114 réponses à ce sujet

[backrow]

great and interesting research, hopefully food for thought for Bioware.

[Dragoonlordz]

Cody211282 wrote...

The polls reflect what me and my friends think, most of us like DA2 and loved DA:O.

^ This

[toggled]

Interesting poll.

I voted in one earlier today (maybe one of yours?) where the OP asked not only the yae/nae question, but also asked the voter to specify which platform they ran the game ran on. The thread was huge, but at a glance, it appeared that PC users were mostly disappointed in DA2, while console users were more likely to enjoy the game.

[StonerMkII]

Jazharah wrote...

I like what you did there, but there is one BIG thing to keep in mind.
You clearly state this is a snippet from the forums, and applies only to the people to the forums, which makes it relevant to us forumites.
The thing to keep in mind is that the people that really really like DA2 that visit these boards, are likely not visiting the forums at this very time. The polls you made were held during the time that DA2 was *just* on the shelves, in its first week; which is the time most people who pre-ordered or got the game at release are spending time inside the game, not on the forums. I am an example in this: I started playing the game at midnight release and am now halfway through my second playthrough while I visited the forums only twice in that time, and I hadn't even noticed your polls.

I wouldn't say your test group is too small to represent a general opinion from the people around here, but I do think that group could not possibly include a relevant representatation, simply because the people who *do* enjoy DA2 were too busy playing it.

It's great to see that you took some actual figures, but I can say with 90% certainty that if you do the exact same polls in two weeks, when people are on their second or third playthrough and come here to check on strategies and make sure they pick up things they missed, your results will be completely different; probably also because the haters are done hating by then. So even then, it would not realistically represent a general sentiment - unless you would compare that new poll with the polls you just held.

Thank you for your efforts though, it's appreciated.

Even in the two weeks, when the "haters" leave, he still wont get accurate results, because those who disliked the game wont be here and would have moved on, leaving those who love the game to taint the results, much like the "haters" are here. A lot of people are still playing the game and not on the forums to voice their opinion.

To the OP it is interesting information but generally you will never get accurate results, because two weeks time, those who disliked the game will move on to something else, and you will be left with nothing but fanboys, and how would that give you any kind of accurate results? Unless EA and BioWare launch a massive polling campaign to get feedback simply polling people here will be next to useles.

[ragnaven]

I had already guessed this though, the forums do seem split, and the fans of both seem to prefer elements of each over ones in the other. Yet gun to their head the bulk is for DA:O, honestly bioware needs to do this. Send a survey to everyone that bought the game, Question 1: Did you finish DA2, if not no other question answer is valid, put trick questions in there incase people lie on question 1. Then see what the registered users think of the games and what they want back from DA:O and what they want to keep from DA2.
Yes that means that some of the people they gained from DA2 will be lost, but the brand loyalty they could inspire with that would earn them more fans, maybe not for the DA series but for their company.

[Sharkey1337]

I'm really hoping Bioware does some serious focus grouping and find a middle ground between Origins and DA2. I just want them to at least see these poll results and really embrace the fact that they've divided their fan community (at least here on the boards).

[SteveGarbage]

Your polling is admirable, but one major flaw is that it takes a sample size only from this site. While the BioWare forums are great to find the most vocal fans, it's hard to say its truly representative of the whole market. I'm sure if you took a poll on Mass Effect 2 when it was released here on the forums it probably would have come out similar, however that game has been highly regarded in the market.

[ShadyKat]

How about waiting a month or so before doing your research. These forums seemed to hate ME2 as well when it first came out. That changed, however. Most of the hate are just PC elitist who hate the fact that the game wasn't made just for them, and them alone. Wait for the rage to die down, and try again.

[Cordoroy17]

"effect Dragon Age 2 has caused on this forum"

you only get the extremists using the forum... further more people still using the forum after release wouldn't be doing so unless they had something to say ?

[Stanley Woo]

I do like science, and this was presented very reasonably. Thank you.

[Gvaz]

Here's what you do for Dragon Age 3:

Don't pander to the idiots who don't like RPGs, They aren't for them and you're just going to tick people off who want them. Unless you stop making RPGs, but that's another beast entirely.

