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[Anomaly-]

I wrote this months ago after I finished the game in a thread of it's own, because I expected it to cause some discussion. I'll link it here rather than paste it, because it's long and anytime I paste something on these boards the text alignment gets all screwed up.

http://social.biowar...5/index/6764219

Modifié par Anomaly-, 21 juin 2011 - 08:52 .

[catofnine]

I normally don't bother with writing reviews, but I'd like to give my feedback here in hopes of seeing more of the things I like in DA3 and less of the stuff I don't.

Loved:
1. Companions--Unlike Origins there's no more interrogating them at the party camp, or buying them with gifts.  DA2 gifts felt more meaningful.  Also, enjoyed learning more about them and their beliefs through party banter and their interactions with each other.  I liked seeing how their attitudes change toward each other over time and parsing out their personal quests over three acts was well done.  I like that Hawke is not the center of their universe.  They're not there just *waiting* on Hawke to talk them.  I didn't think I'd like all the companions, but I did...even Fenris.  Some might argue the writing is a bit sparse, but I found their story arcs touching.  Sometimes less is more.  I'd like to see this character presentation style return for DA3.  I found this cast much more interesting than that of Origins. There were bits that just made me laugh hysterically.  I didn't have as many of those moments in Origins. Kudos to the writing team. Also, I know you guys are still getting flack for making some of them Hawkesexual, but thank you for opting to be inclusive of all people who play your games.  It means a lot.

2. Combat--I love how quickly melee closed gaps and the way abilities feel more responsive.  Combat is more engaging here than in Origins due to the wave system keeping me on my toes, and DA2 nightmare mode stays nightmare mode throughout the game.  Origins' nightmare mode became trivial after L10.  Playing a 2hdr warrior here finally feels fun, until you sods nerfed it in 1.03. (God, why?? Why you do this?? /sadfase)

3. Crafting--thank you for one stop crafting.  I hated the tedious trundling to various maps to get reagents in Origins, and I'm glad to see that particular time sink gone in DA2.

4. Making companion armor unique-- I like the idea of giving them property/attribute upgrades instead of whittling away play time playing dress up with them in the inventory window.  That might be fun for others, but my love for
that sort of max/mining died when my free time took a nose dive.  Please bring this back in DA3, but with more choices and flexibility please i.e. more passives or the option to have more rune slots instead of passives etc.

5. Dialog wheel and VO-- I was not sold on it at first, but came around to it over time.  Loved how it seems like you can mold your own Hawke's personality and that NPCs really respond to your choices.  Picked some aggressive options with Meredith in Act III, and it was one of the most heated exchanges I've ever seen in any of your games. 
Didn't think you guys could pull this off, and I would normally prefer a silent protagonist, but kudos you changed my mind.  I enjoyed it.


Please improve:
1. Inventory "streamlining"--whatever time you saved by not having to hand pick your companion's gear is frittered away by dealing with an inventory that looks like this:
 
RING
RING
RING
ORNATE RING
BELT
BELT
ORNATE BELT
ORNATE BELT
" "

So on and so forth. Not helpful, guys. Can I suggest the use of more descriptive names here?  I don't care if a +5% fire damage ring is called "Ring of WTFBBQ" and corresponding upgrades or downgrades are called "Lesser WTFBBQ" or "Greater WTFBBQ"... hell, anything would have been better than just simply "RING."  I'd like to get an idea of the item's properties without having to mouse over every. single. iteration of it.

2. Bring back "compare to" from the inventory screen in Origins and the ability to see all of your companions and talents in one go at a designated home base.  I hated having to play musical chairs with all my companions and having to go in and out of Hawke's home in order to level them up or check their gear.

3. Allow an option to junk unwanted gear right from the loot box window.  Saves you time from having to sift through an inventory such as the one above just to trash something. 

4. Combat: shoddy gameplay mechanics, please get the hell out of my way.   I like the waves system, but I hate that sometimes the most infuriating things in those fights are: dealing with an uncomfortably tight camera and wonky AI behavior.  DA2, I've seen your ceilings, and they're sooooooooo not  worth trading in the iso-camera.  No deal.  Let us pull the camera back further and give us a better view of the field in DA3, please. 

Also, AI behavior here is worse than in Origins.  I just love it when my ranged set to "ranged" forget how to shoot when a melee unit gets too close and just bravely stand there while getting aoe'd.  Valiente!!  My personal favorite is when companions set to aggressive forget how to give chase when an enemy moves away. 
Izzy, darling, if we want their stuff, we have to kill them first.

I have some tart words for the person who broke my "hold" button, but for DA3 can we go back to keeping party members untethered?  When I hit "hold", I expect my companions to stay where they are...not "inch up and make me groan in consternation." 

You gave me all these shiny smashmouth/fun abilities to play with, but you've gimped my style!  Sometimes it's the little things that make a game wonderful for you, other times it's also the little things that'll make you nerdrage pretty hard while playing it.

5. Waves/Boss fights and enemy AI in general.  I don't share other people's hatred for the waves system.  I actually do enjoy systematically taking apart the waves, but I also share their call for a more judicious use of the wave system.  I don't know if its meant to be representative of Varric's love of tall tales, but not every fight needs to have waves and waves of bodies flying around.  If it is the dwarf's doing, I'd much rather he stick to embellishing Bethany/Isabela's cleavage than inflating Hawke's battle prowess with an astronomical kill count.  Maybe roll back the waves a tad in DA3?

I disliked seeing you guys tuning the difficulty of certain boss fights with the waves mechanic.  On some of these boss fights, you respected the waves more than you do the bosses' abilities...Xebenkeck and Hybris comes to mind.  Your more interesting and challenging fights were those that didn't rely too heavily on waves: Ancient Rock Wraith, Act III high dragon (pre nerf), and those three revenants atop Sundermount in Act III.  I was actually very glad to have not been playing on the console when I met those revenants...my controller would have went flying across the room just out of the sheer frustration of trying to deal with all three at once.

