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Sebastian Support Group! (spoilers...possibly)


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#1626
john-in-france

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rak72 wrote...

Checked Youtube, Bethany is the one starting the flirting - that little ... NM.  Sebastian was just being kind of gentalmanly:


This is the Sebatian Armor mod I have on Nexus - "Starkhaven Knockoff".  It auto levels

Posted Image

http://www.dragonage...ile.php?id=2992


That was you! Nice mod may I say :)

Good, glad I missed the line that must have started it. I so hate the thought of flirty Seb.

Modifié par john-in-france, 10 août 2011 - 06:27 .


#1627
Ellyria

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john-in-france wrote...
My Sebastian/Brighid courtship fiction progresses, will let you know when I post just in case you are interested. I always finish my fiction before posting, I hate people who walk away from their stories, especially when I've been following it for weeks.

Judy


:whistle: I'm bad about that. Usually it's not a problem because I don't post them anywhere, but I posted a Vampire Diaries fic on ff.net last fall, and never finished it because I couldn't get a particular scene written the way I wanted, and then I lost interest because last season wasn't that good. Which is too bad, because I have the whole thing mapped out, it's just not written. 

#1628
john-in-france

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silentstephi wrote...

It's why as much as I'd LOVE for Cullen to be a romance in DA3... I know it won't happen.  The difference being, you can't have any sort of romantic entanglement with the Knight Captain, while with Sebs, it's pretty much laid out there.



I'd like Cullen to be romance interest in DA3 if they import my Warden Amell, otherwise Sebastian as I think we will see a real Good vs Evil story with the first evil Magister of Tevinter involved and Chantry doctrine of the Golden City being confirmed (Legacy). It will be epic, at the least I want Cullen on the team, with me and Sebastian and Warden Amell...wishful thinking...arhhhh.

Judy

#1629
john-in-france

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Chylise wrote...

john-in-france wrote...
My Sebastian/Brighid courtship fiction progresses, will let you know when I post just in case you are interested. I always finish my fiction before posting, I hate people who walk away from their stories, especially when I've been following it for weeks.

Judy


:whistle: I'm bad about that. Usually it's not a problem because I don't post them anywhere, but I posted a Vampire Diaries fic on ff.net last fall, and never finished it because I couldn't get a particular scene written the way I wanted, and then I lost interest because last season wasn't that good. Which is too bad, because I have the whole thing mapped out, it's just not written. 


That's ok I wasn't following it, sadly vampires do nothing for me. I'm the Hammer House of Horror generation, not a Twilighter/Buffy generation.

I bet that you never left a Sebastian romance alone...crying to itself for an update 3 months later. I lurk on the Kinkmeme and fanfiction, sometimes I write there. At the moment some lovely person has posted a request for meme that is just up my street. Seb/F!Hawke and the Chaste marriage/courtship.

#1630
silentstephi

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john-in-france wrote...
My Sebastian/Brighid courtship fiction progresses, will let you know when I post just in case you are interested. I always finish my fiction before posting, I hate people who walk away from their stories, especially when I've been following it for weeks.

Judy


*stares at Ties*
Crap.

*slinks away*

#1631
john-in-france

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Yes, Templars normally take a vow of chastity as they are Brothers and Sisters of the Chantry.
In Ferelden (DAO) the emphasis was Chastity for normal Templar, but Celibacy whilst serving as a Circle Guardian. Like Cullen, who was naughty with my Amell because of modding.

We know that Ser Wesley was married to Aveline, under a vow of chastity. So sex and love is involved here under the vow of chastity.

The great debate comes from the Short Story by Hepler, where Sebastian mentions a vow of celibacy. Perhaps due to him being of royal blood (?!) and inheritance issues. We know that with the death of his family Sebastian left those vows behind in fact, but clings to them mentally. However he never renews them in the game because Elthina does not let him.

Perhaps what the Friendmance does is to give him the normal Brothers option of a vow of chastity, just like a Templar.

#1632
Ellyria

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john-in-france wrote...

That's ok I wasn't following it, sadly vampires do nothing for me. I'm the Hammer House of Horror generation, not a Twilighter/Buffy generation.

I bet that you never left a Sebastian romance alone...crying to itself for an update 3 months later. I lurk on the Kinkmeme and fanfiction, sometimes I write there. At the moment some lovely person has posted a request for meme that is just up my street. Seb/F!Hawke and the Chaste marriage/courtship.


Ewwwww, lumping pansey Twilight in with awesome Buffy? For shame! :P

I haven't written a Sebastian romance fic, but I did leave a Rivalmance playthrough sitting by itself for like a month, because I had finished his Act 3 QB quest and didn't want to go through all of act 3 just for him to say "Geez, I WISH we could hook up... wait, nevermind." Then Legacy came out and I blew through act 3 to see the Rivalmance banter.

