209 réponses à ce sujet

[FatedHeart]

Its amazing the amount of people who think that bioware actually care about what you want AFTER youve paid for the game.. This isnt a MMO, they dont NEED to keep you interested, they arnt after a monthly fee. Sure they want your cash for expansions.. but frankly there are enough people who enjoy the game and dont feel the urge to whine about it here to make loosing those that do an acceptable amount.



Everything that people have moaned about is addressed in one or more mods. those that have the concerns that mages are too good, or the games to easy go download the mods and play it how you want it.. or better yet... mod it yourself.. and then you can have the game exactly how you want it.

[Unbroken Lineage]

I really feel for those thin-skinned game developers. The crap they have to put up with... Anyway, I'm enjoying the game as it is. Improvements are always nice. But I'm getting nothing but pleasure from this game. Thanks BioWare.

[Schyzm]

F-C wrote...

Schyzm wrote...
tell you what, you can continue to troll me till the cows come home.  I'm going to go back to discussing the actual game.  good luck with your flaming trolls.

It would be different if you were actually having a discussion.

Your 'discussion' amounts to things like : "this game sucks", "bioware is fail",  "i hate the combat" , "this is an abortion of a game"  and so on and so forth.

That is not a discussion, that is just trolling.

I actually explain numerous times the things that are broken.  to some extent everyone knows them.  all the best abiltiies are given to mages, mages have unlimited resource, numerous warrior and rogue abilties are actually inferior to auto attacking.  I've mentioned all these things a lot.  but if it satisfies you for me to mention them some more, then ok.

I assume now that I've discussed things in game you will stop trolling me, if you don't stop then it just further proves how meaningless your constant trolls are.

[addiction21]

F-C if you stop feeding it it will go away.

[F-C]

Schyzm wrote...
I actually explain numerous times the things that are broken.  to some extent everyone knows them.  all the best abiltiies are given to mages, mages have unlimited resource, numerous warrior and rogue abilties are actually inferior to auto attacking.  I've mentioned all these things a lot.  but if it satisfies you for me to mention them some more, then ok.

I assume now that I've discussed things in game you will stop trolling me, if you don't stop then it just further proves how meaningless your constant trolls are.

You can use the toolkit to change the things you dont like, Bioware has even told you to do so.

You have no reason to sit here bashing on Bioware because you dont like something for hours on end when you have the ability to change your game to suit your needs.


Once you have made your points, you do not need to come back just to say things like "bioware is fail" or "this is an abortion of a game" that is what turns you into a troll.

State your opinion and leave it at that, then you are having a discussion. Coming back to just insert flames about bioware makes you a troll.

[Riddley313]

F-C wrote...

The reason they said its working as intended is the lore and the world of the game.

I agree with the sentiment because all of the lore and story points to mages being powerful.


They have given you a toolkit to modify your own game if you dont like something about it.
You have the tools to fix it for yourself.

If people would take all these hours they are spending trolling the forum and instead invest them into utilizing the toolkit to modify their game to their personal needs they would already be finished.

That is something that I find silly.

You are investing countless hours into this forum crusade about classes when if you actually put that effort into something productive like using the ToolKit, you would have something to show for it.

If every single person starts modifying the game to their liking, what's the point of even having a discussion forum for different playstyles, character builds, and party composition? Everything would be dependent on the specifics that are changed by the user. There is a reason why, in the early stages of a game's release, we look to the developer to balance their game appropriately to create a solid foundation from which to build from. It just seems very odd to me that for a game just released, we have to rely on overhaul mods to bring the classes more in line with each other.

In some perspectives, mages may be "balanced" according to the lore, but apparently many people who bought this excellent game don't share this viewpoint of balance. There are those of us that like to explore many different options and character builds, and it becomes increasingly difficult when there's a class in the game that not only does everything, but does it better than any other class.

[Schyzm]

F-C wrote...

Schyzm wrote...
I actually explain numerous times the things that are broken.  to some extent everyone knows them.  all the best abiltiies are given to mages, mages have unlimited resource, numerous warrior and rogue abilties are actually inferior to auto attacking.  I've mentioned all these things a lot.  but if it satisfies you for me to mention them some more, then ok.

I assume now that I've discussed things in game you will stop trolling me, if you don't stop then it just further proves how meaningless your constant trolls are.

You can use the toolkit to change the things you dont like, Bioware has even told you to do so.

You have no reason to sit here bashing on Bioware because you dont like something for hours on end when you have the ability to change your game to suit your needs.


Once you have made your points, you do not need to come back just to say things like "bioware is fail" or "this is an abortion of a game" that is what turns you into a troll.

