734 réponses à ce sujet

[Liliandra Nadiar]

Question,
Been looking at specing Verric into a more debuff/control set up and been looking at Fatiguing Fog/Confusion since I'm thinking of specing Anders into Spirit for a change of pace. Even without the Disorient effect, both seem like good incoming damage mitigation tools, and with the effect and spirit bolt/walking bomb should/might be a good way to clear clumps of trash mobs. So far the 'downside' I'm immediately seeing is 'stealing' Death Blows from the 'Zerker. Any thoughts/experience with that set up?

[Bozorgmehr]

Manveru123 wrote...

Just a few things to share. I've found SnS Berserker/Vanguard to be a better option for me, because:

- it removes the need to stack STR over 41 for chance to hit due to The Vague Blade's effect. If you get it, that is.
- there's a shield in Act III with Immunity to Knockback, that's the only thing which can stop a properly geared B/V.
- you have more skill points to spend, since SnS tree is generally useless for this type of character and you're not spending any points in 2h tree.

Just personal preference I guess but it seems to work exceptionally well for me. Great topic btw.

1) My 2H only had STR 41 and I never noticed anything that looked like misses or blows that did no or very minor damage - but it's hard to see everything considering the insane attack speed. I can say my 2H (B/R) did more damage / cleared rooms faster with minimal STR & CON and max WIL compared to high STR (and less WIL). I seriously doubt you need something like the Vague Blade to (reliably) hit something.

@ level 23 (STR 41) with gear and the Blade of Mercy: attack 100% (784) > 100% vs normal, 89% vs Lieutenant, and 74% vs Boss. When I go full STR same equipment: attack 100% (3825) > 100%, 100%, 85% - only a very small improvement IMHO and not worth it when you have Berserk.

2) You can buy the Etched Ring of the Twins (Act 2) to get knockback immunity - no need to go SnS for that.

3) You do want to invest in the 2H tree: just for Sunder => more staggers => more CCCs => enemies die quickly. BTW, where do you invest in? There aren't many abilities that work well with Berserk, all the sustains are bad for stamina (=bad for damage). I think the Templar spec would suit that type of character better (instead of Berserker).

[Manveru123]

My argument about The Vague Blade comes from a str/wil comparison someone did a few pages back, raising a few valid points. You might want to check it out. Also The Vague Blade happens to be one of the best one handers in the game and has three rune slots so it's not like I'm losing damage by using it.

I'm actually wearing that ring and for some reason I completely forgot it does that... guess I'm gonna keep Shield of the Knight Herself then ;p

Other than Berserker, Reaver and Vanguard I'm investing the points in Second Wind talents with upgrades mostly. Fully upgraded with cooldown reduction I was able to stay in Berserk for the whole duel with Arishok. Not using any sustains, no, but it's still tough on points. I did skip buying the books in Act 1 if that matters.

[Roxlimn]

Why use Shield of the Knight Herself? Isn't Mage Friend better?

[godlike13]

Roxlimn wrote...

Why use Shield of the Knight Herself? Isn't Mage Friend better?

Shield of the Knight Herself gives a 100% of basic attack damage vs. enemies that attack in melee

[Liliandra Nadiar]

To clarify, the shield reflects a melee attacker's damage not your damage.

[AreleX]

This is really hard to do, since I'm constantly switching my tactics around, and nothing ever stays set in stone for long, but I'll try to make an amalgamation of the things that worked best, in my limited testing. At Level 19:

Isabela Tactics

Self: Health <25% - Use Potion
Self: Mana or stamina <10% - Use Stamina Draught
Self: Any - Activate: Speed
Self: Surrounded by at least two - Activate: Savvy (Buccaneer's Savvy upgraded)
Self: Surrounded by no enemies - Deactivate: Savvy (Buccaneer's Savvy upgraded)
Self: Health <50% - Use current condition for next tactic
Anders: Any - Back-to-Back (Invisible Friend upgraded)
Enemy: Attacking Anders - Use current condition for next tactic
Hawke: Any - Goad
Enemy: Attacking Isabela - Goad
Anders: Being attacked by a melee attack - Armistice
Self: Being attacked by a melee attack - Armistice
Enemy: Clustered with at least two enemies - Use current condition for next tactic
Anders: Being attacked by a melee attack - All Hands on Deck (Shore Leave upgraded)
Enemy: Target rank is Elite or higher - Use current condition for next tactic
Anders: Being attacked by a melee attack - Twin Fangs (Reversed Grip upgradeded)
Enemy: Target rank is Elite or higher - Use current condition for next tactic
Enemy: STAGGERED - Explosive Strike (Merciless Strike upgraded)

As you can see, I pretty much have her set to be Anders' bodyguard, since she can kill enemies around him without very possibly destroying him in the process. I'm thinking about dropping Explosive Strike (Merciless Strike upgraded) altogether, just because the way the AI handles chained attacks is incredibly iffy. It's awesome when it works, don't get me wrong, seeing her one-shot Elites will never get old, it's just that I don't feel like it works consistently enough, at this point in testing.