I also hate starting a new PT/story when I haven't finished my previous one. The only reason I put the TVD fic up is because a bunch of us on a forum I used to frequent were all writing fics at the same time, so we wanted to critique and help each other. None of us got very far, I had five chapters, another girl had seven, and the rest had one or two. It was pretty sad. :innocent:

#1633
john-in-france

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silentstephi wrote...

john-in-france wrote...
My Sebastian/Brighid courtship fiction progresses, will let you know when I post just in case you are interested. I always finish my fiction before posting, I hate people who walk away from their stories, especially when I've been following it for weeks.

Judy


*stares at Ties*
Crap.

*slinks away*


Nope my particular annoyance at the moment is Aftermath, where Sebastian is romancing a F!Hawke pregnant by Anders. I so wanted to read the end. Deserted by author after chapter 14. Sob...

Where is Ties? Just so I guilt you into finishing good Sebastian fiction (if it is), there are so few Sebastian stories.

#1634
Ellyria

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john-in-france wrote...
Nope my particular annoyance at the moment is Aftermath, where Sebastian is romancing a F!Hawke pregnant by Anders. I so wanted to read the end. Deserted by author after chapter 14. Sob...

Where is Ties? Just so I guilt you into finishing good Sebastian fiction (if it is), there are so few Sebastian stories.


:lol: I find it amusing that a lot of Sebastian fics I read, Anders loves Hawke. I thought it was just me who thought that Anders always is in love with Hawke, romance or no.

Not only are there so few Sebastian stories, there are so few GOOD Sebastian stories. Maybe I'm just picky with my fanfiction, but I've only liked a few fics, and a couple one-shots, the rest I quit after the second or third chapter, and that's spanning every video game/TV show fic I've ever read. I don't search for fics anymore, I usually get recommendations or I know the person who's writing it.

Modifié par Chylise, 10 août 2011 - 07:24 .


#1635
john-in-france

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Chylise wrote...

john-in-france wrote...

That's ok I wasn't following it, sadly vampires do nothing for me. I'm the Hammer House of Horror generation, not a Twilighter/Buffy generation.

I bet that you never left a Sebastian romance alone...crying to itself for an update 3 months later. I lurk on the Kinkmeme and fanfiction, sometimes I write there. At the moment some lovely person has posted a request for meme that is just up my street. Seb/F!Hawke and the Chaste marriage/courtship.


Ewwwww, lumping pansey Twilight in with awesome Buffy? For shame! :P

I haven't written a Sebastian romance fic, but I did leave a Rivalmance playthrough sitting by itself for like a month, because I had finished his Act 3 QB quest and didn't want to go through all of act 3 just for him to say "Geez, I WISH we could hook up... wait, nevermind." Then Legacy came out and I blew through act 3 to see the Rivalmance banter.

I also hate starting a new PT/story when I haven't finished my previous one. The only reason I put the TVD fic up is because a bunch of us on a forum I used to frequent were all writing fics at the same time, so we wanted to critique and help each other. None of us got very far, I had five chapters, another girl had seven, and the rest had one or two. It was pretty sad. :innocent:


I read Fenris, Cullen and Alistair fiction from the DA universe...

Yes, I can totally see the problem with Rivalmance, got caught there a few times myself, and can not write it. Hot friendmanced Sebastian in a kilt, no problem. I have a weird mindset!

Was that Cheeky Monkeys? I joined, felt the lack of Sebastian love, and ran for it. They described him as the bald man with the horrid belt buckle. I agree on the belt buckle of righteousness, and my Hawke thinks it has angles in just the wrong places for a decent hug between them.

Rather than re-writing DA2, my muse is writing between scenes that are canon, with a few tweaks here and there since Bioware didn't write it for us. All that Remains night and Sebastian kidnapped by Thrask and Grace etc.

Personally I think anyone stupid enough to kidnap Hawkes fiance deserves what they get...

#1636
john-in-france

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Chylise wrote...

john-in-france wrote...
Nope my particular annoyance at the moment is Aftermath, where Sebastian is romancing a F!Hawke pregnant by Anders. I so wanted to read the end. Deserted by author after chapter 14. Sob...

Where is Ties? Just so I guilt you into finishing good Sebastian fiction (if it is), there are so few Sebastian stories.


:lol: I find it amusing that a lot of Sebastian fics I read, Anders loves Hawke. I thought it was just me who thought that Anders always is in love with Hawke, romance or no.

