156 réponses à ce sujet

[LeBurns]

Well I don't like games changing their fundimental makeup to play better on the consoles either, but I don't image that the developers will take the time to give us two versions of every game.  Heck this game isn't even finished and they shoved it out the door.

The gap between PC's, consoles, HDTV's are closing together and one day it will all be done in one system.  A great big HDTV with built in PC and game console abilities.  These years are what we can call growing pain years.

Granted I still must have a mouse to play a FPS.

[TwistedComplex]

Yeah, they learned their lesson with a big pile of cash from 360 sales

Bioware has been THOROUGHLY educated

[TwistedComplex]

Myounage wrote...

Archereon wrote...

While I don't like this game any more than the next Bioware fan, I must remind you PC=/= less action.

Diablo fans, for example, are hardcore PC elitist. Their forum, which is usually dead, exploded when Blizzard said they might be thinking about future console installments of Diablo.

I said this. Mass Effect 2 was better than 1 for me despite all the actioney elements because that's what mass Effect was suppose to be. Bioware simply forced all of that on Dragon Age because "OMG ME 2 DID SO GOOD LETS MAEK IT WITH SORDS AND SPELLZ"

DA2 isn't a thrid person shooter

Different setting
Different story

Name one thing aside from the dialog wheel that is similar to Mass Effect. And i swear to god if you say "voiced protagonist" I'm going to s*** on your desk. Almost every game ever made has one main character

[JrayM16]

Yeah, forum backlash won't mean ANYTHING if they still make money.

Not that money is the only factor. I'm sure they're disapointed with how many people didn't like the game. But I liked it, and plenty of others did to. Only time will tell if there was any "lesson" to learn at all.

[yoda23]

I found ME2 to be a bit more shallow than ME but that was because Bioware wanted to focus more on the game-play mechanics. With DA2 I think some of the same type of lab testing is also going on. I am pretty confident at this point that Bioware knows the ins and outs of making a great RPG. As a result I see these sequels as opportunities to re-fine/re-work game-play mechanics for the trilogy conclusions. Its in the conclusions or the third episodes of both games where I expect the complexity and RPG elements, which they either didn't have the time or resources to include in the second acts of either 2 games, to be added back in for a more enjoyable experience as a conclusion. I really think that is what's going on here with DA2 and ME2 and it's why I am super positive about ME3 and DA3 respectively.

[Rinkusu]

TwistedComplex wrote...

DA2 isn't a thrid person shooter

Different setting
Different story

Name one thing aside from the dialog wheel that is similar to Mass Effect. And i swear to god if you say "voiced protagonist" I'm going to s*** on your desk. Almost every game ever made has one main character

From memory i can say:

companions have a set armor that changes if they are better friends with you (need to find/buy upgrades but it's the same stuff)

Inventory system is pretty similar

and (even if i can't prove it) i'm pretty sure that if ME2 had melee weapons the fighting would not be that different.

So i can say that some "improvements" came from ME2 ideas.

[Elite Midget]

You can't just pass off the connection that O->2 is very similiar to what happened wirg ME1->2

[Aermas]

Drogo45 wrote...

Another PC Player seeing the influence and control the niche pc gaming folks had slip away. Change, innovation and evolution are occurring and DA2 is a sign of that - and it will occur with or without you.

Evolusion is becoming more comlex & more niched, not the other way around, this is by definition de-evolusion

De E-Volus-ion of Dragon Age
Viva la Re-Volus-ion

[Myounage]

Drogo45 wrote...

Another PC Player seeing the influence and control the niche pc gaming folks had slip away. Change, innovation and evolution are occurring and DA2 is a sign of that - and it will occur with or without you.

Ahh, a more obvious troll I have never seen. Our platform invented every genre. Just thought you might want to know that. Your games will always be a product of our platform.

Also, I did name lots of things they took from ME 2 and tried to force into Dragon Age. That's what the entire OP was. Maybe you'd better go back and read it?

Elite Midget wrote...