Modifié par AreleX, 30 mars 2011 - 05:13 .

[Graunt]

Roxlimn wrote...

Manveru123:

I've played an SnS BV almost to completion. It's pretty spiffy - too bad I'm going to have to redo Act 3 to get the Vague Blade. I'm deciding on whether to finish with Glandivialis instead.

Anyways, I'm thinking about something here. Shield Defense penalizes you -25% Damage for +25% Damage Resistance. Is it enough to offset Barrage?

The Vague Blade seems more useful as a "trash" killing weapon.  Even with Devastation + Lyrium Rune + either Impact or Spirit, it just doesn't do all that much against bosses or Templars thanks to their armor. Glandivalis and Sataareth in particular seemed to do much more, even without any runes in place.  Sataareth in particular just wrecks Hybris and Orsino (who is very weak vs Fire and Spirit).

My argument about The Vague Blade comes from a str/wil comparison someone did a few pages back, raising a few valid points. You might want to check it out. Also The Vague Blade happens to be one of the best one
handers in the game and has three rune slots so it's not like I'm losing damage by using it.

It's actually a bit overrated.  I had Aveline setup as essentially nothing but DPS and she did more against tougher enemies with an unslotted elemental weapon.  She was also sitting at 100% attack, even with just 41 STR at lvl 24.  Aveline obviously is not Hawke, so she won't be able to get the most potential out of the weapons, but I really don't see how it makes any difference what character has it since you can't magically make a physical weapon suddenly "better" against highly armored opponents.

Modifié par Graunt, 30 mars 2011 - 07:02 .

[Roxlimn]

Graunt:

Thanks for the tip! I was very partial to Sataareth. Any thoughts on one-handed Bassrath-Kata?

[Graunt]

Roxlimn wrote...

Graunt:

Thanks for the tip! I was very partial to Sataareth. Any thoughts on one-handed Bassrath-Kata?

I never actually ended up with that, simply because I wasn't going to spend gold on the Qunari swords just to complete the quest.  I think I really only had the one (or two?) vendor swords left to buy to just complete the quest, so I'll do it this playthrough.  I think other people were discussing the deathblow effect, and that it might not even work.  I'm not really sure how that sword could actually even be as good as the Vague Blade though, especially if you're already at, or near 100% attack.

Modifié par Graunt, 30 mars 2011 - 10:10 .

[Roxlimn]

I'm curious about the power of the +damage to humans. That could be very useful against Mages and Templar.

[Manveru123]

Graunt wrote...

The Vague Blade seems more useful as a "trash" killing weapon.  Even with Devastation + Lyrium Rune + either Impact or Spirit, it just doesn't do all that much against bosses or Templars thanks to their armor. Glandivalis and Sataareth in particular seemed to do much more, even without any runes in place.  Sataareth in particular just wrecks Hybris and Orsino (who is very weak vs Fire and Spirit).

I'm not a fan of high end elemental weapons because they only have one rune slot and I like having devastation and lyrium rune in my weapons Also I think I've sold Sataareth somewhere already so can't use it even if I wanted to.

[jsamlaw]

Manveru123 wrote...

My argument about The Vague Blade comes from a str/wil comparison someone did a few pages back, raising a few valid points. You might want to check it out. Also The Vague Blade happens to be one of the best one handers in the game and has three rune slots so it's not like I'm losing damage by using it.

If you're referring to the post that concluded dumping all points into STR as opposed to WIL, I believe that post failed to account for Second Wind.  The more points placed in WIL, the more value gained from Second Wind and the longer Beserk can be sustained.

I'd be curious to see how the #s work out based on the assumption that you'll have 2 or 3 full stamina bars when calculating the damage output of a STR build vs. a WIL build (after 41 STR of course)

Modifié par jsamlaw, 30 mars 2011 - 04:10 .

