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[AlexXIV]

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yes and I tell you why even before I go to that link.

First off devs said this: DA2 is not about fighting an ancient evil like DA:O. Meep. Wrong. You fight Meredith possessed by an ancient evil.

Wait... this isn't true.  Or at least you're stating an opinion as fact.

We don't know what the hell the Idol is.  You're assuming it's some living spirit  or 'ancient evil" that takes over Merideth.  But there's exactly  Nothing in the game that  points to this.  It's an idol of lyrium.  And lyrium isn't evil.  it's an element that makes you crazy if  enough of it  it gets in your blood.  We learn that in DA:O.

It's ancient and if it makes people crazy it is obviously evil. .

Lyrium is evil then.  lol

Makes people crazy?  Check  (see: 'lyrium addled"  See:  The Codex Entry for Lyrium.  See:   the crazy dwarf  merchant in Orzamar).

Next up:  Proof that posession occured with Merideth  (your claim), rather than, say,  Lyrium induced psychosis.  Get to it.

Lyrium is dangerous at the very least. You can argue it is evil. That's the same argument about bloodmagic.

It is the old phrase: Power corrupts, ultimate power corrupts ulitmately.

What the idol does is giving you power and at the same time loosening your morale code. This is bound to make people do evil things, no matter how good their intentions. For all we know Meredith could have been alright to the point she got her hands on the lyrium idol. I always wondered if using lyrium is really so much better than bloodmagic. You could see Lyrium as the life blood of the world. It flows in veins through the earth.

[AlexXIV]

Yrkoon wrote...

DiablosShadows wrote...

It went from Bartrand to Meredith directly no other ppl.

Not true.  we know for a fact  (codex entry)  that someone forged it into a sword for Merideth.  And we also know that Bartrand is not a  dwarven smith.

Meredith had it for 3 years though. I don't know about Bartrand, but he probably about the same time. So possibly it is not dangerous if you only hold it for a short time, but the longer you do, the worse it gets.

[Caladors]

AlexXIV wrote...

Lots of vaild stuff.

I have to say your a great speaker.
Or writter as the case maybe.
I don't agree with every point but I do agree with much.

I am simply leaving this as a place holder for when I have the time to answer.

[AlexXIV]

Caladors wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Lots of vaild stuff.

I have to say your a great speaker.
Or writter as the case maybe.
I don't agree with every point but I do agree with much.

I am simply leaving this as a place holder for when I have the time to answer.

Why thank you but I rather think of myself being good at logic and common sense. My writing could be alot better, especially in english. I admire people here who can write what I think in a perfect use of words where I could only sound like a 5th grader with the most basic use of the most basic words ...

[Yrkoon]

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yes and I tell you why even before I go to that link.

First off devs said this: DA2 is not about fighting an ancient evil like DA:O. Meep. Wrong. You fight Meredith possessed by an ancient evil.

Wait... this isn't true.  Or at least you're stating an opinion as fact.

We don't know what the hell the Idol is.  You're assuming it's some living spirit  or 'ancient evil" that takes over Merideth.  But there's exactly  Nothing in the game that  points to this.  It's an idol of lyrium.  And lyrium isn't evil.  it's an element that makes you crazy if  enough of it  it gets in your blood.  We learn that in DA:O.

It's ancient and if it makes people crazy it is obviously evil. .

Lyrium is evil then.  lol

Makes people crazy?  Check  (see: 'lyrium addled"  See:  The Codex Entry for Lyrium.  See:   the crazy dwarf  merchant in Orzamar).

Next up:  Proof that posession occured with Merideth  (your claim), rather than, say,  Lyrium induced psychosis.  Get to it.

Lyrium is dangerous at the very least. You can argue it is evil. That's the same argument about bloodmagic.

It is the old phrase: Power corrupts, ultimate power corrupts ulitmately.

Yes, anything this subjective  can be argued.  But it's a huge leap of logic (not to mention dishonest debating) to call Bioware a bunch of liars for saying that there's no ancient evil to  vanquish based on this subjective  argument.  There is NOT.

Merideth is the final boss.  You have to vanquish her.    That she's wielding an ancient 'weapon' that's making her crazy  does not mean you're fighting an ancient evil.

