179 réponses à ce sujet

[Deylar]

I realized another thing.

A lot of people like Hawke because he had a voice and the Warden was "mute". Er, what part of the Warden was mute?

If anyone remembers Origins, when you customize your Warden you choose a voice for them Sarcastic, Charming, Wise, Mystical, Violent.

In battle sequences when they are calling out and killing undead the Warden speaks with whatever Voice you gave them.

My Elf Warden used the Violent voice and when they entered a battle sequence as if dead corpses were rising he'd say things along the lines of, "Why can't the dead stay dead" or "I'll put you back in the grave to die again". They even laughed during battle sequences.

Yes, granted the Warden didn't speak during main cut scenes and was mute for the most part in Main Sequence. However, because I remember the Voice I choose for him in Customization I always kind of remember his Battle Voice and the Customize Voice in my head and so it never bothered me.

Has everyone forgotten this?

The Warden granted didn't speak in main cutscenes, wasn't a mute.

[Persephone]

He didn't just not speak in major cutscenes, all he had were battle cries.

[StingingVelvet]

Bethesda's RPGs have outsold Bioware RPGs since Oblivion and they have no voice-over for the main character. I don't see why Bioware feels it is needed to be successful.

[Deylar]

Persephone wrote...
He didn't just not speak in major cutscenes, all he had were battle cries.

That, however, doesn't make him mute. Just means he didn't speak in major cutscenes.

But I also think it is up to the player themselves with a little bit of um imagination.

I always used the battle cry voice in my head when I read over the dialogue and what I wanted to say. I imagined his voice just from the battle cry voice they gave me.

*shrugs*

[Legbiter]

Yes he was. A complete mute.

[Deylar]

simfamSP wrote...
Can I give you a ladder so you can get of my back?

rofl!

That was always so funny to hear.

@Stinging: Agreed. For me its so easy to be able to use a character that isn't like Hawke. Because then I can create my own stories. And it gives it more of a "This is My Hero" over "This is Hawke he has his own history you didn't create he's Bioware's character"

[Deylar]

Legbiter wrote...

Yes he was. A complete mute.

A mime more likely. Mute No.

[EmsaFallkin]

Personally, I don't need VO's but neither do I hate them. What I do hate is the extra work which usually takes away from other parts, as well as the "depersonalization" of the player character. I don't mind voiced PC's, but it lends itself to a 3rd view storytelling which I expect from console RPG's and such. CRPG's has always been a genre in itself for me becuase it allows me to "be" the PC rather than just view a story. Bioware has always fullfilled this with their former games (that I've played), but with DA2 I feel as if I'm viewing a story rather than being part of a story.

I'm not a hater, just dissapointed. There's a huge difference.

[TJSolo]

Has everyone forgotten this?

People have not forgotten but the ones that make the claim the Warden is mute are doing it to be funny or they are ignorant to how text dialogue works in games. Every line you pick for the Warden is the Warden talking in DAO it is just the lines do not have a voice over to be heard by the player, the characters in the game hear the Warden just fine.

Modifié par TJSolo, 19 mars 2011 - 01:52 .

[Bratinov]

Some people like games to be more like interactive movies...
Immersion is better if the character that is supposed to be your avatar doesn't speak (see Bethesda titles, Gordon Freemen)

Hawke is not your avatar, he's just some random guy you give behavioral suggestions to, thats all.

I cringed at the warden's battle cry

Modifié par Bratinov, 19 mars 2011 - 01:55 .

[Aradace]

"battle cries" dont count. So yes, when you split hairs, he was "mute". Unless you can discover some sort of "normal" dialog where the Warden DOESNT stare dramatically off into the middle distance and actually gives actual "input" into a conversation beyond selecting the dialog. Then sorry, he was still "mute"

[Deylar]

Aradace wrote...
"battle cries" dont count. So yes, when you split hairs, he was "mute". Unless you can discover some sort of "normal" dialog where the Warden DOESNT stare dramatically off into the middle distance and actually gives actual "input" into a conversation beyond selecting the dialog. Then sorry, he was still "mute"

I disagree. Its clear he had a voice. Its clear that he spoke. You can imply thus that he talks, thus he isn't mute.