Not only are there so few Sebastian stories, there are so few GOOD Sebastian stories. Maybe I'm just picky with my fanfiction, but I've only liked a few fics, and a couple one-shots, the rest I quit after the second or third chapter, and that's spanning every video game/TV show fic I've ever read. I don't search for fics anymore, I usually get recommendations or I know the person who's writing it.


Normally, I don't do Anders. I just don't like DA2 Anders, but some of the plot worked well, the writing needs some polishing, but better than some I've read the first chapter of.

Sadly most Sebastian stories seem to be out of character. Though occassionally I'm in the mood for OOC - the desire demon dream sequence when Merrill helps Hawke out of the chaste marriage being a classic.

Modifié par john-in-france, 10 août 2011 - 07:30 .


#1637
silentstephi

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john-in-france wrote...

silentstephi wrote...

john-in-france wrote...
My Sebastian/Brighid courtship fiction progresses, will let you know when I post just in case you are interested. I always finish my fiction before posting, I hate people who walk away from their stories, especially when I've been following it for weeks.

Judy


*stares at Ties*
Crap.

*slinks away*


Nope my particular annoyance at the moment is Aftermath, where Sebastian is romancing a F!Hawke pregnant by Anders. I so wanted to read the end. Deserted by author after chapter 14. Sob...

Where is Ties? Just so I guilt you into finishing good Sebastian fiction (if it is), there are so few Sebastian stories.



It's just another spin on the same ol' story.
(now with an actual link! /facepalm)
I haven't read Aftermath, but probably will once I'm done writing.  I don't read too much fanfiction when I've got a story I'm doing because I don't want to make folks think I'm stealin' their ideas...

Ties is kind of a personal demon purge for me too.  Which is why I've stalled.  But lemme know what you think.  I've got another few unfinished/unpublished on my harddrive.

Side note: Ok, for some reason my current PT has Sebastian almost fully rivaled and we're not even out of Act 2 yet.  How did I do that?!

Modifié par silentstephi, 10 août 2011 - 07:34 .


#1638
R2s Muse

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john-in-france wrote...

Yes, Templars normally take a vow of chastity as they are Brothers and Sisters of the Chantry.
In Ferelden (DAO) the emphasis was Chastity for normal Templar, but Celibacy whilst serving as a Circle Guardian. Like Cullen, who was naughty with my Amell because of modding.

We know that Ser Wesley was married to Aveline, under a vow of chastity. So sex and love is involved here under the vow of chastity.

The great debate comes from the Short Story by Hepler, where Sebastian mentions a vow of celibacy. Perhaps due to him being of royal blood (?!) and inheritance issues. We know that with the death of his family Sebastian left those vows behind in fact, but clings to them mentally. However he never renews them in the game because Elthina does not let him.

Perhaps what the Friendmance does is to give him the normal Brothers option of a vow of chastity, just like a Templar.


I'm curious about this one. Where does it say that...? I'm wondering because there's this nice little tidbit from David Gaider about how templars do not take vows of chastity. They can get married, with permission, like regular people (so long as their spouse is self-sufficient, which is just ... odd but anyway). But, I don't believe they're  Chantry brothers/sisters; they just work for the Chantry.

D'oh, just realized for the first time that he also says that Chantry priests are celibate.
"Chantry priests are considered "married" to the Maker-- though it's not
an actual marriage, just a spiritual one-- and thus are indeed celibate."

#1639
silentstephi

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R2s Muse wrote...

john-in-france wrote...

Yes, Templars normally take a vow of chastity as they are Brothers and Sisters of the Chantry.
In Ferelden (DAO) the emphasis was Chastity for normal Templar, but Celibacy whilst serving as a Circle Guardian. Like Cullen, who was naughty with my Amell because of modding.

We know that Ser Wesley was married to Aveline, under a vow of chastity. So sex and love is involved here under the vow of chastity.

The great debate comes from the Short Story by Hepler, where Sebastian mentions a vow of celibacy. Perhaps due to him being of royal blood (?!) and inheritance issues. We know that with the death of his family Sebastian left those vows behind in fact, but clings to them mentally. However he never renews them in the game because Elthina does not let him.

Perhaps what the Friendmance does is to give him the normal Brothers option of a vow of chastity, just like a Templar.


I'm curious about this one. Where does it say that...? I'm wondering because there's this nice little tidbit from David Gaider about how templars do not take vows of chastity. They can get married, with permission, like regular people (so long as their spouse is self-sufficient, which is just ... odd but anyway). But, I don't believe they're  Chantry brothers/sisters; they just work for the Chantry.


