*spoilers ahead*
I'm playing Nightmare right now but I can't seem to get past a certain part that seems way to hard.
I'm talking about the quest to recruit Anders. When you meet up with the tranquil mage and soon a bunch of Templars appear.
I can't get past this part of the game on Nightmare! It's just too hard! My current party is:
Hawke (2H Warrior), Varric (ranged), Bethany (mage) and Aveline (SS Warrior tank).
Any tips on how to beat this part on Nightmare?
Quest: Tranquility on NIGHTMARE, how did you do it?
Débuté par
Guest_Luc0s_*
, mars 12 2011 03:20
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#2
Posté 12 mars 2011 - 03:38
Riloux
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Run down to the door and fight them there. Anders will stay up and tank a couple because he's invincible.
#3
Posté 12 mars 2011 - 04:29
Colma
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Riloux wrote...
Run down to the door and fight them there. Anders will stay up and tank a couple because he's invincible.
This haha. You can do the same thing whenever you get a temporary companion like Anders, Merril, etc.
#4
Posté 12 mars 2011 - 04:51
Grumpy Old Wizard
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Get used to retreating. Like the others said, run down by the door. Try to keep the backs of all party members to the wall so you don't get backstabbed by the Templar Hunter. Anders hopefully will keep some templars occupied so you won't face so many at a time down there. When reinforcements spawn they will take longer to reach you. Use taunt to try to keep the enemy off your squishies.
Modifié par Grumpy Old Wizard, 12 mars 2011 - 04:53 .
#5
Posté 12 mars 2011 - 04:59
Adhin
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I had my Vanguard/Reaver (2h, all str/con), Bethany (in creation for healing), Varric, and Merrill when I did that. I basically sent the 3 ranged to the back of the room by the tranquil guy and proceeded to bash the crap outa the templar group till everyone was dead.
I'd use Bethany and Varric to do Fireball/Explosive arrow where it wouldn't hit my guy. Would use Varric stunning gas bomb thing, actually upgraded that just to get to confusion (FF-friendly). So he's currently my controler (swapped out bethany once I got Isabela).
2 big things besides that I use constantly. I have 3 points in Warmonger currently, 2 in Pummel Strike/Blow, and 1 for Taunt. Merrill has upgraded Chain Lightning, which I have in her AI routines to use anytime someone is staggered. So I'll often target a bigger HP mob with the Pummel Strike, which almost always staggers on impact (about 50/50 vs bosses) and she zaps em for over 1000 dmg. It usually kills elites in a single shot or brings em to 5-10% hp, and zaps everything else for a good bit.
Second thing is I also spec her directly into arcane so I can get Barrier, which I had in that fight as well. Have her setup to use it on anyone whos at 50% hp (usually only Hawke since hes the tank). It was only the 50% Damage resist version but that drastically cuts into the damage incoming. Fully upgraded it at this point.
Another good one, since I'm going in arcane with her - Crushing Prison. Fully upgraded it has a 100% chance to paralyze for its duration against staggered, and does 300% dmg. It's kinda like the chain lightning thing only has added CC and does a ton of dmg over 10 seconds.
Didn't have that for the templar fight with the Tranquil quest but the rest I did (minus isabela of course). So far im lvl 9 and haven't had companion get knocked out yet. But I've been reloading everytime one does, trying to see if I can do the whole first act with out half-wiping on the hard fights.
That all said I think a Hawke Mage, with Aveline and Ander's would be a pretty unstoppable force. I highly recommend ignoring Cunning on a tanking Warrior unless your using Fenris to tank. Thing is he only needs str for requirements, so you don't have to bring his Con up to e32 just to equip the 'good stuff' late game. So you can go 42 str for 2h-weapons, and then rest in cunning. Plus he gets some %defense based skills as well so you should be able to get him up pretty damn high. Add onto that some extra 'stacking' from other buffs and he should be a solid avoidance tank.
Aveline though she needs that 32 con just for shields, and 32 Cunning isn't really worth it compared to putting that 20+ points into Con, that's +100 HP. Keep in mind, Defense gets cut down by -30% vs a boss but it always capped at 5% min. Basically means putting cunning in her is only useful vs normal mobs, and ultimately if your having issues vs normals your not gonna kill any kind of boss anyways.
