2340 réponses à ce sujet

[Generatio]

This was by far the hardest choice I faced in my play through. After agonizing for long while, I let him live.

[Kyosukedei]

Mage killed him, warrior kept him as friend. I don' like same sex romances. Just preference in video games.

[Archangel01]

I killed him. Justice was/is a demon. Merrill was persecuted because of her dealings with demons. Her whole clan was against her. But Anders is misunderstood? He was possessed.The name Justice is a rationalization, Vengeance would have been more appropriate, but less sympathetic. What I found interesting was that all of the problem demons in this story were pride demons. Meredith,Merrill, Anders and so on. The Qunari.Bartrand. Isabella They could have called the episode Pride Goes Before the Fall.

[TJPags]

I only thought I killed him.

[Kabraxal]

I want to kill him before the end of Act 1 now... grrrrrr.

[Lumikki]

Of course I killed him, there was no choise. Andres forced the war to happen, there was no way to avoid it. How ever, I don't have to be part of it.  Act what he did was unbelivable crime, killing so many innocent people. How ever, I also stoped playing there, because game would have forced me to kill a lot of innocent people more because in his act. So, end of game for me, before game really even ended.

Because Anders choise I could not go mage side and because Tempar leader choise I could not go her side. There was no side to choose, than just leave Kirkwall. Of course game did not allow it, so I quit playing.

Modifié par Lumikki, 17 mars 2011 - 01:46 .

[coolair74]

I killed him, he was clearly not the same Anders from Awakening. He was corrupted and just like the Keeper, then only way to sever the link was too kill him.

[AlexXIV]

Lumikki wrote...

Of course I killed him, there was no choise. Andres forced the war to happen, there was no way to avoid it. How ever, I don't have to be part of it.  Act what he did was unbelivable crime, killing so many innocent people. How ever, I also stoped playing there, because game would have forced me to kill a lot of innocent people more because in his act. So, end of game for me, before game really even ended.

Because Anders choise I could not go mage side and because Tempar leader choise I could not go her side. There was no side to choose, than just leave Kirkwall. Of course game did not allow it, so I quit playing.

Well I also thought it i kind of lame that you don't have a middle ground choice. I mean you even get the option to say you don't pick sides, but this option was just another one of those hundrets the game chooses to ignore. I mean how could they have forced Hawke to fight? Fight or I kill you? I would have liked to see that.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 17 mars 2011 - 01:50 .

[Lumikki]

Yeah, why to choose any side, just because some stupid person makes unbelievable crime. Just hang him for the crime, where it belogs.

If I would have sided with mages, then I would done exactly what Anders wanted. He would have successfully forced me to take side and kill alot of innocent templars.

If I would have sided with templars, then I would kill a lot of innocent mages just because Anders action.

If mages and templars can't find middle ground and live with each other, then they can kill each others, but I don't have to help them to do it. There is enough idiot's allready in Kirkwall, without me become idiot too.

Modifié par Lumikki, 17 mars 2011 - 02:14 .

[errant_knight]

Archangel01 wrote...

I killed him. Justice was/is a demon. Merrill was persecuted because of her dealings with demons. Her whole clan was against her. But Anders is misunderstood? He was possessed.The name Justice is a rationalization, Vengeance would have been more appropriate, but less sympathetic. What I found interesting was that all of the problem demons in this story were pride demons. Meredith,Merrill, Anders and so on. The Qunari.Bartrand. Isabella They could have called the episode Pride Goes Before the Fall.

Whoa. Interesting observation.

[Ariella]

Why is everyone so freaking afraid of Sebastian? I'd wished I'd had the option to tell him to go ahead and TRY to raise an army... Considering Starkhaven is in as bad shape and DOESN'T have any mages to depend on. Plus his whole whiny "I'm not going to take the throne back until I have a good reason", was so hypocritical and proved that, yes he was fickle, because to me, it sounded like he was going to raise an army because I picked Anders over him more than what Anders had done.

It makes me seriously considered deleting Exiled Prince so I don't have to deal with him...

