490 réponses à ce sujet

[bigrob08]

Brenus wrote...
Its not that I'm not willing to enjoy them, I simply dont. Also, why the hell should I have to buy a console when I already have a top of the range gaming PC? 

And RPGs / Strategy games are not 'narrow' genres, at least no where near as narrow as running around and shooting, or hack n slashing is.

You still havnt yet told me of any console games that are better than A+ games on the PC, oh wait, thats right, its because there arent any!

I'm withdrawing myself from this discussion, because it's pointless. You've made it clear that you cannot objectively evaluate games that are outside the RPG or Strategy genres.

[Brenus]

bigrob08 wrote...

Brenus wrote...
Its not that I'm not willing to enjoy them, I simply dont. Also, why the hell should I have to buy a console when I already have a top of the range gaming PC? 

And RPGs / Strategy games are not 'narrow' genres, at least no where near as narrow as running around and shooting, or hack n slashing is.

You still havnt yet told me of any console games that are better than A+ games on the PC, oh wait, thats right, its because there arent any!

I'm withdrawing myself from this discussion, because it's pointless. You've made it clear that you cannot objectively evaluate games that are outside the RPG or Strategy genres.

You have selective reading at its finest dont you?

Brenus wrote...

Dr. Impossible wrote...
A fighting game can be complex too.

Yes, I do enjoy Street Fighter 4 on the PC.

I also enjoyed Test Drive Unlimited 2, and thats not an RPG or Strategy game, and it was console first, but released on the PC as well.

Modifié par Brenus, 21 mars 2011 - 12:50 .

[Lotto]

What's with these threads telling me how much I owe bioware?

[Gatt9]

bigrob08 wrote...

Akka le Vil wrote...
I'm afraid you simply mix cause and effect.
The hatred against console doesn't come from some arbitrarily decision to hate console.
The hatred comes from the FACT that each time a game is made for console, it's dumbed down. Regardless of if people who play console actually deserve or require the dumbing down, it's simply something that is done.

And the scorn toward console gamers come from the fact that, more often than not, dumbed down game actually fare better on console.

So put together the "developpers consider that they have to dumb down their game to please console gamers" and "console gamers buy a lot of said game", and draw the conclusions you can.

Are you talking specifically about games that available for both the PC and consoles? That excludes a lot of console content.

If PC gamers are upset about developers streamlining games for consoles, then their spite towards consoles and console gamers is misdirected. If PCs were a more attractive platform, it wouldn't be a problem. Developers are stepping away from PCs for a reason, and still producing A+ titles on consoles. PC gamers need to realize this, and deal with it.

Gaming shifted to consoles because the previous generations existed on an ultra-low resolution display making artwork a great deal cheaper than what it cost to do on the PC.  They remain shifted away due to  misguided publishers thinking that they'll make more money making the simplest games possible in order to reach the most people possible.

It has nothing to do with the platform being "More attractive" and everything to do with money and people who don't understand buisness.

I'd suggest you spend some time learning gaming history before trying to rewrite it again.

[bigrob08]

Brenus wrote...

bigrob08 wrote...

Brenus wrote...
Its not that I'm not willing to enjoy them, I simply dont. Also, why the hell should I have to buy a console when I already have a top of the range gaming PC? 

And RPGs / Strategy games are not 'narrow' genres, at least no where near as narrow as running around and shooting, or hack n slashing is.

You still havnt yet told me of any console games that are better than A+ games on the PC, oh wait, thats right, its because there arent any!

I'm withdrawing myself from this discussion, because it's pointless. You've made it clear that you cannot objectively evaluate games that are outside the RPG or Strategy genres.

You have selective reading at its finest dont you?

Brenus wrote...

Dr. Impossible wrote...
A fighting game can be complex too.

Yes, I do enjoy Street Fighter 4 on the PC.

I also enjoyed Test Drive Unlimited 2, and thats not an RPG or Strategy game, and it was console first, but released on the PC as well.

My last post in this topic. When I wrote my response, I had yet to see you mention that you liked Street Fighter 4. It doesn't change my position. Enjoying two games outside of the genres you mentioned doesn't make you a diverse gamer. Writing off Uncharted 2 as a C+ game because it's not the kind of game you like is much more telling than the fact that you like Street Fighter 4 and Test Drive Unlimited 2.

