478 réponses à ce sujet

[Ub3r_]

TheDauntless wrote...

My argument has been that white humans are not allowed to be gay/bi in BioWare games.

so you are racist? you cant accept a gay from any other part of the world?


also, on your whine i have a little song, i believe it goes like..

"you can't always get what you want"

[Varenus Luckmann]

I feel horribly discriminated against. As a paraphiliac, I hereby voice my demands for the inclusion of at least one romancable doorknob in every Bioware game henceforth.



Can we have a coming-out party now?

[SpanishFightingChicken]

this is the dumbest topic ever...Bioware has taken big risks in putting a homosexuality into a game that is going to be awsome wether it is there or noy and of coarse their not going to make it a huge part of the game...after all Bioware is a business not and activist group for gays do you think that if this game were full of gay stuff anyone outside of the gay gaming community would buy it prolly not...and that would be a ton of money spent for little or no profit, i think its great that they even attempt this, but that fact that somone had to go and say it is discrimination because gays dont get enough representaion!! stupid, its a video game damnit

[TheDauntless]

so you are racist? you cant accept a gay from any other part of the world?

What gays do you mean? You must mean BioWare's bisexual characters. Check their heritage and you'll see that this is BioWare's own internal memo to forego depicting white gay males, not my idea. Although if I were racist, I probably wouldn't have issues against all this.

Modifié par TheDauntless, 30 octobre 2009 - 12:19 .

[CJohnJones]

Maybe Alistair is as gay as can be, but just doesn't like your character that way. Pretending is fun!

[Maria Caliban]

Ub3r_ wrote...

TheDauntless wrote...

My argument has been that white humans are not allowed to be gay/bi in BioWare games.

so you are racist? you cant accept a gay from any other part of the world?


also, on your whine i have a little song, i believe it goes like..

"you can't always get what you want"

"But if you try sometimes, you just might find, you get what you need."

Your song would seem to suggest that he persist in making threads like this.

[Varenus Luckmann]

TheDauntless wrote...

so you are racist? you cant accept a gay from any other part of the world?

What gays do you mean? You must mean BioWare's bisexual characters. Check their heritage and you'll see that this is BioWare's own internal memo to forego depicting white gay males, not my idea. Although if I were racist, I probably wouldn't have issues against all this.

Yes, because, like, totally, racists are all such homophobes and, like, we, like, homosexuals cannot be, like, racists. Because we're so liberal, like, totally.

[TheDauntless]

Yes, because, like, totally, racists are all such homophobes and, like,
we, like, homosexuals cannot be, like, racists. Because we're so
liberal, like, totally.

I do know someone who is a racist homophobic homosexual. But what a great la....laugh that guy is.

Where were we on the topic? I remember. BioWare's racist homophobia if not by intent then certainly by practice via exclusion of gay white male characters, and in fact their complete exclusion of any gay characters.

Modifié par TheDauntless, 30 octobre 2009 - 12:43 .

[aidron]

TheDauntless wrote...
There are NPCs who are 100% straight. Two among them in DA are 50% straight. There is no such thing as the gay gamer to BioWare. Just the cop-outs.

Like I said, I'm not interested in 100% straight or gay NPCs. I want fluid, bisexual NPCs that are free game for everyone so that we all have more options.

And actually, I think BioWare is well aware that a portion of their audience is gay. You'd have to be an idiot to not know that there are queers out there who enjoy games.

And for those who are idiots... I enjoy guys and games and guys in my games who swing every way imaginable.

It would go away if this didn't matter to people. Many seem intent on trying to tell themselves I'm wrong to make themselves feel good about an upcoming purchase.

I'm not really interested in telling you that you're wrong. I simply disagree and I'm still content with my purchase. BG2 (while not one of the best games ever in my humble opinion) had no gay romances and I still had a wonderful time playing it.

[Drasanil]

Only a single gay option! At least you got that, what about all the other people with uncommon sexual preferences? What of them I say!? Where is the justice for necrophiliacs, zoophiliacs and chubby chasers? All the material was already in game, such a waste... Why can't a devouring corpse gobble your knob? Why can't Dog have a go at your muffin? And why can't one tap some sweet sweet brood mother booty?*
 
 
*Disclaimer: Drasanil neither supports nor encourages any of the previously mentioned practices, and cannot be held liable for missing knobs, mauled muffins, or broken pelvises resulting from any attempt preform the previously mentioned activities

[aidron]

Pyro_Monkey wrote...

the problem of course is though characters may not be gay in my game, i'd still know that they could be, and there'd probably be at least one point in conversation where their interest came up, and it would make me think differently about that character.   The point is that straight men tend to feel unconfortable around gay/bi men, even virtual ones.  If bioware made every character gay/bi then there'd be a large number of straight players who wouldn't feel attached to any of the characters because they feel uncomfortable.  As an example of this, in Mass Effect, Liara was the only character I almost never talked to, regardless of the gender of the character I was playing.

