Aller au contenu

Photo

Why is there some Much hate for DA2?


  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
339 réponses à ce sujet

#276
Glorfindel709

Glorfindel709
  • Members
  • 1 281 messages
Honestly, I have a couple of reasons for the "hate" of DA2

A) The story writing felt sub-par in all but the tail end of Act 2 (All That Remains, Qunari related things, etc etc). I didn't care about my character, I didn't care about the people I was playing with. The only NPC that I actually enjoyed was Leandra and Varric. There was no connection, no immersion. Not only that, but I honestly felt like my choices didn't even matter beyond a few letters on the writing desk. All roads led to the same conclusion, so to speak, which despite what people claim, is not something you really saw in Origins.

B) The entire game feels rather rushed, from the sub-par writing compared to what we can usually expect from a biowre title, to the bugs that should have been caught by any decent beta tester that break the game or immersion (Castillons bug, the improper import flags, the terrible graphics jumping during cutscenes.

C) Act 3 was an abomination. The build up of the M/T conflict was effing terrible. "Not all mages are evil, insane, maleficar, abominations!!! You can't just do cruel things to them!" Except every mage NPC you meet falls into one of those categories (or all 4) barring 2 [and I challenge anyone to give me 5 examples of mages who dont]. "Ts are just doing their duty to keep us all safe!!! They're not bad people" Except the Ts are lead by a paranoid schizophrenic and most of the Ts barring Thrask, Cullen, and Keran come off as sadists of the highest degree (tranquil solution... N.azis in Kirkwall? Really?) And then the Boss fights. Absolutely terrible. Just... ugh. They felt entirely shoe-horned in and were absolute ****.

D) The Framed Narrative and Passage of Time --- the only thing that let us know that time passed was Varrics little speel and the fact that you went from living in a slum to living in a mansion wearing Hugh Hefners PJs. We were, quite frankly, lied to by Laidaw and Co. when we were told that as the years passed we would see Kirkwall change and become shaped by our choices as Champion. Regardless of the act you were in, it was the same looking city, with the same NPCs wearing the same clothes saying the same lines over and over again. For Andrastes sake, there is a NPC *STILL* yammering on about how long it takes to get a meeting with the Viscount in Act 3.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Did I expect to hear constantly about my Warden? No. Because this is a different character and part of Thedas (regardless of what the *2* would lead people to believe). But it would have been nice if there had been more than two or three real mentions of what I did in the game that I loved so much and spent 100+ hours on and the game was advertised as one where you could import your game and the decisions you made in the previous one would actually matter.

The game was honestly rushed crap, and I know that if the DLC is of the ME variety (as in it occurs during the story meaning I'm going to have to submit myself to a third playthrough) I won't be buying. Here's to waiting for DA3 - A, hopefully, player driven choice mattering RPG that dismisses reused maps as a concept of "more content" for the actual artistic and design credibility to make some different maps for the the various caves and mansions you might find yourself in, removes the notion that a boss fight rivaling Devil May Cry type combat is necessary, and entirely ignores the idea of "Press a button, and something awesome happens."

Because hey, I pressed a button and something awesome happened, once in DA2. It was the power button after I beat the game.

Modifié par Glorfindel709, 21 mars 2011 - 07:54 .


#277
Phonantiphon

Phonantiphon
  • Members
  • 787 messages

fraquar wrote...

bassmunkee wrote...

Because some people just can't get to grips with change and also I don't think that a lot of them even know why they don't like it - it's just that they jump on the band wagon.
If you actually bother to play the game it is an extremely rewarding experience. Like everything you get out of it, what you put into it.
I don't know why some of the people on here bothered buying it in the first place, tbh.


What in god's green acres is rewarding about running around the limited universe like a hamster?  There are some good things in the game, but the bottom line is in order to follow the storyline you HAVE to be a hamster.  I can't imagine what the base game is gonna be like for those without the Black Emporium, because quite frankly we really didn't need another Rogue/Archer in Sebastian when we already have Varric..... 

yawn.

#278
Coldest

Coldest
  • Members
  • 244 messages

Ajspeed wrote...

Bioware Cant Satisfy everyone but they do there best.

Indeed BioWare put a lot of sweat and blood copy pasting the same areas over and over again and they totally don't deserve getting hammered for it.

#279
zsom

zsom
  • Members
  • 333 messages

Ajspeed wrote...