[Yrkoon]

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

DiablosShadows wrote...

It went from Bartrand to Meredith directly no other ppl.

Not true.  we know for a fact  (codex entry)  that someone forged it into a sword for Merideth.  And we also know that Bartrand is not a  dwarven smith.

Meredith had it for 3 years though. I don't know about Bartrand, but he probably about the same time. So possibly it is not dangerous if you only hold it for a short time, but the longer you do, the worse it gets.

What in the world  are you talking about?

We know that Bartrand and Meredeth both held the idol.  But were they the only ones?  That's the question that this particular quote pyramid is asking.

[AlexXIV]

Yrkoon wrote...
Yes, anything this subjective  can be argued.  But it's a huge leap of logic (not to mention dishonest debating) to call Bioware a bunch of liars for saying that there's no ancient evil to  vanquish based on this subjective  argument.  There is NOT.

Merideth is the final boss.  You have to vanquish her.    That she's wielding an ancient 'weapon' that's making her crazy  does not mean you're fighting an ancient evil.

Ok, but it also a stretch to say DA2 is not about fighting an ancient evil if for once, the deep road expedition is pretty much thing thing that caused everything, even according to Varric. And that can only be because of the lyrium idol. And also if you only fought Meredith and not the power of the idol it'd be probably a much shorter fight. Not to mention that we really know whether Meredith would have called the Right of Annullment if she wasn't under the influence of the idol or if she could have been talked out of it.

The point is after what Bioware said, most people (like me) expected more of a political game with the mages agenda, chantry agenda and the qunari. But in the end everyone seems to be possessed in some way. Call me radical in this view, but that's a broken promise to me.

[Yrkoon]

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...
Yes, anything this subjective  can be argued.  But it's a huge leap of logic (not to mention dishonest debating) to call Bioware a bunch of liars for saying that there's no ancient evil to  vanquish based on this subjective  argument.  There is NOT.

Merideth is the final boss.  You have to vanquish her.    That she's wielding an ancient 'weapon' that's making her crazy  does not mean you're fighting an ancient evil.

Ok, but it also a stretch to say DA2 is not about fighting an ancient evil if for once, the deep road expedition is pretty much thing thing that caused everything, even according to Varric. And that can only be because of the lyrium idol.

Again, you're stating an opinion as fact.  We hear about Merideth and her.... overbearing personality as soon as we first set foot in Kirkwall.... and that's way before the deep roads expedition.


The Idol just amplifies  everything.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 18 mars 2011 - 04:03 .

[AlexXIV]

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

DiablosShadows wrote...

It went from Bartrand to Meredith directly no other ppl.

Not true.  we know for a fact  (codex entry)  that someone forged it into a sword for Merideth.  And we also know that Bartrand is not a  dwarven smith.

Meredith had it for 3 years though. I don't know about Bartrand, but he probably about the same time. So possibly it is not dangerous if you only hold it for a short time, but the longer you do, the worse it gets.

What in the world  are you talking about?

We know that Bartrand and Meredeth both held the idol.  But were they the only ones?  That's the question that this particular quote pyramid is asking.

My answer was that even if they were not the only ones, the idol may not have influence on people instantly. Like some sort of pollution. Think of the ring in lord of the rings. Frodo resisted at first, but eventually even he couldn't. Of course I assume the idol is weaker than the ring. So I am saying you only meet Bartrand 3 years after the deep roads expedition. And there are again 3 years after chapter 2, in which Meredith gets the idol. So both have had it for 3 years. Maybe that's even the reason for the 3 year breaks after every chapter. It's the time the idol needs to control the owner. So whoever forged or traded it may only have had it for a couple of days or weeks.

[Yrkoon]

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

DiablosShadows wrote...

It went from Bartrand to Meredith directly no other ppl.

Not true.  we know for a fact  (codex entry)  that someone forged it into a sword for Merideth.  And we also know that Bartrand is not a  dwarven smith.

Meredith had it for 3 years though. I don't know about Bartrand, but he probably about the same time. So possibly it is not dangerous if you only hold it for a short time, but the longer you do, the worse it gets.

What in the world  are you talking about?

We know that Bartrand and Meredeth both held the idol.  But were they the only ones?  That's the question that this particular quote pyramid is asking.