Enemy AI: Please make enemy mages less stupid in DA3-- the same goes for your lieutenants and desire demons.  With the exception of Huon in Act III, you can ignore most of them and dust their friends. Yes, even on nightmare.  Your assassins with the uninterruptable lolbackflip iWin button were the only deadly units on the field.  It shouldn't be so.  Make me worry about high end targets again.

6. Delivery quests: Who is Wrexler, and why should I give a crap about his hat?  For the record I enjoyed most of the quests in the game.  I understand these delivery quests are xp padding, but I think they could have benefited with a little more set up.  It's disconcerting to pick up an item and have the journal tell you to cash in at X map.  My
suggestion would be to plant better bread crumbs with these quests...even if they are simply one liners. 

Example using Wrexler's quest:
-In Act 1 you meet Wrexler in the Hanged Man, click on him and he fires off a scripted drunk one liner about the
hat or have some other patron make some mention of it. 
-Act 2, he could be in the tavern bellyaching about having lost it. 
-When you do find the hat later in the game, you'll have some idea of who to bring this hat. 
You can also have Varric or Isabela (Hanged Man regulars) fire off a one liner upon receipt of the hat and such.

Point is instead of making these quests droll xp padding, you could take off the training wheels (codex entries, plot arrows) for once and reward players for actually paying attention to the world/environs you've built.  After all, these quests are just trivial bonus xp, right?

7.  Story/Presentation: Handling of the Hawke v. Arishok duel makes me cry with sad.  I'm not even going to touch upon Meredith/Orsino endgame in Act III--I will say that the companion quests were the only redeeming things in Act III for me.  Merrill's quest and giving her the last gift were just profound and heavy moments that I did not expect out of the game. Well done there.  I find the Arishok duel problematic because as far as duels go the actual fight was pretty uninspired and boring. 

Duels in media aren't interesting solely because of the buttwhupping, flash of cutlery, gunpowder, pyrotechnics or what have you.  The little things that happen during the duel can also make them interesting: the looks on the combatant's faces, their movements and gestures, reactions from the crowd, the intermittent dialog in between fighting.  Duels, imo, are more than just a clashing of arms until one party yields or loses.  It's also a chance to show the audience something about the characters that they haven't seen before. 

If we're to be tasked to whittle down a boss like the Arishok, instead of having him reset the fight with potions at ~50% health, I'd rather you guys bake those additional hitpoints right into the health bar and give us cutscenes at specific health intervals just to break up the monotony.  If there was ever a time to really lean on the use of cinematics, I think this would have been it. 

I'd salvage the fight by breaking the fight into phases and start those phases after the cutscenes:

-Opening cutscene where you show combatants sizing each other up.  Start of phase 1. 
-Get the Arishok to 66% health, get a cutscene and transition to start of phase 2.
-At 33% health, get another cutscene and transition to phase 3.
-Arishok's defeat: trigger final cutscene already in game.

Reveal more of the Arishok's abilities as the fight goes on...would he simply test his opponent in phase 1 or would he go all out?  As the fight gets more drawn out would he get more desperate and therefore hit harder/faster but suffer more damage from being more reckless?  Would he be hasted with armor penalties in phase 3?  What kind of opponent is he when the chips are down?  We could have learned something about him here.

More armchair quarterbacking in terms of cutscenes:

-Could have used the intermittent cutscenes to show the tension between the combatants and/or in the room. 
-Contrast the shots of the Qunari looking on stoically with that of the hostages cringing at the sound and sight of the fight in the room. 
-Show the power of the Arishok.  Really.  Show him narrowly missing Hawke and let us hear the sound of one of his blades as it swipes past.  Show the impact of   the missed blows on the pillars.  God knows I've juked him into those things enough.
-Give us a shot of Isabela looking on, if present.  How would one of the best duelists in Thedas feel about the possibility that her lover/friend dying in a fight that she might have felt was hers?
-If Isabela's not present, maybe a reaction shot of the LI or someone else in the party somewhere in the cutscenes.
-If this fight was a truely a knockdown dragout kind of fight, show the weariness in the combatants' faces.  Or fear or determination.  Anything.  Would have loved to see the Arishok let loose all those years of frustration in this fight.

This should have been a moment of high drama and tension.  However, when we clicked on the happy plot arrow over the Arishok all we got was a stultifying pillar hugging jukefest where we chipped away at a seemingly interminable mountain of hitpoints.  Given the events in Act III, this fight *was* the high point of Hawke's character arc, and unfortunately it was a complete and utter emotional flat line.  Your characters deserved better.  Your audience deserved better.

I can't speak for the other forumites, but I do not enjoy playing armchair quarterback with you guys.  It's far easier to criticize and tear down someone else's work than to create your own.  If someone asked me where you guys excel, I'd easily say storytelling and creating memorable moments in games that stay with you long after you've shelved the title.  I don't share in the hatewagon's relentless vitriol, but I do agree with some of them that you guys did not play up to the strengths of your studio in this title.  In terms of story, I was with you until the end of Act II, and was pretty numb when the whole thing implodes in the tail end of Act III.  The memorable moments in this game were few and far in between compared to Origins. 

I do enjoy the overall class gameplay changes and upon replaying Origins I could see why you guys felt a more dynamic gameplay shift was needed in DA2.  Would love to see you guys further refine the combat system, and I'm giddy at the prospect of what DA3 might bring storywise.  I enjoyed the game in general, hell even loved certain parts of it --warts and all, but I didn't love all of it.  There is definitely room for improvement, but I do appreciate some of the risks you took in DA2. 

I hope this feedback was helpful in some way, and thank you for reading.

Modifié par catofnine, 26 juin 2011 - 06:09 .

[curlzncrush]

catofnine wrote...

 "Ring of WTFBBQ"

Fell off my chair, laughing.

The rest of your review is pretty good.  I have to admit, cutscenes during boss battles would be brilliant.  The Witcher 2 has something of the like and it worked extremely well.

I have to ask though, which of these criticisms do you think Legacy will try to address?

[deatharmonic]

I agree with most of the OP...

1. What i would like to see is a return of the non-linear story approach. I found that the player was given the illusion of choice, as it doesn't matter what the player says or wants to do, the story will always turn out the same. That, with out a doubt impaired replay value heavily. Therefore it would greatly improve the gaming experience to have side quests and the main story line splinter into different outcomes based on player choice.