Bratinov wrote...
Some people like games to be more like interactive movies...
Immersion is better if the character that is supposed to be your avatar doesn't speak (see Bethesda titles, Gordon Freemen)
Hawke is not your avatar, he's just some random guy you give behavioral suggestions to, thats all

Agreed on all standpoints.

[Montana]

StingingVelvet wrote...

Bethesda's RPGs have outsold Bioware RPGs since Oblivion and they have no voice-over for the main character. I don't see why Bioware feels it is needed to be successful.

Bethesda characters doesn't even "speak" in full centences, just single words (atleast before FO3).

BTW: I like voiced protagonists in BW games, couldn't imagine I'd like them in Bethesda games due to the sandbox style.

Modifié par Tony77A, 19 mars 2011 - 02:04 .

[Montana]

simfamSP wrote...

Can I give you a ladder so you can get of my back?

God how I hated that soundset!

[StingingVelvet]

Tony77A wrote...

StingingVelvet wrote...

Bethesda's RPGs have outsold Bioware RPGs since Oblivion and they have no voice-over for the main character. I don't see why Bioware feels it is needed to be successful.

Bethesda characters doesn't even "speak" in full centences, just single words (atleast before FO3).

BTW: I like voiced protagonists in BW games, couldn't imagine I'd like them in Bethesda games due to the sandbox style.

Voice acting in an open world game worked out fine in Gothic and Risen.  I don't have a huge problem with voice acting itself, I more have a problem with not picking exactly what my character says.  Despite DA2's icons and very simplistic good/funny/bad paradigm there were still plenty of times where what I said was not what I meant to say.

[JabbaDaHutt30]

Deylar wrote...

Aradace wrote...
"battle cries" dont count. So yes, when you split hairs, he was "mute". Unless you can discover some sort of "normal" dialog where the Warden DOESNT stare dramatically off into the middle distance and actually gives actual "input" into a conversation beyond selecting the dialog. Then sorry, he was still "mute"

I disagree. Its clear he had a voice. Its clear that he spoke. You can imply thus that he talks, thus he isn't mute.

Bratinov wrote...
Some people like games to be more like interactive movies...
Immersion is better if the character that is supposed to be your avatar doesn't speak (see Bethesda titles, Gordon Freemen)
Hawke is not your avatar, he's just some random guy you give behavioral suggestions to, thats all

Agreed on all standpoints.

um, ok? he was mute during dialogue interactions. that was the point. having characters say battle cries or crap like that stretches from as far as Baldur's Gate 1, ok? i don't see the point in trying to split hairs here.

Modifié par JabbaDaHutt30, 19 mars 2011 - 02:09 .

[Deylar]

StingingVelvet wrote...
Voice acting in an open world game worked out fine in Gothic and Risen.  I don't have a huge problem with voice acting itself, I more have a problem with not picking exactly what my character says.  Despite DA2's icons and very simplistic good/funny/bad paradigm there were still plenty of times where what I said was not what I meant to say.

Same.

[JabbaDaHutt30]

StingingVelvet wrote...

Tony77A wrote...

StingingVelvet wrote...

Bethesda's RPGs have outsold Bioware RPGs since Oblivion and they have no voice-over for the main character. I don't see why Bioware feels it is needed to be successful.

Bethesda characters doesn't even "speak" in full centences, just single words (atleast before FO3).

BTW: I like voiced protagonists in BW games, couldn't imagine I'd like them in Bethesda games due to the sandbox style.

Voice acting in an open world game worked out fine in Gothic and Risen.  I don't have a huge problem with voice acting itself, I more have a problem with not picking exactly what my character says.  Despite DA2's icons and very simplistic good/funny/bad paradigm there were still plenty of times where what I said was not what I meant to say.

the PC's voiceacting in gothic sucked. risen was a slight improvement but I suppose you don't care as much because the voiceacting doesn't get bonus points in any of those games for any voiced NPC

Modifié par JabbaDaHutt30, 19 mars 2011 - 02:13 .

[StingingVelvet]

JabbaDaHutt30 wrote...

StingingVelvet wrote...

Tony77A wrote...