Not so odd when you think that being a templar is a dangerous job.  I wonder though if because it's a religous order then don't have like... a family support network.   Macha doesn't seem all that self sufficent when you think about it.  She depends on Karen.

#1640
john-in-france

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silentstephi wrote...

john-in-france wrote...

silentstephi wrote...

john-in-france wrote...
My Sebastian/Brighid courtship fiction progresses, will let you know when I post just in case you are interested. I always finish my fiction before posting, I hate people who walk away from their stories, especially when I've been following it for weeks.

Judy


*stares at Ties*
Crap.

*slinks away*


Nope my particular annoyance at the moment is Aftermath, where Sebastian is romancing a F!Hawke pregnant by Anders. I so wanted to read the end. Deserted by author after chapter 14. Sob...

Where is Ties? Just so I guilt you into finishing good Sebastian fiction (if it is), there are so few Sebastian stories.

It's just another spin on the same ol' story. (now with an actual link! /facepalm)
I haven't read Aftermath, but probably will once I'm done writing.  I don't read too much fanfiction when I've got a story I'm doing because I don't want to make folks think I'm stealin' their ideas...

Ties is kind of a personal demon purge for me too.  Which is why I've stalled.  But lemme know what you think.  I've got another few unfinished/unpublished on my harddrive.

Side note: Ok, for some reason my current PT has Sebastian almost fully rivaled and we're not even out of Act 2 yet.  How did I do that?!


The link didn't work but this quote showed the http, will read tomorrow. I must go to bed, the night is running away with me. Posted Image

So far I have no problem with reading other fiction, it is just not aimed at Friendmanced Seb in the same way, so I have no temptation to steal lines. Unlike Isabela and Varric, can you imagine what those two write?

Until tomorrow. Bon Nuit!

#1641
R2s Muse

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silentstephi wrote...

R2s Muse wrote...

I'm curious about this one. Where does it say that...? I'm wondering because there's this nice little tidbit from David Gaider about how templars do not take vows of chastity. They can get married, with permission, like regular people (so long as their spouse is self-sufficient, which is just ... odd but anyway). But, I don't believe they're  Chantry brothers/sisters; they just work for the Chantry.


Not so odd when you think that being a templar is a dangerous job.  I wonder though if because it's a religous order then don't have like... a family support network.   Macha doesn't seem all that self sufficent when you think about it.  She depends on Karen.


I dunno, I think it sounds like some weird post-facto rationalization about the fact that Aveline is one of those new-fangledy career girls. LOL You'd figure you'd want these guys being as stable as  possible, but, yeah, if your family never gets to see you, you may need to be a bit more self-sufficient.

#1642
Ellyria

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john-in-france wrote...

I read Fenris, Cullen and Alistair fiction from the DA universe...

Yes, I can totally see the problem with Rivalmance, got caught there a few times myself, and can not write it. Hot friendmanced Sebastian in a kilt, no problem. I have a weird mindset!

Was that Cheeky Monkeys? I joined, felt the lack of Sebastian love, and ran for it. They described him as the bald man with the horrid belt buckle. I agree on the belt buckle of righteousness, and my Hawke thinks it has angles in just the wrong places for a decent hug between them.

Rather than re-writing DA2, my muse is writing between scenes that are canon, with a few tweaks here and there since Bioware didn't write it for us. All that Remains night and Sebastian kidnapped by Thrask and Grace etc.

Personally I think anyone stupid enough to kidnap Hawkes fiance deserves what they get...


I read an Alistair fic and half of a Cullen fic a few weeks ago, but the author's writing style made me feel depressed, so I had to stop.

Actually, the forum I was at had nothing to do with DA, it was a Vampire Diaries forum. But... Sebastian bald?! Just because his hairline is a bit higher than Fenris' or Anders'... :blink:

I'm not a fan of fics that want to rewrite an entire game/movie/book/etc with what they think SHOULD have happened. Certain scenes from the original here or there? Yes, absolutely! (like lywinis' Seb!fic) Scenes that happen offscreen during the game? Yes please! But rewriting the entire game? Ugh, no thanks.

That being said, I'd love to read your Sebastian fic when it's done. :happy: I have so much headcanon about those scenes you mentioned that I'd like to see others' interpretations.

#1643
john-in-france

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Templars go through a rigorous process of recruitment and indoctrination, in monastic refuges segregated from everyday society. While the majority of their members are male, some female templars do exist, having chosen to serve the Maker as a defender of the faith rather than a spiritual guide for the community. Templars are discouraged from marrying or raising children since it is impractical to live apart from ones' dependents. However, such unions are occasionally permitted, provided that the templar's spouse has his or her own means of support, for example, owning land or a title.[1] A templar marrying another templar or a mage within the same Circle would be considered fraternization within the ranks and would seldom receive permission.