2. The refinement of classes I also found to be a bit of a pain, I feel as though it placed an unnecessary restriction on the player. It was always nice to have the choice to wield a sword on my rogue... This leads to my next point. I lamented the fact that the player was unable to become an arcane warrior or battle mage. which I guess links to bioware's desire to refine the classes. For me it took something huge away from the mage in this game, as the style heavily promotes fast paced combat it would have been extraordinarily fun to pummel some bad guys with my arcane warrior. Again this comes down to giving the player the choices and freedoms we once had in DA:O.

3. Not being able to give your companions armour just leads to inventory clutter. Once again its a matter of choice, i'd like to control what my companions wear.

4. Specializations: I found that the abilities my companions had were a lot cooler than what the player could posses. There was nothing which was specifically unique to the player. Any character in the game could be a blood mage, templar, reaver, assassin etc etc. When I came across Fenris i found this guy has lyrium ghost?! a move which turns him into phantom like warrior. I thought wow why does my character only get a set of generic moves to choose from? whilst my companions get astoundingly cool moves.

[Wozearly]

Anomaly- wrote...

I wrote this months ago after I finished the game in a thread of it's own, because I expected it to cause some discussion. I'll link it here rather than paste it, because it's long and anytime I paste something on these boards the text alignment gets all screwed up.

http://social.biowar...5/index/6764219

I nearly posted in your thread, then realised that necro'ing from 3 months back might not necessarily be viewed kindly by the mods, so I'll say it here.

Great points, well made, and I'm personally in agreement with them. Although not directly in the constructive criticism thread, I'd recommend its feedback is noted when the devs do the next sweep through this thread (although IIRC, all of them have been raised separately before, apart possibly from the point about Benny Hill).

Although now we're at page 100, my guess is that additional points of view are unlikely, and that most posts will primarily show how many people line up to criticise / suggest alternatives for specific elements.

[DaiyoukaiGeisha]

Probably already stated in this rather long thread but:

1. Re-used/Skinned Enemies from Mass Effect. Guys, the Varterral was a reskinned Geth tank. Some of the fade demons looked a little too much like reskinned Geth as well (with the single glowing eye). You guys have great artists working there, please use them. If you're going to re-use models (which makes some sense), please put a hell of a lot more effort in to make them look unique and different.

2. Dialog choices. Oh my, where does one begin. Ok, I get it, you like the dialog wheel. But must it be so mind numbingly obvious what the "witty"/"evil"/"diplomatic" responses are? Can't I have the option (like in DA Origins) to pick from a longer list of dialog choices that allows me to learn more about the NPC I'm talking too without it being so bloody obvious? What I like about DA:O was the fact that I could start a conversation but could still end up saying something the NPC didn't like or flirt, without the mind numbing "peace"/"love"/"hate"/"witty" symbols of a dialog wheel. Give your audience a little credit here, we all don't need to be led around by the nose.

3. Bring back Dual-Wielding Warriors. This is truly a supreme pet peeve of mine. One of the things I LOVED about DA:O was that I could spec my Warrior to be a dual-wielder with swords. Slaying my enemies with Maric's sword in one hand and Starfang in the other was pure bliss. Why oh why did you take that away in DA 2!? Just because I'm a Warrior does not necessarily mean "tank" (aka Shield/Sword combo or Two-hander). I truly miss the freedom of spec'ing my Warrior how I wanted it to be.

4. Really adding on to #3 here. Losing the ability to clothe my party members. What the...I don't even...who decided that was a good idea? There was joy to be had by dressing up Alistair in Calian's armor and dressing up Sten to look like a Templar. It was fun. By taking this aspect of the gameplay away, you've taken quite a bit of the fun the away. Finding random "add-ons" to tack on to my comrades is just plain dull. Perhaps this is the Sims addict talking, but I liked having control over what my party members wore.Someone even made a mod to add this functionality back, and it adds so much to the game overall.

Edit:

Regardless of what happens, DA 3 better retain the ability to have a Mabari in my party (a la DA 2). This was a good change in DA 2 IMHO. Mabaris == Happy DA Gamers

Modifié par DaiyoukaiGeisha, 22 juin 2011 - 10:05 .

[ChoirChronos]

I didn't plan to comment on here either; showing up so late and knowing nearly if not all of my thoughts has already been expressed by more than some in better ways, but I'll at least put in a quick list to 'add on my vote' so to speak on less common and/or notorious issues.

More Varied and/or Less Stereotypical Female Designs- YES please.  I for one appreciated it; I'd be kicking myself if Bioware backed off and I didn't say anything anywhere.  Many of the cast females, IMO, didn't sit neatly into the "videogame vixen" category in some way and that was cool to witness.  Despite balking at the new elf designs at first, I did eventually come to like the twist on the Pretty Fey Elf is Pretty trope.

Sexuality Choices- YES.  Again, appreciated it. 

Codex- PRO- Liked how things stayed flagged after stopping over it.  CON- I miss the category heads being lit if there was still new info on it.

Items- Please bring descriptions back.  I should be ashamed of myself but I would hand over $2-5 for an item descriptions DLC. 

Junk- Lacking this time around.  If there isn't enough time to improve it or revert it back to Origins I'd be open to not having it at all personally.

Dialogue- I technically prefer the full dialogue but I'll be okay either way if lessening ambiguity is active goal in creating dialogue options.  Ideally I want full knowledge of the intent and relevent meaning of all my character responses.  I respect that this can never be truly perfected but I believe there's still room for improvement. 

More Companion Interaction- I personally couldn't have too much of this probably so yeah, YES please.

[49todd]

Anomaly- wrote...

I wrote this months ago after I finished the game in a thread of it's own, because I expected it to cause some discussion. I'll link it here rather than paste it, because it's long and anytime I paste something on these boards the text alignment gets all screwed up.

http://social.biowar...5/index/6764219

Listen to this man!

