30 réponses à ce sujet

[slick1972]

Seriously, what is all the hate for? Mages are just humans, or elves, or apparently qunari, who happen to be more powerful than you. Newsflash, it happens all the time. First civilization to invent the gun? Straight ot the top. Imagine if it had been an automatic rifle. What happened to freedom?

Now if it was a lone being that showed freakish power over the natural order of things, then yeah, you can be frightened, and hate that person if they become evil. But mages? Only thing more common is a stupid merc throwing himself at you even though you overpower him easily.

And seriously, aren't mages just like Star Wars' Jedi? Shouldn't their way, which was never protested by anyone I've ever heard, apply here? Why can't orsino send a team of mages to hunt down apostates? You know, because they would have more success.

Maybe I'm nuts. Maybe I'm just ranting. Or maybe I'm right. You decide.

[Raiil]

Well, it went from 'some idiots in Tevinter who were magical herp derped how did I abomination' to 'anyone with magic will become a demon unless we staple them to a tower, and even then it's still a risk' at some point. Basically, a few jerks went and screwed it for the rest of us. Mages are paying the price for the arrogance of a few.

[slick1972]

That's what I mean though, why is it that with mages, a few incidents (OK, a lot in Kirkwall) means that all mages are evil. If a town went nuts, killing neighboring towns, was stopped, and then there were some residents that said they weren't part of that, would they be evil?

Just saying.

[sylvanaerie]

well, you tell me. If you were in public and someone was being murdered in front of you and a number of witnesses and no one did a thing to stop the perpetrator, would that mean they aren't evil? They didn't do the deed....but they didn't do anything to stop it either.

[Pileyourbodies]

There is no hate for mages, it is a respect for the law.

[slick1972]

@sylvanaerie:

This is an inadequate comparison, mages cannot police themselves, they are locked up all the time. (Unless BioWare thought, "It would be really cool to have the player fight a mage here, let's conveniently forget they are all locked up right now, and drop a few random mages in.)

@Pileyourbodies:
The law is a sign of hatred, just the same as pro-slavery laws were a sign of hatred for African-Americans.

[DamnThoseDisplayNames]

Because developers thought that making every mage in a game explode in a hail of demonic meat and ichor is cool.

[NvVanity]

Well there's a few reasons,

1. Darkspawn Creation: Supposedly Tevinter Mages entered the Maker's Golden City and yeah you know the rest.
2. Demons Like Mages: Not very good.
3. Blood Magic:Also not good.
4. MAGIC: Being able to shoot fire from your hands might scare people.

Seems like a political motif of the Chantry and Templars. We protect you from the Mages, you need us sort of thing.

[Pileyourbodies]

To slick1972: Those same law books that once subjected Africans now guarantees that they are African-Americans and free from oppression.

[Addai]

slick1972 wrote...

That's what I mean though, why is it that with mages, a few incidents (OK, a lot in Kirkwall) means that all mages are evil. If a town went nuts, killing neighboring towns, was stopped, and then there were some residents that said they weren't part of that, would they be evil?

Just saying.

It's more than a few.  The Veil is thin in Kirkwall because of its history, so there's a lot of bad juju there.  Many people also see magic as a curse.  They're afraid.  A mage is a walking mini nuke and can't be disarmed, except ineffectually by templars, so it's hardly a surprise that some people think they're better off dead or at least locked up in a deep hole.

[Deylar]

Because in the game the mages all turn into demons.

[Pileyourbodies]

Yeah considering the whole thin veil as alluded to in many many peices of lore about the city Kirkwall is a terrible place for a circle of Magi since thin veil=easier demonic possession.

[slick1972]

@NvVanity:

Allow me to translate your points to reference Jedi.

1. Vader enters Jedi temple. (Not a direct comparison, but close)
2. Dark side tempts all Jedi -> not good
3. Force lightning, choke, etc. -> not good
4. Force -> Being able to shoot lighting from your fingertips might scare people

Just saying.