State your opinion and leave it at that, then you are having a discussion. Coming back to just insert flames about bioware makes you a troll.

how about you state your opinion and leave it at that.  coming back and trolling me w/ the same post 50 times isn't going to help.  I'm not going to stop discussing the game dragon age(you know the thing you never discuss, while you constantly troll me).  

[F-C]

Riddley313 wrote...
If every single person starts modifying the game to their liking, what's the point of even having a discussion forum for different playstyles, character builds, and party composition? Everything would be dependent on the specifics that are changed by the user. There is a reason why, in the early stages of a game's release, we look to the developer to balance their game appropriately to create a solid foundation from which to build from. It just seems very odd to me that for a game just released, we have to rely on overhaul mods to bring the classes more in line with each other.

In some perspectives, mages may be "balanced" according to the lore, but apparently many people who bought this excellent game don't share this viewpoint of balance. There are those of us that like to explore many different options and character builds, and it becomes increasingly difficult when there's a class in the game that not only does everything, but does it better than any other class.

They cant make the game suit every persons needs on an individual by individual basis.

No matter what they do to the game there will be a camp of players on the forums whining about something isnt right and it needs to be adjusted and all that.

It is an impossibilty to please everyone, that is a fact.


That is why the toolkit is there.

Those of you who are not happy can change your game to your needs, while those that are currently enjoying the game arnt forced to play 'your way'.


It is simply an impossibility to make everyone happy at the same time.

[Avispex]

F-C wrote...



You can use the toolkit to change the things you dont like, Bioware has even told you to do so.

You have no reason to sit here bashing on Bioware because you dont like something for hours on end when you have the ability to change your game to suit your needs.


Once you have made your points, you do not need to come back just to say things like "bioware is fail" or "this is an abortion of a game" that is what turns you into a troll.

State your opinion and leave it at that, then you are having a discussion. Coming back to just insert flames about bioware makes you a troll.

You are kidding right?  I mean, you  are doing exactly what you are calling trolling.  This is not a thread for you and nobody here needs your opinion.  This is a thread for people who respectively provided real feedback to bioware and would like an equally respectful response.  Your snippy little comments serve absolutely no purpose.  So you are a fanboy.  Good for you. You have expressed yourself, so keep strolling.  A great troll once said, "Once you have made your points, you do not need to come back.."  Listen to yourself.  You are your own definition of troll.  Buh-bye.

[Schyzm]

Riddley313 wrote...

F-C wrote...

The reason they said its working as intended is the lore and the world of the game.

I agree with the sentiment because all of the lore and story points to mages being powerful.


They have given you a toolkit to modify your own game if you dont like something about it.
You have the tools to fix it for yourself.

If people would take all these hours they are spending trolling the forum and instead invest them into utilizing the toolkit to modify their game to their personal needs they would already be finished.

That is something that I find silly.

You are investing countless hours into this forum crusade about classes when if you actually put that effort into something productive like using the ToolKit, you would have something to show for it.

If every single person starts modifying the game to their liking, what's the point of even having a discussion forum for different playstyles, character builds, and party composition? Everything would be dependent on the specifics that are changed by the user. There is a reason why, in the early stages of a game's release, we look to the developer to balance their game appropriately to create a solid foundation from which to build from. It just seems very odd to me that for a game just released, we have to rely on overhaul mods to bring the classes more in line with each other.

In some perspectives, mages may be "balanced" according to the lore, but apparently many people who bought this excellent game don't share this viewpoint of balance. There are those of us that like to explore many different options and character builds, and it becomes increasingly difficult when there's a class in the game that not only does everything, but does it better than any other class.

I think it's somewhat offensive to just tell everyone "mod it."  I guess you can design a game with as awful a combat mechanics as possible and some fanboi will just say "mod it."  

[Khayman II]

Guess what? They already have your money so they don't have to change s##t. You're not paying a monthly fee so they have no obligation to change the game after release unless it's actually broken. If you don't like the game go play one you do.

[F-C]

Schyzm wrote...
I think it's somewhat offensive to just tell everyone "mod it."  I guess you can design a game with as awful a combat mechanics as possible and some fanboi will just say "mod it."  

did you just skip over my above post looking for something to troll about?

they cant make everyone happy no matter what they do. there will always be a camp of players on the forums complaining about this isnt right, that needs to be adjusted and so on.

thats why the toolkit is there.

if you arnt happy about something you can change it without forcing 'your way' on to the other people who enjoy the current game.



if they change something to how one person likes, he will just be replaced with another person who doesnt like that change. then change it again for that person and he is replaced by someone else who doesnt like that.

its a never-ending cycle and its pointless.

you cannot please everyone at the same time, its not possible.

that is why the toolkit is there.



if that amount of logic is too much for you, then i dont know what to tell you besides you will never be happy.

[Schyzm]

F-C wrote...

