37 réponses à ce sujet

[Liane Darc]

So I heard a rumor that there might be a way to save the mother which was to let some blood mage live during a quest in act 2 and then when your mother dissapiers to go see him. He supposedly teleports you directly to her >.>? Now im curious if anyone has tried this if so does it work?

[maselphie]

I let all the blood mages that I could live, and my mother still died. So I'm going to guess it's just a rumor.

[Liane Darc]

Awww Darn '

[Maria Caliban]

Nope. There's a blood mage that will help you fight the killer, but no way to save Leandra.

[Rex1493]

The quest is called Prime Suspect. The person you find in the mansion is a blood mage who will bring you right to the killers hideout if you spare him during that quest. However, Leandra will still die if you use him for help. Did this on my play through, so I know it doesn't effect the outcome.

Also, bring Verric with you for a nice interrupt from him while talking to the killer. 

Modifié par Rex1493, 11 mars 2011 - 09:31 .

[UltiPup]

Leandra's death is apart of the plot. I believe it is supposed to be a plot point that is supposed to help people decide if they want to side with the mages or templars.

[LPPrince]

David Gaider wrote...

No, her death occurs no matter what. We actually tried putting in a "save your mother" version in that quest-- the problem we found, however, was that people treated that version as the *only* possible outcome. Everything else was a fail condition, even if it was a more dramatic ending that added to the main plot. Tying that version to things you did earlier also didn't work, as anyone who didn't then do that felt like they either had to start all over again or just didn't know about it, period. 

It was something we went around on for a while, but in the end decided to stick with the dramatic version. It's not about saving your mother, it's about showing what the dark side of magic can mean to someone when it's personal and not some abstract concept. 

He sent me this in a PM earlier today because I brought up the subject in another thread.

[AlexXIV]

LPPrince wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

No, her death occurs no matter what. We actually tried putting in a "save your mother" version in that quest-- the problem we found, however, was that people treated that version as the *only* possible outcome. Everything else was a fail condition, even if it was a more dramatic ending that added to the main plot. Tying that version to things you did earlier also didn't work, as anyone who didn't then do that felt like they either had to start all over again or just didn't know about it, period. 

It was something we went around on for a while, but in the end decided to stick with the dramatic version. It's not about saving your mother, it's about showing what the dark side of magic can mean to someone when it's personal and not some abstract concept. 

He sent me this in a PM earlier today because I brought up the subject in another thread.

Well that sucks. I mean they played around with the option to save her and they discarded it because most people would pick it? About the most stupid thing I ever heard, if I even chose to believe it. That a mage did it doesn't do anything to any intelligent person because obviously, sick people exist in real life where there is no magic. It could as well have been someone who raped her and killed her or something. This is just disgusting and unnecessarily casting a huge shadow over the whole story.

I really like many things about the DA2 story, but some times (yes, this is not the only) I really doubt Bioware writer's ability to think straight. I don't even know how it is possible that the same, more or less brilliant writers make so many good things but then screw up quite a bunch of tiems. This is just one of these things I am going to overlook in favor of the rest of the game which isn't half as bad as decisions like this let on. It was a lame decision. I can't even imagine how it got through and nobody said ... hold a second, we can't do that. Maybe they need more controversal people in their writing and leading teams who actually say something if something is going wrong.

Bioware should consider to change this in a patch or something or I will have to go with a mod that is probably poor quality which would also suck, but not as much as the original.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 11 mars 2011 - 11:30 .

[Blacklash93]

Considering you only have like 3 two-munute conversations with her over the course of 15-20 hours, I didn't miss her much.

[Malja]

Very nice explanation from him... I enjoyed the event, and that just increases my appreciation of it to see it wasn't some mindless 'whoopsie, forgot to implement'.

[M8DMAN]

antze wrote...

I dont know about you, but when I realized what had happened to "my" mother, it was prolly the most disturbing game moment for me:blush:

I felt shocked, appalled. Time to drop some heads..

I said "holy sh*t" out loud when I saw her neck. That mage was into some heavy Ed Gein crap right there.

[MrStorm2K]

It was definitely the most powerful moment of the game for me. Even if you could save her somehow, I doubt I would.

[AlexXIV]

Blacklash93 wrote...

Considering you only have like 3 two-munute conversations with her over the course of 15-20 hours, I didn't miss her much.