-edit-
Oh yeah that one thing mentioned above me. 2 things to keep track of with rogue-like mobs. Usually titled assassins (any elite-types using 2 blades). They have a %chance to steal health potions, so I'd make sure you have a good supply on you. You'll get to pick them up later but i've gotten stuck with 0 pots in a fight cause one stole all of em. Also, when they disapear (2 ways they do that) they 'walk away' then come back.
Issue with this is they will often times pick a new target if its with in a certain distance from where they disapeared. So you want to make sure your tank, who should be dealing with them, is far enough way from your ranged units. If they're not that assassin is highly likely to just ignore you after they stealth out and will back-stab your mage/rogue which, often, leads to an instant death for them.
That right there is why anytime there is one, I put the party on hold and send them all further back, even isabela who's melee. Keeps her alive and I don't have to worry about saving her ass, which I almost never can in that kind of a situation. Bastard double-crits outa stealth for some absurd dmg. Also, on NM, they ignore all armor doing that 1 out of stealth attack (more reason to have tons of HP as a tank).
I'd use Bethany and Varric to do Fireball/Explosive arrow where it wouldn't hit my guy. Would use Varric stunning gas bomb thing, actually upgraded that just to get to confusion (FF-friendly). So he's currently my controler (swapped out bethany once I got Isabela).
2 big things besides that I use constantly. I have 3 points in Warmonger currently, 2 in Pummel Strike/Blow, and 1 for Taunt. Merrill has upgraded Chain Lightning, which I have in her AI routines to use anytime someone is staggered. So I'll often target a bigger HP mob with the Pummel Strike, which almost always staggers on impact (about 50/50 vs bosses) and she zaps em for over 1000 dmg. It usually kills elites in a single shot or brings em to 5-10% hp, and zaps everything else for a good bit.
Second thing is I also spec her directly into arcane so I can get Barrier, which I had in that fight as well. Have her setup to use it on anyone whos at 50% hp (usually only Hawke since hes the tank). It was only the 50% Damage resist version but that drastically cuts into the damage incoming. Fully upgraded it at this point.
Another good one, since I'm going in arcane with her - Crushing Prison. Fully upgraded it has a 100% chance to paralyze for its duration against staggered, and does 300% dmg. It's kinda like the chain lightning thing only has added CC and does a ton of dmg over 10 seconds.
Didn't have that for the templar fight with the Tranquil quest but the rest I did (minus isabela of course). So far im lvl 9 and haven't had companion get knocked out yet. But I've been reloading everytime one does, trying to see if I can do the whole first act with out half-wiping on the hard fights.
That all said I think a Hawke Mage, with Aveline and Ander's would be a pretty unstoppable force. I highly recommend ignoring Cunning on a tanking Warrior unless your using Fenris to tank. Thing is he only needs str for requirements, so you don't have to bring his Con up to e32 just to equip the 'good stuff' late game. So you can go 42 str for 2h-weapons, and then rest in cunning. Plus he gets some %defense based skills as well so you should be able to get him up pretty damn high. Add onto that some extra 'stacking' from other buffs and he should be a solid avoidance tank.
Aveline though she needs that 32 con just for shields, and 32 Cunning isn't really worth it compared to putting that 20+ points into Con, that's +100 HP. Keep in mind, Defense gets cut down by -30% vs a boss but it always capped at 5% min. Basically means putting cunning in her is only useful vs normal mobs, and ultimately if your having issues vs normals your not gonna kill any kind of boss anyways.
-edit-
Oh yeah that one thing mentioned above me. 2 things to keep track of with rogue-like mobs. Usually titled assassins (any elite-types using 2 blades). They have a %chance to steal health potions, so I'd make sure you have a good supply on you. You'll get to pick them up later but i've gotten stuck with 0 pots in a fight cause one stole all of em. Also, when they disapear (2 ways they do that) they 'walk away' then come back.
Issue with this is they will often times pick a new target if its with in a certain distance from where they disapeared. So you want to make sure your tank, who should be dealing with them, is far enough way from your ranged units. If they're not that assassin is highly likely to just ignore you after they stealth out and will back-stab your mage/rogue which, often, leads to an instant death for them.
That right there is why anytime there is one, I put the party on hold and send them all further back, even isabela who's melee. Keeps her alive and I don't have to worry about saving her ass, which I almost never can in that kind of a situation. Bastard double-crits outa stealth for some absurd dmg. Also, on NM, they ignore all armor doing that 1 out of stealth attack (more reason to have tons of HP as a tank).