My answer was that even if they were not the only ones, the idol may not have influence on people instantly..

  And from where are you coming to this conclusion?    Certainly not from playing the game.  The  Idol has an *instant* effect on Bartrand, doesn't it.  The moment he lays his hands on it, he locks  his entire expedition up  in the deep roads to die   (including his brother) and heads off to the surface  alone with the idol.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 18 mars 2011 - 04:08 .

[AlexXIV]

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...
Yes, anything this subjective  can be argued.  But it's a huge leap of logic (not to mention dishonest debating) to call Bioware a bunch of liars for saying that there's no ancient evil to  vanquish based on this subjective  argument.  There is NOT.

Merideth is the final boss.  You have to vanquish her.    That she's wielding an ancient 'weapon' that's making her crazy  does not mean you're fighting an ancient evil.

Ok, but it also a stretch to say DA2 is not about fighting an ancient evil if for once, the deep road expedition is pretty much thing thing that caused everything, even according to Varric. And that can only be because of the lyrium idol.

Again, you're stating an opinion as fact.  We hear about Merideth and her.... overbearing personality as soon as we first set foot in Kirkwall.... and that's way before the deep roads expedition.


The Idol just amplifies  everything.

I state facts as facts, you just happen to see them as opinion. You say yourself the idol influenced her. Whatever her personality was before, it got worse. So there was influence of an ancient evil. And she uses it's power in the end fight.

[OLDIRTYBARON]

AlexXIV wrote...

OLDIRTYBARON wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yes and I tell you why even before I go to that link.

First off devs said this: DA2 is not about fighting an ancient evil like DA:O. Meep. Wrong. You fight Meredith possessed by an ancient evil.

Wait... this isn't true.  Or at least you're stating an opinion as fact.

We don't know what the hell the Idol is.  You're assuming it's some living spirit  or 'ancient evil" that takes over Merideth.  But there's exactly  Nothing in the game that  points to this.  It's an idol of lyrium.  And lyrium isn't evil.  it's an element that makes you crazy if  enough of it  it gets in your blood.  We learn that in DA:O.

It's ancient and if it makes people crazy it is obviously evil. Or do you think that's a good thing? I don't know that lyrium as such drives people crazy or is to be considered evil. It causes addiction though. Anyway, lyrium isn't inherently evil. The idol is. It drives everyone who owns it mad. Which makes me conclude that it is corrupted.

Wrong.

The idol - and this is inferred from the game itself - amplifies dominant emotions. If you're a selfish bastard at heart but your conscience and ties to family keeps you from strangling your younger brother, the idol amplifies your base emotion until it overrides your, for lack of a better term, conscience. All the people who held the idol in Dragon Age 2 did not "go mad" or become power hungry or turn dark side. Both the Champion and Varric held the idol (or were in a asshair's reach of it in proximity), and neither of them turned on their family, killed random innocents, or went around waving their junk at old women while barking at the moon. The two people who really had control of the idol were unstable or complete pricks to begin with, so for them their base emotions of greed and paranoia were amplified by the idol.

Also, what of the people who handled the Idol as it passed from Bartrand to (eventually) Meredith? How come we heard nothing of merchants and labourers going mad and pissing out their buttholes (I'm told that's a manifestation of evil in at least 37 states)? You'd think Varric and all of his sources would've picked up on a trail of insanity as the idol journeyed to Meredith's sword.

As it stands, there is nothing in Dragon Age 2 or the accompanying lore to dictate that the idol is evil in any way, shape or form. To bring it around to pop culture, that's like saying the Venom symbiote from Spider-Man is evil because it brought out the worst of Peter Parker's primal emotions. That wasn't the suit manipulating Parker, it was Parker's id manifesting without the shackles of conscience. All the suit did was amplify what was already there, same as the idol.

For someone telling me I am wrong you make a lot of wrong assumptions.

First off the black spider man suit was an alien symbiont which gave the one it is merged power, but sucked out their life. If Peter Parker kept it he would probably have died very quick. I have read the comics btw, and not just watched the video. If that's not evil for you, fine. Evil is a religious term, so you can argue if it even exists.