As well as this, there's also the fact that in real life, homosexuality isn't exactly rampant all throughout the population.  the fact that out of the 4 guys in your party, one of them is bi, is actually much higher odds than in real life.  making them all homosexual would certainly break realism.

No, it's not rampant and so I can understand on that point if not every NPC is bisexual. Regardless, I think it hurts a game more to not give every player the most options possible to increase their fun, whether or not certain people will be put off by that or feel uncomfortable.

That sounds kind of harsh, but it's not meant to be. I do try to be sympathetic, but in the end, if you're bothered by bisexual characters in a game then it really does force me to try that much harder to be sympathetic to your needs since it boils down to lessening options for others as opposed to simply denying yourself those options if you feel them unwelcome.

[Maria Caliban]

Drasanil wrote...

Only a single gay option! At least you got that, what about all the other people with uncommon sexual preferences? What of them I say!? Where is the justice for necrophiliacs, zoophiliacs and chubby chasers? All the material was already in game, such a waste... Why can't a devouring corpse gobble your knob? Why can't Dog have a go at your muffin? And why can't one tap some sweet sweet brood mother booty?*
 
 
*Disclaimer: Drasanil neither supports nor encourages any of the previously mentioned practices, and cannot be held liable for missing knobs, mauled muffins, or broken pelvises resulting from any attempt preform the previously mentioned activities

I don't think it's funny to suggest homosexuality is the same as necrophilia and bestiality.

[hexaligned]

Zevran is a more stereotypical gay why? From what I have seen of Alistair he seems insecure, overly defensive, and just unsure of himself in most situations. In other words he overcompensates often in showy ways meant to make himself look like is comfortable, but actually just highlight how insecure he is. That molds more accurately to the gay people I have known in my own life...much more than the suave, smooth, confidant person Zev seems to be.

[aidron]

Drasanil wrote...

Only a single gay option! At least you got that, what about all the other people with uncommon sexual preferences? What of them I say!? Where is the justice for necrophiliacs, zoophiliacs and chubby chasers? All the material was already in game, such a waste... Why can't a devouring corpse gobble your knob? Why can't Dog have a go at your muffin? And why can't one tap some sweet sweet brood mother booty?*
 
 
*Disclaimer: Drasanil neither supports nor encourages any of the previously mentioned practices, and cannot be held liable for missing knobs, mauled muffins, or broken pelvises resulting from any attempt preform the previously mentioned activities

I nearly spat precious coffee all over my monitor.

Shame on you for being so clever.



... SHAME!

[Varenus Luckmann]

Drasanil wrote...
Only a single gay option! At least you got that, what about all the other people with uncommon sexual preferences? What of them I say!? Where is the justice for necrophiliacs, zoophiliacs and chubby chasers? All the material was already in game, such a waste... Why can't a devouring corpse gobble your knob? Why can't Dog have a go at your muffin? And why can't one tap some sweet sweet brood mother booty?*
 
*Disclaimer: Drasanil neither supports nor encourages any of the previously mentioned practices, and cannot be held liable for missing knobs, mauled muffins, or broken pelvises resulting from any attempt preform the previously mentioned activities

You're awesome.

Maria Caliban wrote...

Drasanil wrote...

Only a single gay option! At least you got that, what about all the other people with uncommon sexual preferences? What of them I say!? Where is the justice for necrophiliacs, zoophiliacs and chubby chasers? All the material was already in game, such a waste... Why can't a devouring corpse gobble your knob? Why can't Dog have a go at your muffin? And why can't one tap some sweet sweet brood mother booty?*
 
 
*Disclaimer: Drasanil neither supports nor encourages any of the previously mentioned practices, and cannot be held liable for missing knobs, mauled muffins, or broken pelvises resulting from any attempt preform the previously mentioned activities

I don't think it's funny to suggest homosexuality is the same as necrophilia and bestiality.

Why not? They're just as valid as sexual orientations. Don't let the trappings of modernity make you lose perspective. Think of all the zoophiliacs who's feelings you're hurting by calling them sexual deviants. Once upon a time, homosexuality was also considered a mental disorder. Oh, what enlightened times we live in.