Im having trouble comprehending so many peoples deep seeded hate for this game many of whom were judging it before they even played it. Honestly what is wrong with its?
Its like Mass Effect and the changes made to Mass Effect 2 its refined the gameplay making things alot neater and easier to manage and id say it better for it Mass Effect and DAO both had similar problems of somewhat clunky interface but they both have been refined in there sequels due to what the fans complained was wrong with the first game, Bioware Cant Satisfy everyone but they do there best.


Most people (mostly the fanboys..) wanted to get a DAO II instead of another story set in Thedas. And let's face it, DA II is great, but it's not a sequel.

DAO was a huge success and had a big fanbase, these girls and guys would only be satisfied if they get the same characters, fights, story etc. back, and making the story shorter, having a voiced character just added the necessary excuse to bash the game.

There are ppl who criticize in an intelligent manner, actually most are like this, there is however a very small but very vocal minority, which is acting kind of... childish. Sorry but this is a fact...

I hope the nerdrage will stop in time, and I do hope that the game will be a financial success,
because I wouldn't mind if there is going to be a DA III as well.

Modifié par zsom, 21 mars 2011 - 11:35 .


#280
Cody211282

Cody211282
  • Members
  • 2 541 messages

Coldest wrote...

Ajspeed wrote...

Bioware Cant Satisfy everyone but they do there best.

Indeed BioWare put a lot of sweat and blood copy pasting the same areas over and over again and they totally don't deserve getting hammered for it.


They also worked very hard to make every location look way more dull then the first gmae, oh and it took time to destroy the tactics of the game and replace it with wave after wave of magic teleportaion mercs.

#281
Dan UK

Dan UK
  • Members
  • 181 messages
"I dont think its a BAD game. But the sheer volume of my diassapointment, at what it could have been, makes it impossible for me to LIKE it." - Quote: Me, Just now

Modifié par Dan UK, 21 mars 2011 - 12:15 .


#282
Guest_simfamUP_*

Guest_simfamUP_*
  • Guests
It's a good game, a great game even, but people expected Origins 2, it's their ignorance that is at fault.

#283
Dan UK

Dan UK
  • Members
  • 181 messages
Why would we expect anything other than Dragon Age: Origins 2? Ok so they dropped the 'origins', so from that we should have expected them to totaly change the game? Sounds like a storyline shift to me, not a gameplay one.

#284
Pandaman102

Pandaman102
  • Members
  • 1 103 messages

simfamSP wrote...

It's a good game, a great game even, but people expected Origins 2, it's their ignorance that is at fault.


Head on over to the spoilers section and try to tell that to the people who are complaining about DA2 for its own flaws, not some "Origins 2" expectations.

#285
DyingSkunk

DyingSkunk
  • Members
  • 21 messages
I didn't hate it, but it left me feeling extremely "meh".

In a good RPG, I am driven by the story and constantly want to keep playing just to find out what happens next. I don't want it to be over.

In DA2, I felt like I was just grinding my way through it, with nothing terribly interesting driving me onward. A series of loosely-related sidequests, culminating in a rushed and awkward finale. When it was over, I was just kind of like, "Oh. Ok.".

#286
Eldragon

Eldragon
  • Members
  • 82 messages
I liked the story, I hated, and I mean HATE the game mechanics changes. (Waves of enemies, 2 stats required to equip items, class restrictions on weapons) Ruined the game for me.

I've started writing a nice long post on how these issues can be fixed for DA3 at least three times, but I can never bring myself to post it, because deep down I know Bioware is only interested in catering to the casual player now.

Modifié par Eldragon, 21 mars 2011 - 01:22 .


#287
Dynames

Dynames
  • Members
  • 18 messages
i really like the game what made me sad was the lack of interaction between my char and the rest of my team i wanted to talk to them like i did in the first one but now it only matters in certain places :\\ that and not letting me change the Armour of my team that is pissing me off :(

#288
EmsaFallkin

EmsaFallkin
  • Members
  • 74 messages
A slight copy+paste from another post I made:

I don't mind them "evolving" their RPG's anyway they like. But did they have to do it in the middle of a franchise?

I see people say that "we" (the dissapointed and the haters) can't adapt, we'll be left behind, etc etc. But really? You think the Dragon Age franchise and Bioware is all there is in this world? I used to love Bioware for giving me my cRPG fix, but I'm also a console player and I also play all kinds of games. I do not consider DA2 evolutionary, I've seen it all before. This isn't evolution, this is a different genre than DA:O. Was Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars an evolution of the Super Mario franchise? No, it was a different genre.