Modifié par Adhin, 12 mars 2011 - 05:03 .
#6
Guest_Luc0s_*
Posté 13 mars 2011 - 01:31
Guest_Luc0s_*
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Thank you so much people! Thanks to your tips I've finally beaten this quest! In fact, I feel like I've become a little better in this game in general thanks to your tips.
The "run down to the main door and fight there" thing really worked. I was lucky, Anders tanked the Templar Lieutenant. so I didn't have to worry about him at all. When the Templar Hunter (the rogue) came, I positioned all my characters with their back against the door and put them on "hold". I just waited for the Hunter to approach me and then I beaten the crap out of him. Everytime he went into stealth mode, I made sure all my characters where against the door with their back, so the Hunter couldn't backstab them. Because my 2H Warrior Hawke did by far the most damage to the Hunter, he was usually attacked by the Hunter, which was perfectly fine as my Hawke had a good amount of health and Bethany kept healing him when Heal was available.
YES, I FINALLY DID IT!
The "run down to the main door and fight there" thing really worked. I was lucky, Anders tanked the Templar Lieutenant. so I didn't have to worry about him at all. When the Templar Hunter (the rogue) came, I positioned all my characters with their back against the door and put them on "hold". I just waited for the Hunter to approach me and then I beaten the crap out of him. Everytime he went into stealth mode, I made sure all my characters where against the door with their back, so the Hunter couldn't backstab them. Because my 2H Warrior Hawke did by far the most damage to the Hunter, he was usually attacked by the Hunter, which was perfectly fine as my Hawke had a good amount of health and Bethany kept healing him when Heal was available.
YES, I FINALLY DID IT!
#7
Posté 13 mars 2011 - 09:09
keginkc
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Okay I got through this last night, and I did it a little differently than I expected. I'm a primal/force mage with Aveline, Merrill and Varric. When the fight started, I immediately bypassed all the mobs, ran down to the entrance. I'm not sure why, luck of the draw I guess, but only the Lieutenant followed. All the Templars and the Archer aggroed onto Anders. So I took the opportunity to quickly kill the Lieutenant. Eventually Templars began to creep down the stairs, and I killed them as they appeared. The Hunter appeared, and I kited him around the upper floor with whoever he happened to be aggroed on at the time. Once all the trash was dead, I fought him right in the center of the room, with my 3 ranged companions spread far apart in case he aggroed on one of them, and then finished him off.
I don't know if I'll ever get that lucky again, the original plan was to clear the adds and then deal with the Hunter and Lieutenant, but being able to kill the Lieutenant right at the start made the fight so much easier. I didn't have to deal with his stuns or his healing.
So I think on future Nightmare attempts (I still have a warrior and rogue Hawke to make...) I will try to focus fire on the LT and then clear the trash, handling the Hunter as he appears.
I don't know if I'll ever get that lucky again, the original plan was to clear the adds and then deal with the Hunter and Lieutenant, but being able to kill the Lieutenant right at the start made the fight so much easier. I didn't have to deal with his stuns or his healing.
So I think on future Nightmare attempts (I still have a warrior and rogue Hawke to make...) I will try to focus fire on the LT and then clear the trash, handling the Hunter as he appears.
#8
Posté 13 mars 2011 - 09:14
soteria
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Thing about killing the lieutenant first is that if he has troops alive and in range he'll order them to attack a character.
#9
Guest_iOnlySignIn_*
Posté 13 mars 2011 - 09:47
Guest_iOnlySignIn_*
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Yeah, kill the lieutenant first. Concentrate all fire, all disabling powers (Horror, Petrify, Crushing Prison, Pummel Strike, Miasmic Flask, what have you) to take him out asap. If you're lucky he'll only drink potions once or twice. When the Hunter comes up, focus fire on him. If he stealths, run all your characters as fast as possible and use Stealth/Back-to-Back/Stone's Throw/Stonewall/Barrier - it would make him fail at his backstab or shift his focus to Anders. When he reappears bombard him. Use potions whenever available. In the end you should have 1 or 2 party members alive plus Anders, versus 1 or 2 Archers plus the Hunter. It's a bit luck-dependent, and the Mabari helps a lot.
Modifié par iOnlySignIn, 13 mars 2011 - 09:48 .