[PriscilaSSR]

 I just clocked 100 hours in the game (and played ME2, Witcher 2 and a little bit of DAO again), so I finally think it's time to leave my review here. I think I have now more information to express what I liked and what I didn't. Sorry if it seems repetitive, probably someone else already said everything better than I will, but I love this game and after months of seeing people criticizing it here, I feel I have to express my own opinion.

(Ps. I'm sorry if I compare the game with others, I tried to keep focus on DA2, but sometimes I think I express myself better with comparisons).

https://lh5.googleus...aGw8P_JQQhZvms LOVE IT https://lh6.googleus...uDt2SB80sxaowtw

1.  The Party
+ Banters (witty, insigthful, hilarious, incredible!)
+ Personalities
+ More input during quests
+ Personal quests more linked to the main plot and deeper than DAO
+ Unique armour (prettttyyyy)

The first time I played I confess I didn't care for Merill and Anders, mostly because I got her last than everyone and him, because he changed a lot from what I expected after Awakening. But now I really enjoy all of them. They feel very real and have great personalities, their backstories are not just part of a dialog tree but integrated nicely into the plot. This is something that DAO did not have and makes DA2 superior in this particular aspect.

Personal quests are part of the main game now, not just something unlocked by dialog that has no additional feel to the main plot. Every quest has something to say about mages, templars, magic, Qunari or Kirkwall. They all tie into a great package that builds a emotional connection not just to the characters but to the city as well, and the troubles it's facing.

While DAO party is wonderful and I simply love them to bits, they did not have many opinions about quests or personal interest in them (even Morrigan and Alistar, while important in the ending of the game, don't care about the Dalish vs Werewolves conflict, the mages vs templars or the dwarven political troubles etc). Sure Leliana and Wynne turn on you because of Andraste's ashes, but that's not nearly close to Varric's level of involvement in Bertrands expedition, the way we meet Aveline, Isabella's quest... Ander's... well... Anders. Even the ones with no true stakes at a quest share their opinion and just seem to care more at what Hawke is doing.  

And that's just not comparing to DAO, but Mass Effect 1 & 2 (ME2 did better in terms of pacing and epic personal quests but not by much), KOTOR, and Neverwinter. My, do I dare? Even better than Baldur's Gate! O_o!

For me there is no question that DA2 party is the best part of the game and the best one from Bioware to date.

2.  Hawke
+ Voiced
+ Personal journey
+ 3 Personalities
+ Dialog wheel with icons

I always have a bad feeling when RPGs try to "define" the PC too much. Mostly, I confess, is because I am female gamer, which means that if the PC is defined, then, well, he ain't gonna be a girl. He's going to male white and... maybe bald lol. Something that I am just so tired of playing and don't wish ever to play in a RPG (sorry Witcher 2, good game but I just can't stand Gerald, I tried too).

So I became somewhat worried for DA2 because of the voiced protagonist... But, thankfully Female!Shepard exists and that made me believe in Bioware. I'm glad that I didn't lose faith, because I love Hawke.

All my Wardens made the game personal to me and all that, and if Bioware decides to go back to non-voiced I will not mind at all... But BOY does it make a difference to have a voiced protagonist! It makes room for great dialog, great cinematic scenes (romances I'm looking at you https://lh3.googleus...eYyNhUrw03qRVUA)

But most important: I can roleplay with a voiced protagonist! Hawke has 3 personalities and not just 3 opinions about something (something that Shepard suffers from it a bit and well, Gerald from Witcher 2). It's not just about choice, but It's how my character feels about something and the fact that I can express it!  It's moments like a talk with Fenris/Aveline about how I feel on leaving Lothering, discussions with Carver, Merill about Carver/Bethany that truly matter to make me care about Hawke.

3. Visuals
+ Better style and lightning overall
+ Better faces/expressions (specially humans, that no longer look weird/horsey)
+ Better Qunari (I finnaly got why everyone was scared/wary of Sten in DAO)
+ More unique elves (Loved the look with the exception of poor Zevran who was ridiculously ugly, not awesome)
- Silly looking darkspawn

4. Combat
+ Better animations
+ Fast paced
+ More fun overall
+ Uniquess of each class
- Got boring by the end of the game
- Repetition

Yes, sue me! I love the new combat. I loved DAO's combat, but DA2's is more fun overall, because it's quicker, has better animations, more interesting talents (they made two handed swords FUN! I still can't believe it lol).

I played on normal and hard, and yes, it feels more easy than DAO and it CAN be tedious by the end of the game. It's strange, because in DAO, the more you played the more fun it became (and its the same in Witcher 2), while in DA2 it got old. Well, actually it's not strange when I think about it.... The explanation, I suppose, is the same for everything else that I felt was lacking in the game. For combat, it's the lack of more talents and spells. Maybe I played wrong, but all the great spells and abilities I got were the beginning, so by the end of Act 2, well, nothing else surprised me, it was just repetition of the same tactic I used from Act 1.

Nevertheless, I still put combat as something that I loved it, because the real issue with it, in my opinion, is something else, that I will elaborate in a bit.

<_< What I REALLY didn’t like <_<

1. Act 3... Just... Act 3. UGH.
I have no words for my disappointment over the last act of the game. Actually, I have quite a list of words...Mostly curses in my native language haha.  After a great charismatic villain in Act 2, with a gutting twist with a NPC and quite the complicated/grey plot... Act 3 gave me a black/white crazy fest. Not only the two antagonists had no prior development, they are both unappealing and... just annoying. There is no reason why Hawke couldn't solve the problem before it got that ugly, or why she had to be involved at all. I don’t know, I just didn’t feel anything for either side, and only choose one because of my class and what I felt it was the lesser evils. And no, two things being bad doesn’t make a complicated moral question or deep plot, just an annoying forced choice that even has the gall to pretend to be a important one. Hawke simply didn’t matter, no matter what choice I made, things will always happen in a determined sucky way.

Sure, it was the same with DAO ending... The Blight always ended, but how it ended was mostly in the Warden’s hands. While in Act 3, we are just placed suddenly between these two people, approachable people (Something that Loghain and the Archdemon were not), that Hawke speaks to a lot. Both that seem willing to talk and compromise... Until the plot dictates that everything should go to hell for no good reason (Even Sebastian points this absurd during the scene! after screaming MAKKKERR NOOOO lol).