Well that's another thing I don't get about DA2. Devs repeatedly stated in this very forum that the game is focused more about the Hawke family. And what happens is that you lose everyone for the largest part of the game. And where are the family themed quests and stories? I mean there are 2 or 3 and then?

It's not so much about missing Hawke's mother, it is about having a weak and lame plot. They are trying to make the players connect with their main character more by having him going through one tradgedy after the other. Like 'Aww, look at the poor Champion, he is losing his whole family. Father dead, brother died, sister died or became a Warden or was taken to the Circle, mother died in the most sick and morbid way some pervert could think of ...

I mean by what kind of people do they try to be taken serious? They make a game about the Hawke family and the story is they all die or something ... That's what Origins did in the human origin story. And we get it cooked up again as a supposed 'brilliant idea to give the game more depth' ... whatever.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 12 mars 2011 - 12:01 .

[AbsolutGrndZer0]

Actually, in my 2nd playthrough I planned it so that my Hawke will be without any family at the end.  She will see all the trouble mages cause, and side with the Templars.  Her sister was the only mage she trusted, because they kept each other on the straight and narrow.  With her sister dead (as I did not take Anders, on purpose), she has no reason to support mages anymore.

[LPPrince]

I didn't find it lame. The lameness came from losing EVERY MEMBER OF THE FAMILY.

What would've made Leandra's perma-death lame is if the writers NEVER thought of including a way to save her, or thought of the back door saving with DuPuis.

They did. And while I still wish they included the option, I can honestly understand why they implemented it.

[XX55XX]

At least we still have Uncle Gamlen.

[LPPrince]

XX55XX wrote...

At least we still have Uncle Gamlen.

The regretful douche bag that he is.

[BaronIveagh]

David Gaider wrote...

No, her death occurs no matter what. We actually tried putting in a "save your mother" version in that quest-- the problem we found, however, was that people treated that version as the *only* possible outcome. Everything else was a fail condition, even if it was a more dramatic ending that added to the main plot. Tying that version to things you did earlier also didn't work, as anyone who didn't then do that felt like they either had to start all over again or just didn't know about it, period. 

It was something we went around on for a while, but in the end decided to stick with the dramatic version. It's not about saving your mother, it's about showing what the dark side of magic can mean to someone when it's personal and not some abstract concept. 

Dear Bioware:

Normally I do not hate on your games.  I have found many of them to be enjoyable. 

This is not one of them.  It was a big step backward for both RPGs and Bioware writing.

To wit: Your first sibling dies no matter what you do.  Your second sibling dies or is taken away in chains no matter what you do.  Your mother is slaughtered no matter what you do. 

While I like dark story telling, the point of a roleplaying game is that the players decide what thier actions are, and tell their own story, not to shoehorn whatever decision the player makes into your idea of what makes a good story.  

If you want a game that is about melee and is a story on rails, why not just call it 'God of Dragon Age'?  I had bought this game with the mistaken idea that it was supposed to be a role playing game.  There is no RPG in this 'action rpg', as the only real decisions that player actually gets is 'What is my character class', 'who do I sleep with' and 'Do I fight the very thinly disguised ****s and thier 'Tranquil Solution' or fight the mages that might, might, turn into abominations or take up blood magic, like the two people I may or may not have been sleeping with the entire game'?  

[AbsolutGrndZer0]

BaronIveagh wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

No, her death occurs no matter what. We actually tried putting in a "save your mother" version in that quest-- the problem we found, however, was that people treated that version as the *only* possible outcome. Everything else was a fail condition, even if it was a more dramatic ending that added to the main plot. Tying that version to things you did earlier also didn't work, as anyone who didn't then do that felt like they either had to start all over again or just didn't know about it, period. 

It was something we went around on for a while, but in the end decided to stick with the dramatic version. It's not about saving your mother, it's about showing what the dark side of magic can mean to someone when it's personal and not some abstract concept. 

Dear Bioware:

Normally I do not hate on your games.  I have found many of them to be enjoyable. 

This is not one of them.  It was a big step backward for both RPGs and Bioware writing.

To wit: Your first sibling dies no matter what you do.  Your second sibling dies or is taken away in chains no matter what you do.  Your mother is slaughtered no matter what you do. 

While I like dark story telling, the point of a roleplaying game is that the players decide what thier actions are, and tell their own story, not to shoehorn whatever decision the player makes into your idea of what makes a good story.  

