285 réponses à ce sujet

[Teredan]

I like the push-button something happens philosophy of DA2 combat.
What I heavily disliked is that the speed was a tad too much exaggerated. But the worst thing by far was that every encounter had tons of waves that made tactical positioning nearly pointless or well considering the possibility that I am not that good of a player making it very inaccessible.

Despite that going back to the same tempo of combat as origins would be wrong too in my opinion.

Modifié par Teredan, 11 avril 2011 - 07:34 .

[Grovermancer]

A week or so ago, I saw footage of Ninja Gaiden on G4's E3 coverage.

Looked almost identical to DA2's combat.  Just like I, and many others, have said since day 1.  (ps.  that's not a compliment)


I actually LOL.  Well, more of a chuckle.


Then I thought of all the sycophant apologists, and how they'd tantrum if such a thing were mentioned.  Or make excuses, and pretend it's a good thing. 
I mention it anyhow, because it's true.



In actuality, this is all good.  I responded in that thread a while ago; I'd not preorder DA3 (as I did for DA2, since it had the words "Dragon Age" and "2" in it -- you know -- probably accounting for 50% of DA2's sales)

I've come to realize I'll not even buy DA3, used.  I'm done with this IP.  This isn't only because the creators have sold out and have no integrity or self-respect.  Sure, there's that.  It's also cause I'm trying to get away from wasting so much time gaming.  Thanks to Laidlaw or whoever for making that choice easier.  (I'm serious on that, BTW.  No more Fallout, probably no BioShock, no Total War...  basically TOR is the only game I'm even gonna try from now on, and even that will be cautious.  Life is just too damned short.)


Anyhoo, post any tantrums in the folder: "projection.'"


EDIT:  why I'm posting this now:  bored w/ gaming in general,
realizing what a waste of time it is, a buddy gave me a copy of "Alan
Wake," thinking that would change my snootiness.  I borrowed an Xbox and
tried playing it.  First off, I already played Silent Hill back in the
day.  So nothing new here.  Second, I already played a game that used to
have a palpable, real world and atmosphere.  It was called "Dragon Age
Origins."  That reminded me of the E3 Ninja Gaiden footage.

Modifié par Grovermancer, 16 juin 2011 - 11:21 .

[Zanallen]

Another damn necro. This is getting ridiculous.

[Bejos_]

Zanallen wrote...

Another damn necro. This is getting ridiculous.

Well, at least there's something we agree on, eh?

[billy the squid]

I hated DA2's combat among other things and I too have serious reservations regarding DA3, (and too a lesser extent ME3, if DA2 epitomises the trend in bioware's design) it is unlikely I will buy it or any further DLC unless there are some serious redesigns included.

But, was it really necessary to bring the thread back from the dead?

[Grovermancer]

I guess the reason it was "necroed," was because it's still applicable IMO.

First, based on what I recently saw at E3 -- Ninja Gaiden footage.
Second, on what some like to post... how 'kewl' the (Ninja Gaiden-like) combat of DA2 is.


ps. WHO CARES when a post was made? Is it STILL RELEVANT? Or have the issues been put to rest? Apparently not, based on posts I still see... and I rarely even come here anymore, yet still see them. (people pretending Ninja Gaiden combat fits the DA universe)

[FieryDove]

Grovermancer wrote...

I guess the reason it was "necroed," was because it's still applicable IMO.

This may be true but I think the mods lock most/all necro's and suggest people start a new topic.

I don't really care either way...just saying.

[Ryllen Laerth Kriel]

This thread is still prevalent. I hope Bioware takes this into account when creating DA 3. I don't know a single person I would qualify as even marginally sane, or over the age of fifteen who enjoys DA 2's combat animations.

[Kevin Lynch]

New discussion in an old thread is fine by me, but discussing the raising of a thread from the dead is not needed. Just keep it on topic. Thanks.

[FieryDove]

Ryllen Laerth Kriel wrote...

 I don't know a single person I would qualify as even marginally sane, or over the age of fifteen who enjoys DA 2's combat animations.

That is a bit harsh...no?

I liked some of them so...I am insane...or maybe I *youthened*.

Kevin Lynch wrote...

New discussion in an old thread is fine by me, but discussing the raising of a thread from the dead is not needed. Just keep it on topic. Thanks.

You are always so nice like that.

Modifié par FieryDove, 17 juin 2011 - 12:55 .