I get that developers wanted a canon event that would shape the DA world, but the way the game did it was just... not very satisfying or epic. Maybe it was too quick.

After Act 2 I expected to be involved in politics, nobles intrigue (man, it would’ve been great to know more of the rich families in Hightown, Hawke’s neighboors!), assassination attempts, signs of corruption growing from each side little by little, a epic moment with my party/LI, a slow build up to the inevitable confront between forces that are neither right or wrong. Instead I got a obvious “well, here’s the expected things happening really fast to an obvious conclusion”. Doesn’t help that combat by that time is pretty the same, and all the important conversations and quests are done in Act 2.

https://lh6.googleus...oVZYnVuPc6jSd6U What I think that can be better for sequelshttps://lh3.googleusercontent.com/XPRA6Mhc5GZe0M-PoSzmSx2rotm625awtzrnoSxoCtR2uqLPS9Sb82OJ6H2qUD0TryoXIzWdJdKjY1SiG_PWNFaMGJ54Vywgml9Ely3krnUX5vRcwQg

1.  Items and Armour
a. Less bland items:  What's the difference between two white "Rings" "Belts" "Swords"? Gah, so frustrating! I just learned to ignore the white items, trashing them or selling at the first opportunity (Especially now that I have loads of DLCs goodies). It just defeats the purpose of having items if all of them are going to have the same names and icons. "Ring of Power" "Ring of Ice" and etc, sure, are cliched names, but at least it makes easier to choose between them.

b. More variety of followers' clothing: look, I love the unique armour (I said that in the first part of this post) and don't really care if I can't change their armour (Carth kept his unique armour in KOTOR forever, and sure Wrex wearing a pink armour was funny the first time, but, I really prefer the unique armour) , but someone wearing the same thing for 7 years is just.... Weird. And makes me a little sad. And please don't make me buy it in form of DLC. Just no. I only ask for 2 or 3 variations (one for each Act perhaps?). ME 2 had different colors, and it was nice (still not enough but it makes more sense for space dudes to have less options).  I can sacrifice some option for Hawker if necessary (but of course more everything is always welcomed haha)

2. Environments, Encounters and Boss Fights.
a. I think the combat would've been better received if the environments and tactics hadn't been so repetitive (well, people were going to complain either way, I guess).  Well, I know for sure that a better diversity probably could solve all the combat problems that annoyed me, personally. Act 1 felt very much fresh and interesting because it was the first time in generic cave 1, you know?  I think the best exemple of this is Uncharted series that I recently played, it has the same formula and enemies all game, but the beautiful and varied places you go make everything more exicting and surprising. Also the wave behaviour of encounters was a bit repetitive as well (it got better in patch 1.03, but is still a issue, I think). What makes combat fun to me is the surprise, be in the form of new weapons/spells, number/variety of enemies and, of course, different types of battlefields. 

b. What I can say? Boss fights were not epic. They didn't feel epic at all, even when the enemy was badass and huge, it still lacked "punch" (the same tactic used in common enemies applied in boss fights... gah). DAO did so much better in this aspect, even now I get nostalgic (you guys probably hate the word haha) of defeating the Ogre in Ostagar and killing the Broodmother...

3.  Romance and Friendship/Rivalry system
+ Equal opportunity
+ Better romance scenes
+ Not agreeing doesn't mean necessary hate
- No integration of romance into the plot
- Lack of romance only dialog after... consummation haha. (could be more of a issue with timing and act2/act3 transition)
- Lack of relevance (be friendship or rivalry)

Okay, I love the friendship/rivalry system, I think is a great improvement from DAO system, the fact that you can disagree and not loose a relationship with a NPC is awesome and much more real than forcing the PC to please at all costs the NPC, I felt much more at ease to roleplay and not necessary take particular stance on something because I know the NPC in question would not agree with me otherwise and thus hate/leave me.This made the party feel real and truly close to Hawke.  

But, I still think that, in the end, being friends or rivals didn't mean all that much. Maybe because the dialog was pretty similar no matter what end of the spectre Hawke was. I guess I missed an EPIC moment that shows the end result of the system, like loyalty is questioned or the rival punches Hawke in the face for doing something horrible, lol. DA2 felt very much like a game about Hawke and her friends/family, less about something external, so I think it would have gained a lot more "punch" if in the end being friends or rivals would've meant something more to the main plot, especially in act 3.

This is something that also applies to romances. They were wonderful, and I really enjoyed them, but relevance to main plot probably would've made them perfect. (Something that really made a difference to Alistar and Morrigan's romances). Yes, two of the romances were somewhat related to big big events in DA2, but the fact that you are in a relationship doesn't not make much difference there, Hawke has no control over what's happening (and can't even express all that much her feelings on the event in a context of romance), while the Warden has all the choices in the Dark Ritual.

Also a nitpick: First time I played, I really wasn't sure about happened with a certain LI. Finding out in a codex page was not cool. lol. Also... MORE special romance dialog could be nice, maybe a small romance quest? I know romance is something that most don't bother with (??) but I know I would love it with a intensity of burning suns haha.

4. Family dynamics.
I don't know how much of it it's still relevant for a sequel, but I really think the family dynamic was wasted! It had huge potential (especially by making Act 3 much more personal and emotional). ALMOST SPOILERS  KINDA OF A SPOILER. There was practically no dialog/contact with the siblings and Leandra in Act 2, and that really made a difference on the impact of what happened with them and the choice in Act 3 of what side to support.  /END OF THE KIND OF A SPOILER

5. Staying in Kirkwall and the Time Jump
It worked in Baldur’s Gate 2, but it didn’t work so well in DA2. Kirkwall was just too small and didn’t change enough over time. The same people stand in the same spot for 7 years or so. Fenris doesn’t even clean his house with the corpses. Sure, the sun goes down, and that’s pretty cool, but how about some rain for half of Act 2? Majora Mask did it! haha. Maybe more parts opening over time, maybe part of Hightown was closed for the Hawke in Act 1... Maybe you can only enter the Viscount’s palace in Act 2... Maybe you can really explore the mage Circle in Act 3. Things like these would’ve made a big difference.

