7 réponses à ce sujet

[Amphibious Bagel]

I am an extremely new/amateur modeller learning on my own, so I apologize in advance if this is a silly question.

For NWN2 model projects, I've been using the latest version of Tazpn's Import/Export tool with a copy of GMAX 1.2 and am running Windows 7 (64 bit). I haven't had any problems importing/exporting models for placeables, weapons, etc., but it seems that anything requiring a SKIN modifier keeps getting borked when I import it. When I import a head, hair, cloak, or body armor model, all the envelopes appear to be shifted off-center.

I've been able to work around this for hair meshes by manually shifting all the envelopes over to the center again (there are usually only 3-4 bones involved, so it's never been a hassle). Then export them (again using Tazpn's tool) and they show up in game just fine. But manually editing all the envelopes on a body armor or cloak is proving to be extremely difficult, and a lot of times something is skewed, so then the model looks very strange in game. (Warped, verts pulling in off directions, animating strangely.)

I'm not sure if I'm doing something wrong, set up my tools incorrectly, or if there is a conflict with the programs I'm using. If it matters, I noticed that when I import a model, I never get a prompt box to select whether the model is a head/skin mesh etc. as is seen in some tutorials. I can't figure why this is, but I wonder if this is why the envelopes keep getting shifted on import?

Any ideas on how to fix this? Or is this something that everyone has to deal with?


Thank you in advance for any guidance you can provide!

[Hellfire_RWS]

This is an issue I have with the envelopes as well, but not on all models. I think its something we just have to deal with I use 3ds Max 8

[Amphibious Bagel]

So is there a quick and easy way to shift the envelopes? Again, I'm really new at this, so I've just been selecting the little grey squares (the two that allow you to manipulate the x/y/z for the envelope on each end), and individually putting them into place. Is there a way to select all the envelopes universally and get them to shift over? Or is there more to it than simply shifting them on the X axis like that?

If so, could someone point me to or provide a tutorial/information on how the envelopes need to be positioned to render the body armor/cloaks/heads correctly in game?

[-Semper-]

why you want to shift them? the bones are in the correct place and you have to edit the weighting in any case if you're using custom models. perhaps it's better to use the weithing tool together with vertices and let the envelopes alone.

[Amphibious Bagel]

Well, the bones seem to be in the right place, but the envelopes are not? At least, that's what it looks like after they've been imported. I still don't understand why, or if I'm mistaken.

They can't be right since I can import a body model from the OC, but then after exporting it, it's skewed, even though I haven't touched anything.

[Amphibious Bagel]

In detail, here's what I mean:

1) First I import a stock model into GMAX by going to File -> Import. Then change the file type to "NWN2 MDB Importer (*.MDB, *.GR2)". Select the stock male mesh I have in my override folder. Then click "Open." Make note that I never at any time get an option to tell the importer if my model is a head mesh, etc.; I seem to be missing this feature?


2) This is what now shows on my screen. Looking good so far.


3) But...If I go to edit anything on the mesh, and in particular, click "Edit Envelopes", you can see that all the Envelopes are shifted off center. This is bad as far as I can tell.


4) Okay, so without changing the envelopes at all, I try exporting the mesh to see what will happen. You can see in the right hand panels that the NWN2 Exporter seems to be defaulting to "Skin", so I'm not going to touch anything. I simply go to File -> Export, then save this file as an MDB overtop of the model I imported.



5) So now I load up the toolset to take a look at the model...and lo and behold, there's nothing there! I seem to have broken it, but all I did was import/export.


That is definitely not good.

Please keep in mind that I am very new to all of this, so I may have missed a basic step in my importing/exporting that may be an obvious thing to more experienced modellers. If so, what am I doing wrong?

If not, is there a solution to this?

[BigfootNZ]

Max skin modifier exports fine with expotron but ive found importing back into Max borks everything up royally... Bones are almost impossible to move or select, verts weighted all over... but thats to be expected really since im sure there is data missing that wasnt exported that Max needs to do its job with its skin modifier. In your example youve basicly imported a mdl, the import cant be completed right in regards to the skin modifier for the mesh by Max, then youve exported a corrupt messed up skin back into an mdl... hence your last pic

Only way around it is to reweight the model to its bones which can be lengthy, and i wouldnt use envelopes to do that, since NWN2's skins can only take a max of 4 (I think might be 3) bones per vertex... and with envelopes theres chances you'd get more than that limit which would bork things up. Not to mention you'd get horendous deformation if you used envelopes only.

Envelopes are evil , better to paint the weighting, havent done to much with skins in NWN2 yet, but in NWN1 I did alot and it was easy to just select a bone/s, select the verts i wanted influence for that bone, weight em to 1.0 full influence then go in and tweak weights between bones vert/s by vert/s... better results, quicker and a hell of a lot more accurate control over it all...

Set all your bones envelope radiuses to 0 first also.

Just wish exportron imported a useable set of bones (ones you didnt have to click an infinetly small point at the top of bone to move)... Ive been slowly reconstructing the OC skeletons with primitives and aligning them to the originals and linking em up as a duplicate which should work fine since really all expotron is doing is the same thing the old MDL exporters did for skins in NWN1, what the bones are and shaped as is irrelevant, all it needs to know is origin, what its linked to, orientation of its axis and what verts are weighted to it... they'll be a heck of a lot easier to work with and animate (hopefully).

Modifié par BigfootNZ, 17 mars 2011 - 08:32 .

[Amphibious Bagel]

Yeah, I found weight painting seems to be the only option to correct this, which is a royal pain.

However, when I was working with some custom Kobold skins, I discovered the the weights, despite appearing to be off center...seem to work alright and "snap back into place" after doing some very strange clicking around in the program. I haven't found any rhyme or reason to it yet.

But if I do ever figure out a semblence of order to it, I'll post it so others can benefit (and avoid the hassle of custom weight painting things).