[Jaron Oberyn]

I don't think it's fair to call some of us who dislike parts of the game Bioware haters. The only reason we voice our opinion so aggressively is because we actually love Bioware. We know their standards, and are disappointed when we see them drop it just to make a quick buck (EA).

-Polite

[Mister Swamp]

I love when people make presumptions about the demographic of "forum-goers" haha.

Nice post OP, insightful. It is no surprise that people who didn't enjoy DA:O have nothing to compare it against and consequently call it a "masterpiece", give me a break.

[MonkeyLungs]

GvazElite wrote...

Here's what you do for Dragon Age 3:

Don't pander to the idiots who don't like RPGs, They aren't for them and you're just going to tick people off who want them. Unless you stop making RPGs, but that's another beast entirely.

I like that idea.

[General Flynt]

MonkeyLungs wrote...

GvazElite wrote...

Here's what you do for Dragon Age 3:

Don't pander to the idiots who don't like RPGs, They aren't for them and you're just going to tick people off who want them. Unless you stop making RPGs, but that's another beast entirely.

I like that idea.

There are plenty of action/adventure games out there I cannot understand why they had to mess with Dragon Age like this.

[BFBHLC]

Thank you Sharkey. Let the CoD fans be CoD fans, please... You guys have such an amazing thing to go with here what with the character import / programming, the engine, the scene editor, the talented artists, and might I add the characters and story - don't let the younger generation saturate this beloved genre, as their minds are simple. The Millenial generation is unintelligent and uncaring, they might like the button mashing, but the fanbase you already had - that had BioWare sustained for MANY years, is more than enough to keep you going, regardless of how many billions of dollars that CoD makes...

[Tsadad]

Interesting results, thanks for sharing.

[Kastagir]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

I don't think it's fair to call some of us who dislike parts of the game Bioware haters. The only reason we voice our opinion so aggressively is because we actually love Bioware. We know their standards, and are disappointed when we see them drop it just to make a quick buck (EA).

-Polite

I absolutely agree.  I would prefer to see the word "critic" used more often than "haters" but I suspect that as most of the proponents of DA2 that avidly defend Bioware are doing so simply to be heard while simultaneously claiming that the majority of people are enjoying the game.  If I had purchased the game and was enjoying it, I wouldn't be posting on the forums unless I felt really strongly about it.  

I'm a critic of Bioware's treatment of the DA franchise - first the dramatic decline in quality assurance (as compared to the stellar support in the two and a half months following release) in March 2010 with the Awakening expansion and the 1.03 patch and then in May/June 2010 with the belated and grudgingly presented, insufficient 1.04 update that has since marked the developer's abandonment of the game.

I was hopeful that this meant that extra effort had been spent on making DA2 a superior game, one that would make everyone forget about DA:O's flaws.  Sadly, this is not the case.  DA2 has shown itself to be rushed in terms of depth, detail and variety of environments and dialogue.  It has shown Bioware's focus on appealing to the people who didn't like DA:O for it's sluggish combat (something I've always felt was summarily solved with a simple haste spell) and has resulted in the stripping of all complexity and control from the game.  

The only reason people (well, reasonable people - not spammers or name-callers) go to the trouble to post their critical and sometimes negative thoughts about this game is because they loved Origins to some degree.  I did.  I still do.  I wish support had continued in order to allow it to reach its potential, but any liklihood of that happening has past.  It makes no sense to label critics of the game as haters, since Mark Laidlaw himself pointed out that many of the design changes were made in direct response to critics of the first game.  So, at least some people at Bioware listen to the feedback.  Don't label the reasonable and thoughful critics of this game unnecessarily.  They (we) simply want Bioware to listen because we love cRPGs and we loved what Dragon Age: Origins seemed to imply about the future of the genre.

[Gatt9]

SteveGarbage wrote...

Your polling is admirable, but one major flaw is that it takes a sample size only from this site. While the BioWare forums are great to find the most vocal fans, it's hard to say its truly representative of the whole market. I'm sure if you took a poll on Mass Effect 2 when it was released here on the forums it probably would have come out similar, however that game has been highly regarded in the market.