[LobselVith8]

TexasToast712, maybe you can engage in an adult discussion instead of throwing labels around? I don't agree with you, and that's the case with people who have different viewpoints. Just look at any Loghain debate. Please refrain from name-calls just because I don't share your views on Anders. I don't think he's a villain for wanting an end to slavery. You don't share that view? That's fine, but engage in an adult discussion instead of insulting me over it. Just because I disagree with your view doesn't mean you should attack me for it.

[LobselVith8]

NeoSparda, I don't think anyone in the Chantry was acting in the interests of the mages. The Grand Cleric wasn't actively doing anything to help them, or even passively. I see Anders wanting an end to the statement, and thinking no one was advocating for the mages, including the First Enchanter. He wanted the mages to fight for their freedom. Thank you for responding civilly to me, even if we don't agree on this issue.

XxDeonxX, the way I see it, it's a debate between subjugation and freedom. There's no middle ground. Whether you believe the Templar Order or the mages are correct, there's no middle ground between being under Chantry control and being free. After a thousand years of being slaves (as multiple characters can refer to the Chantry controlled Circles, including Hawke), I think that enough was enough. As for the Qunari, even Tevinter and the Chantry called a cease-fire to deal with them, and the mages were the edge in the New Exalted Marches against the Qunari.

[Alran]

 I sided with the Mages for a few reasons.
A: Bethany was in the circle in my playthrough.  (Want to take her with me on the expedition next playthrough with a warrior hawke to see how it pans out tho)

B: I got the sense that the mages were resorting to use blood magic because of the actions taken against them.

C: I didnt like the Knight-Commander.  Someone in that position doesnt need to take over a city.


Anders.  Really no other option about it.  I killed him.  

[santipants]

I just finished my playthrough and was disappointed there's no New Game+ option that let's me import my levels, but I guess that's what the leveling glitch is for, right guys?

I let Anders live figuring someone else would kill him, then told him to gtfo before the last battle.

I sided with the mages because the way the templars deal with mages throughout every DA game is purely tyrannical? Why would anyone ever side with the templars is beyond me, they basically lobotomize people who don't agree with them and hold people captive just because of the way they're born. I think some of you pro-templar people would have made great ****s (lolol) but seriously, down with the templars.

I was upset seeing Anders do that because I thought he was lame in Awakenings and really grew to like him up to that point, and I was disappointed in Ordinos too. Just shows if you push people too far they get desperate and do stupid things. Poor old lady.

[Big_Choppa]

Don't worry, they'll probably bring him back in the 3rd. Sort of like when I killed Flemeth and Leliana and they both magically appeared in DA2. Yes, this was even after the import. If I can't control the outcome then what the hell is the point of putting those options in the game?!

[Taure]

Yeah... I killed that jerk

[Nokternul]

I took pleasure in executing him right there on the spot in front of everyone. I like how no one jumped to his defense--that made me chuckle. Unfortunately I think Sebastian thinks I did it for him. Yet again I'm stuck with cleaning up Sebastian's mess cause Mr. Silver Spoon won't get his hands dirty. What a pansy.

[SkittlesKat96]

I kept him alive, though I was very angry at him, Sebastian went to Starkhaven.

EDIT: Jeez, a lot of you guys killed Anders. Maybe I'm too merciful.

Modifié par SkittlesKat96, 19 mars 2011 - 05:17 .

[Ironos]

I killed him. For some pretty good reasons. My Warden told him to make a new life with the Wardens, yes it's almost no better than being the Circle, but hey, you're not dead. Secondly, Justice was a spirit of the Fade who was unwillingly brought into the real, and was pretty chill for what could be a demon, and now what with Anders becoming even more of a whiny ****, well, let's just kill him and maybe save Justice in the bargain. Next, Anders' rationale was pathetic. Start the war, fine, screw it! But your grand opening shot should be to destroy a huge group of Templars, not a bunch of monks. Derp, public opinion is for chumps! So yes, Anders dying was good. If I hadn't sided with the mages in the hopes of maybe keeping the Blood Magic out, and to keep Bethany on my side, the Templars would have free reign.