[Pileyourbodies]

@slick1972

The Jedi police themselves, they exterminated the Sith they thought and forbade dark side teaching, no good jedi shoot lightning from their fingers those that do are all bad. However i'd not consider the Jedi good because they use mind control on people...

[DarthSliver]

Mages are misunderstood, thats all

[slick1972]

Regarding the point saying mages are "mini nukes":

The thing is, anyone can fit this description, especially when pushed to the edge. Remember Columbine? Kids who didn't feel they were accepted. Or maybe you could even fit the American revolutionists into this bucket, as they started a long, bloody war over not fitting in with the king's plan.

[slick1972]

@Pileyourbodies:

This is precisely my point. Mages should be policing themselves. Not templars, who are afraid of them, but mages who might still be afraid, but also will be rational.

[Pileyourbodies]

Slick what happened to the kids at columbine? Oh right the same thing that would happen to a mage in Thedas if they did that.
The American revolutionaries used diplomacy, they did diplomacy with the british and the french and the dutch and the germans and the russians. They sought to change the system through Legal means, the fighting here in america was arguably not all that important. The same month as yorktown the british had passed legislation that made us free from british control due to crossing the atlantic the war went on however.
The mages didn't, Orsino should have gone to the grand cleric sooner. He sought to bypass legal means.

[chester013]

Magic is a tool, as with any tool it's the wielder who determines how it is used. Of course the more powerful the tool the more good or bad you can do with it.

If I had a hammer, I could say fix a neighbours roof or bludgeon him to death. Magic is a really really big hammer and some people went with option number 2, therefore mages are feared and kept on a short leash.

[slick1972]

@Pileyourbodies:

The point of Columbine in this topic is that madness can happen to anyone, and anyone can be dangerous. A crazy man, a cold-hearted man, a man with serious depression, a child, an old man, the list goes on. All can be dangerous. As far as diplomacy goes, the diplomatic options that were explored are things we are not privy to. For all we know, Meredith and Orsino had talks with the Grand Cleric for the entire time since Meredith got the idol. For all we know, they had nice chats about the weather. Point is, who's to say he didn't try talking to Elthina sooner?

[theamplifiedsoul]

Mages are feared because of their power. An evil non mage can be killed easily compared to an evil mage. Blood magic is scary to the normal people of Thedas. Abominations have created destruction and chaos. No, not all mages are that way, but the ones who diddo evil acts scared the normal people enough to lock them all up. You can argue why they are wrong all you want, but it doesn't change how they feel. Right or wrong the fear is what drives the chantry and templars to keep mages locked up. Comparing them to Jedi is not a good argument due to the fact that you asked why they are scared of them, not if they are wrong or right.

[Pileyourbodies]

He does. he says hes going to take this issue up with the grand cleric. If he already had done so he wouldn't need to phrase it like he did.

And my rebuttle is that those people were put down. All people can be dangerous and the law applies to all people. We're all living in a circle of magi, police chiefs are Knight commanders and Legislators are our Chantry.

[slick1972]

@ Chester013:

Exactly, up until the short leash. Why does there need to be a short leash? Is the best option not to come up with a system of mages that police the circle themselves? Perhaps with chantry cooperation, much like the Jedi temple and the Republic.

Anyhow, it's been intersting, and by all means, keep posting, but I have to go to bed now. It feel like it took five hours to post all this, I'm that tired. G'night.

[Pileyourbodies]

If you bludgeoned him to death then you would be arrested and if found guilty and later if you're lucky put on Parole you'd be on a short leash.

Mages are like they're on Parole and have restrictions on where they can live.

[Valtauran]

I can understand the hate, Mages are very powerful and can do ALOT of damage if unchecked, i do think the Templars are doing it the wrong way, they should be watched to make sure demons don't gain a foothold, but they shouldn't be treated like criminals.

The Templars treat all mages as if they WILL be possessed, its totally wrong, its the Templars own fault on how the game ended up, if only they were more relaxed, still keeping an eye on them, but not treating them like crap.