StingingVelvet wrote...

Bethesda's RPGs have outsold Bioware RPGs since Oblivion and they have no voice-over for the main character. I don't see why Bioware feels it is needed to be successful.

Bethesda characters doesn't even "speak" in full centences, just single words (atleast before FO3).

BTW: I like voiced protagonists in BW games, couldn't imagine I'd like them in Bethesda games due to the sandbox style.

Voice acting in an open world game worked out fine in Gothic and Risen.  I don't have a huge problem with voice acting itself, I more have a problem with not picking exactly what my character says.  Despite DA2's icons and very simplistic good/funny/bad paradigm there were still plenty of times where what I said was not what I meant to say.

the PC's voiceacting in gothic sucked. risen was a slight improvement but I suppose you don't care as much because the voiceacting doesn't get bonus points in any of those games for any voiced NPC

I was meaning less quality-wise and more just it worked mechanically.  Fallout: New Vegas could have had voice-over for the player as long as the dialogue was the same and I would not have cared.  The key essentual problem with the Mass Effect method and now the DA2 method is that I do not know what I am going to say.  This debate has raged on this forum since ME came out but Bioware have done nothing to change my mind over the years.  If anything I had more instances of saying something off the wall in DA2 than the previous games.

The icons do not help because angry could mean good, bad or anything else, being angry itself is not a clear indicator of the result.  Seeing that little red fist does not instantly tell me anything other than Hawke will be angry when she says whatever she is going to say.  It does not clue me in to context or intent.

[Noir_Skye]

simfamSP wrote...

Can I give you a ladder so you can get of my back?

That brings back fond memories of my Noble Rogue Warden.

If our warden makes an appearance in a future game, do yo think they will us the voice we selected in origins?  With the dialogue wheel, I doubt we will go back to the dialogue choices in origins.

[Rykoth]

The reason why you don't have a VO on the Elder Scrolls is because UNLIKE Dragon Age 2 you are not playing a "canon" character.

Hawke, and to a lesser extent, the Warden, are canon characters. They will forever be imprinted on the history of Thedas. The Warden ends the Fifth Blight before it begins. Hawke does what Hawke does (avoiding spoilers) and becomes the Champion of Kirkwall.

We know these things happened, and a few key things do happen along the way. These things are as one might put it, destiny. The Warden, using DAO HAS to use the treaties. He cannot go to the Landsmeet and save the day without using those and saving the Arl. Hawke HAS to do the things Hawke does to be champion.

But it's HOW. It's a canon character.

Bethesda games don't do that. It's traditionally a first person YOU are the hero sandbox. Which isn't bad, but it isn't for everyone. Me? I like structure in my story. I like to be touched emotionally, I like to interact with regular characters.

Morrowind? Oblivion? I liked the former's epic story but it never "touched" me because there wasn't a narrative of any kind.

The only reason the Warden didn't have a VO is because of the cost it would take to get X amount of VO jobs done for each race and origin.

[Aradace]

Deylar wrote...

Aradace wrote...
"battle cries" dont count. So yes, when you split hairs, he was "mute". Unless you can discover some sort of "normal" dialog where the Warden DOESNT stare dramatically off into the middle distance and actually gives actual "input" into a conversation beyond selecting the dialog. Then sorry, he was still "mute"

I disagree. Its clear he had a voice. Its clear that he spoke. You can imply thus that he talks, thus he isn't mute.

.

Symantics.  The point is that not everyone likes "pretending" that you're actually speaking when you selected dialog choices in Origins.  His mouth never moved and words never technically came out during dialog (unless you count apparently telepathy.)  The point is that the liklihood of EAware going back to a "voiceless" protagonist (beyond battlecries) in DA3 is extremely unlikely.  Not entirely impossible, but very very unlikely.

[HyperLimited]

He/she was not mute. He/she just lacked a voiceover during conversations. 

[AtreiyaN7]

Sorry, but in real conversations, your Warden is a mute. I can't believe you're trying to spin a few lines that your Warden uses when clicking on objects or in battle as somehow being the equivalent of substantive speech. If you hate voiced protagonists, I have a solution: cotton balls.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 19 mars 2011 - 09:03 .