If you want a game that is about melee and is a story on rails, why not just call it 'God of Dragon Age'?  I had bought this game with the mistaken idea that it was supposed to be a role playing game.  There is no RPG in this 'action rpg', as the only real decisions that player actually gets is 'What is my character class', 'who do I sleep with' and 'Do I fight the very thinly disguised ****s and thier 'Tranquil Solution' or fight the mages that might, might, turn into abominations or take up blood magic, like the two people I may or may not have been sleeping with the entire game'?  

I object to the role I have in real life.  My father was killed by nurses who oversedated him with Adavan, a drug he was allergic to (it sedated him much deeper than most people, very dangerous) and left him on a flat matress when it was noted in his file he had sleep apnea and must be elevated.  However, there was no proof as the amount of Adavan in his system was normal and he had the "body of a 35 year old" (autopsy doctor said that) at 50.  The fact that I was unable to save my father and that my last words to him were "Don't worry, you aren't going to die in here, you'll be home in a week or two" should be changed by God.  I feel cheated.

What you want isn't a roleplaying video game. What you want is a game with a real human on the other side, that can interpret your decisions in 10,000,000 different ways.

What you want is old school 'pen and paper' roleplaying. Try the official Dragon Age Roleplaying Game from Green Ronin, or else my favorite for fantasy based games, Pathfinder (a D&D update (way better than 4th edition IMO) by Paizo) and use the Green Ronin book as source material.

However, I warn you.  Things you don't like can happen even in pen and paper games.  Example, once I had a Mage the Ascension character whose parents were murdered by Nephandi (in Dragon Age terms, Abominations) to hurt her and try to trip her up so she'd make mistakes in rage when they came after her.  She wasn't there at the time, there was nothing she could do to save them.

Modifié par AbsolutGrndZer0, 12 mars 2011 - 02:00 .

[Caldain]

I'll admit, I cried like a little girl when she died. I've never been so upset with a video game before. I guess that's the kind of reaction the writers were looking for but it still hurt. Your annoying little brother dead, your sister estranged, your uncle is a worthless layabout and then your mother dies. Ah, the life of a hero.

[BaronIveagh]

AbsolutGrndZer0 wrote...
I object to the role I have in real life.  My father was killed by nurses who oversedated him with Adavan, a drug he was allergic to (it sedated him much deeper than most people, very dangerous) and left him on a flat matress when it was noted in his file he had sleep apnea and must be elevated.  However, there was no proof as the amount of Adavan in his system was normal and he had the "body of a 35 year old" (autopsy doctor said that) at 50.  The fact that I was unable to save my father and that my last words to him were "Don't worry, you aren't going to die in here, you'll be home in a week or two" should be changed by God.  I feel cheated.

What you want isn't a roleplaying video game. What you want is a game with a real human on the other side, that can interpret your decisions in 10,000,000 different ways.

What you want is old school 'pen and paper' roleplaying. Try the official Dragon Age Roleplaying Game from Green Ronin, or else my favorite for fantasy based games, Pathfinder (a D&D update (way better than 4th edition IMO) by Paizo) and use the Green Ronin book as source material.

However, I warn you.  Things you don't like can happen even in pen and paper games.  Example, once I had a Mage the Ascension character whose parents were murdered by Nephandi (in Dragon Age terms, Abominations) to hurt her and try to trip her up so she'd make mistakes in rage when they came after her.  She wasn't there at the time, there was nothing she could do to save them.

First my condolances on your loss.  Second, it wasn't your decision that led to your father dying.  Don't compare apples to oranges.

I'll laugh at the tremendous irony of someone telling me to play a pencil and paper rpg, leave it as one of the quirks of the internet, and move along to the fact that a roleplaying game is about telling the story of the players.  If you write a likeable character, and then murder them, it's sad and depressing, rarly dramatic, and frequently arouses the ire of the players.

Dramatic would have been a difficult, last instant rescue, possibly a 'big damn heroes' sort of moment, or forcing the player to choose between their mother and some childern, or thier mother and thier love interest.  THAT would have been dramatic.  This was not dramatic.  This was a badly handled attempt to give you a reason to side with the Templars, who are definitly in National Socialist territory as far as morality goes. 

[Dante Angelo]

MrStorm2K wrote...

It was definitely the most powerful moment of the game for me. Even if you could save her somehow, I doubt I would.

^This^

[Blacklash93]

I was so sad to lose the mother who only had no more than 20 minutes of screen-time...

Seriously, the supposed family themes in this game failed hard.