137 réponses à ce sujet

[DeepConjac]

The mission where that freak mage used ure mother as spare parts where so depressive that i wished i could go on a rampage against the circle.. that was realy well done. But i think part l and ll is best, always more fun to climb than to be on the top.

DLCs are fine by me, problem is that i buy everyone if i like the game. Like the damn apperance trash they give us on ME2... im weak..

Modifié par DeepConjac, 19 mars 2011 - 09:56 .

[Icinix]

DeepConjac wrote...

The mission where that freak mage used ure mother as spare parts where so depressive that i wished i could go on a rampage against the circle.. that was realy well done. But i think part l and ll is best, always more fun to climb than to be on the top.

DLCs are fine by me, problem is that i buy everyone if i like the game. Like the damn apperance trash they give us on ME2... im weak..

*pats on back*

You're not alone good buddy. I too suffer from the weakness.

[Ailith Tycane]

The ending was obviously set up for either an expansion, or DA3. Why was it so hard to understand?

Cliffhangers themselves are not entirely satisfying, but at least they let you know theres more to come later. That's the point.

[Wulfram]

The ending worked OK for me. It wasn't a cliffhanger, because for my Hawke her story was one of someone who tried to keep the peace and stop Kirkwall falling apart. The story ended with her failure, but it still ended.

I'd rather have got a farewell scene with Hawke and her companions than the sequel hook in the rather superfluous framing story, but it didn't feel like a cliffhanger to me.

[Foolsfolly]

Ailith430 wrote...

The ending was obviously set up for either an expansion, or DA3. Why was it so hard to understand?

Cliffhangers themselves are not entirely satisfying, but at least they let you know theres more to come later. That's the point.

...unless it flops.

Not saying DA2 will flop or has flopped. I'm just saying, we've all seen the movie that sets up a sequel that never happens because the movie did terribly.

Off the top of my head there's Chronicles of Riddick but there's dozens of those movies that set up something that never happens.

[Baelyn]

Foolsfolly wrote...

Ailith430 wrote...

The ending was obviously set up for either an expansion, or DA3. Why was it so hard to understand?

Cliffhangers themselves are not entirely satisfying, but at least they let you know theres more to come later. That's the point.

...unless it flops.

Not saying DA2 will flop or has flopped. I'm just saying, we've all seen the movie that sets up a sequel that never happens because the movie did terribly.

Off the top of my head there's Chronicles of Riddick but there's dozens of those movies that set up something that never happens.

But they can't just make every game have a definitive "end" just for fear of it flopping and not being able to continue the story. Its a risk they run, sure, but in all honesty we all know (99%) that there will be at the very least DLC that will semi conclude this story and more probably an expansion and subsequent games.

[HawXV2]

Everwarden wrote...

Hank84 wrote...

Ending does explain some stuff, just because you dont understand doesnt mean its bad.

That would be true only if it was so complexly awesome that someone might not be able to fully grasp it. If the ending is so simple, pointless and abrupt that it's hard to 'get' what just happened, that means it's bad. 

DA2 had an ending that was just awful. Really, really awful. Shamefully bad. Bioware should be crying right now because of the failure they let ship. 

I got it fine. I guess some people are just smarter than others.

[DeepConjac]

I hope there will be a DA3 because its a cool world, i would REALY like to visit Kal-Sharok or Minrathous (you hear about Minrathous all the time..).

Ye too bad with Riddict, i liked that movie. They made som good games thou..
And Eragorn is a good example, but it didnt deserve a sequel.. cheap copy of LOTR.

[Durgon Ironfist]

Is it odd I notice that the major of self important angry posters in this community have the same portrait as the OP?

[Foolsfolly]

Baelyn wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

Ailith430 wrote...

The ending was obviously set up for either an expansion, or DA3. Why was it so hard to understand?

Cliffhangers themselves are not entirely satisfying, but at least they let you know theres more to come later. That's the point.

...unless it flops.

Not saying DA2 will flop or has flopped. I'm just saying, we've all seen the movie that sets up a sequel that never happens because the movie did terribly.

Off the top of my head there's Chronicles of Riddick but there's dozens of those movies that set up something that never happens.

But they can't just make every game have a definitive "end" just for fear of it flopping and not being able to continue the story. Its a risk they run, sure, but in all honesty we all know (99%) that there will be at the very least DLC that will semi conclude this story and more probably an expansion and subsequent games.

Why can't there be a definitive end to a story? All stories have endings. Look at the Mass Effect series, each game has you stopping one big threat that's working for the larger Reaper threat. Each game wraps up a story (geth invasion in ME1, Collector abductions in ME2). This game didn't wrap anything up. You can leave hooks for sequels but you can't just meander around for 40 hours and end the game at the first battle of a war.