#10
Guest_Luc0s_*
Posté 14 mars 2011 - 12:31
Guest_Luc0s_*
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About the Mabari:
Really dumb question, but how do I unlock the Black Emporium DLC with the Mabari? I pre-ordered the game on Steam and got myself 3 different product-keys but I can't find which one is for the Black Emporium and I don't know where to get this DLC either. Help?
Really dumb question, but how do I unlock the Black Emporium DLC with the Mabari? I pre-ordered the game on Steam and got myself 3 different product-keys but I can't find which one is for the Black Emporium and I don't know where to get this DLC either. Help?
#11
Posté 14 mars 2011 - 01:15
cyph
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#12
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 06:48
Downtown1
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This battle was way too hard.. I for one had a party makeup that couldn't burst the Templar Lieutenant before the other Templars spawned in. Once that happens the Templar Hunter pretty much whoops you.
By fighting down by the door, some of the Templars stay up to fight Anders, which means more time to finish off the Templar Lieutenant before the rest of the mob gets drawn to you.
Must have taken be 1-2 hours for this one battle.
Anyway, seems like almost any hard battle can be made easier by running away (so that the second wave doesn't find you). Which I guess is cheesy, but then again, why the hell do they have enemies spawn in thin air? Dragon Age Origins was much better than this.
By fighting down by the door, some of the Templars stay up to fight Anders, which means more time to finish off the Templar Lieutenant before the rest of the mob gets drawn to you.
Must have taken be 1-2 hours for this one battle.
Anyway, seems like almost any hard battle can be made easier by running away (so that the second wave doesn't find you). Which I guess is cheesy, but then again, why the hell do they have enemies spawn in thin air? Dragon Age Origins was much better than this.
#13
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 07:05
IN1
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Downtown1 wrote...
This battle was way too hard.. I for one had a party makeup that couldn't burst the Templar Lieutenant before the other Templars spawned in. Once that happens the Templar Hunter pretty much whoops you.
By fighting down by the door, some of the Templars stay up to fight Anders, which means more time to finish off the Templar Lieutenant before the rest of the mob gets drawn to you.
Must have taken be 1-2 hours for this one battle.
Anyway, seems like almost any hard battle can be made easier by running away (so that the second wave doesn't find you). Which I guess is cheesy, but then again, why the hell do they have enemies spawn in thin air? Dragon Age Origins was much better than this.
Since NPC Anders is invincible, this battle is not hard at all. And yes, running away is usually a correct decision tactically when facing overwhelming odds. On the other hand, if you are trying to take on 15 enemies while staying in an extremely confined area, the outcome should not surprise you.
Whoever calls tactical repositioning cheesy should stick with Mortal Kombat. It's not an exercise in machoism.
Modifié par IN1, 26 mars 2011 - 07:05 .
#14
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 08:22
Firky
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Well, I'd consider letting Anders take all the heat cheese. Running away, maybe. Repositioning, no.
I beat this on NM at level 7 - just - without any cheese; by my definition, and it was really hard. I took down the Lieutenant very last. Before the 2nd group spawned I made sure that all of the remainingTemplars were nearly dead so I could kill them all together with chain lightning just as the next group arrived.
(And I used lots of healing potions.)
I beat this on NM at level 7 - just - without any cheese; by my definition, and it was really hard. I took down the Lieutenant very last. Before the 2nd group spawned I made sure that all of the remainingTemplars were nearly dead so I could kill them all together with chain lightning just as the next group arrived.
(And I used lots of healing potions.)
Modifié par Firky, 26 mars 2011 - 08:23 .
#15
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 08:34
TcheQ
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Unfortunately, this kind of situation is going to happen a billion trillion times befoere you hit 30 hrs gameplay : / Though it is nice in this case to be able to let infiinte health Anders do all the fighting.
#16
Posté 26 mars 2011 - 08:35
IN1
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>without any cheese; by my definition
Using 'runscript killallhostiles' is cheesy. Maxing out your attributes using savegame editor is cheesy. I do not advocate the abuse of obvious glitches (not that there are any you can take advantage of during this particular fight, to be honest). All the rest, being an integral part of game mechanics, is not (yes, AI limitations are an integral part of game mechanics).
Of course, you can play by whatever custom rules you like. However, by my definition, making a mildly challenging encounter nearly impossible to win by limiting your tactical options (=acting like the AI) is stupid. Not manly, not gallant, just plain stupid.
