490 réponses à ce sujet

[Sabriana]

neppakyo wrote...

yay! Im not the one in trouble with Mr Woo this time

happy_daiz, comments like yours are not very constructive either, can be interpreted as worse.

Now lets go back to the polite passive-aggressive arguments that we all enjoy

That poster makes perfect sense to me, Nepp. I'm spending a lot of times here, because it's much more fun than trying to convince myself to re-install DA 2, and finish my poor "abandoned at the beginning of Act III" rogue.

I mean, think about it. I didn't spend a lot of time on the forums for that "other" game. Why? I was too busy playing it - over and over again. The only thing that keeps me from popping into the DA 2 forums is playing that "other" game. Yep, it's still installed, since the day I purchased, and yes, I'm still having a lot of fun with it.


Edited to add:

@ Kilshrek

I just read your link. Although I'm in the habit lately of dismissing that particular site until I have further information, that doesn't really sound good. Meaningless stat game? Whut? Oh well, time will tell. I'm only a 'casual' fan of the ME series, so having it destroyed by 'streamlining' and "let's not force people to think" is not as bad for me, personally, as it might be for the ME series fans. If it does take a turn into a strange direction, and thereby alienates the ME core fans, I will however, offer my sympathy. I know how it feels.

Modifié par Sabriana, 06 mai 2011 - 05:59 .

[neppakyo]

Sabriana wrote...

neppakyo wrote...

yay! Im not the one in trouble with Mr Woo this time

happy_daiz, comments like yours are not very constructive either, can be interpreted as worse.

Now lets go back to the polite passive-aggressive arguments that we all enjoy

That poster makes perfect sense to me, Nepp. I'm spending a lot of times here, because it's much more fun than trying to convince myself to re-install DA 2, and finish my poor "abandoned at the beginning of Act III" rogue.

I mean, think about it. I didn't spend a lot of time on the forums for that "other" game. Why? I was too busy playing it - over and over again. The only thing that keeps me from popping into the DA 2 forums is playing that "other" game. Yep, it's still installed, since the day I purchased, and yes, I'm still having a lot of fun with it.

Same here! Though I need to reinstall, cause patch 1.04 fuxx0red up some of my mods, also Im having fun in these forums, playing TW1, Divinity II: DKS, some time in PS:T just to name a few.

[Sabriana]

Waves (no, not *those* waves. I'd never do that to either of you *grin*) at Ali & Nepp

I was lucky in that. DA:O never really had any major bugs and glitches for me, even though my machine is ancient in computer terms. I was lucky even with mods, they never interfered with one another or the game (three cheers for Chasen, and EJ). But the mods I have now are mostly mods that fix flag-triggering, script-triggering, and the like. The biggest one is "Winterforge", which I love to pieces.

I'll never get the "you should be thankful" arguments. Why should I be thankful for something that gave me what I never expected to get, for a price that is more than twice of what it is actually worth. I'm tired of saying "I don't hate the game, but it was a hybrid, like any other dime a dozen hybrids out on the marked, for which overpaid. Way overpaid. I'm not thankful, I'm angry at myself for trusting blindly. It was, for me, an average game, that was hyped to me as the successor of an above average game. A way above average game, imo, personally, me, I, etc.


Edited because spelling seems to be extraordinarily hard this morning. Need more coffee.

Modifié par Sabriana, 06 mai 2011 - 06:20 .

[neppakyo]

Hi Ali and sab!

yeah I agree with the "you should be thankful" comment you made. It gets quite annoying *sigh* Myself I keep upgrading a piece here and there for my computer around twice a year. Usually every 4 years I have to change the motherboard for the next gen of CPU's, so that 'other' DA game runs super smooth on my system.

Then there are the "It should be judged on its on and not against the first one" arguments. When its billed and hyped as a sequel, its gunna be judged against the previous game. Hell, even if I judged it on its own, still have the same complaints.

[Ottemis]

Kilshrek wrote...

ME 3, delivering 100% more shooter since 2185

Now can we please have that ridiculously outdated RPG sign removed? It has no place in a modern, streamlined game.

(On the fly quote, I read the link, but haven't read most of the previous posts, have to leave soon =P)

Calling it one thing, doesn't mean it's not another aswell right?
Imho ME2 reaked of RPG elements, while some other parts were more tailored to resemble a shooter. Still I'd call it an RPG before I call it a shooter. 