That's a decent ending if you're whole goal throughout was to not have a war, but that's not the story they were telling either (except for the Act 2 storyline which has you trying to avoid a war at all costs).

This game just ends, with three years unaccounted for (and the other years that Varric skips) and we're left sitting there staring at the TV and wondering why we're disappointed. The ending doesn't work. When it's all over it doesn't make me sad, happy, or angry. I didn't say, "Oh, **** I can't wait for the next one!" Or anything. It was just over.

Looking around these forums, I'm not the only one who felt the ending was a huge disappointment. If it wrapped up just one storyline (if there was even a storyline to wrap up is a different discussion altogether) then we'd feel a sense of closure and accept the ending.

[Baelyn]

Foolsfolly wrote...

Baelyn wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

Ailith430 wrote...

The ending was obviously set up for either an expansion, or DA3. Why was it so hard to understand?

Cliffhangers themselves are not entirely satisfying, but at least they let you know theres more to come later. That's the point.

...unless it flops.

Not saying DA2 will flop or has flopped. I'm just saying, we've all seen the movie that sets up a sequel that never happens because the movie did terribly.

Off the top of my head there's Chronicles of Riddick but there's dozens of those movies that set up something that never happens.

But they can't just make every game have a definitive "end" just for fear of it flopping and not being able to continue the story. Its a risk they run, sure, but in all honesty we all know (99%) that there will be at the very least DLC that will semi conclude this story and more probably an expansion and subsequent games.

Why can't there be a definitive end to a story? All stories have endings. Look at the Mass Effect series, each game has you stopping one big threat that's working for the larger Reaper threat. Each game wraps up a story (geth invasion in ME1, Collector abductions in ME2). This game didn't wrap anything up. You can leave hooks for sequels but you can't just meander around for 40 hours and end the game at the first battle of a war.

That's a decent ending if you're whole goal throughout was to not have a war, but that's not the story they were telling either (except for the Act 2 storyline which has you trying to avoid a war at all costs).

This game just ends, with three years unaccounted for (and the other years that Varric skips) and we're left sitting there staring at the TV and wondering why we're disappointed. The ending doesn't work. When it's all over it doesn't make me sad, happy, or angry. I didn't say, "Oh, **** I can't wait for the next one!" Or anything. It was just over.

Looking around these forums, I'm not the only one who felt the ending was a huge disappointment. If it wrapped up just one storyline (if there was even a storyline to wrap up is a different discussion altogether) then we'd feel a sense of closure and accept the ending.

I, too, am not the only one that feels like the ending was perfect and fit in line exactly with what this game set out to do. There is an ending. The only difference is you know what it is from the beginning. You know the story ends badly...you know the world has been plunged into chaos...and that you were at the heart of it all....you just don't know how that came to be.

The whole point was to tell the how, not the result. This isn't your standard game that follows the formula of the end being the unknown. The end is certain and unavoidable. The unknown is how that end came to be and this game tells that story amazingly well.

You also can't compare this story to the Mass Effect series. Bioware has stated many times that the two series are telling two very different types of stories (Mass Effect is telling the story of a hero whereas Dragon Age is telling the story of a time and a place, i.e. Thedas during the Dragon Age) so this point is really moot IMO.

We already knew this game was not a means to an end but rather a huge set up of what is to come. An epic story requires an epic set up which in this case requires an entire game of content to give you the truly massive backdrop of the conflict that is stirring in the world. Again I would argue that the story does have an end. The end is that Hawke tried to make things better in Kirkwall but failed ultimately. No matter what (s)he did, (s)he was helpless at what was to be his/her destiny (remember the whole catch phrase?) What other type of end do you want? Hawke killed the bad guys, did everything (s)he could. It started a war.* Queue sequel hook*.

Edit for typos

Modifié par Baelyn, 19 mars 2011 - 08:29 .

[Foolsfolly]

The only thing I was comparing ME and DA about was how one series ends each game with an ending and how this one had no ending. The game stops but nothing's resolved.

What you're saying is that the 'point' of the game was to figure out the 'why and hows'. Ok. Fair point if they made the how and whys important.

The How turns out like this: Hawke didn't do anything. The Chantry/Qunari and Templar/Mage fights all had Hawke dragged into the fight. He didn't start anything.

The Whys turned out to be fear for the Chantry/Qunari war and a magic evil idol that we know less about than any other plot point in a BioWare game.

An evil idol. Like this was a Brady Bunch special instead of a BioWare game.

So when the How and Whys aren't interesting and that's the entire point of the game...then you see where we're having a disconnect, yes?

There was another thread around here a few days ago that said the whole thing would have been vastly better if there was no 'Every Mage is a Blood Mage' or 'Evil Idol Made Me Do It' way out. Had the argument been like the Chantry/Qunari fight, where two different human perspectives clashed and led to an unavoidable war then the game would be better.