[Big_Choppa]

SkittlesKat96 wrote...

I kept him alive, though I was very angry at him, Sebastian went to Starkhaven.

EDIT: Jeez, a lot of you guys killed Anders. Maybe I'm too merciful.

I killed him on the basis that he blew up an entire Chantry church full of innocents. Oh, and he started a gigantic war between the mage circles and the Chantry. Way to go, dude. Way to go. <_<

[Nokternul]

SkittlesKat96 wrote...

I kept him alive, though I was very angry at him, Sebastian went to Starkhaven.

EDIT: Jeez, a lot of you guys killed Anders. Maybe I'm too merciful.

You are. Think about it.

You've been helping Anders out with all of his personal BS, his incesant whining, dealing with him basically throwing himself at you, AND dealing with his psychotic multiple personality disorder.

On top of that, you may have also been trying to keep the peace between Mages and the Chantry/Templars, whilst trying to reach an adequate resolution... and maybe you've also been standing up for the Mages against Meredith's own personal crusade, not to mention Fenris' irrational emo hate. All the while Mages have been trying to kill you, your friends, your LI--and HAVE killed your Mother, despite your efforts.

So he basically just pissed on everything you've been trying to do, assuming you took that course of action throughout the game; to mention nothing about the fact that he basically betrayed whatever friendship you had, even after everything you've been through--effectively throwing you, your sister, Merrill, and countless other innocent Mages under the bus to be targeted by the Templars.

Lets not forget the presumably innocent religious people he just murdered in cold blood.

He's a terrible person who deserves to die a much more brutal death than he got. If anything, killing him the way you do IS merciful. I was rather annoyed actually--he was in a perfect position to be beheaded in that scene, especially considering my Hawke was a 2h Warrior.

Modifié par Nokternul, 19 mars 2011 - 05:30 .

[Soldatto Rosso]

 What many may be forgetting when they say that Grand Cleric kept waffling about not picking a side is that as the head of the Chantry of Kirkwall, she still has to answer to the Divine and her cohorts in Val Royeaux. If you played Sebastian's sidequests, she will tell you to meet with Sister Nightingale because she does not want the Divine's forces to interfere in Kirkwall. If she is seen to move against Meredith without ample proof of wrongdoing, the Divine may be forced to condemn the Circle of Kirkwall and call down a Right of Annulment. She may even send her own forces and take over the city herself, as Elthina was afraid of when she sent you to speak with Nightingale. As Grand Cleric of Kirwall, she not only has to play politics in order to keep order in the city, she has to placate forces outside the city as well. If Kirkwall is seen to be a haven for blood mages and its Knight Commander is removed for no good reason, many may see the city as a haven of heretics, and the neighboring nations may call for a Divine March against it. 

The Kirkwall Circle is also unique among the other Thedas Circle of Magi in that it's Knight Commander has an unusual amount of authority, not only over the Circle but the city itself. As seen in Origins, the Circle in Ferelden had a different heirarchy, with the Knight Commander and First Enchanter almost equal in terms of rank. It is obvious that Meredith has overstepped her authority, as the heavy handed treatment of the Kirkwall Circle's mages show. She also advocates the practice of making mages tranquil after their Harrowing, which is against Chantry law. She also oversteps her bounds again during the last arc, as she enacts the Right of Annulment without receiving the go-ahead from the Divine. 

As for Anders, well, I killed him. My Hawke was a mage, and Anders was his best friend. Hawke fully supported his fellow mages, despised the Circle, but absolutely hated blood magic as he has seen the evils it could do first hand. He also has heard from Fenris about the full extent of what free mages can do, as the Tevinter Imperium so clearly illustrates the exact opposite of what the Chantry is trying to do with its Circles. But in the end, none of his personal feelings about the subject really matter, because Anders took matters into his own hands. 