[Bejos_]

Kevin Lynch wrote...

New discussion in an old thread is fine by me, but discussing the raising of a thread from the dead is not needed. Just keep it on topic. Thanks.

I was under the impression necro'ing was frowned upon. Okay, thanks for the info.

Modifié par Bejos_, 17 juin 2011 - 01:14 .

[Grovermancer]

Bejos_ wrote...

Kevin Lynch wrote...

New discussion in an old thread is fine by me, but discussing the raising of a thread from the dead is not needed. Just keep it on topic. Thanks.

I was under the impression necro'ing was frowned upon. Okay, thanks for the info.

Isn't "spam" frowned upon?  

Unless you have something to actually add to this discussion...? 

Is DA2's combat more like Ninja Gaiden, than it is like DAO's combat?  (And if so, does that appeal to a certain "mindset?")

And does that align w/ the demo-goals in stated interviews, on record from the honchos?

Modifié par Grovermancer, 17 juin 2011 - 01:36 .

[Zanallen]

DA2's combat is nothing like Ninja Gaiden's combat. Not in looks, not in gameplay and definitely not in difficulty.

[Grovermancer]

Zanallen wrote...

DA2's combat is nothing like Ninja Gaiden's combat. Not in looks, not in gameplay and definitely not in difficulty.

So you've seen it?


Because I have, and it is.



Hell, there's even a move in the E3 Ninja Gaiden footage that literally looked almost identical to Scythe.


So either I was seeing things, or you're wrong/stating untruths.  (again, have you actually seen it?)


edit:  the toon lept in through his enemies w/ a faster-than-the-eye-can-see slash, and everything exploded

Modifié par Grovermancer, 17 juin 2011 - 01:40 .

[Bejos_]

Grovermancer wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

Kevin Lynch wrote...

New discussion in an old thread is fine by me, but discussing the raising of a thread from the dead is not needed. Just keep it on topic. Thanks.

I was under the impression necro'ing was frowned upon. Okay, thanks for the info.

Isn't "spam" frowned upon?  

Unless you have something to actually add to this discussion...? 

Is DA2's combat more like Ninja Gaiden, than it is like DAO's combat?  (And if so, does that appeal to a certain "mindset?")

And does that align w/ the demo-goals in stated interviews, on record from the honchos?

Aw, did somebody hurt your ego? Grow up. I'm apologising to the mod.

OT: The combat animations are fun. That's one of the very few things I actually liked about the game. All of this nitpicking, when there are other, huge problems, is really unnecessary. This is as beside-the-point as "All of the characters are bi".

Modifié par Bejos_, 17 juin 2011 - 01:42 .

[Grovermancer]

Bejos_ wrote...

Grovermancer wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

Kevin Lynch wrote...

New discussion in an old thread is fine by me, but discussing the raising of a thread from the dead is not needed. Just keep it on topic. Thanks.

I was under the impression necro'ing was frowned upon. Okay, thanks for the info.

Isn't "spam" frowned upon?  

Unless you have something to actually add to this discussion...? 

Is DA2's combat more like Ninja Gaiden, than it is like DAO's combat?  (And if so, does that appeal to a certain "mindset?")

And does that align w/ the demo-goals in stated interviews, on record from the honchos?

Aw, did somebody hurt your ego? Grow up. I'm apologising to the mod.

OT: The combat animations are fun. That's one of the very few things I actually liked about the game. All of this nitpicking, when there are other, huge problems, is really unnecessary. This is as beside-the-point as "All of the characters are bi".

In other words: 

OT: The combat animations are fun. That's one of the very few things I actually liked about the game.



That's what I figured.

[Bejos_]

Grovermancer wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

Grovermancer wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

Kevin Lynch wrote...

New discussion in an old thread is fine by me, but discussing the raising of a thread from the dead is not needed. Just keep it on topic. Thanks.

I was under the impression necro'ing was frowned upon. Okay, thanks for the info.

Isn't "spam" frowned upon?  

Unless you have something to actually add to this discussion...? 

Is DA2's combat more like Ninja Gaiden, than it is like DAO's combat?  (And if so, does that appeal to a certain "mindset?")

And does that align w/ the demo-goals in stated interviews, on record from the honchos?

Aw, did somebody hurt your ego? Grow up. I'm apologising to the mod.

OT: The combat animations are fun. That's one of the very few things I actually liked about the game. All of this nitpicking, when there are other, huge problems, is really unnecessary. This is as beside-the-point as "All of the characters are bi".