Schyzm wrote...
I think it's somewhat offensive to just tell everyone "mod it."  I guess you can design a game with as awful a combat mechanics as possible and some fanboi will just say "mod it."  

did you just skip over my above post looking for something to troll about?

they cant make everyone happy no matter what they do. there will always be a camp of players on the forums complaining about this isnt right, that needs to be adjusted and so on.

thats why the toolkit is there.

if you arnt happy about something you can change it without forcing 'your way' on to the other people who enjoy the current game.



if they change something to how one person likes, he will just be replaced with another person who doesnt like that change. then change it again for that person and he is replaced by someone else who doesnt like that.

its a never-ending cycle and its pointless.

you cannot please everyone at the same time, its not possible.

that is why the toolkit is there.



if that amount of logic is too much for you, then i dont know what to tell you besides you will never be happy.

are you really still trolling me?  how long you just going to troll me w/ the same post?  I'd like to know how committed of a troll you are.

[F-C]

Schyzm wrote...

F-C wrote...

Schyzm wrote...
I think it's somewhat offensive to just tell everyone "mod it."  I guess you can design a game with as awful a combat mechanics as possible and some fanboi will just say "mod it."  

did you just skip over my above post looking for something to troll about?

they cant make everyone happy no matter what they do. there will always be a camp of players on the forums complaining about this isnt right, that needs to be adjusted and so on.

thats why the toolkit is there.

if you arnt happy about something you can change it without forcing 'your way' on to the other people who enjoy the current game.



if they change something to how one person likes, he will just be replaced with another person who doesnt like that change. then change it again for that person and he is replaced by someone else who doesnt like that.

its a never-ending cycle and its pointless.

you cannot please everyone at the same time, its not possible.

that is why the toolkit is there.



if that amount of logic is too much for you, then i dont know what to tell you besides you will never be happy.

are you really still trolling me?  how long you just going to troll me w/ the same post?  I'd like to know how committed of a troll you are.

so you just completly skipped over the meat of my post to make a troll comment?

ironic.

[Unbroken Lineage]

You can just "Block this Person", btw.

--edit-- Nevermind, tried it, doesn't work.

Modifié par Unbroken Lineage, 17 novembre 2009 - 08:09 .

[Schyzm]

Unbroken Lineage wrote...

You can just "Block this Person", btw.

oo sweet thanks.  bummer doesn't work.

Modifié par Schyzm, 17 novembre 2009 - 08:10 .

[Sparklehorse69]

Any reasonable person could see where this thread was going from the title alone. Seriously, "We're" ready for some Bioware response? Please don't attempt to speak for everybody and in case you didn't get the memo, developers almost always treat threads like these like the plague and with good reason.



I mean really, you expect to see these "balance" threads in mmos but in a single player rpg? Really?



Apparently some people think that video games should be completely tailored to their precise desires and abilities. It would benefit people to remember that what one person sees as a flaw, another person might see as a positive.



For example, powerful mages. I personally find that the power the mages in this game have is completely in line with the lore of this world. In my opinion, to weaken the mage in this game actually detracts from the story. That is just my opinion. If you don't like mages you don't have to use one. It's about choice.



My advice is to find a way to play the game that you enjoy or move along to the next game. This is probably the best single player rpg experience to come along in years. Is it perfect? Of course not. Nothing is ever perfect but it's pretty incredible nonetheless

[Wonderboy2402]

T0rin3 wrote...

Avispex wrote...

1.  Difficulty balance.

Too difficult? Not enough? Not enough variation in difficulty levels? Needs clarification.

If I assume you mean too difficult, as most people who mention difficulty do, then this may be an issue of tactics/learning curve/general difficulty, than something that needs tweaks. The BG series of games that DA:O is said to hail from, are notorious for their high levels of difficulty. Now, we're not talking Battletoads difficult here, but difficult based on your approach to any given encounter. It is a stretch from the average modern game to inject this level of difficulty in, but for the genre (as defined by Bioware/Black Isle) it is par for the course.

Personally, it is refreshing to actually have a game where my tactics vary from encounter to encounter, where I have to think about how I can approach the situation differently to elicit a better outcome. For the most part, this is the case with DA:O, the exception being the mage class, or rather, multiple mages working together. Which brings me to my next point....

2. class balance, mana potions for mages with nothing for rogues/ wariors, steep stamina cost for skills making warriors passive during tactical battles.

Fix the mages!! It is a rollercoaster of power with that class. They go from Arcane Missile to Cone of Cold, not very far apart on the skill tree, but vastly different in their power levels. Storm of the Century, Mass Paralyze, Forcefield, etc. etc. It seems the top end of mage power is well above what it should be, and the lower end of mage power is below what it should be. A class full of scaling spells somewhere in the middle would be much better, more along the lines of what you see in the other classes.