From your answer:

'the idol amplifies your base emotion until it overrides your, for lack of a better term, conscience'

And that's what? A good thing? Do you think it is good to have emotions to cook over and no conscience to stop you from doing stupid things? You basically describe what going mad is about. I don't see your point. At all.

I never even argued that the idol is connected to some evil spirit or whatever. Point is it drives people mad. Even the best emotions (love, care) if it goes too far and is not held back by any sort of conscience can only end badly. If you want an example: Anders, Orsino, the guy who killed Leandra.

I too read comic books, and I remember Venom's introduction quite well. The symbiote never wanted to leave Parker, and indeed loved Parker. Parker forced it off of him not just because it was going to permanently bond to him, but also because of its amplifier nature. In comics, cartoons, video games, and films it's always the same: Parker rejects suit because he couldn't control himself with it.

You were in fact arguing that the sword Meredith possessed was an ancient evil. Your exact words. It's not. It's forged from the lyrium idol, which in itself was not evil. It was a tool to be used (for what purpose we don't know yet), and tools in and of themselves are not evil. They aren't sentient. They can't speak and have no mind to speak of. Kind of hard for a paper clip to have a vendetta against you when it doesn't have a mind.

I also wasn't arguing that the effect it had on Bartrand and Meredith wasn't bad. It obviously was very, very bad, but that doesn't excuse your hyperbole when calling the lyrium idol an ancient evil when it was just an object.

[AlexXIV]

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

DiablosShadows wrote...

It went from Bartrand to Meredith directly no other ppl.

Not true.  we know for a fact  (codex entry)  that someone forged it into a sword for Merideth.  And we also know that Bartrand is not a  dwarven smith.

Meredith had it for 3 years though. I don't know about Bartrand, but he probably about the same time. So possibly it is not dangerous if you only hold it for a short time, but the longer you do, the worse it gets.

What in the world  are you talking about?

We know that Bartrand and Meredeth both held the idol.  But were they the only ones?  That's the question that this particular quote pyramid is asking.

My answer was that even if they were not the only ones, the idol may not have influence on people instantly..

  And from where are you coming to this conclusion?    Certainly not from playing the game.  The  Idol has an *instant* effect on Bartrand, doesn't it.  The moment he lays his hands on it, he locks  his entire expedition up  in the deep roads to die   (including his brother) and heads off to the surface with the idol.

Well he has always been an ass. I don't know how it was forged and I am not really the person responsible for plotholes.

[Eurypterid]

*edit* Ack. Nevermind. sigh. Sleep. Sleep is good...

Modifié par Eurypterid, 18 mars 2011 - 04:13 .

[Yrkoon]

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...
Yes, anything this subjective  can be argued.  But it's a huge leap of logic (not to mention dishonest debating) to call Bioware a bunch of liars for saying that there's no ancient evil to  vanquish based on this subjective  argument.  There is NOT.

Merideth is the final boss.  You have to vanquish her.    That she's wielding an ancient 'weapon' that's making her crazy  does not mean you're fighting an ancient evil.

Ok, but it also a stretch to say DA2 is not about fighting an ancient evil if for once, the deep road expedition is pretty much thing thing that caused everything, even according to Varric. And that can only be because of the lyrium idol.

Again, you're stating an opinion as fact.  We hear about Merideth and her.... overbearing personality as soon as we first set foot in Kirkwall.... and that's way before the deep roads expedition.


The Idol just amplifies  everything.

I state facts as facts, you just happen to see them as opinion. You say yourself the idol influenced her. Whatever her personality was before, it got worse. So there was influence of an ancient evil. And she uses it's power in the end fight.

Right.  And this brings us back to your claims that Bioware lied:    Did bioware claim  we wouldn't be fighting  (ancient evil) influences?

No, they didn't.  I know what you're trying to get at.  But until you can prove that Merideth herself is  an ancient entity, you don't have a factual argument.  At all.  In fact, you haven't even established that she's possessed.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 18 mars 2011 - 04:18 .

[DrGulag]

This is an answer from the other thread that was just closed (regarding Darksydephil's rant video towards the ending of DA2):

MasterSolo  DA2 Hawke defeats Meredith/Orsino, and then we get what to expect to from DA3. You also don't need to know who the redhead is, even if you didn't play DA:O, you will find out who she is in DA3 one way or the other(its part of the mystery, if you didn't play Origins).