You can't just pass off the connection that O->2 is very similiar to what happened wirg ME1->2

Yes, somewhat. ME 2 was more fun than ME 1 though, and the franchise was an action RPG franchise from the beginning. ME 2 really was a case of streamlining, it's a more enjoyable game for it. DA 2 however ... is dumbing down or something. It's just horrible and not fun for more than an hour or so a day. The big difference here is that DA 2 is a radical departure in goal from the first game and is less enjoyable than origins / Awakening.

Modifié par Myounage, 14 mars 2011 - 08:26 .

[Icy Magebane]

I'm going to go ahead and agree with everything the OP said, except for the part about being a PC elitist. This game was trying way too hard to be Mass Effect, and it didn't work at all.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Drogo45 wrote...

Another PC Player seeing the influence and control the niche pc gaming folks had slip away. Change, innovation and evolution are occurring and DA2 is a sign of that - and it will occur with or without you.

I wish people would stop treating "change", "innovation", "evolution", and "improvement" as synonyms.  And stop treating the first three as unmitigated goodness.  And stop misusing "evolution".

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 14 mars 2011 - 08:28 .

[PurpleJesus]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

GregoriusMaximus wrote...

The plot of this game was mindblowingly stupid and nonsensical. X randomly exploding the whole X? Oh C'MON!

No, it wasn't, and if you'd paid attention to the tensions between certain groups in DA:O, then everything that happened in DA2 made quite a bit of sense. It wasn't stupid, unless you consider having a big bad some kind of requirement for a game - or is seeing the bigger picture too hard? Does one always need an archdemon or some other gigantic monster to slay for a game to not be stupid?  DA2 involved a lot of politics, and I think it was a good story, especially given the impact on the world.

Copied from another post i made , if dog boy can do it so can i 

 Ok ill part from my usual tripe remarks lately mostly due to my sense of disappointment with DA2 and give true opinion. 

Why have a known Antagonist ?

It provides focus , a goal if you will , a singular force which represents all that is wrong with the world. 

Why ? because it works.

This week it will be Quidaffi (no idea if that is spelled right)
last week it was Sadam Hussein. 

Look how the human mind wants to simplify the trouble of a whole region into one singular person . 
 It is effective and provides focus. 

You can argue that all great stories are mostly a rehash of a Greek fable or legend. The Greeks really nailed literature before anyone. And most Epic tales are a reinterpretation. 

There are 2 types of Evil characters typically , one far more compelling than the other. There is evil for the sake of evil , or simply born bad you might say , and there is the concept of the fallen .   The latter being much harder to develop in literature , movies , or art.  But if successful  would instantly become a classic figure. 

Born bad is easy , Lord of the rings uses the born bad model , and in my opinion produces the weaker and less compelling villain in Sauron , but also develops the more compelling and complex Golem , a prime example of the fallen . 

But as i am in this forum i will chose some different examples . 

Star Wars , Darth Vader.
A modern classic of the fallen. 

Born innocent , born "Good" but due to a character flaw becomes evil , in this case hate.
it is his weakness that is his downfall , and he is the "Bad Guy" to which the hero's must test their metal. 
It is not hero's strength of body which will prevail but strength of character. A "classic" Example of the   Antagonist  written 
to great effect. 

Dragon Lance: Raistlin Majere. 

Another Great Example , in this case his weakness is pride.

Xmen: magnito 

His weakness is Fear. 

In all of these examples there is a known Antagonist, they are the backdrop against which the hero can show their virtue. 
Often by successfully overcoming that which corrupted the villain. 

Most classic stories , and most Greek "Epic" tales revolve around these concepts. The setting can be space , earth , or fantasy. It is the tale of the human condition , that is Epic. 

And it is lacking in Da2 , as there is no force present to which the hero can prove his worth . And thereby feels less Epic. 

I will argue that in DAO this was present, in the Tivinter mages.... Their downfall .. Ambition . 
The Grey wardens , their virtue .. self sacrifice.