Anders, whether he was influenced by the demon Vengeance or not, went too far. Compromise between Orsino and Meredith might have been possible. Might. But Anders did not want to take the middle ground. He did not want a continuation of the Circle. He wanted war and revolution, plain and simple. He wanted to shock and anger everyone into action. So he killed Elthina, her priests, those worshipping in the Chantry, and everyone who was around in High Town at the time, in order to start his crusade. He knew that this would be the excuse Meredith wanted to break the stalemate, and he knew that she would call for the Right of Annulment. He knew that all the mages in the Circle would be slaughtered, but to him these lives were an acceptable loss. After all, what are innocent lives compared to the Cause? Anders is a fanatic, plain and simple. All that matters to him was the bottom line, and he had deluded himself into believing he was in the right. Even if he died, he knew his cause to be righteous. He even said so himself, calling himself a "martyr." 

I'm not saying that the Circle is perfect; events in both games show otherwise. It is pretty much a prison as well as a haven. In Origins, there were numerous mages who saw their Circles as home. They believed in the Circle, believed in the Chantry, and (somewhat grudgingly) believed in the necessity of the Templars. It is a middle ground of sorts between the tyranny of mages that the Imperium stands for and the tyranny against mages that are the Quanari. It was a system designed not only to protect regular people from mages, but to protect mages from the wrath of the normal as well.

But all that is over, as Anders' war has begun. Not only did all the Circles in Thedas rebel against the Chantry, most likely due to anger at what Meredith had tried to do, but the Templar Order has broken away from the Chantry as well. I'm not really sure what Bioware has in store for the next game, but it is fascinating to speculate.

Anyway, I killed Anders, not because I was angry at his betrayal, (I was) nor because I was shocked at the loss of innocent life. (I was.) I killed him because he needed to die, because there is no doubt in my mind that he would have killed again in the name of his cause. Anders is ill in the head, whether this be from Vengeance or a deep character flaw that has just now surfaced. He would not hesitate to slaughter more innocent lives, and so I did not hesitate to end his. I loved his character, he was very complex and nuanced and extremely well written. But he was a danger to others, and a danger to the city that Hawke was duty-bound to protect.

Modifié par Soldatto Rosso, 19 mars 2011 - 06:18 .

[LobselVith8]

Soldatto Rosso wrote...

The Kirkwall Circle is also unique among the other Thedas Circle of Magi in that it's Knight Commander has an unusual amount of authority, not only over the Circle but the city itself. As seen in Origins, the Circle in Ferelden had a different heirarchy, with the Knight Commander and First Enchanter almost equal in terms of rank.

Soldatto, First Enchanter Irving and Knight-Commander Greagoir weren't equals - just listen to Irving talk about how powerless he was about the Jowan situation in the Magi Origin. Who made the decision regarding Jowan? Greagoir. Who signed the Right? Greagoir. Was Irving even permitted to see the evidence in question? No. Did Irving have any say in the matter? Not according to him, and he seems very resentful over the matter. Look at how Greagoir turns down any possibility of sending more mages to Ostagar despite Duncan's request being made at the behest of King Cailan, with Irving supporting the idea of sending more mages to Ostagar. How many mages were even permitted to fight in Ostagar? Seven. Only seven mages were permitted by Greagoir to fight against the darkspawn, despite Irving's objections. While it's certainly true that Knight-Commander Greagoir delegated some responsibility to Irving, they were hardly equals.

Even with the Magi boon, Irving thanks the Hero of Ferelden for releasing them from "their shackles," and he's a moderate. The Senior Enchanters of the Circle of Ferelden were also ready to ally with Uldred because of Teyrn Loghain's promise to give the Circle freedom (until Wynne revealed what really happened at Ostagar) so it's clear many mages in the Ferelden Circle were unhappy.

Considering that all the Circles of Magi split from the Chantry when Anders showed them that the Chantry and its Order of Templars can be defied, I don't think many mages were content with the complete lack of basic rights and lack of freedom they had, as well as the Chantry being in control.

Modifié par LobselVith8, 19 mars 2011 - 05:34 .

[LobselVith8]

Nokternul wrote...

Lets not forget the presumably innocent religious people he just murdered in cold blood.

The same religious members who are part of an organization who have enslaved his people for nearly a millennia, you mean?

Modifié par LobselVith8, 19 mars 2011 - 05:36 .