You actually think that's acceptable?

That a player like Darksydephil invests 70 hours into this game, performing all the side quests available, and gets a short confusing ending without any closure. And that it would have been the same ending regardless if you had completed the game in less than 20 hours skipping all the possible quests?

I find it almost unforgivable after games like New Vegas. Atleast give us still images with some info like in Origins. How hard can it be? What happened to the Dalish clan, Fenris, did Sebastian go to Starkhaven, Bethany, etc.

Unless these things are corrected in a DLC it's definitely a subpar ending and a horrible to those people who are new to the series. They dont even know who Leliana is. 

I really don't know what has happened to your standards Bioware. This is 2011. I'd change most of the Wounded Coast quests for a couple of extra minutes after defeating Meredith.

Modifié par DrGulag, 18 mars 2011 - 04:21 .

[AlexXIV]

OLDIRTYBARON wrote...
I too read comic books, and I remember Venom's introduction quite well. The symbiote never wanted to leave Parker, and indeed loved Parker. Parker forced it off of him not just because it was going to permanently bond to him, but also because of its amplifier nature. In comics, cartoons, video games, and films it's always the same: Parker rejects suit because he couldn't control himself with it.

You were in fact arguing that the sword Meredith possessed was an ancient evil. Your exact words. It's not. It's forged from the lyrium idol, which in itself was not evil. It was a tool to be used (for what purpose we don't know yet), and tools in and of themselves are not evil. They aren't sentient. They can't speak and have no mind to speak of. Kind of hard for a paper clip to have a vendetta against you when it doesn't have a mind.

I also wasn't arguing that the effect it had on Bartrand and Meredith wasn't bad. It obviously was very, very bad, but that doesn't excuse your hyperbole when calling the lyrium idol an ancient evil when it was just an object.

Well when you read the comics you know that if parker had kept it he would have aged and died in fast time. There was an episode of 'what if' that dealt with it.

This is really a debate about what is evil. Can a tool be evil? A paper clip? Does the paper clip influence your mind? Again, I have been at this point in the thread up there, evil is a religious term. Psychologists don't use the term evil. So it is a matter of believe. If you believe that there is a tool that can influence your mind, change your personality. Strip away your conscience, empower your emotions. And trades that for alot of power I believe it is evil. I don't know if being evil requires a sentient being. What if a tool is cursed. It was cursed by an ancient evil spirit. Is the tool still not evil? Is there still no evil connected?

This is just about semantics trying to justify Bioware. If I give you something and told you 'it will not cost you money' and l later tell you that I want your pants for it. Did I lie? No. Did I try to cheat you? Yes.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 18 mars 2011 - 04:22 .

[GeeEarl]

Eventide wrote...

 

Basically, the ending was atrocious for such a long game and it isn't fair to gamers at all.  

Was anyone else disappointed by the ending? Why or why not? 

I agree totally.  I thought the ending was a Side Quest. Dragon Age Origins had  a superior  story line.
The player ability was the only improvement for novice RPG players, which I am not. The story line was weak.
I actually finished the game and didnot know it until the credits rolled. After playing Mass-Effect and dragon age Origin, what a let down.

[GeeEarl]

I agree totally. I thought the ending was a Side Quest. Dragon Age Origins had a superior story line.
The player ability was the only improvement for novice RPG players, which I am not. The story line was weak.
I actually finished the game and didnot know it until the credits rolled. After playing Mass-Effect and dragon age Origin, what a let down.

[Jimmy Fury]

DrGulag wrote...
I find it almost unforgivable after games like New Vegas. Atleast give us still images with some info like in Origins. How hard can it be? What happened to the Dalish clan, Fenris, did Sebastian go to Starkhaven, Bethany, etc. 

See: All eleventy billion threads moaning about how the Origins epilogues were "retconned" by DLC, DA2, etc.

No epilogue slides means no issues with having to undo the epilogue slides if they want to use the characters again in another game.

[dreman9999]

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yes and I tell you why even before I go to that link.

First off devs said this: DA2 is not about fighting an ancient evil like DA:O. Meep. Wrong. You fight Meredith possessed by an ancient evil.

Wait... this isn't true.  Or at least you're stating an opinion as fact.

