ChaplainTappman wrote...
See, I go back to what Anders says, multiple times. There's is no "Anders" and "Justice." They are one and the same, inseparable. And mage or no, Hawke knows enough about mages to know that there's (as of yet) no cure for an abomination. Unless you're going to keep him chained up in the cellar until they figure out a way to separate the two (and hope he doesn't get loose), I don't see what can be responsibly done save kill him.
We're not gonna agree on this one. So let's leave it be. It's something like your playthrough, your choices and motivations; and my playthrough, my choices and motivations. We each do things the other need not understand, even after both of us have stated his/her reasons.
It's a captain's mast, essentially. It's clearly a time of war, and Anders is Hawke's subordinate. The people of Kirkwall have too many fires to put out, literally and figuratively.
I think it's also a kind of courtesy, since Hawke gets this "concession" after having sided with either Orsino or Meredith. Or something like: all of the above.
Like I said, I think Varric is under the misapprehension that Seekers are templars. Consider that Cassandra introduces herself as a "Seeker of the Chantry." If the Seekers had abandoned the Chantry, she would've said something to the effect of "Seeker of Andraste" or somesuch. Taking Cassandra at her word (and she's either honest, or a good enough liar to fool Varric), it's obvious that the Seekers are trying to resolve the war, likely at the Divine's order.
As the game starts up,
Varric: I've had gentler invitations.
Cassandra: I'm Cassandra Pentaghast, Seeker of the Chantry.
Varric: And just... what are you seeking?
Varric seems hardly surprised, or even curious about what a seeker is. In fact, he comes straight to the point. Tells me he might already know what a seeker is. As to what exactly Varric knows or whether he's only being cool about it... who knows? Nothing in the game to suggest anything either way, as far as I could see.
And I'll admit I don't know what the seekers abandoning the Chantry even means. So, the answer's out there at the moment.
No doubt. I omitted the topics of blood magic and demonology because those are higher-level discussions that are necessarily contentious. These things should be studied; my opinion is that there should be a second tier of Harrowing the most talented and least corruptible enchanters would have to pass in order to be allowed to study blood magic and demonology. This eliminates the two great dangers of blood magic: mages would no longer have to make deals with demons to learn blood magic, and since only the strongest would be allowed to learn, they'd be able to resist the demons they attract.
I didn't mean blood magic. That's a different matter, as you put it. I meant with demonic possession, which happens during harrowings also, one'd expect mages, templars, and the Chantry to be actively working on it to figure things out, so to say. To take risks, yes, but that is a part of having to make things better, for the future. Such an attitude/mentality is non-existent.
That said, until there's a cure for possession other than death, and unless you're willing to loose mages incapable of resisting demons, the Harrowing is all we have.
Look at the whole "fear-factor" surrounding
the harrowing. The young apprentices know next to nothing what they'll face when they're forced to take "the test." Now why do this? What is the whole idea behind it? To make a mage better able to resist demons in the longer run, or to say, "Well, you're a mage. Deal with it. And if you can't, we'll deal with you later."
It's not the harrowing itself I'm questioning, but the way the whole thing works. Research into demonic possession ought to help mages in the longer run, I'd think, to remove this whole element of fear and to use respect, reason, and so on, in its stead.
Sure, I know a few here would argue that the whole purpose of the harrowing is to test the mage "in the field." To have the young mage unprepared but yet emerge successful would be a great accomplishment for the mage. But that's not how it needs to really work. Again, it depends on what one's end goal is. The templar order behaves as a rigid military unit, which is why the whole thing works this way, I think.
The evidence we have (which I admit is scant and anecdotal) tells me that the Seekers represent a more liberal element within the Andrastian faith. Cassandra is looking, as I've said before, for the literal truth of what happened in Kirkwall, not the dogmatic truth a group like the Order would claim to possess. And Leliana is not only a high ranking Seeker (Cassandra, herself appearing to be high on the totem pole, defers to Leliana) but is also the Divine's personal agent. But Leliana's notions about the Maker and the nature of the Andrastian faith would be heretical to an organization as zealous and conservative as the Order.
I could put two of the templars in there, namely Thrask and Cullen, and make more or less the same argument. It's just that we've seen a lot more of templars than of seekers, which might lead to bias our opinions regarding the matter.
Alrik should have been dealt with, certainly, but I suspect that his corruption was of too mundane a nature to draw the Seekers' attention. And like it or not (I certainly don't), but Karras is a phenomenal templar by the Order's logic, especially in a restive city like Kirkwall. While (again, anecdotal) evidence suggests Divine Justinia doesn't share Karras' and Meredith's anti-mage outlook, she likely was willing to give templars in Kirkwall a looser rein than in, say, Ferelden.
Please don't misunderstand me. I have nothing against the Divine. I know that both Meredith and the Divine rejected the "Tranquil Solution." And Meredith and Karras are probably both on the extreme ends of what it means to be a templar - Meredith shows this during the final quest when she seems outraged if Hawke decides to let the three or so mages who surrender in the Gallows go, and thus doesn't allow her to perform the RoA to completion. I think that what we see of Cullen in the end is I could hope a reasonable templar to be and behave.
And perhaps you're right about the seekers not dabbling with seemingly mundane events. But that said it seems rather silly if their only role is something like stopping a full-scale mage-templar war.
As of right now, that is, 9:40 Dragon, there's no reason why a mage seeking freedom would concede to returning to the Circle model. Passions are running too high, and besides, they may be fighting a war, but they're free. But time will show the mages that the Circles were created as much for their safety from the public as the public's safety from mages.
Perhaps most mages would agree that they're vulnerable and that they're to some degree dangerous to common folk. And this would always result in them having some kind of friction with the rest of society. But the issue isn't that. The issue is whether the Circles were the only options left. And that too under a dogmatic, superstitious leadership like that of the Chantry-Templar combination. It has been stated before, and I will say it again - the status quo had to go - it wasn't seeming to be working. Whether this war results in a better or worse future for everyone concerned remains to be seen.
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