Honestly, while I'm not one for shooters, I'd rather they streamline combat MORE to apply to the shooter-players, because the changes I would imagine that would mean would be an improvement to me while being a more nessecary improvement to the shooter-fans.
I'll personally enjoy the game anyways, and this is, well wow, my favorite gameline ever. It tromps FF in my book, never thought that would happen. I'm a sucker for scifi and a sucker for an engrossing story, plus I do like to hear "headshot!" once in a while. And here I am, hooked on ME2.

As an example: I had my boyfriend (who really plays nothing but shooters of late) try Mass Effect 2 out a couple of times, and he was completely annoyed by the clunky aiming system, for one. It wasen't streamlined enough for sure, quite awkward actually to some not at all familiar with the line. Everyone should be able to agree here that stuff like that is stuff nobody would mind seeing improved amirite?

Modifié par Ottemis, 06 mai 2011 - 06:43 .

[neppakyo]

Ah, so your boyfriend prefers the method of auto-aim, and auto-next target over the manual way?

I had no problems with ME2's aiming. Mind you Im on a PC, and a mouse is a lot more accurate than the clunky controllers.

EDIT: Slow edit, ISP must be messing around with the servers at 3am

Modifié par neppakyo, 06 mai 2011 - 06:51 .

[Ottemis]

neppakyo wrote...

Ah, so your boyfriend prefers the method of auto-auto, and auto-next target over the manual way?

I had no problems with ME2's aiming. Mind you Im on a PC, and a mouse is a lot more accurate than the clunky controllers.

No, for starters he prefs not to have to aim off the side of his screen rather then the middle, which I can relate to really.
We're on PC's too.

Or the focus not flickering every 5th of a second even though you're aiming straight at a mob. Then releasing an ability on it, misses 80% of the time. I have this in spells and it ain't pretty =/

Now don't get me wrong, I could live with this fine, but could it possibly use improvement? Imho YES. And I'd be as happy for it as my bf might be. Especially if small tweaks up it's appeal for him.

Modifié par Ottemis, 06 mai 2011 - 06:49 .

[Kilshrek]

Ottemis wrote...

(On the fly quote, I read the link, but haven't read most of the previous posts, have to leave soon =P)

Calling it one thing, doesn't mean it's not another aswell right?
Imho ME2 reaked of RPG elements, while some other parts were more tailored to resemble a shooter. Still I'd call it an RPG before I call it a shooter. 

Honestly, while I'm not one for shooters, I'd rather they streamline combat MORE to apply to the shooter-players, because the changes I would imagine that would mean would be an improvement to me while being a more nessecary improvement to the shooter-fans.
I'll personally enjoy the game anyways, and this is, well wow, my favorite gameline ever. It tromps FF in my book, never thought that would happen. I'm a sucker for scifi and a sucker for an engrossing story, plus I do like to hear "headshot!" once in a while. And here I am, hooked on ME2.

As an example: I had my boyfriend (who really plays nothing but shooters of late) try Mass Effect 2 out a couple of times, and he was completely annoyed by the clunky aiming system, for one. It wasen't streamlined enough for sure, quite awkward actually to some not at all familiar with the line. Everyone should be able to agree here that stuff like that is stuff nobody would mind seeing improved amirite?

Can't say I know where the clunky combat complaint is coming from, unless you have the console version. edit : Because I play on the PC, I have no idea how the console version works.

My shooty experience comes from the early CoD and MoH games, BF manshoots, the occasional Quake and Doom. The only difference in ME is that it's an over the shoulder game so it alters your perspective.

But at any rate if they want to tweak the combat even further be my guest, so long as they don't streamline the armour and ammo again I don't care what they do to combat.

My concern is their slapping of RPG on the most tenuous of links. The argument that comes out of this then will be "Oh, but you role play as Commander Shepard!" and I say "You bloody well role play anonymous soldier #51 in any FPS out there as well, you choose to shoot and kill or be shot and killed" Role playing right there.

If they streamline stats even further then truly, Bioware doesn't make the sort of games I want to play anymore and that's a shame, but I'll take my business elsewhere in the future.

Modifié par Kilshrek, 06 mai 2011 - 06:53 .

[neppakyo]

Ottemis wrote...

No, for starters he prefs not to have to aim off the side of his screen rather then the middle, which I can relate to really.
We're on PC's too.

Or the focus not flickering every 5th of a second even though you're aiming straight at a mob. Then releasing an ability on it, misses 80% of the time. I have this in spells and it ain't pretty =/

Now don't get me wrong, I could live with this fine, but could it possibly use improvement? Imho YES. And I'd be as happy for it as my bf might be. Especially if small tweaks up it's appeal for him.