If I want "Awesome" I'll play GoW or any other game focusing on Awesome.
If I want a cinematic experience I'll play Heavy Rain.
If I want a living and interesting city I'll play Assassin's Creed or The Witcher.
If I feel some strange longing for a vague para-phrased dialogue wheel I'll play... Mass Effect.

I doubt there is anything "new" in their game, most of it feel like they borrowed the ME blueprint and tackled on some exploding bodies and lightning fast combat.

And that story! I can like the intent of it, but the execution, as well as some of the major plot quests, are just crap.

Anyways. Doing this in a sequel was just a really foolish move. They should have named it Dragon Age: The Champion and focused even more on the console side and even going so far to call it a console game, and just given the DA:O fans a DLC that put an end to the Morrigan/Godchild story and killed of that part of the franchise.

Meh, I've said it several times. I'm not a hater, I'm dissapointed.

#289
Barrechor

Barrechor
  • Members
  • 26 messages

bassmunkee wrote...

fraquar wrote...

bassmunkee wrote...

Because some people just can't get to grips with change and also I don't think that a lot of them even know why they don't like it - it's just that they jump on the band wagon.
If you actually bother to play the game it is an extremely rewarding experience. Like everything you get out of it, what you put into it.
I don't know why some of the people on here bothered buying it in the first place, tbh.


What in god's green acres is rewarding about running around the limited universe like a hamster?  There are some good things in the game, but the bottom line is in order to follow the storyline you HAVE to be a hamster.  I can't imagine what the base game is gonna be like for those without the Black Emporium, because quite frankly we really didn't need another Rogue/Archer in Sebastian when we already have Varric..... 

yawn.


lol you forgot to mention the fact that in a game called 'Dragon Age 2' there were coincidentally only '2' Dragons. Both of them part of side quests and neither of them being particularly memorable.

Dragons had a major part to play in DA:O but the same cant be said for this pile of utter garbage.

This game failed on so many levels...

BAH, I WAS MEANT TO QUOTE THE POST ABOVE THIS ONE!!

Modifié par Barrechor, 21 mars 2011 - 02:22 .


#290
Thiefy

Thiefy
  • Members
  • 1 986 messages
it was a good game just not as good as the first, and a lot of people have a problem with that.

#291
Xaenn

Xaenn
  • Members
  • 174 messages
My biggest complaint to date with Bioware games is "DLC" which I'm sure not many people share, but I rather wait for a proper expansion with the length or nearly the length of the original, then pelleted to death with small DLC's that just seem like loot dungeons.

Look at Throne of Bhaal. I don't expect the game to be like it, but it was pretty in depth, felt almost like the original, was a fairly long game ( I took my time ) :S

#292
EmsaFallkin

EmsaFallkin
  • Members
  • 74 messages
Xaenn, Just wait a year, buy the Ultimate Edition with all DLC, and give your old signature edition to someone you hate :P

#293
Xaenn

Xaenn
  • Members
  • 174 messages

EmsaFallkin wrote...

Xaenn, Just wait a year, buy the Ultimate Edition with all DLC, and give your old signature edition to someone you hate :P


Haha.  Idea perhaps. I perfer DLC not to be as sporatic as some are ment to be played after origins, some midst, all about different things without tying them to anything :S

Modifié par Xaenn, 21 mars 2011 - 02:40 .


#294
AloraKast

AloraKast
  • Members
  • 288 messages

Jadestorm7 wrote...

Basically, the biggest part of what people are upset about is the apparent laziness that went into development of the game -- re-using maps over and over and over and over, for example, loot not being fresh -- superior dagger x 43, etc. I still find it an extremely enjoyable game, and I'm going to play through as each class, but I feel the game would be 100% better if the developers spent another year or two on all factors of it. Better to have an incredible game in 2013 than sell a lot of copies in 2011, but killing your game in the process.

edit: I probably wouldn't like the game at all if I wasn't playing 100% on nightmare, though. Love the challenge, it's what allows me to look past seeing the same cave 13 times. But, if there is a DA:3, please, please, please polish it before you release it. No laziness. No sloppy story. Just spend the extra time on it and you'll get way better reviews, way more hype for future games and way more copies sold. <3


I have to say... This!