In other words: 

OT: The combat animations are fun. That's one of the very few things I actually liked about the game.

That's what I figured.

So because I liked the combat animations ... What? What is your point here? I'm waiting.

[Grovermancer]

The best part of this entire topic, is how there are (actually 2) lists of FACTS on the first page...

...and how they can't be disputed.


Sure, you can then try and manipulate the conclusions to said facts, especially if you conveniently ignore logic in lieu of your agenda... but that kinda says something right there, doesn't it?


DA2's (mostly melee) combat animations and speed and atmosphere and abilities were significantly different than DAO's combat, and it was intentionally made to appeal to a certain "sensibility." (guess how that sensibility responds to that statement? That's called irony)

[Grovermancer]

Bejos_ wrote...

Grovermancer wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

Grovermancer wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

Kevin Lynch wrote...

New discussion in an old thread is fine by me, but discussing the raising of a thread from the dead is not needed. Just keep it on topic. Thanks.

I was under the impression necro'ing was frowned upon. Okay, thanks for the info.

Isn't "spam" frowned upon?  

Unless you have something to actually add to this discussion...? 

Is DA2's combat more like Ninja Gaiden, than it is like DAO's combat?  (And if so, does that appeal to a certain "mindset?")

And does that align w/ the demo-goals in stated interviews, on record from the honchos?

Aw, did somebody hurt your ego? Grow up. I'm apologising to the mod.

OT: The combat animations are fun. That's one of the very few things I actually liked about the game. All of this nitpicking, when there are other, huge problems, is really unnecessary. This is as beside-the-point as "All of the characters are bi".

In other words: 

OT: The combat animations are fun. That's one of the very few things I actually liked about the game.

That's what I figured.

So because I liked the combat animations ... What? What is your point here? I'm waiting.

You've already made it in your 2 spam posts, as well as the 2 after, which includes this one.

Unless you can dispute the fact list on Page 1., and/or the implications/conclusions of those lists.

[Zanallen]

Grovermancer wrote...

So you've seen it?

Because I have, and it is.

Hell, there's even a move in the E3 Ninja Gaiden footage that literally looked almost identical to Scythe.

So either I was seeing things, or you're wrong/stating untruths.  (again, have you actually seen it?)

edit:  the toon lept in through his enemies w/ a faster-than-the-eye-can-see slash, and everything exploded

I have seen it. Both the teaser trailer and the gameplay walkthrough. I have also played the other Ninja Gaiden games and know how they play.

The Ninja Gaiden games have reactive combat. You are actively dodging, avoiding any attackings, jumping from walls, etc. Contrariwise, Dragon Age 2 combat is largely stat based. Other than ninpo, Ninja Gaiden's skills revolve around initiating attack combos. DA2 has separate skills that use an energy system. From the videos, it also looks like Ninja Gaiden is using QTEs of some sort. About the only similarity between the two games is that the combat is stylized.

So, while I respect your opinion, I feel that you are wrong.

[Bejos_]

Grovermancer wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

Grovermancer wrote...

In other words: 

OT: The combat animations are fun. That's one of the very few things I actually liked about the game.

That's what I figured.

So because I liked the combat animations ... What? What is your point here? I'm waiting.

You've already made it in your 2 spam posts, as well as the 2 after, which includes this one.

Unless you can dispute the fact list on Page 1., and/or the implications/conclusions of those lists.

Right.

You have an argument to make, but you won't come out and make it.

Okay. Have fun doing whatever it is you're trying to do here.

It's interesting that you won't engage me on the issue of whatever that statement above was meant to convey, but you're more than willing to throw around veiled epithets.

You and Elhanan make people like Zanallen look reasonable.

[Guns]

OSUfan12121 wrote...

Maybe because some people actually like the combat now? I hated combat with a passion in DA:O it was by far the worst part of the game and it wasnt realistic at all. Your not gonna swing a sword, wait 15 seconds then swing it again. Now im not saying combat in DA2 is perfect but its a step in the right direction.

If you don't like football you don't change the rules. You go try a different sport.

[Grovermancer]

Zanallen wrote...

Grovermancer wrote...

So you've seen it?

Because I have, and it is.

Hell, there's even a move in the E3 Ninja Gaiden footage that literally looked almost identical to Scythe.