[Ares3521]

Got a question,

how the heck do you get the blood of mercy
or
the bloom?
ive been to sundermont and i didnt get it?
only explanation i could come up with is that i missed it somehow. Im on the last part of Act III, i havent started the last quest and ive done everything else. Can anyone tell me what i did wrong? or how to get either of those weapons?

[Roxlimn]

The Blade of Mercy is found in a chest in the warehouse meeting place during the Best Served Cold quest in Act 3. You gift it to Fenris and then take it back.

[Ares3521]

Nice man! thanks. i never went to speak to fenris at his mansion, so i never got it. I have it now though, thanks !

what about bloom? anyone?

[AreleX]

It drops from the Arcane Horror in the Arwiergan Scrolls quest. 'Quest' is a bit of a misnomer, though; you aren't really going to any new areas for the most part, you are revisiting places you've been to find the scrolls (you activate the quest by picking one up (3 total), and it ends with a boss fight after you find all three.

This particular Arcane Horror/Scroll is found by going up the path to the right of Keeper Marethari, where you first meet Merrill. Keep going up, and you should fight an Arcane Horror, and once you kill it, the scroll is behind the waist-size broken stone wall (you would not believe how long I spent looking for this ****ing thing, I suck at this game).

Liliandra Nadiar wrote...

Question,
Been looking at
specing Verric into a more debuff/control set up and been looking at Fatiguing Fog/Confusion since I'm thinking of specing Anders into Spirit for a change of pace. Even without the Disorient effect, both seem like good incoming damage mitigation tools, and with the effect and spirit bolt/walking bomb should/might be a good way to clear clumps of trash mobs. So far the 'downside' I'm immediately seeing is 'stealing' Death Blows from the 'Zerker. Any houghts/experience with that set up?

Sorry, I must've missed this. If you're playing on a difficulty below Nightmare (Walking Bomb is a good way to ruin your party's s**t via friendly fire), you'll definitely be dropping things quickly doing that. I'm not sure why you'd do it, though; half the fun of this build is ripping through trash in the most badass way possible!

If you really really want to use Fatiguing Fog, I'd say go for it. I personally think that it's not worth it to spend all those points (I've had Varric/Isabela using it fully upgraded while playing this build before), but all this could, as you said, serve as a way to switch things up a little bit. I wish I understood the mechanics behind the Obscure effect better, I think that would make it easier for me to help you reach a conclusion on it. Try it out though, and if you learn anything, be sure to let me know.

.

Modifié par AreleX, 31 mars 2011 - 02:11 .

[WJC3688]

If you're referring to the post that concluded dumping all points into
STR as opposed to WIL, I believe that post failed to account for Second
Wind.  The more points placed in WIL, the more value gained from Second
Wind and the longer Beserk can be sustained.

I'd be curious to
see how the #s work out based on the assumption that you'll have 2 or 3
full stamina bars when calculating the damage output of a STR build vs. a
WIL build (after 41 STR of course)

How does Second Wind increase the damage gained from Wil investment?  I don't quite understand.  It lets you refill your stamina bar, sure, but my calculations already assumed a full stamina bar, and Second Wind doesn't increase your max stamina or the % of your stamina that's translated into damage.

[Graunt]

AreleX wrote...
If you really really want to use Fatiguing Fog, I'd say go for it. I personally think that it's not worth it to spend all those points (I've had Varric/Isabela using it fully upgraded while playing this build before), but all this could, as you said, serve as a way to switch things up a little bit. I wish I understood the mechanics behind the Obscure effect better, I think that would make it easier for me to help you reach a conclusion on it. Try it out though, and if you learn anything, be sure to let me know.

Personal experiences an anecdotal evidence don't really add much, but I dismissed pretty much the entire Sabotage line until reading what Rumination had to say about it, as well as looking at it in action in his videos.  True, it does require a hell of a lot of points to reach, however...really, Varric has nothing better to dump his points into.  

The Archery line in general is just flat out horrible unless you're playing as an Elemental Mage, and even then you have to worry about fire immune creatures.  The difference between having Fog and not is pretty large for survivability, and for specific groups that can abuse disorient, that's your surefire way to get it.

This is my lvl 24 Varric: biowarefans.com/dragon-age-2-talent-builder/#8tBD1zoMm0riuQwHbWR1kc0OSGCIU (not in any order)

How does Second Wind increase the damage gained from Wil investment?  I don't quite understand.  It lets you refill your stamina bar, sure, but my calculations already assumed a full stamina bar, and Second Wind doesn't increase your max stamina or the % of your stamina that's translated into damage.