And many other comments in this thread. Dragon Age: Origins was an epic adventure, a vast and rich world with interesting characters and companions, all of which came together beautifully to provide the player a truly wonderful immersing experience. That is not to say that DA:O didn't have its flaws, bugs, it had things which I personally did not like/enjoy but which appealed to others. Like I was reading in another thread (some superb discussion going on there IMO: http://social.biowar...1/index/6673392) it is impossible to make a game that will appeal to every audience and while attempting to make such a game, you only "achieve an early grave"... er, I mean you end up appealing to no audience at all. Posted Image

Attempting to appeal to everyone combined with the fact that this game WAS rushed through the development process, sacrificing quality while trying to capitalize on the franchise... cutting corners, spending as little time and money as humanly possible while trying to rush out an unpolished product out the door... well, all of that shows in the end product.

IMO DA2 had its moments, even though the game was rushed; it had some interesting characters (with all too brief and limited interactions), it had some LOL moments (some of the companions banter truly made me laugh out loud) and even the story was... interesting, even though some of the aspects I was not too fond of personally. However, in practically every aspect of the game, I was able to see the corners that were cut in order to meet this impossible deadline.

For someone who thrives on delving deep into the world, exploring every nook and cranny, completing every quest imaginable and immersing myself in the interactions with my companions... I was still able to finish the game in well under 40 hours. For the same price as I paid for DA:O, this adventure ended way too soon and the experience itself... left me wanting.

As I have stated before in my feedback of the game experience, this game could definitely have used another year in development at the very least. Call me crazy, but I actually prefer to learn that the release date of a game I have been waiting for has been pushed back, for that leads me to believe the developers are taking the time to work out whatever bugs they encounter or are spending more time on whatever aspect of the game that doesn't meet with their approval. It tells me that the developer is taking pride in their product and are refusing to release a sub-standard game... that they are not sacrificing quality in order to make a quick buck. Of course, that is not always the case when a game is pushed back, but I choose to believe that is the case.

There are many aspects of this game I did not enjoy and overall I find the DA2 experience to be a 6 at the very most... while Origins was definitely a 9.

#295
TJSolo

TJSolo
  • Members
  • 2 256 messages

zsom wrote...

Most people (mostly the fanboys..) wanted to get a DAO II instead of another story set in Thedas. And let's face it, DA II is great, but it's not a sequel.

DAO was a huge success and had a big fanbase, these girls and guys would only be satisfied if they get the same characters, fights, story etc. back, and making the story shorter, having a voiced character just added the necessary excuse to bash the game.


The "Origins" part is only a subtitle. The sequel would still be called DA2O, although sequel subtitles are normaly changed.
If what you say is true, "DAO was a huge success and had a big fanbase", then where is the rationality in making the next iteration of that game in such a way that many people(even some who like it) "...not a sequel."?
What took place in the few months before DA2 development  to make EA Bioware go "3+ million people are just not enough, let's scrap it and do something completely different"?

If EA Bioware wants to capitalize off of the DA name by calling the product DA2 then they forfeit the right to have such game judged as a standalone product.

Also the Free Marches are in Thedas.
Becareful when using labels as shortcuts to describe people,  derogatory label use tells more about the person using them than the group that is trying to be labeled.

Modifié par TJSolo, 21 mars 2011 - 03:37 .


#296
quentilage

quentilage
  • Members
  • 7 messages
in thsi Dao v Da2 argument,  i  feel ist a bit of a mixed bag, some parts in DA2 are  better than Dao , but other parts Dao   better than da2 ,  ltry to list some of the  pro and cons for both  as follows:

 For DA2 :

1) new chars are in the main better than from dao  , though morrigan stil the best npc har ive seen in any game yet, merrith is prob closest to new super char, leats there isnt alistair this time :P

2) combats  is fun  ,though over pwering at  times   with 2 many mobs realy :)  but stil fun
            
 3 ) end set scene fight was  so much better than dao



For dao : 

1 ) much better long story

 2)  diffrent races u can play

 3)  lot more quests u can do

4)  many more are's  to explore,   ended up knowing every square inch of   zones in da2  2 quickly

5) Did NOT like the new respense wheel  that was imported from ME2  at all

 6) lack of choise of armour in da2 for  the rest of your group was   a pain ( made any quets rewards often redundent

7  )  dA2 was   made to to fit  consols : i play on pc ( have xbox  BUT never use it for rpg style games if i  can help it)

8) inter char conversation during camping  was a  lot of fun in dao , da2 removed  it , which was a BIG mistake



In conclusion I loved  both games ,  B U T ,  da2 could have been so much better if they hadnt altered  it the way they have done, STILL cant  wait to  get DA3 if and when it  comes out , but hope bioware learn from the mistakes  and  not try and make da 3 justa  copy of ME in fantasy setting


And hope morrigan and merrith  both get  added to da3


             

                 

                  

#297
Heather Cline

Heather Cline
  • Members
  • 2 822 messages
I have to argue a point against your inter character conversation in camp thing. None of the characters in camp spoke to one another when you were there. You had to speak to them and have a conversation with them. The same thing happens in DA2. You go into where ever they are at and speak to them and again have a conversation. Yes in DA:O you had a lot more conversation options because you were asking tons of questions about the character you were speaking to, but once all those options were exhausted they repeated the same lines over and over again.