THE END! 

Anyway, I guess I only said what already has been said, but I glad I did it, because DA2 IS a great game and all the negativity I feel in this forum makes me sad (people have the right to feel angry/disappointed and all, but it makes me feel bad for Bioware, especially since I don’t think the game deserves the hate).

Modifié par PriscilaSSR, 24 juin 2011 - 05:59 .

[H6A6TE6]

It deserves the hate. Specially when you coughed up 60 bucks for nothing. But I guess that's my fault for not playing the demo. Just expected it to be as great as origins, boy am I naïve.

Oh, I guess I am not adding to the thread?

Ok, here's a tip for DA3: try to make it a pc game, Bioware, and not a console port, that should solve al lot of the problems with DA2.
And try to make it without the child-like exploding bodies and impossible Tekken moves.
Get back to making a great story with lots of lore and depth. You even recycled the lore from DA1, ffs. And make us care about the characters again (guess a second Morrigan wild be hard though...).
That's just scratching the surface, but since the chances that anyone is going to pay attention to this reply are slim to none, I'll stop here. The fans are neglected, big bucks is what counts...

Still, should you heed any of these suggestions: Thank you very much.


PS: A month ago I even mailed Blizzard, thanking them for being almost the only developer not under the (console) yoke of EA.

Modifié par H6A6TE6, 24 juin 2011 - 01:52 .

[lofte_2000]

H6A6TE6 wrote...
Ok, here's a tip for DA3: try to make it a pc game, Bioware, and not a console port, that should solve al lot of the problems with DA2.
And try to make it without the child-like exploding bodies and impossible Tekken moves.
Get back to making a great story with lots of lore and depth. You even recycled the lore from DA1, ffs. And make us care about the characters again (guess a second Morrigan wild be hard though...).
That's just scratching the surface, but since the chances that anyone is going to pay attention to this reply are slim to none, I'll stop here. The fans are neglected, big bucks is what counts...

Still, should you heed any of these suggestions: Thank you very much.


PS: A month ago I even mailed Blizzard, thanking them for being almost the only developer not under the (console) yoke of EA.

I actually agree with you there 100% It may be blunt but it's my opinion also. *shrugs*

Modifié par lofte_2000, 24 juin 2011 - 04:09 .

[Endurium]

First up I'd like to praise the DA2 engine on PC for being far more stable than DAO's engine. I never had DA2 crash on me even after hours of play, while DAO still suffers memory leaks that bring performance to a slideshow if I don't reboot the game every two or three hours, assuming I can play that long without a crash.

I also think the art design in DA2 is much improved over DAO. Most people probably ignore the furniture and other non-interactive objects in places, but I found myself appreciating the details.

Now for some criticism, which probably echoes the previous 99 pages. The first two features make it difficult for me to take DA2 seriously:

1. Spawns. I question the intellect of whoever decided enemies should spawn out of thin air, especially behind the party (I do full clears so this would be quite unlikely), on the party (excuse me, this place is taken), or in the sky and falling down to the ground (???).

2. Death. Enemies snap apart like Lego pieces decorated with gory artwork. I didn't know Bioware was subcontracting the folks responsible for Lego Pirates of the Caribbean.

Area re-use and re-exploring do tend to become tedious by Act 2. I've seen the excuse offered and hope DA3 avoids doing this. On this note, recycled home interiors aren't an issue because real houses also follow cookie-cutter floor plans. Natural areas do not, however.

I don't appreciate most of my family being red-shirted by this game, especially right off the start. Contrivance much?

Once upon a time, cutscenes were epic; something we looked forward to after fighting our way to an Act boss or to the next chapter of our character's life. Now it's getting to the point where Bioware's games are mostly cutscenes. Every freaking conversation is a cutscene, and cutscenes are responsible for *all* of the poor tactical positions my party finds itself in at the start of battle.

DA2 innovative? No. I was playing better, truly innovative games long before Bioware was born. Many younger gamers laud Mass Effect as innovative, for example, but two much older games called Starflight and Starflight II did it first (upgradeable ship, multi-talented crew, 800 planets to explore, wormholes to speed travel, a galactic menace to beat down, many alien species to interact with, etc. only thing missing was Bioware's idea of romance). Even the Elcor are, at least in conversation, a blatant copy of Starflight II's Arla species.

Modifié par Endurium, 25 juin 2011 - 04:32 .

[cmillercbm]

when you arrive in kirkwall,after speaking with gamlen,go first to athenrill.accept her offer and speak to the merchant.answer him with the middle option.he will give you the key to a chest it contains 2 gold.do not return to athenrill but go to meeran accept his offer and kill frederick and company.you will get 5 gold off frederick which you keep.go on to meeran and tell him you have completed his mission ,the gold is a good jumpstart for the future.you will get to kill athenrill later.you will earn rivalry {5} from aveline.no biggie

[berserkerblob]

I'd like to have the arcane warrior back for my mages (but at least for the maincharacter) and having said that it is just reasonable to get our second weapon set back in order to switch between sword and the magic staff.

Modifié par berserkerblob, 25 juin 2011 - 11:47 .

[snfonseka]

After I played Witcher 2, I understood one thing; that compared to DA2 environment, W2 environment is very rich. BW even though W2 is your competitor I think you should check that game and compare your DA2 environment against it.

[Calneth]

Overall I had a lot of fun playing DA2 on Xbox 360. There's always room for improvement though and I agree with most of the criticisms in the original post (reused maps and and the way enemies drop out of the sky in particular). I'll try to focus on the positives in this.

A Question About Character Creation
I really liked the hair of default fem Hawke but it was unavailable when I chose to make my Hawke from scratch. The same goes for default male Hawke's beard and hair style. My brother liked the beard and wanted to use it for his custom character but it wasn't an option on the slider. This is a small criticism but I felt it was weird to be denied a customization option. I was left wondering why these two options were limited to the defaults. Were these exclusive options a way to entice more people into playing with the defaults?