But outside influences of Blood Magic/Demons and the Idol stripped away all importance of the finale and the argument itself. And I agree with that statement.

The story's weak and the ending is a glaring miscalculation which I hope was rushed because then we can say, 'They didn't finish it like they wanted' instead of 'wow they had no idea what they were doing with this game.'

[jsh788mang]

I was let down, with the ending, after waiting soo long for this game to come out. I get it there is something bigger happening in the DA world. I'm just hope they take there time with DA 2 expansions and DA 3. DA 2 just seems rushed and kind of unfinished. Maybe they will fix that with the expansions and explain what happened, and how they all split.

[NinjaRogue]

xnoxiousx wrote...

Why:
60 second ending that explains nothing
You dont know what happened to any characters like you did in da1 epilouge
People who did not play da1 will not under stand it
At least in mass effect 2 cliff hanger you know every one is alive and well

Apparently you havn't played Final Fantasy X....

[dakphillips]

I too, am extremely unhappy with the ending.  Act I and II had Hawke losing allot, but in both acts he took direct actions to better someone (his family, then Kirkwall as a whole).  In Act III, he just gets to fight allot of people and realize theres no hope seeing as everyone in the city is either a blood mage or crazy.  There should have been ways to force a Mage/Templar war (setting up future games) without having Hawke be a complete pawn in Act3. 

It just felt odd because I thought there were big improvements in several aspects of the game.  Combat, skill trees, evolving companion quests and armor.  Dialogue and Hawkes default voice variations were IMO the best Bioware has produced.  But areas we expect them to be the best in...storytelling, options with real consequences, companions we can get to know outside of their quests...just fell flat this time.  

I'm still hopeful they will take more time with DA3 and put out a complete game at release.  And despite my naggings I'll probably be in line with all the other suckers come release date for DA2 DLC...but this did turn me off my 'Bioware can do no wrong' attitude.

[Unichrone]

Ailith430 wrote...

The ending was obviously set up for either an expansion, or DA3. Why was it so hard to understand?

Cliffhangers themselves are not entirely satisfying, but at least they let you know theres more to come later. That's the point.

A cliffhanger ending does not necessitate a bad or unsatisfying ending.  Dragon Age 2's ending is both poorly constructed and unsatisfying.  

[Unichrone]

Durgon Ironfist wrote...

Is it odd I notice that the major of self important angry posters in this community have the same portrait as the OP?

Look at my big, angry horns, little boy.

[Akron1983]

NinjaRogue wrote...

xnoxiousx wrote...

Why:
60 second ending that explains nothing
You dont know what happened to any characters like you did in da1 epilouge
People who did not play da1 will not under stand it
At least in mass effect 2 cliff hanger you know every one is alive and well

Apparently you havn't played Final Fantasy X....

BLASPHEMY!!! 

[DeepConjac]

I think that Act 2 had much better story than Act 3. The Qunaris beliefs and culture are interresting... I agree that they could have dropped the whole "evil idol" thing.. power have corrupted people before, u dont need some idol to explain it.
And why does that Grace mage (who kidnapped Carver/bethany) want to kill the Champion so badly? I actually killed a lot of templars to help her free.. what more could i do? I left them in a way better situation than when i came so thats just stupid. There was enough arse-hole mages in the rest of the game.
There should too be more defined templar/mage story choises, not jumping to help on side or another before u finaly get to choose side at the climax. 

Modifié par DeepConjac, 19 mars 2011 - 09:08 .

[Emzamination]

Foolsfolly wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

No kotor2 takes the cake for worse rpg ending in history seeing as it was the same ending video for good or evil. 

It wasn't the same.

In one the Ebon Hawk is destroyed and another it's not. I can't remember which but that was the principal difference.

Oh, and Malacore V is destroyed for the Light ending and it's a secret Sith Training camp thingy for the Dark ending.

Meh besides the platform and the hawke it was basically the same  To be honest I hadn't even noticed that difference till you mentioned it 

[Foolsfolly]

Emzamination wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

No kotor2 takes the cake for worse rpg ending in history seeing as it was the same ending video for good or evil. 

It wasn't the same.

In one the Ebon Hawk is destroyed and another it's not. I can't remember which but that was the principal difference.

Oh, and Malacore V is destroyed for the Light ending and it's a secret Sith Training camp thingy for the Dark ending.

Meh besides the platform and the hawke it was basically the same  To be honest I hadn't even noticed that difference till you mentioned it 

It's a small difference and all the bad things about that ending kind of eclipse the actual ending. The worst being the completely unresolved Hover-Droid and G0-T0. What the crap? Where's my crew? What's going on?

KOTOR 2....man, that was a disappointing game. At least DA2 isn't that disappointing.

[Baelyn]

Foolsfolly wrote...