[Brenus]

Actually, I had never ever heard of Uncharted 2, because its not available on the PC, hence its hardly worth me considering.

Im not going to buy a crapbox 360 or whatever rubbish console is required to play the game on when I've already spent so much money on a vastly superior PC. 

Modifié par Brenus, 21 mars 2011 - 01:03 .

[EmsaFallkin]

I don't mind them "evolving" their RPG's anyway they like. But did they have to do it in the middle of a franchise?

I see people say that "we" (the dissapointed and the haters) can't adapt, we'll be left behind, etc etc. But really? You think the Dragon Age franchise and Bioware is all there is in this world? I used to love Bioware for giving me my cRPG fix, but I'm also a console player and I also play all kinds of games. I do not consider DA2 evolutionary, I've seen it all before. This isn't evolution, this is a different genre than DA:O. Was Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars an evolution of the Super Mario franchise? No, it was a different genre.

If I want "Awesome" I'll play GoW or any other game focusing on Awesome.
If I want a cinematic experience I'll play Heavy Rain.
If I want a living and interesting city I'll play Assassin's Creed or The Witcher.
If I feel some strange longing for a vague para-phrased dialogue wheel I'll play... Mass Effect.

I doubt there is anything "new" in their game, most of it feel like they borrowed the ME blueprint and tackled on some exploding bodies and lightning fast combat.

And that story! I can like the intent of it, but the execution, as well as some of the major plot quests, are just crap.

Anyways. Doing this in a sequel was just a really foolish move. They should have named it Dragon Age: The Champion and focused even more on the console side and even going so far to call it a console game, and just given the DA:O fans a DLC that put an end to the Morrigan/Godchild story and killed of that part of the franchise.

Meh, I've said it several times. I'm not a hater, I'm dissapointed.

[Brenus]

There is absolutely nothing new about DA2, its just standard cookie cutter consolized garbage as is found in hundreds of other console games already on the market.

[Derengard]

They don't push the game in any original direction. I would approve of substantial ideas like the frame-narrative, the family dynamic, more intimate or political storytelling if it would be pulled through to any impressive extent. But taking it more in a comic and action direction is neither any different, progressive direction nowadays (as it's omnipresent and also a concept older than Doom (nice allusion, don't you think)) nor does it improve the game overall (as 80% of reviews tell you), except for making it easier to produce.

Modifié par Derengard, 21 mars 2011 - 01:37 .

[Elite Midget]

Same outcry happened when ME2 hit released.

Mass Effect 2 sold VERY well.

Bioware will not change their stance because their current one makes them a lot of money.


Give it till years end before they suck it up and stop careing. By than they'll either have bought DA2 or have moved on to greener pastures. Like the Witcher 2 which I can guarentee wont sell anywhere near as much as DA2.

Modifié par Elite Midget, 21 mars 2011 - 01:40 .

[EmsaFallkin]

Well, it's a good PC gamer year anyways. The Witcher 2, Neverwinter, Skyrim, Diablo 3 and Deus Ex - Human Evolution.

[ElectricPhase]

I keep seeing this sort of thing posted over and over:
- If you like the game, whether you've played it or not, you are open minded and your opinion is welcome.
- If you dislike the game--no matter what lengths you go to back up your opinion with evidence, no matter how civil you are in expressing it, and even if you completed multiple play-throughs-- you're a h8r. Oh, and part of an inappropriately "vocal minority".

Sigh.

[Il Divo]

Brenus wrote...

If console games are so great, then how about releasing them on the PC? Oh, wait, thats right, then absolutely no one would buy a console ever again.

Try playing Prince of Persia: Sands of Time or Legacy of Kain (everything since Soul Reaver) on PC with a mouse and keyboard. It doesn't work.

[Dr. Impossible]

Use a gamepad then.

[EmsaFallkin]

Il Divo.... You do know that there are gamepads for PCs? I've got two of them even...

[Il Divo]

EmsaFallkin wrote...

Il Divo.... You do know that there are gamepads for PCs? I've got two of them even...

I do. It's what I used when playing Prince of Persia off Steam. But at that point, I'd say you removed one of the key aspects that people claim separates 'console gamers' from PC gamers. If you choose to play Prince of Persia with a game pad, you're basically playing on a console with better graphics.