The Improved Combat
The combat in DA2 shined in that it was way more responsive than the system in DA:O. For example, when I ordered a character to drink a Health Potion they did it lightening fast. A quick execution time could mean the difference between life and death in a tough battle. I didn't mind mashing the A button to attack (I usually did that anyway when I play DA:O. Weird habit, I guess).

Combat Animations
The combat animations went well with the faster pace of battle. I love watching my rogue slice through enemies simply because it looks freakin' cool.

Skill Trees
Kudos on designing the new skill trees! Visually, they look great. Gameplay wise, I enjoyed the many customization options and being able to tailor my Hawke to my preference of play within a class (Fast attacking Duelist) I particularly appreciated that many skills encouraged the use of cross class combos.

Crafting
The crafting was improved because materials didn't clog up my inventory and I didn't have to travel around looking for that one NPC who had whatever ingredient I needed. Crafting is now quick and easy but still rewarding for those players who choose to seek out all the crafting resources. 

Hawke's Voice Over and Personality
I feel that Hawke being voiced over allowed for more cinematic experiences during cutscenes. Conversations feel more like...conversations. You can hear Hawke's voice and the emotion that goes along with it. I enjoyed having power over Hawke's personality and tone because it allowed me tailor the tone to the situation. In most games with dialogue options I usually go with the "good/nice" reponse but this was the first time I opted for a sarcastic/funny approach. It was interesting to see how NPCs responded to different tones and the options add a bit of replay value.

New Art Style
I felt the style of DA:O was a bit dark and muddled but the new art direction adds some brightness and originality. I always appreciate when games opt to have a unified and distinguished style. Elves are no longer humans with pointy ears, qunari are no longer large humans, dwarfs are no longer short humans. It's nice to see that the races are more distinguised and that you didn't opt for perfect-in-every-way Tolkien elves.

Companions Being "Hawksexual"
For what it's worth, thanks a lot. As a gaymer, I truly appreciated that I was allowed to romance any character I wanted. I know it's not "realistic" but it's inclusive and you've gained a lot of loyalty and love from me and my fellow gaymer pals for it. Thanks. 

Companion Input In Conversation
It makes sense that the people traveling with you are listening and have an opinion on what Hawke is saying to others. Being able to turn the conversation over to a companion is a great way to change the conversation pace and have your teammates help out (or hinder you). It gives them another use aside from combat and makes for some fun exchanges. And even though I didn't turn the conversation over to her, I really like how Merrill can ruin your trick during the quest "Finders Keepers". This moment is a delight in that it provided characterization (I gathered that Merrill was not very street savvy or good at lying) while directly affecting the task at hand (the guards attacked).

Story
I'm not going to pretend that I'm an expert writer and comment on the merits and downfalls of the story. All I can say is that I generally enjoyed it because it included more political intrigue rather than just going on a journey to defeat some evil Big Bad (Not that there's anything wrong with those kinds of stories. We just already saw that in DA:O). It also felt more like a set-up game for something huge. All the dominoes are in place. Time to watch em' fall in DA3. This is just an observation.  


That's all I can think of for now. Thanks for considering player feedback BW.

[El Tell]

I don't think that Dragon Age 2 feels like the sequel to Origins at all. They just feel like different games. I think there are aspects of both games people will either like or dislike, and therefore Bioware will only have to say that they can't make everyone happy. If it was me I would have just made Dragon Age 2 a stand-alone game, inventing a new franchise. For me the cameo appearances from characters out of Origins just feel surreal to the gaming experience.

"Oh look, it's him from the first game.., blah blah blah, See ya then"

The new art direction IMO was ok, but I just think that (and I know this has been said elsewhere, but I did think it) the elves look like little pale-coloured Na'vi. And what was the point of the Qunari redesign? What they look like isn't really important, IMO. It's how they act and what they do. I think if they wanted them to have horns (I suppose to roll with Ogres having horns and Orgres are derived from Qunari-broodmother offspring), but they should have given them horns in the first one. I think this adds more distance between DAO and DA2.

I also do not care what anyone at Bioware says about the overhead camera not being needed. It is. I want to put my mage/archer at the top of a staircase, but cannot unless I run the character there myself holding my 2 mouse buttons, In the meantime, my other characters are getting pounded when I should be micro-managing them. So it's a toss up, do I want my mage/archer to get pounded, or my DPS warrior/rogue? Sure, it's possible to sort it out, but not as much fun, or with the level of control the overhead camera gives.

And the camera getting stuck between your selected character and the wall is just a pain. I do not see any reason not to put it in except that no one could be bothered. Or they didn't have time. It all just screams "money money money". Very disappointing.

After I completed DA2 (2H Warrior), I went back to DAO and played that through again and I just thought that this (DAO) is so much more epic than DA2. The Battle of Ostagar, with the hordes of darkspawn and human soldeirs clashing on the battlefield. Awesome, felt like something off Lord of the Rings, which isn't a bad thing IMO. The thing is with DAO also, it may be a "save the world" plot, which I understand some people aren't mad on anymore (cheesy, perhaps?), but I think that if the Warden had failed (ie, Darkspawn Chronicles), it would have only been the end of Fereldan. There were still a great deal of wardens elsewhere and the Blight would still more than likely be stopped, Although at greater cost.

Don't get me wrong, I like DA2, I just do not think it's as good as the first in terms of gameplay or storyline. Better graphics, better combat animations. Still undecided about the different skill tree layout.

I do not think that I will play DA2 as much as DAO, and will probably trade/sell my DA2 after my second playthrough and stay on the DAO whenever I fancy some squad-based RPG killing.

Thanks for your time.

EDIT: Spelling

Modifié par El Tell, 26 juin 2011 - 10:30 .

[lofte_2000]

At least they know now what doesn't work

[Stanley Woo]

A few off-topic posts removed. Thank you all for the great feedback and constructive criticism in this thread. I encourage y'all to keep it coming.

[Uccio]

About trash. I had a jolly moment thinking of my Hawke dumbster diving for moldy dolls, moth eaten scarfs and pulling torn trousers off a corpse. A truly noble way for a hero to get couple of coppers.