I know this to be true, because zoophilia is completely natural and doesn't (usually, just like homophilia) hurt anyone. Just like homophilia, it's also present in the world of animals. Therefore, it must be natural! Logic!

We totally need a romance with Dog.

Modifié par Varenus Luckmann, 30 octobre 2009 - 12:59 .

[hexaligned]

Varenus Luckmann wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Drasanil wrote...

Only a single gay option! At least you got that, what about all the other people with uncommon sexual preferences? What of them I say!? Where is the justice for necrophiliacs, zoophiliacs and chubby chasers? All the material was already in game, such a waste... Why can't a devouring corpse gobble your knob? Why can't Dog have a go at your muffin? And why can't one tap some sweet sweet brood mother booty?*
 
 
*Disclaimer: Drasanil neither supports nor encourages any of the previously mentioned practices, and cannot be held liable for missing knobs, mauled muffins, or broken pelvises resulting from any attempt preform the previously mentioned activities

I don't think it's funny to suggest homosexuality is the same as necrophilia and bestiality.

Why not? They're just as valid as sexual orientations. Don't let the trappings of modernity make you lose perspective. Think of all the zoophiliacs who's feelings you're hurting by calling them sexual deviants. Once upon a time, homosexuality was also considered a mental disorder. Oh, what enlightened times we live in.

I know this to be true, because zoophilia is completely natural and doesn't (usually, just like homophilia) hurt anyone. Just like homophilia, it's also present in the world of animals. Therefore, it must be natural! Logic!

We totally need a romance with Dog.

I'd say you are an obvious troll..but I'll bite.  Sex between two adult self aware humans is a bit different than sex between a human and an animal, or an adult and a child.

[Drasanil]

Maria Caliban wrote...
I don't think it's funny to suggest homosexuality is the same as necrophilia and bestiality.

They aren't the same and my previous post was silly in the extreme not unlike the premise of this thread, a point which I was trying to illustrate. Lighten up a bit.

Modifié par Drasanil, 30 octobre 2009 - 01:01 .

[TheDauntless]

Like I said, I'm not interested in 100% straight or gay NPCs. I want fluid, bisexual NPCs that are free game for everyone so that we all have more options.

I prefer that most of all too. It's not happening, though. Given what there is to work with I don't believe there should be bisexual characters who are there first and foremost to please straight gamers while pretending they're respecting the interests of gay gamers.

Zevran is a more stereotypical gay why? From what I have seen of
Alistair he seems insecure, overly defensive, and just unsure of
himself in most situations. In other words he overcompensates often in
showy ways meant to make himself look like is comfortable, but actually
just highlight how insecure he is. That molds more accurately to the
gay people I have known in my own life...much more than the suave,
smooth, confidant person Zev seems to be.

You could use that to argue that Alistair be included as a M/M option to contrast his differences with Zevran. That's merely a suggestion.

Modifié par TheDauntless, 30 octobre 2009 - 01:04 .

[Varenus Luckmann]

relhart wrote...

Varenus Luckmann wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Drasanil wrote...

Only a single gay option! At least you got that, what about all the other people with uncommon sexual preferences? What of them I say!? Where is the justice for necrophiliacs, zoophiliacs and chubby chasers? All the material was already in game, such a waste... Why can't a devouring corpse gobble your knob? Why can't Dog have a go at your muffin? And why can't one tap some sweet sweet brood mother booty?*
 
 
*Disclaimer: Drasanil neither supports nor encourages any of the previously mentioned practices, and cannot be held liable for missing knobs, mauled muffins, or broken pelvises resulting from any attempt preform the previously mentioned activities

I don't think it's funny to suggest homosexuality is the same as necrophilia and bestiality.

Why not? They're just as valid as sexual orientations. Don't let the trappings of modernity make you lose perspective. Think of all the zoophiliacs who's feelings you're hurting by calling them sexual deviants. Once upon a time, homosexuality was also considered a mental disorder. Oh, what enlightened times we live in.

I know this to be true, because zoophilia is completely natural and doesn't (usually, just like homophilia) hurt anyone. Just like homophilia, it's also present in the world of animals. Therefore, it must be natural! Logic!

We totally need a romance with Dog.

I'd say you are an obvious troll..but I'll bite.  Sex between two adult self aware humans is a bit different than sex between a human and an animal, or an adult and a child.