We don't know what the hell the Idol is.  You're assuming it's some living spirit  or 'ancient evil" that takes over Merideth.  But there's exactly  Nothing in the game that  points to this.  It's an idol of lyrium.  And lyrium isn't evil.  it's an element that makes you crazy if  enough of it  it gets in your blood.  We learn that in DA:O.

It's ancient and if it makes people crazy it is obviously evil. Or do you think that's a good thing? I don't know that lyrium as such drives people crazy or is to be considered evil. It causes addiction though. Anyway, lyrium isn't inherently evil. The idol is. It drives everyone who owns it mad. Which makes me conclude that it is corrupted.

We don't even know what it is. We never fought the Idol just Meredith who was over powered. It was nothing like the darkspawn at all.

[DrGulag]

No epilogue slides means no issues with having to undo the epilogue slides if they want to use the characters again in another game.

That's hardly an excuse not to give players a decent ending after 70 hours of gameplay.

Give closure to people and come up with new ideas for future installments. Enough with the lazy writing and taking the easy way out. This is a next gen game and one of the major releases of the year.

Modifié par DrGulag, 18 mars 2011 - 04:31 .

[AlexXIV]

dreman9999 wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Yes and I tell you why even before I go to that link.

First off devs said this: DA2 is not about fighting an ancient evil like DA:O. Meep. Wrong. You fight Meredith possessed by an ancient evil.

Wait... this isn't true.  Or at least you're stating an opinion as fact.

We don't know what the hell the Idol is.  You're assuming it's some living spirit  or 'ancient evil" that takes over Merideth.  But there's exactly  Nothing in the game that  points to this.  It's an idol of lyrium.  And lyrium isn't evil.  it's an element that makes you crazy if  enough of it  it gets in your blood.  We learn that in DA:O.

It's ancient and if it makes people crazy it is obviously evil. Or do you think that's a good thing? I don't know that lyrium as such drives people crazy or is to be considered evil. It causes addiction though. Anyway, lyrium isn't inherently evil. The idol is. It drives everyone who owns it mad. Which makes me conclude that it is corrupted.

We don't even know what it is. We never fought the Idol just Meredith who was over powered. It was nothing like the darkspawn at all.

And you know the darkspawn are evil? Or the archdemon? Because the Chantry told you so? We don't know anything about them other than that they come to the surface every few centuries. What motivates them? We don't really know.

[Yrkoon]

AlexXIV wrote...

OLDIRTYBARON wrote...
I too read comic books, and I remember Venom's introduction quite well. The symbiote never wanted to leave Parker, and indeed loved Parker. Parker forced it off of him not just because it was going to permanently bond to him, but also because of its amplifier nature. In comics, cartoons, video games, and films it's always the same: Parker rejects suit because he couldn't control himself with it.

You were in fact arguing that the sword Meredith possessed was an ancient evil. Your exact words. It's not. It's forged from the lyrium idol, which in itself was not evil. It was a tool to be used (for what purpose we don't know yet), and tools in and of themselves are not evil. They aren't sentient. They can't speak and have no mind to speak of. Kind of hard for a paper clip to have a vendetta against you when it doesn't have a mind.

I also wasn't arguing that the effect it had on Bartrand and Meredith wasn't bad. It obviously was very, very bad, but that doesn't excuse your hyperbole when calling the lyrium idol an ancient evil when it was just an object.

Well when you read the comics you know that if parker had kept it he would have aged and died in fast time. There was an episode of 'what if' that dealt with it.

This is really a debate about what is evil.

Nice try.  But  you know this debate is really  about a hell of a lot more than that. 

You've made quite a few claims you've been unable to support with in game evidence.

1) That  the final boss was possessed
2) That  she was possessed by an ancient evil

And therefor:

3) Bioware was lying when they said there was no ancient evil to vanquish


  The FACT is that Lyrium, regardless of whether  or not you believe it's evil does NOT possess people.     And even if it did,  you don't vanquish it in this game, so...  what part of Biowares claim  is false again? 

Modifié par Yrkoon, 18 mars 2011 - 04:32 .

[sonofalich]

the ending was terrible, i was hoping for a better summation of your choices like they did in Origins. instead it turned into Mass Effect.