Thats legit and makes sense :happy: I got quite used to it, and was able to play just fine on the insane level.. those stupid scion things shockwaves were annoying though 

[Ottemis]

I didn't rlly mind the armor change in either DA2 or ME2 for the simple reason that I'd rather have something well designed looking utterly good on a character then having a load of them of which 50% look craptastic while I would have to pick them min-maxing my character combat-wise.
Same with companions.

Quality over quantity issue.
Having said that, I do enjoy min-maxing and fiddling with stat-balance, so it's a double edged blade, like with most things. I'm not overly worried though, because I personally can appreciate both approaches.

Modifié par Ottemis, 06 mai 2011 - 07:01 .

[SkittlesKat96]

carlosjuero wrote...

How about we appreciate that everyone has differing opinions? You are no more right than the people who do not like DA 2 - both are opinions. Pure and simple.

I agree with this but I think the OP is touching on the more sour attitudes people have been having, I've been seeing literally dozens and dozens of rude and insulting posts getting deleted and things have just been so volatile, it's a wonder (and a good thing) that Bioware hasn't tried to argue back or anything

[neppakyo]

Ottemis wrote...

I didn't rlly mind the armor change in either DA2 or ME2 for the simple reason that I'd rather have something well designed looking utterly good on a character then having a load of them of which 50% look craptastic while I would have to pick them min-maxing my character combat-wise.
Same with companions.

Quality over quantity issue.
Having said that, I do enjoy min-maxing and fiddling with stat-balance, so it's a double edged blade, like with most things. I'm not overly worried though, because I personally can appreciate both approaches.

I'd prefer if they kept in the ability to change armors, but actually make the armors look good. All of them, unless its a special set, saying, "Dwarf nug wrestling armor" then it shouldn't look too good.

Or introduce an armor crafting thing, so people who like it, can alter armor they find, etc.

[Kilshrek]

Armour in ME 2 made my Shep look rather plain. And they served absolutely no purpose. The only meaningful ones were ammo boosters, because ammo could become scarce at times. The only reason why the whole team didn't look craptastic is because their armour was miraculously set, so that even in a zero-g/low/no atmosphere environment they suffer no ill effects. classy.

DA 2 armour was slightly better, but the spiky bits... no, really, no. This isn't Soul Calibur, Hawke is not an Ivy/Siegfried/Nightmare hybrid.

Mods may more may not make it into the final game, I hope they do. Researching weapon mods really doesn't have the same feel as slapping on an ammo or weapon mod. Turning ammo(inferno,AP and the like) into abilities as well, mein gott, why?

edit : last post on thread derail, hopefully

Modifié par Kilshrek, 06 mai 2011 - 07:10 .

[Ottemis]

SkittlesKat96 wrote...

carlosjuero wrote...

How about we appreciate that everyone has differing opinions? You are no more right than the people who do not like DA 2 - both are opinions. Pure and simple.

I agree with this but I think the OP is touching on the more sour attitudes people have been having, I've been seeing literally dozens and dozens of rude and insulting posts getting deleted and things have just been so volatile, it's a wonder (and a good thing) that Bioware hasn't tried to argue back or anything

Would have been useless to try, it's like sticking your hand in a raging fire, just adds fuel.
Agree with the OP btw. But I do understand some people feel robbed, very sorry for them. The reactions are volatile though, can't say I really enjoy to see the way some express themselves. And yeah a constructive argument or conversation is made completely impossible most of the time.

Modifié par Ottemis, 06 mai 2011 - 07:13 .

[neppakyo]

Ottemis wrote...

Would have been useless to try, it's like sticking your hand in a raging fire, just adds fuel.
Agree with the OP btw. But I do understand some people feel robbed, very sorry for them. The reactions are volatile though, can't say I really enjoy the way some express themselves.

I try to act rational, but sometimes I fail and just go herg blargh. Especially in the two "2 million sales" thread. When its not true, its not stated they "sold" it was "sold in" which means shipped/sold to retailers, not consumers.

Whoops, almost went off there, sorry >.<

[Altima Darkspells]

Ottemis wrote...

(On the fly quote, I read the link, but haven't read most of the previous posts, have to leave soon =P)

Calling it one thing, doesn't mean it's not another aswell right?
Imho ME2 reaked of RPG elements, while some other parts were more tailored to resemble a shooter. Still I'd call it an RPG before I call it a shooter. 

Mechanics are how genres are defined.