So either I was seeing things, or you're wrong/stating untruths.  (again, have you actually seen it?)

edit:  the toon lept in through his enemies w/ a faster-than-the-eye-can-see slash, and everything exploded

I have seen it. Both the teaser trailer and the gameplay walkthrough. I have also played the other Ninja Gaiden games and know how they play.

The Ninja Gaiden games have reactive combat. You are actively dodging, avoiding any attackings, jumping from walls, etc. Contrariwise, Dragon Age 2 combat is largely stat based. Other than ninpo, Ninja Gaiden's skills revolve around initiating attack combos. DA2 has separate skills that use an energy system. From the videos, it also looks like Ninja Gaiden is using QTEs of some sort. About the only similarity between the two games is that the combat is stylized.

So, while I respect your opinion, I feel that you are wrong.

Then we'll have to agree to disagree, since I saw footage of the character doing what looked exactly like the 2-H Scythe move.

But on a larger scale... how about this, in regards to DA2's comat:

-- utra-fast movements
-- spasmadic, even twitchy strikes and weapon attacks
-- jumping and leaping all over the place, in the blink of an eye
-- weightless weapons; absurdly too fast strikes and attacks
-- completely wrong, unrealistic and unnatural combat kinesthetics
-- overall movements and techniques a human body could never do
-- combat that amounts to just beating on each other; beating down life of enemies (especially bosses)
-- waves of fodder enemies essentially 'spawning,' all over the place
-- bodies exploding from melee strikes

Would you say that is true?  If not, what specifically is not?

Because that is the same thing we've traditionally seen in most console hack n' slash games, such as Ninja Gaiden, and all the rest.

[Ryllen Laerth Kriel]

FieryDove wrote...

Ryllen Laerth Kriel wrote...

 I don't know a single person I would qualify as even marginally sane, or over the age of fifteen who enjoys DA 2's combat animations.

That is a bit harsh...no?

I liked some of them so...I am insane...or maybe I *youthened*.

Well I did say that for dramatic effect, so I meant no personal insult to you of course.

I do not like the DA 2 animations for the characters, PCs or monsters. The darkspawn look comical as they lurch along at a frantic pace. It looks like it was just sped up at the last second after the animations were already rendered for their movements, almost like an old silent film but without the class associated with the limitations in a pioneered technology. Also the choreography is just rediculous. How is spin kicking a glass flask more efficient (or more accurate) than just tossing it at an enemy? Wouldn't it break if you kicked it instead of carefully throwing it? Why do rogues ninja-vanish for a backstab? Why do warriors often one hand their two handed weapons like baton twirlers in a parade? Why do mages look like they are taking more effort to shoot generic magic bolts from their staves than they do to cast the higher level spells in the game? And why do the staff animations loop so quickly to make them seem so redundant? In regards to age and violence, I was refering to how physics are entirely neglected for both attacker and victim with bodies exploding, being cut in half and blood spraying. None of it obeys any rational thought on an adult level to me. Fantasy combat should try to look a little "fantastic" but shouldn't look like a bunch of clowns with foam rubber weapons inventing their own martial art on day one That's how it seemed to me.

[Grovermancer]

Bejos_ wrote...

Grovermancer wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

Grovermancer wrote...

In other words: 

OT: The combat animations are fun. That's one of the very few things I actually liked about the game.

That's what I figured.

So because I liked the combat animations ... What? What is your point here? I'm waiting.

You've already made it in your 2 spam posts, as well as the 2 after, which includes this one.

Unless you can dispute the fact list on Page 1., and/or the implications/conclusions of those lists.

Right.

You have an argument to make, but you won't come out and make it.

Okay. Have fun doing whatever it is you're trying to do here.

It's interesting that you won't engage me on the issue of whatever that statement above was meant to convey, but you're more than willing to throw around veiled epithets.

You and Elhanan make people like Zanallen look reasonable.

I have.  The thread has.  Your games and pretention don't change that.  It's here for all to see.

You spammed 'necro!  necro!,' cause you like DA2's combat, but couldn't negate the thread premise and given facts; you couldn't offer an actual counter-argument. 

That reflects on you.  (and possibly, on the mindset that would like spaz-kewl console combat, ironically enough)

I also mentioned -- as though it's necessary -- the entire premise of the thread, for you to actually address, after your spam-necro stuff.
Again you run from it and refuse to step up and address it.

Sorry, you won't get this thread closed.  Nice try, though.