Becuase having a larger stamina bar allows you to use more activated abilities while maintaining a decent attack bonus after those are used.  Having Second Wind simply allows you to dump even more abilities without having to worry nearly as much about your bar.  Unless all you do is auto attack and only use Cleave, you aren't going to have a full stamina bar at all times, even with Death Blow, especially on bosses.

Modifié par Graunt, 31 mars 2011 - 03:03 .

[mjharper]

Have you seen this thread?

http://social.biowar...8/index/6861617

From the fourth post: "So as you can see, if you are a berserker/reaver and you have both Barrage and Fervor activate most of the time, then your Dex is almost always going to be more valuable [than Str]."

Having a blast with the build, btw :-)

[snowylee]

Graunt wrote...

AreleX wrote...
If you really really want to use Fatiguing Fog, I'd say go for it. I personally think that it's not worth it to spend all those points (I've had Varric/Isabela using it fully upgraded while playing this build before), but all this could, as you said, serve as a way to switch things up a little bit. I wish I understood the mechanics behind the Obscure effect better, I think that would make it easier for me to help you reach a conclusion on it. Try it out though, and if you learn anything, be sure to let me know.

Personal experiences an anecdotal evidence don't really add much, but I dismissed pretty much the entire Sabotage line until reading what Rumination had to say about it, as well as looking at it in action in his videos.  True, it does require a hell of a lot of points to reach, however...really, Varric has nothing better to dump his points into. 

@Graunt do you have a link to the thread with videos? I cant seem to find it

[XOGHunter246]

The Bloom is found from the scroll side quest in sundermount google it you need to kill a Arcane Horror with some other mobs to get it. During this quest you get the Celebrant another very good sword which on nightmare mode is a tough battle against two named Revenants.

[HippeusOmega]

What accessories are good for a berserker at end game?

[jsamlaw]

How does Second Wind increase the damage gained from Wil investment?  I don't quite understand.  It lets you refill your stamina bar, sure, but my calculations already assumed a full stamina bar, and Second Wind doesn't increase your max stamina or the % of your stamina that's translated into damage.

Because the damage bonus provided by WIL via the Berserk talent depends on how long you can sustain the skill.  Therefore, as you put more points into WIL, Second Wind will return an even greater amount of stamina upon use.

STR is persistant damage and doesn't have a time component.  So measuring STR vs. the damage increase of Berserk for 1 full stamina bar will be very different than measuring the damage increase of STR vs. the damage increase of Berserk for 2 or more full stamina bars.

Specifically, the previous STR vs. WIL post concluded, in part, that when stamina is exhausted WIL points become useless whereas STR is always useful.  Well, as a counter to that conclusion what if stamina was never exhausted because the stamina bar was sufficient to last 45 seconds so Second Wind (upgraded) was always available for use?

TL;DR:  You can't measure the WIL side of the equation without factoring in unlimited stamina or the exact duration of Berserk, which will be affected by instant cast talents such as Second Wind (and to a lesser extent Bolster).

Modifié par jsamlaw, 31 mars 2011 - 03:56 .

[AreleX]

Graunt wrote...

Personal experiences an anecdotal evidence don't really add much, but I dismissed pretty much the entire Sabotage line until reading what Rumination had to say about it, as well as looking at it in action in his videos.  True, it does require a hell of a lot of points to reach, however...really, Varric has nothing better to dump his points into.  

The Archery line in general is just flat out horrible unless you're playing as an Elemental Mage, and even then you have to worry about fire immune creatures.  The difference between having Fog and not is pretty large for survivability, and for specific groups that can abuse disorient, that's your surefire way to get it.

This is my lvl 24 Varric: biowarefans.com/dragon-age-2-talent-builder/#8tBD1zoMm0riuQwHbWR1kc0OSGCIU (not in any order)

That's true about Varric, I was thinking more Act II when I made that post, but you're right. Get the good stuff out of the Bianca tree, pick up a few things in Scoundrel, and you can pretty much do whatever you want.

Do, however, consider that a +20% movement speed increase from Embellishment will possibly turn him into a Predator drone of deadly speed and accuracy when it comes to getting in your goddamn way. I've seen him sprint across the field like Usain ****ing Bolt to stand in front of me and shoot an enemy from 2 inches away, when he was shooting it JUST FINE FROM WHERE HE WAS.

Care to share a link to the thread/videos?

Modifié par AreleX, 31 mars 2011 - 04:42 .