The only thing I was comparing ME and DA about was how one series ends each game with an ending and how this one had no ending. The game stops but nothing's resolved.

What you're saying is that the 'point' of the game was to figure out the 'why and hows'. Ok. Fair point if they made the how and whys important.

The How turns out like this: Hawke didn't do anything. The Chantry/Qunari and Templar/Mage fights all had Hawke dragged into the fight. He didn't start anything.

The Whys turned out to be fear for the Chantry/Qunari war and a magic evil idol that we know less about than any other plot point in a BioWare game.

An evil idol. Like this was a Brady Bunch special instead of a BioWare game.

So when the How and Whys aren't interesting and that's the entire point of the game...then you see where we're having a disconnect, yes?

There was another thread around here a few days ago that said the whole thing would have been vastly better if there was no 'Every Mage is a Blood Mage' or 'Evil Idol Made Me Do It' way out. Had the argument been like the Chantry/Qunari fight, where two different human perspectives clashed and led to an unavoidable war then the game would be better.

But outside influences of Blood Magic/Demons and the Idol stripped away all importance of the finale and the argument itself. And I agree with that statement.

The story's weak and the ending is a glaring miscalculation which I hope was rushed because then we can say, 'They didn't finish it like they wanted' instead of 'wow they had no idea what they were doing with this game.'

Well then we are just going to have to agree to disagree then. We can argue till we are blue in the face but it ultimately comes down to opinion. Neither can prove that the ending was bad or good. Some people love it; some people hate it. I feel like I have defended my position well enough on why I thought it was brilliantly done.

What irks me is people that spout their opinion as if it is definitive fact. If you don't like it fine. You are certainly entitled to your opinion on the game and its ending. But plenty of people do like it very much and appreciate greatly what the game accomplishes.

Bioware has made it clear that they don't want to stagnate the series by just reusing the same formula so its fairly safe to say the next game will not follow this same precedent. I for one and greatly looking forward to whatever they bring out way next.

Modifié par Baelyn, 19 mars 2011 - 09:21 .

[DrGulag]

The majority seems to be disappointed with the ending if you read professional and user reviews from metacritic, gamespot etc.

Some people think it is acceptable and then we have individuals who find it  very few fulfilling.

But when the average user rating for this game is in the 4´s or 7´s out of ten (depending if you look from gamestop or metacritic) and you read about the gripes, it's a pretty strong signal Bioware.

If for one, am disappoint.

Modifié par DrGulag, 19 mars 2011 - 09:27 .

[Foolsfolly]

I'm all for new stories! I don't want a repeat of Origins, the Blight is so uninteresting. Mindless zombie orcs defiling everything they touch isn't a compelling villain. It's something to stop, sure, but it's not compelling. No one will ever say that the Arch-Demon was right (unlike Meredith who I believe was right).

The problem is the War with Templar/Mages happens. Hawke does nothing that prevents or causes that war. Hawke does nothing but side quests while avoiding the entire issue as much as possible until the game forces the issue with the Chantry explosion.

The argument is that personal freedom (Mages) vs public safety (Templars). That argument breaks down completely when every mage is evil and the Templars are led by a crazy person because an Idol made her do it.

Now there's no argument. The Mages were evil and the Meredith was crazy because the plot told her to be so. And Hawke has no affect on any outcome, good or ill.

That's a storytelling problem. That's part of the reason why the ending just happens and we're left feeling disappointed.

It's not because it's a cliffhanger or because it's about the journey instead of the destination, the journey is Crazy people and demons but only after dozens of hours of finding lost kittens and fighting innumerable sized gangs in the streets.

[Dark Specie]

Foolsfolly wrote...

I'm all for new stories! I don't want a repeat of Origins, the Blight is so uninteresting. Mindless zombie orcs defiling everything they touch isn't a compelling villain. It's something to stop, sure, but it's not compelling. No one will ever say that the Arch-Demon was right (unlike Meredith who I believe was right).

The problem is the War with Templar/Mages happens. Hawke does nothing that prevents or causes that war. Hawke does nothing but side quests while avoiding the entire issue as much as possible until the game forces the issue with the Chantry explosion.

The argument is that personal freedom (Mages) vs public safety (Templars). That argument breaks down completely when every mage is evil and the Templars are led by a crazy person because an Idol made her do it.

Now there's no argument. The Mages were evil and the Meredith was crazy because the plot told her to be so. And Hawke has no affect on any outcome, good or ill.

That's a storytelling problem. That's part of the reason why the ending just happens and we're left feeling disappointed.

It's not because it's a cliffhanger or because it's about the journey instead of the destination, the journey is Crazy people and demons but only after dozens of hours of finding lost kittens and fighting innumerable sized gangs in the streets.

You, Sir, summarizes the problem with the game and it's ending the best, I think