The comparison to a rogue is a tier 1 skill that stuns a single enemy for 2 seconds, and a tier 4 skill that stuns every enemy within 10 miles for 2 hours. That's what it feels like when playing a mage.

About difficulty, playing normal with 3x warrior and 1 rogue has points where the difficulty SKYrockets.  I recognized that mages were looking a little overpowered, cone of cold, and decided to play my game with such a party. I think I would be having a hard time with my party makeup on anything harder. Potions are always used along with injury kits.. and I am using every CC and stun I have available. The BIG crowd controller is the barbs song that AOE stuns enemies.

If i don't kill a mages in the first 10 seconds of combat I'll lose the skirmish and have to reload.

[Schyzm]

Sparklehorse69 wrote...

Any reasonable person could see where this thread was going from the title alone. Seriously, "We're" ready for some Bioware response? Please don't attempt to speak for everybody and in case you didn't get the memo, developers almost always treat threads like these like the plague and with good reason.

I mean really, you expect to see these "balance" threads in mmos but in a single player rpg? Really?

Apparently some people think that video games should be completely tailored to their precise desires and abilities. It would benefit people to remember that what one person sees as a flaw, another person might see as a positive.

For example, powerful mages. I personally find that the power the mages in this game have is completely in line with the lore of this world. In my opinion, to weaken the mage in this game actually detracts from the story. That is just my opinion. If you don't like mages you don't have to use one. It's about choice.

My advice is to find a way to play the game that you enjoy or move along to the next game. This is probably the best single player rpg experience to come along in years. Is it perfect? Of course not. Nothing is ever perfect but it's pretty incredible nonetheless

for the four hundred billionth time mmo's did not invent balance.  dnd the godfather of all rpg's has balance patches, the first dnd had them, dnd fourth edition had them.  and if I may be so bold dnd is vastly more balanced than the abortion of combat mechanics in this game.

[F-C]

i would like one of you to please explain how they can make everyone happy at the same time.



you know they cant, you know its impossible, you know thats why the toolkit is there.

[Buckmanius]

I don't see a problem with the balance, I see a problem with "balance-whiners" trying to change the story of the game to fit some imagined idea of a (whats the opposite of an abortion?) LIVE HEALTHY BIRTH combat system. Lets take some of the same fuzzy logic and apply it to, lets say chests.

There is some amazingly usefull loot in chests and some of them are locked. Should all warriors be able to bash a chest? Should mages use a spell slot to learn a "knock" type spell. NO rogues open chests and Mages "zomgwtfpwn" in combat. You know its not going to be changed. You know of a way to change it yourself. Why continue to whine?

[Frash807]

Avispex wrote...

Well, the game is a huge hit.  Congrats.

Clearly there is a lot of excellent work to be proud of.  The game is a beautiful accomplishment of art, music, design, narrative, etc.

We have also seen many fans address confusion concerning a few key elements of gameplay with little to no developer response concerning the following issues:

1.  Difficulty balance.

2. class balance, mana potions for mages with nothing for rogues/ wariors, steep stamina cost for skills making warriors passive during tactical battles.

3.  Inadequate documentation.  No way to know relative value of skills that reduce cost by some unknown amount, etc.

4.  Tactics menu/ default:  AI learning curve/ documentation/ working as intended?  Improved tools for party management would be a godsend.

These are just a few common themes.  Several people have written extensively and constructively and seem to have valid issues that have been articulated well and presented respectfully.

I think we are ready for some kind of a response.

You must be new to any kind of video game forum.  Devs hardly ever respond to any forum.  It just adds fuel to the fire.  The game has just come out and people are making demands for rebalance, tactics, etc.  Just play the game as it is and if a patch comes out, you'll know about it. 

[Schyzm]

Buckmanius wrote...

I don't see a problem with the balance, I see a problem with "balance-whiners" trying to change the story of the game to fit some imagined idea of a (whats the opposite of an abortion?) LIVE HEALTHY BIRTH combat system. Lets take some of the same fuzzy logic and apply it to, lets say chests.
There is some amazingly usefull loot in chests and some of them are locked. Should all warriors be able to bash a chest? Should mages use a spell slot to learn a "knock" type spell. NO rogues open chests and Mages "zomgwtfpwn" in combat. You know its not going to be changed. You know of a way to change it yourself. Why continue to whine?

yes that's an excellent trade.  mages annihilate everything in combat and rogues are locksmiths.  maybe if bioware taught rogues how to be plumbers they could double their usefulness.

[Buckmanius]

Schyzm wrote...

yes that's an excellent trade.  mages annihilate everything in combat and rogues are locksmiths.  maybe if bioware taught rogues how to be plumbers they could double their usefulness.

If i give you a lol  to the plumber thing  would you please respond to the question:   Why continue to whine?