The stage is set from the beginning for a "Epic" tale. This is missing from the second installment. 
The lack of a clearly defined Antagonist  waters down the story , and no amount of combat , or flash can compensate for this. 

Dont dismiss "classic" stories , or their power to speak to the human soul. 
The writing in DA2 was weaker for it's absence . 




Ok now back to mindless game bashing. 

Modifié par PurpleJesus, 14 mars 2011 - 08:30 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

LeBurns wrote...
The gap between PC's, consoles, HDTV's are closing together and one day it will all be done in one system.  A great big HDTV with built in PC and game console abilities.  

No.

[JrayM16]

Myounage wrote...

Drogo45 wrote...

Another PC Player seeing the influence and control the niche pc gaming folks had slip away. Change, innovation and evolution are occurring and DA2 is a sign of that - and it will occur with or without you.

Ahh, a more obvious troll I have never seen. Our platform invented every genre. Just thought you might want to know that. Your games will always be a product of our platform.

Also, I did name lots of things they took from ME 2 and tried to force into Dragon Age. That's what the entire OP was. Maybe you'd better go back and read it?

So, who cares if all game genres were on PC originally?

Seriously, justifiying the point like that is like saying British people are superior to American people because a cross-section of American citizens can trace their ancestry to Britain. 

Also, saying your "platform invented every genre" is disingenuous.  Designers invented every genre and they worked with the PC because that's what they had to work with.  That's what was available to designers when most major genres were invented. 

Your genre-platform point is completely irrelevent.

[AlanC9]

PurpleJesus wrote...
Why have a known Antagonist ?

It provides focus , a goal if you will , a singular force which represents all that is wrong with the world. 

Why ? because it works.

This week it will be Quidaffi (no idea if that is spelled right)
last week it was Sadam Hussein. 

Look how the human mind wants to simplify the trouble of a whole region into one singular person .

So because humans are stupid about how they approach the real world, our stories must be stupid as well?

I'm not so much arguing against you as finding your position incredibly depressing.

Edit: Though now that I think about it, there's plenty of literature without an antagonist. I can't actually think of the last good novel I read that had one. And that very much includes fantasy and science fiction.

Modifié par AlanC9, 14 mars 2011 - 08:49 .

[Contempris]

Mass Effect 2 better than Mass Effect 1? I've heard it all now, are you a Holocaust Denier too?

[AlineSanrider]

What's sad is that BioWare use to be the one company that can't make a bad game...

[Nightrain50]

What I don't understand is... I know they tried to "mass effect" dragon age, but why?? Isn't Dragon Age their best selling game ever?? I just don't understand the reasoning. Mass Effect was a shooter it actually has a chance to pull in the CoD fans and still sold less than DA. It's sales on PS3 were horrific.

[AlineSanrider]

Nightrain50 wrote...

What I don't understand is... I know they tried to "mass effect" dragon age, but why?? Isn't Dragon Age their best selling game ever?? I just don't understand the reasoning. Mass Effect was a shooter it actually has a chance to pull in the CoD fans and still sold less than DA. It's sales on PS3 were horrific.

Exactly

[AlanC9]

No, ME2 is obviously better.

And dude, that's a pretty stupid metaphor. I mean, holocaust denier?

[AxellSlade]

Here's hoping Dragon Age 2 was just spin-off with a naming misunderstanding and Bioware will announce Dragon Age Origins 2 soon.

[Cataphract1014]

Was the lesson on why this game is good? I hope they did!

[Josh.lalic]

Dragon age 2 was probably the biggest disappointment for me this year so far.
I probably wont buy another bioware product after this unless its actually good.

[FierachEredasSoulchiou]

Don't think Merril was supposed to be Tali in Dragon Age or Isabella, Morrigan in Dragon Age 2. That sort of thinking is rather close-minded, attempting to want the characters to be something they're not, and claiming they fail your expectations when they're different from what you want.

[Nerevar-as]

If only they would have taken the good things from both MEs. But they took the worst: repeating scenarios, horrible paraphrasing, decompressed story, less customization...