with neither.



That being said, one of my biggest complaints with the game is that certain spells are vastly overpowered or underpowered and change a great many fights from impossible to trivial. For example, there is maybe one boss fight I have found, including Revenants, High Dragons, that does not become trivial simply through proper use of Force Field. The only one I've found where this is not the case is Gaxxkang. That's not saying much though because you can just use Glyph of Neutralization to trivialize it instead.



In short, there is nothing stopping you from doing this other than poor use of your companions. It is irritating to say the least that certain spells are so terribly imbalanced, but there's nothing stopping you from taking advantage of them on Wynne or Morrigan.

[Evilsod]

Its amazing how much of an ego boost some sad people get from posting about how they used a gamebreaking character setup to win at something in a singleplayer game... probably cheated to lvl25 too no doubt.



I'm confused as to why you aren't using healing pots... by lvl16 (since i did Ozrammar then) you get gold practically thrown at you for selling loot. More than enough to make a load of decent pots through Herbalism.

[Raisthlin Arckon]

Blindandbloody wrote...

Ah, do not listen to the nay sayers, I find most combat encounters in this game to be frustrating head aches with little pay off.

I think bioware should redo the combat system so that ALL OF MY KILLS ARE FATALITIES AND NOT JUST SOME AS IT INCREASES STRESS AFTER A TOUGH FIGHT TO NOT GET ONE!



*cough* Excuse the outburst, as I was saying. Nothing in this game is impossible as I was able to to many things without anyone in my party as a mage.

As far as I can tell aswell, lightning spells are completely useless. And once you level beyond a certain point almost all enemies will use you as fodder. The A.I. can be one of the most unresponsive path-finding challenged bastards ever.

Some players may in fact enjoy such a head ache I simply play for a good time and prefer not to dedicate myself to all the random skirmishes as much as others.

lightning spell useless ? OMG your so wrong. Storm of the century combo magic (which uses tempest) is the strongest spell in the game. Can easily do 75+ damage per tick in a VERY large area.

[egervari]

kab wrote...

Is it really so hard to pick up Mind Blast and Force Field on Wynne? You can make it through the entire game with any class, but if you build your main character or your companions poorly it can become impossible. About the only valid "this is impossible" gripe I've seen is that Wynne and Morrigan are the only Mage companions and it is not difficult to end up with neither.

That being said, one of my biggest complaints with the game is that certain spells are vastly overpowered or underpowered and change a great many fights from impossible to trivial. For example, there is maybe one boss fight I have found, including Revenants, High Dragons, that does not become trivial simply through proper use of Force Field. The only one I've found where this is not the case is Gaxxkang. That's not saying much though because you can just use Glyph of Neutralization to trivialize it instead.

In short, there is nothing stopping you from doing this other than poor use of your companions. It is irritating to say the least that certain spells are so terribly imbalanced, but there's nothing stopping you from taking advantage of them on Wynne or Morrigan.

That's part of my point, and thank you that you just made it elegantly. Wynn doesn't have any of these spells from the get go. Sure, it's possible that I pick those exact spells from all those that are available. And a new player to the game on the first playthrough is supposed to know this... how? 

This is even more of a problem in that certain skills sound good, and end up being crap... and yet it takes many points in a chain to get it. Then wynn's earth picks are junk. I don't care what that other poster said. Earthquake is giant failure of a spell. Anytime it's effective, you don't really need it... and when you really need it, it doesn't do anything.

You are right in one way, I have 3 points saved up on wynn from level 14 to 16. And I guess I have 4 more levels or so to go before I reach the end of the game. So I guess I could get those spirit spells and all of the glyphs... in time. Sadly, by the time I get these spells, I'll be almost done the game, having put up with most of the frustration by not having these spells and when I do have them all, I won't get many oppurtunities to use them.

You can argue I didn't build up my campanions properly. I agree - but there's so many options, how is one supposed to know? It's not like the game's picks are awesome. And some people's advice (like getting arcane mastery because it's "so good" is just plain bad bad bad advice). 

Because of the imbalance of mages vs. everything else, and the imbalance of skills within the mage tree, there is huge potential for a player to mess it up. Sure it's easy if you know what to pick... but with so many combinations being "wrong", I think that's a fault on the game's design and not so much the player. And there is no in-game respec, although I hear there's a mod for it now. Still, should have been put into the game if choosing abilities is this fragile.

[egervari]

 Also, Mind blast isn't as effective as it sounds. If you do the quest where you have to fight 4 mages that cast stuns, cone of cold and so many massive damage spells... you need to stun those idiots for longer than .5 seconds. Mind Blast, as a trial, didn't really do the job. There's 4 mages - how the heck does mind blast help here? I tried force field... got resisted all the time in this encounter. So... I never committed the points permanently.

[Blindandbloody]

Mind blast is pretty useless. I'd rather just invest in cold magic, that's where the real victories are had.

[Kwonne]

The higher Magic value the better heal yes?



Also, use Heroic Defence and Regeneration as well as Group Heal. (while Heal cooldown is refreshing)

[egervari]

Kwonne wrote...

The higher Magic value the better heal yes?

Also, use Heroic Defence and Regeneration as well as Group Heal. (while Heal cooldown is refreshing)

Yep... have the best magic value I can get already...and using all of those spells.

[Raisthlin Arckon]

Mind blast was a life saver for the whole game for me on hard but i agree cone of cold can also be very useful. You could also use the paralysis and revulsing glyph spell combos to paralyse everyone in a medium area for a while and just kill them as they are helpless. Theres also force field and crushing prison combos. Mana cleanse, templar skills, etc, etc, etc. Then you can also use special arrows which interupts spellcasting which makes mages a piece of cake as they cannot cast any spells at all. Damm! use some tactics for god sake!

[Raisthlin Arckon]

egervari wrote...

Kwonne wrote...

The higher Magic value the better heal yes?

Also, use Heroic Defence and Regeneration as well as Group Heal. (while Heal cooldown is refreshing)

Yep... have the best magic value I can get already...and using all of those spells.

whats your magic and spell power values ?

[egervari]

Raisthlin Arckon wrote...

egervari wrote...

Kwonne wrote...

The higher Magic value the better heal yes?

Also, use Heroic Defence and Regeneration as well as Group Heal. (while Heal cooldown is refreshing)

Yep... have the best magic value I can get already...and using all of those spells.

whats your magic and spell power values ?

37 willpower and 45 magic and 44 spellpower.

[LegendaryFluffy]

I haven't gotten to this part yet, but what I do on really hard parts is move back to a doorway and plug all the bad guys up there. If you can, before you jump into a battle, (this doesn't work if the battle is initiated with a cutscene) set your party to hold position, get out a bow or use your mage to attack just one enemy. If done correctly, this causes just one baddie to leave his position and attack without bringing all the combatants at the same time. Switch back to free movement, kill the bad guy, and repeat ad inifinitum.

[Selvec_Darkon]

Potions help, you'd be surprised how useful those balms that offer protection against various types of damage are. It's particularly useful when you are vsing enemies that tend to spam one type of damage. Like fireball.