In DA2 they didn't do that which I think is unique and fun.

But the argument against why there is so much hate for DA2. The 'elitists' of the rpg world think that changing a games combat system, dialogue system and what not is a bad thing. They want games to stay the same way forever. Want the silent protagonist while all the npc's are voiced.

The silent protagonist is a dying character model. I haven't seen the silent protagonist in a long time. It came back with DA:O and one other game Divinity II. I think it's still being used for the Zelda series but I'm not sure. Prior to that the last time I saw a silent protagonist was in Chrono Cross. After that none of the characters in an RPG, be it a Western RPG or a Japanese RPG used the silent protagonist model. Only games that still have those models are the revamped games that the Japanese game developers keep on doing. Re-doing the Final Fantasy games for the Nintendo DS, or the Zelda Games and so on and so forth.

Then there is the argument that DA:O had choices that affected the entire outcome of the prologue of the game. Again apples and oranges come to mind. DA:O was built in the classic rpg genre. DA2 is built for the modern era. It's like comparing comic books of today with comic books of the 50's. You look back at the 50's and go "OMG I don't know how people could even think of liking this stuff." It's because many people hate that the fact that consoles are the platform for most gaming these days. They hate that their tried and true beloved RPG's are changing and evolving and not what they used to be.

I've been gaming since I was 5. I've grown up with games. I never had a computer until I hit college. Any computers I had contact with was when I was in school. So I had the console, I grew up on them and when I finally got a computer I started gaming on there, but it was a different beast and I've only played a handful of games on the computer. Most of my gaming experience is still console based.

I always see complaints about DA:O from console gamers. The console version had a clunky interface. Combat was hard as hell and not as smooth and responsive as what I've seen for PC based version. This is because the PC based was built first and the Console version only built second. This time around the game was built for the console and the PC was built at the same time but instead of developing and top down view which many PC gamers wanted, they went a different route and decided, no we will build the games with the exact same view system, just give the PC gamers an auto-attack feature.

PC gaming is a dying breed. It has been for the last decade or so. Console gaming has been on the rise. I wouldn't be surprised if PC gaming dies out completely in the next 20 or 30 years. Most gamers are young children to young adults. Most gamers play on the console these days. It's only the old school gamers who grew up on PC gaming that want everything to stay as PC centric when that won't happen.

This is why there is so much hate for DA2. Because they don't want things to change.

Modifié par Heather Cline, 21 mars 2011 - 04:24 .


#298
Warrgh

Warrgh
  • Members
  • 7 messages
As a clever reviewer said; "the discussion about Dragon Age II doesn't need to be 'is it good?' - It is - but needs to be 'is this what fans wanted from a sequel to Dragon Age: Origins?'"

#299
TcheQ

TcheQ
  • Members
  • 275 messages

Glorfindel709 wrote...


B) The entire game feels rather rushed, from the sub-par writing.


You obviously don't play many games.  The writing in Da2 compared to anything but a Bioware or Bethesda game is untouchable. 

Here's a suggestion for a fun time:

Play another game that has cutscenes and heavy dialogue (suchas Darksiders), and count how many times you roll your eyes at either the words or the acting, divided by the number of hours of dialogue.

Count: Da2: 0.5, Darksiders: 15

=P

#300
neppakyo

neppakyo
  • Members
  • 3 074 messages

Warrgh wrote...

As a clever reviewer said; "the discussion about Dragon Age II doesn't need to be 'is it good?' - It is - but needs to be 'is this what fans wanted from a sequel to Dragon Age: Origins?'"


Here here! And DA2 isn't want I wanted in a sequel. Its a decent game in itself, despite plot holes, poor story (the writing is good, just how the story is stiched together.. ugh) And Act 1.. one of the most mind numbing things to get through, Once was fine, it was new.. second playthrough.. I had more fun playing a mouse in the fade quest in DA:O.