Mmmm...Carefull there.  Press manipulation kicked in a long time ago.  Alot of sites remove low scores after a period of time when they think a user won't notice.  Especially if a user creates an account just to express his displeasure with one game that really irked him,  they get invalidated for only rating one or two games and then not logging in for awhile.  Some sites also intentionally prune ratings below a certain threshold as trolling,  but leave equally unrealistically high ones.

They see it as a credibility issue,  if they rate a game as an 8,  but the users settle down to a 6,  doesn't look good for them.  So they narrow the spread to be more inline with their numbers,  so they look more credible.  Since their ratings are generally overinflated,  they do it by "Pruning the trolls".

So it's really up in the air how highly regarded it is,  there's no metric that can be used at this point.

Edit:

The problem with pruning the trolls is equivalent to Facebook like/dislike.  Very often people use the extreme ends of the scale and maybe the middle.  Especially the younger you get,  the more absolute it is.  So essentially pruning removes some unknown number of valid responses because many see the range as only 3 options 0/5/10.  Sucks/Ok/Great.

Modifié par Gatt9, 14 mars 2011 - 04:12 .

[DTKT]

I do feel like the sample is a bit small here.

It's also not varied enough.

Interesting results nonetheless.

[Kilshrek]

I think I fall into the "Liked DAO, liked DA 2." I'm not particularly turned away by DA 2 but it could have been so much more.

Rather like ME 2 it drastically changed a formula that only needed a little tweaking. So far though I am much more accepting of the changes in DA 2 than ME 2. My largest complaint with the game so far would be combat, hands down.

[oldmansavage]

Hard to gauge the true amount of Yays and Nays.  There are probably more people that like this game than Origins because its catered to the button mashing masses.

[colata]

Good point but highly doubtful if BW's ever gonna change their strategy.

[RiverLucky]

Sharkey1337 wrote...

 So I was curious at the sheer bipolar effect Dragon Age 2 has caused on this forum. Just how split was the community on the game? I made several polls and found some interesting results. Now granted I'm no professional statician, I'm a lab scientist, but I do understand the scientific method and realize my method isn't solid. HOWEVER, these numbers match up pretty well to each other and clearly matches the forum's enviroment from what I've seen. So let's take a look at some of these numbers.

My first poll was a simple Yay! or Nay! response on an overall opinion of Dragon Age 2. Out of a current number of 417 voters, 215 (52%) responded with Nay! while 202 (48%) responded with Yay! The community is perfectly split on their opinion of the game, 1:2 people either like it or hate it. Seems pretty consistent with the type of threads we've been seeing. poll link: social.bioware.com/956165/polls/16602/

Seeing such a split in opinions for DA2, I created a second Yay!/Nay! poll for Dragon Age: Origins. Only 172 responded on this one, however the smaller pool gives a pretty accurate picture. In terms of DAO, there were 148 (86%) Yays!, greatly outnumbering the 24 (14%) Nays! Makes sense as being a fan of the first game obviously means you're here on the DA2 forum for liking the series so far.
poll link: social.bioware.com/956165/polls/16646/

In seeing that 14% not liking DA:O I figured it was time to see opinions on both games in comparison to each other. Here I gave voters the option of choosing preferance to DAO, DA2, liking both equally, or disliking both. This is where it got rather interesting to me in some of the results. Out of 170 voters, 101 (59%) prefered DAO, 24 (14%) prefered DA2, 42 (25%) liked both games equally, and a whopping 3 (2%) disliked both games.
poll link: social.bioware.com/956165/polls/16696/

In conclusion these polls tell me several things:

• Only half the community likes DA2, a severe drop from the first game.
• Only a third of DAO fans actually like DA2.
• Those that disliked DAO seem to have been won over by DA2.
• 2% of us are trolls, lol.

Overall, it's pretty clear that Bioware has a lot of feedback to listen to on DA2. They've accomplished in winning over people that didn't like DAO, however they disappointed twice that number of fans of the first game. Not exactly the progress I'm sure they were hoping to make.

So fellow community members, discuss!

 

Nice work on the stats. But to get a true reflection, all the people who bought the game and completed it would have to participate.

Not everyone will end up on the forums hence will take it with a grain of salt.

[Cataphract1014]

Not to diminish the polls or anything, but with a game that sold over 3 million copies, and its sequel that is probably over a million. 3 polls that don't even have 1000 votes combined on them mean very little in the grand scheme of things.