Please! ditch that and get some other ways of making money when the character is getting onwards in the social ladder.

[Ohpus]

I would tend to agree. Rather than looting for the sake of looting, what about a noble's income in Act II ? I'm a partner in a mine, but I neither gain or lose money from it?

[MorrigansLove]

www.youtube.com/watch

Watch this, Bioware.

[LittleBits]

I just have to say I loved the game, I am not a console player I am a MMORPG player but sadly there is not one game out at the moment that is enjoyable so I thought I would try a stand alone game. I just love this game it is not go kill 500 mobs to get 6 billion factions for one piece of armor, it is, I log in and have fun and I really enjoying it . Now I did not play Origins but since I played this one I decided to give Origins a whirl – but I am sorry that game was not amusing me at all, the combat is a joke, the 5 answer dialogue was like being back at school but I did give it a try.. but it did not amuse me like this one.

Ok so my likes and dislikes:

I loved the story lines I am not a quester but it is a necessary evil in all games but WOW you made questing rock! I just love it. You made me actually feel for my characters which is odd like what you did to my mother …I cried for 5 minutes it was awful. And oh that one quest for the Priest Repentance I think it was called…omg that quest, I was laughing so hard..my husband was like WTF is going on over there, all he could hear was …ohh get the feather …..omg I am still laughing …


The companions are a hoot I never laughed so hard in a game until I played this one. Isabella, Feniris, and Anders I loved them all. I did not want the game to end. The romance thing was awesome except it should be expanded , like take Isabella for an example she ask for help and needs to go on some ship or on the coast and have the story and romance happen at random places, on a beach, on a ship any where just not the house and yes more than once please. Like I know I do something for one and then I know to port back to the house and poof they are their …Let the girls fight it out and the men so far I am sleeping with them all just to see what happens. Oh and I want some of that dwarf lovin, and that sexy priest what a tease on that one after I talked to him I go back to the house and he’s there and I am thinking oh yea! So I click on him and ….you dang teasers he wants to tell me about my dog……that is just so wrong….


Combat is a lot better in this game although I did not like repetitive areas though and the caves where a bit tight especially getting loot in a corner. It reminded me of COV all that cut and paste ….give us more areas more freedoms.
Armor for my companions would be nice I understand what you did so we would have to find them but it does not change the looks….maybe add a appearance slot on the paper doll so that way I can at least dress them my way.


Act three was not very good at all I did not like the fact that it could not be negotiated when it appears that it could have been just resolved and yes I understand that Meredith was possessed by the shard but why could we not find a more peaceful way… or given that option? The templar ending was not as bad as the Mage ending- the mage ending made no sense….and then after the fight was done bam the game was done …it just felt all wrong…I don’t know maybe you have a plan for it but I did not like it …


So to sum it up keep the Ui and the combat and just expand the games areas and add some appearance slots and more romance and rivalries and do a better job on the ending, for the new DA3 I would like to be able to use my characters that I have and expand on the last stage and have them go to stage 4..5..6..7…oh heck I am greedy make it so I can play it for 6 months straight that much content….Oo..


But I just loved the game other than those few things.

Ok I am editing this: Just finished Orgins and the Awakeing- I see why people found so much dissapointment in Da2:

I did not like the combat at all in Orgins so here are my suggestions:

1) Combat like Da 2
2) Story Like Origins ( OMG the story was awesome, much better then Da2) Much better in the desgin, I did not feel so boxed in.
3) Companions- I like them better in Origins- I like the camp but I wish  we actually had everyone inside thier tents where if they want to talk to me thier tent would be avaible to ask before entering- Can I come in? Even just for talking..
4) Keep the storage chest
5) Keep the New Crafting System in Da2
6) More interactions with the Companions- like if I cant decide on a answer I can click one of my compaions and ask thier opinion.
7) The companions with thier remarks are awesome in Origins-  instead of go to sleep why not include us having the romance scene in, like the kiss option.

Ok the ending is a Bit better in Orgins except you forgot my Parade....the ending in Awakeing was aweful so none of that, and no ending like DA2.

Make the game like orgins in length and in depth wise and fix the combat and the companions and fix the ending to actually reward me with a cut scene like origins but if you tell me to go outside to see my adoring fans then by god I better be able to ....

Oh I love Hawke talking- so keep the talking also I would like the New Game to expand on what happend to My warden not that she disappears, bring back my Alistar fighting by my side ...unless the reason I disappear is because it was my time since I did the joining during a Blight.

Modifié par LittleBits, 07 juillet 2011 - 03:55 .

[GNRfan26]

Personally i loved most of the new look. It was quite pretty. But i could not at all stand the Mortal Kombat level fatalities every time i kill someone. Maybe an epic, mind-melting, face exploding spell wouldn't be so insane to have my enemy explode into a million bits, but everything gets a gruesome kill. What that does is gives me no sense of progress in my skills, who cares what i can do at level 18, when at level one i was slicing and dicing a darkspawn with my shield? Another thing, i don't know about everyone else, but i would rather not hear what Hawke says (just read the text) and have some character diversity. I like being an elven archer, or a dwarf warrior. This game is supposed to be in the fantasy category, what fantasy do i get to live out? The romances were the only successes in the conversation department. I love Mass Effect, and I loved DAO, i loved them because they were different games. I miss having a lot of options to talk to people. Romancing Isabella, (she has so much squandered potential for CD btw), my options are
1. I like you
2. I like you, but am sarcastic about it
3. I don't like you
Romancing Zevran you have
1. How do I know you aren't playing me?
2. I'm not sure about this
3. Do what you want to me
4.I'll do what i want to you
5. I'm interested in someone else
6. I can't do this
In short, i want to have options so i can choose what im feeling. And i liked replaying DAO because i was mystified by Morrigan and wanted to find out if there was a better way to win her heart. In DA2, i know which options the best already, because it has a damn heart shape next to the thing. It loses the positive feeling of saying the right thing when you have to try (hard) to say the wrong thing. I don't want it to be so black and white.

Modifié par GNRfan26, 29 juin 2011 - 01:41 .