Using 'runscript killallhostiles' is cheesy. Maxing out your attributes using savegame editor is cheesy. I do not advocate the abuse of obvious glitches (not that there are any you can take advantage of during this particular fight, to be honest). All the rest, being an integral part of game mechanics, is not (yes, AI limitations are an integral part of game mechanics).
Of course, you can play by whatever custom rules you like. However, by my definition, making a mildly challenging encounter nearly impossible to win by limiting your tactical options (=acting like the AI) is stupid. Not manly, not gallant, just plain stupid.
#17
Posté 27 mars 2011 - 02:33
Firky
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^ Fair enough. I wasn't meaning to suggest that letting Anders take the heat was unmanly, just that it's possible to do as a party. (I'm a girl, anyway.) I guess I try to approach these kinds of battles in a spirit they would have been intended to be played in - but using as many health potions in that battle as I did would definitely fit my definition of cheese anyway. Now be gallant and apologise for calling me stupid. (Lighthearted intent.)
#18
Posté 27 mars 2011 - 03:10
sevenplusone
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If you don't want to pull to the other side, kill the commander thing first. That way there's no aura heal, and you can burst down a few archers before the next wave with the hunter spawns.
Wow it took me so long to type this, gotta lay off the wine.
Wow it took me so long to type this, gotta lay off the wine.
#19
Posté 27 mars 2011 - 05:06
IN1
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Firky wrote...
^ Fair enough. I wasn't meaning to suggest that letting Anders take the heat was unmanly, just that it's possible to do as a party. (I'm a girl, anyway.) I guess I try to approach these kinds of battles in a spirit they would have been intended to be played in - but using as many health potions in that battle as I did would definitely fit my definition of cheese anyway. Now be gallant and apologise for calling me stupid. (Lighthearted intent.)
Aha. So it's not womanly, not gallant, etc.
#20
Posté 27 mars 2011 - 05:10
Grumpy Old Wizard
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Aside from running down to the Chantry doors to fight and placing your back to the wall if a hunter is present, I would also like to point out that the templar are weak vs cold. Socket your weapons with a cold rune and you will see your killing speed increased. My latest NM mage already has Anders at level 7 and won the fight very quickly by doing this.
This thread will show you where to get the crafting materials for the rune of frost and you can buy the recipee from Ferildon Imports.
This thread will show you where to get the crafting materials for the rune of frost and you can buy the recipee from Ferildon Imports.
#21
Posté 27 mars 2011 - 05:16
Firky
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IN1 wrote...
Firky wrote...
^ Fair enough. I wasn't meaning to suggest that letting Anders take the heat was unmanly, just that it's possible to do as a party. (I'm a girl, anyway.) I guess I try to approach these kinds of battles in a spirit they would have been intended to be played in - but using as many health potions in that battle as I did would definitely fit my definition of cheese anyway. Now be gallant and apologise for calling me stupid. (Lighthearted intent.)
Aha. So it's not womanly, not gallant, etc.
I accept your apology. Now tell me how the hell to beat the Tal'Vashoth in the cave on NM.
#22
Posté 27 mars 2011 - 05:19
Grumpy Old Wizard
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Tal'Vashoth are weak to cold too. Use Frost runes, and be willing to retreat to more easily defensible positions. Same with the dragons for Bone Pit.
Modifié par Grumpy Old Wizard, 27 mars 2011 - 05:20 .
#23
Posté 27 mars 2011 - 05:46
Firky
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^ This is gunna sound stupid, and after I established that I wasn't stupid too, but where do you find info about resistances/weaknesses etc, in game?
#25
Posté 27 mars 2011 - 05:51
Firky
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Cheers, I was just perusing that right then.
But, is this in game? And enemy abilities too. Like, when a commander does the blue whirly thing, it's healing his troops, but I learned that by observing. I'd like to know what it is and how it works.I guess I was expecting this kind of info to be written up in the game somewhere, but I can't find it.
But, is this in game? And enemy abilities too. Like, when a commander does the blue whirly thing, it's healing his troops, but I learned that by observing. I'd like to know what it is and how it works.I guess I was expecting this kind of info to be written up in the game somewhere, but I can't find it.
Modifié par Firky, 27 mars 2011 - 05:52 .