As disturbing as it may sound, I've seen dogs freely mount self aware humans.
Yeah, I'm totally sure that they really suffer from it. Really.

[Maria Caliban]

Varenus Luckmann wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

I don't think it's funny to suggest homosexuality is the same as necrophilia and bestiality.

Why not? They're just as valid as sexual orientations.

No, they're not. And I get tired of people suggesting that me having sex with my girlfriend is the same as raping a child or an animal, or having sex with a corpse.

That 'joke' wore thin five years ago when I first started on the forums, and it's just as non-funny now.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 30 octobre 2009 - 01:05 .

[aidron]

In the interest of not posting several times like previously...


@relhart: I believe Varenus was merely joking and is not a troll.

@Drasanil: You lightened me up so much you nearly owed me a new cup of coffee.

@TheDauntless: I think the real reason why some of the NPCs are bisexual is not to first and foremost please the heterosexual gamers while considering the homosexual ones an afterthought. If anything, I think two romance options per gender, with one of each being bisexual, was meant to give the player the most options without sacrificing quality. More romances would have required more work and more time, whether they were bisexual or not. You have to draw the line at some point and I am afraid that homosexual romances are not as crucial to a game as heterosexual one simply because of the population's ratio of hetersexual to homosexual people. It's not a slap in the face so much as it is a simple reality, I think.

[Drasanil]

aidron wrote...

@Drasanil: You lightened me up so much you nearly owed me a new cup of coffee.

Eheh, good thing it was only "nearly" it's surprisingly hard to provide coffee over the interwebz, but I can give you a cookie *holds out box*

[DaySeeker]

TheDauntless wrote...

Like I said, I'm not interested in 100% straight or gay NPCs. I want fluid, bisexual NPCs that are free game for everyone so that we all have more options.

I prefer that most of all too. It's not happening, though. Given what there is to work with I don't believe there should be bisexual characters who are there first and foremost to please straight gamers while pretending they're respecting the interests of gay gamers.

Zevran is a more stereotypical gay why? From what I have seen of
Alistair he seems insecure, overly defensive, and just unsure of
himself in most situations. In other words he overcompensates often in
showy ways meant to make himself look like is comfortable, but actually
just highlight how insecure he is. That molds more accurately to the
gay people I have known in my own life...much more than the suave,
smooth, confidant person Zev seems to be.

You could use that to argue that Alistair be included as a M/M option to contrast his differences with Zevran. That's merely a suggestion.

The problem what you think is a humorous suggestion is one actually aspoused by real people not joking and is inevitably raised on any thread wishing to mention the gays.  Also, I doubt if someone equating your sexual partners with animals or corpses you would not find it very funny.  I'm not angry just explaininng why your post is hard to read as funny.

[Maria Caliban]

Drasanil wrote...

They aren't the same and my previous post was silly in the extreme not unlike the premise of this thread, a point which I was trying to illustrate. Lighten up a bit.

Your silly statement has come up in numerous threads over the years as utterly serious statements about why gay romances are wrong and gay people are sick.

I realize you’d like to believe that if someone doesn’t find your comment laugh worthy it’s because they have a three-foot pole lodged into their rectum, but let me suggest to you that maybe, just maybe, your joke just sucks and isn’t funny.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 30 octobre 2009 - 01:17 .

[bd223437]

Maria Caliban wrote...

bd223437 wrote...

The PC also being bisexual and uninterested in monogamay as demonstrated by entertaining all three romances also furthers this point that media is representing same sex interested individuals as promiscuous..

What about the PC being heterosexual, sleeping with Morrigan and immedately running off to see if Leliana would react? We've also seen that. When it comes to romances, reviewers tend to run around and screw everything they can.

What you've selected out here was rebuttal to a different discussion raised by another posted.  If you check my earlier argument, I mentioned theres a fair degree of promiscuity in all the available relationships both in reality and the game in the circumstances that have been made available to us at this point.  The point that you've selected out is that the author of that article that I am talking about created a promiscuous same sex oriented character, Zevran is also a same sex oriented character that is promiscuous.  Yes reviewers tend to try to get everything in at once, so I'm not surprised that all the relationships were persued, though it certainly doesn't help the cause that same sex oriented individuals can be interested in monogamy.  The two female interests as stated in the article were not open to this so no, I don't think that's a particularly fair comparison.  At that point in the game, the two female options were not interested in persuing an open relationship, Zevran at that point was.  That's the problem. 

Modifié par bd223437, 30 octobre 2009 - 01:27 .