[bill4747bill]

ElectricPhase wrote...

I keep seeing this sort of thing posted over and over:
- If you like the game, whether you've played it or not, you are open minded and your opinion is welcome.
- If you dislike the game--no matter what lengths you go to back up your opinion with evidence, no matter how civil you are in expressing it, and even if you completed multiple play-throughs-- you're a h8r. Oh, and part of an inappropriately "vocal minority".

Sigh.

I have seen plenty of pro and con over the top posts. It is hardly one sided as you suggest.
 But really it looks to me like the main problem is people not accepting that some will like the game and others will dislike it. Is that really so hard to do? Must be.

[EmsaFallkin]

No, I'm playing on a computer with a gamepad and superior graphics

Anyways, I've got consoles as well and if I feel a game has gameplay that suits consoles I buy them for console. I wouldn't buy games like Shogun 2 or Dragon Age: Origins for console, but I do buy the ME games for consoles for example.

[Dr. Impossible]

Il Divo wrote...

I do. It's what I used when playing Prince of Persia off Steam. But at that point, I'd say you removed one of the key aspects that people claim separates 'console gamers' from PC gamers. If you choose to play Prince of Persia with a game pad, you're basically playing on a console with better graphics.

On the PC you use whatever input method is the best. For flight simulators people use joysticks, for racing games they use wheels, for fighting games they use pads, for shooters they use mice.

[Il Divo]

EmsaFallkin wrote...

No, I'm playing on a computer with a gamepad and superior graphics

Anyways, I've got consoles as well and if I feel a game has gameplay that suits consoles I buy them for console. I wouldn't buy games like Shogun 2 or Dragon Age: Origins for console, but I do buy the ME games for consoles for example.

That's fair. My only question is though: why buy the Mass Effect series on a console if you can use a game pad? I recall using a 360 controller for Prince of Persia, so couldn't it work the same way there?

[abaris]

  If you choose to play Prince of Persia with a game pad, you're basically playing on a console with better graphics.

That's a kind of logic I really don't get. If I play a flight simulator, I'm using a joystick. The tools don't make up the experience, the game does. Prince of Persia however is a nogo in my book. Exactly the kind of action driven stuff, making me sceptical of console developed games.

Il Divo wrote...

That's fair. My only question is though:
why buy the Mass Effect series on a console if you can use a game pad? I
recall using a 360 controller for Prince of Persia, so couldn't it work
the same way there?

Why would you even need a controller for the Mass Effect series. It plays just fine with keyboard and mouse.

Modifié par abaris, 21 mars 2011 - 02:18 .

[EmsaFallkin]

I actually got ME1 as a birthday present so it wasn't my choice, and then with ME2 I wanted to use my old savegame of course so I had to buy it for 360. If the decision hadn't been forced on me, I don't know. I might be biased since I've only played it on console but I've always felt that ME is a console game.

[abaris]

I might be biased since I've only played it on console but I've always felt that ME is a console game.

Absolutely not. I may be a minority, but the ME series has most hallmarks of a RPG, pretty solid graphics and can be well controlled in the PC environment.

I tell you what makes a really bad console kind game: Racers without any real physics for example and graphics that reduced environments and grapics that were top notch some five years ago.

[Il Divo]

abaris wrote...

That's a kind of logic I really don't get. If I play a flight simulator, I'm using a joystick. The tools don't make up the experience, the game does. Prince of Persia however is a nogo in my book. Exactly the kind of action driven stuff, making me sceptical of console developed games.

I'd say the tool is pretty important. One aspect of the PC that I always thought separated it from consoles is the emphasis on using a keyboard (for games like WoW, Baldur's Gate, etc) which allows for a very different style of play than games which traditionally use a game controller (Prince of Persia, Legacy of Kain).

If that's not the case, what is it that actually separates a game 'designed for console' against a game 'designed for pc'? I'm being serious here, I'm curious as to the opinions.

Why would you even need a controller for the Mass Effect series. It plays just fine with keyboard and mouse.

This is true. Just saying that if someone prefers to use a game controller, in both instances they'd actually be better off on the PC (better graphics). Although, his answer does put everything in context.

Modifié par Il Divo, 21 mars 2011 - 02:26 .

[EmsaFallkin]

@abaris, I haven't said anything bad about ME. I'm sure I would like it on PC as well