ME1 was an (action) RPG.  Player skill was somewhat useful in that you actually had to hit the enemy, but the true damage was done by the magical numbers behind the scene.

ME2 was a shooter.  Among all the other shooter elements, player skill is the most important factor in damage.  In essence, a Shepard at Level 1 with an Eviscerator does the same (proportional) damage as a Shepard Level 60 with an Eviscerator.  If a player were bad enough, Shepard wouldn't be an almighty Valkyrie Spehs Mehrin, but a half-blind nerd who couldn't hit the broad side of a barn.

In short, RPG elements do not an RPG make.  If ME2 is an RPG, then God of War must be one, too.  After all, you collect 'experience' to level up your 'skills' to do more damage or have other effects.  Oh, that means Gears of War is an RPG too.  As is Brink.

The only reason ME2 is even referenced as an RPG is because it's from BioWare--an 'RPG company', and marketing probably wouldn't let them call a spade a spade.  The other is that it has a story that can't be immediately dismissed as the end result of an all-night binge at EA's Hooker and Blow Division.

[Enurale]

Im a real fanatic of DA:O.

I play this game everyday over 1 year. DLC's buyed, addons applied.

i was waited DA:2 w,th excisement.

Sorry but...

Dragon Age 2 is a TOTAL failure for me.

graphics, combat, conversations, characters everything lower has quality then DA:O.

Im a player, who plays pc games for 16 years and plays MMO's for 8 year.

DA:O = 95  (game has only some buggs and needs better expansion like main game, other everything is "PERFECT", ABSOLUETELY not needs any changes.

DA:2 = 70 (im sorry only 70, only storytelling good enough, other elements LOWER than origins.) , i play this game from my friendspc, only half of champaign.

Im very sad.

very, very sad.

honestly, bioware my favorite creator, baldurs gate and DA:O a top point of RPG mountain. but, im worried about for future dragon age games... But i have hope about SWTOR.

PLEASE ! Think logically,  DAO is a total succes, why you need a new system for DA:2 ?

Find a GOOD story for my DA:O wardens future and do same playing elements with DA:O, its my DA:2...

BIOWARE! pls hear voice of real RPG players ! this writings isnt only my ideas!

DA isnt MASS EFFECT !

Do better works in the future.

Sorry about my bad english, but i guess my writings clear enough...


A BLEEDED GREY WARDEN....

Enurale...

[Kilshrek]

Altima Darkspells wrote...

Mechanics are how genres are defined.

ME1 was an (action) RPG.  Player skill was somewhat useful in that you actually had to hit the enemy, but the true damage was done by the magical numbers behind the scene.

ME2 was a shooter.  Among all the other shooter elements, player skill is the most important factor in damage.  In essence, a Shepard at Level 1 with an Eviscerator does the same (proportional) damage as a Shepard Level 60 with an Eviscerator.  If a player were bad enough, Shepard wouldn't be an almighty Valkyrie Spehs Mehrin, but a half-blind nerd who couldn't hit the broad side of a barn.

In short, RPG elements do not an RPG make.  If ME2 is an RPG, then God of War must be one, too.  After all, you collect 'experience' to level up your 'skills' to do more damage or have other effects.  Oh, that means Gears of War is an RPG too.  As is Brink.

The only reason ME2 is even referenced as an RPG is because it's from BioWare--an 'RPG company', and marketing probably wouldn't let them call a spade a spade.  The other is that it has a story that can't be immediately dismissed as the end result of an all-night binge at EA's Hooker and Blow Division.

                                                                                                                                          ^
I...  what...

Modifié par Kilshrek, 06 mai 2011 - 10:35 .

[Ottemis]

@Altima Darkspells:
I'm not such a black & white girl, I rather see everything in varying shades of grey.
Makes it (ironicly) alot less complicated (and less frustrating )

Also makes me right when I claim they all have RPG elements, because obviously they do EVEN if the black and white folk wouldn't class them under the 'RPG' header (for whatever reason).
RPG is a broad concept, the name is what it is, role-playing-game. Says nothing more then that, the rest is pretty much open to interpretation. Hence > grey <.

If a game deviates from an established formula on some parts, it doesn't nessecarily stop being part of the same genre.
We evolve, so do games and the way they are presented, as how each facet is developed.

Modifié par Ottemis, 06 mai 2011 - 02:11 .

[KenRed]

Those instances where you find a random piece of garbage and, magically, you receive a new quest telling you exactly who to give the junk to and where they are.......you call that innovation and moving the genre forward?!  How anyone can defend this "quest" design is beyond me.

Modifié par KenRed, 06 mai 2011 - 02:43 .

[happy_daiz]

Ottemis wrote...

@Altima Darkspells:
I'm not such a black & white girl, I rather see everything in varying shades of grey.
Makes it (ironicly) alot less complicated (and less frustrating )

Also makes me right when I claim they all have RPG elements, because obviously they do EVEN if the black and white folk wouldn't class them under the 'RPG' header (for whatever reason).
RPG is a broad concept, the name is what it is, role-playing-game. Says nothing more then that, the rest is pretty much open to interpretation. Hence > grey <.

If a game deviates from an established formula on some parts, it doesn't necessarily stop being part of the same genre.
We evolve, so do games and the way they are presented, as how each facet is developed.

^This.

[DragonRageGT]

Enurale wrote...
Im a real fanatic of DA:O.
I play this game everyday over 1 year. DLC's buyed, addons applied.
i was waited DA:2 w,th excisement.
Sorry but...
Dragon Age 2 is a TOTAL failure for me.
graphics, combat, conversations, characters everything lower has quality then DA:O.
Im a player, who plays pc games for 16 years and plays MMO's for 8 year.
DA:O = 95  (game has only some buggs and needs better expansion like main game, other everything is "PERFECT", ABSOLUETELY not needs any changes.
DA:2 = 70 (im sorry only 70, only storytelling good enough, other elements LOWER than origins.) , i play this game from my friendspc, only half of champaign.

Im very sad.
very, very sad.
honestly, bioware my favorite creator, baldurs gate and DA:O a top point of RPG mountain. but, im worried about for future dragon age games... But i have hope about SWTOR.
PLEASE ! Think logically,  DAO is a total succes, why you need a new system for DA:2 ?
Find a GOOD story for my DA:O wardens future and do same playing elements with DA:O, its my DA:2...
BIOWARE! pls hear voice of real RPG players ! this writings isnt only my ideas!

DA isnt MASS EFFECT !
Do better works in the future.
Sorry about my bad english, but i guess my writings clear enough...

A BLEEDED GREY WARDEN....

Enurale...

Same here. But DA2 is still a decent game, very very good action game. I can replay it many times but I cannot care the least for the companions or even for Hawke, as we could in Origins. DA2 causes me no emotion at all, way way differently from so many moments of Origins.

[Andyuk101]

WOW

Alot of peoples comments to read, most i agree with. But i dont agree with this Disappointed by the reaction of RPG and Bioware "fans"

A good example of why this game has taken a beating from the fans of Dragon age 2 can be summed up like this:

"If you ordered a Pizza with all the trimmings, the works and the sides, and you had to wait an extra 30 mins or so for your order, when  you finally get to tuck into the main course, you find that the toppings are missing, the crust is undercooked the dough is not well done, and no matter how much you want to finish the meal, you cant because its horrible, so you demand your money back, or the meal be Free".

Pretty much the same with Dragon Age 2, you build up the hype, you realse a very good CGI video of the character hawke and lots of cameo appearences of all the characters in the main trailer, it looks awsome", and you are vastly looking forward to engaging further into the dragon age universe in the sequal you have been waiting for since you have completed DA:O so many times because you enjoyed it that much.

Only to find out that you have paid £40, or $60 for a game that is half done  and only takes half the time to complete, it has so many bugs and problems,and cut and pasted so much re-used material that it leaves you frustrated angry and demanding why you have spent your hard earned money on a game you was lead to believe would be bigger, better, longer, and more of everything than DA:O.

Bioware fans and RPG fans alike cannot and WILL not over look these short comings, its like Lucasarts saying that Star wars the force unleashed 2 was a masterpiece and just like DA2 short changed its fans be releasing a sub-standard, much shorter game than the one before it.

If its not broke then dont fix it? , how about, if its good, then lets make it awsome?!

Theres nothing wrong with people quite rightly venting there anger at wasting there money on a game that should have been so much better than it was, I am looking forward to CHEAP DLC to make up the shortfall in content and address the games issues via lots and lots of PATCHING. If bioware fail to do this for its paying customers and loyal customers, then they are going to loose alot of ground in the RPG market because people wont part with their money so easily because bioware have lost alot of respect over DA2 in my opinon.

But we all have our opinons, i just dont agree with having to justify myself over a game that isnt worth £40 or $60 of my hard earned money.

We expect better, and quite rightly so.

Modifié par Andyuk101, 06 mai 2011 - 04:23 .