Codex. Also referenced under Chantry brothers and sisters. The Seekers also take holy orders so to speak and answer directly to the Divine.

Must go to bed....before I break the keyboard by head smacking into it and snoring loudly!

#1644
silentstephi

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Night JIF.

R2 - Other than Meredith, we're not really given what it's like to be a woman in the order. So far, only templars we've seen with families have been men. Wonder if it's treated differently?

#1645
R2s Muse

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john-in-france wrote...

Templars go through a rigorous process of recruitment and indoctrination, in monastic refuges segregated from everyday society. While the majority of their members are male, some female templars do exist, having chosen to serve the Maker as a defender of the faith rather than a spiritual guide for the community. Templars are discouraged from marrying or raising children since it is impractical to live apart from ones' dependents. However, such unions are occasionally permitted, provided that the templar's spouse has his or her own means of support, for example, owning land or a title.[1] A templar marrying another templar or a mage within the same Circle would be considered fraternization within the ranks and would seldom receive permission.

Codex. Also referenced under Chantry brothers and sisters. The Seekers also take holy orders so to speak and answer directly to the Divine.

Must go to bed....before I break the keyboard by head smacking into it and snoring loudly!


Right, the [1] reference in the Templar Order codex is the David Gaider posting that says Templars do not take a vow of chastity. Just curious if there's elsewhere that talks about templars that way.

@Silentstephi -- that's a great question! My suspicion would be, since they're a minority among the templars, it's totally different for them in practice, since we see that in so many other male-dominated workplaces. Anyhoo...

[Sorry - don't mean to derail - now back to your regularly scheduled Sebastian-oriented program... <3]

#1646
john-in-france

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A quick run down of the Chantry according to codex and game information:

The Divine (female High Priest - celibate)
Grand Clerics (Regional representatives of the Divine, female, - celibate)
Revered Mothers (Priest in charge of local church, female - celibate)
Mothers (Priests, female - celibate)
Sisters and Brothers (Monastic, male and female, vows of chastity according to Leliana DAO, she also states that a vow of chastity does not stop said Brother/Sister from laying with a person that they love)
Lay Sisters and Brothers (male and female, no vows regarding sexuality)

Sebastian says to Merrill :
■Sebastian: Have you heard the Chant of Light?
■Merrill: That's the song they sing at the Chantry, right? It's pretty... but a little repetitive.
■Sebastian: Then you know the story? How Andraste became the Maker's divine bride and convinced Him to offer us a second chance?
■Merrill: Right. But I never understood why she had to die.
■Sebastian: Her mortal husband betrayed her out of jealousy.
■Merrill: But if He wanted her to spread her faith, couldn't she do that better alive?
■Sebastian: The Maker gave us free will. By his betrayal, Maferath showed us that men were not yet worth saving.
■Merrill: I don't know. It's a nice story, but I think it's got some holes.

Maferath is the reason there are no male priests in the Chantry. Sounds a bit like the Roman Catholic take on Eve, thus no female priests in the Catholic church.

So praise the Maker, Sebastian is a Brother...phew, all that Gaider talk had me for a moment.
I still feel very frustrated that Bioware are not clarifying the issue for us. Silence...

Anway the dialogue that always make me think that Sebastian is...somewhat prudent with the truth...somewhere;

■Varric: So, I've known you for three years now. I give up. You beat me. What is it?
■Varric: You like boys? Sheep? You slept with your sister?
■Sebastian: What are you talking about?
■Varric: What are you hiding? Nobody's this bloody clean.
■Varric: After you leave the chantry you... get drunk at the Hanged Man and walk around in women's clothes?
If Isabela is in the party:
■Isabela: Not that I've seen. Unfortunately.
■Sebastian: I've been honest with you and Hawke.
■Varric: Liar.
■Sebastian: Lying is a sin.

Notice that he only says that he's been honest with Varric and Hawke. So who hasn't he been telling the whole truth to? Any speculations?

#1647
john-in-france

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Rivalmancing is...difficult. I'm not loving this playthrough...sob.

Maybe I should just settle for Friendmance.

Judy

#1648
Chignon

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I prefer the rivalmance. It has so much potential for future storylines.

Modifié par Chignon, 11 août 2011 - 01:12 .


#1649
silentstephi

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Rivalmancing without being a turd isn't so hard actually. illusionaryennui came up with a really great guide to getting him to max Rivalry in the second act here.

Though in hindsight, you might need facebook to read it, but I followed the wiki for the most part and had him Rival'd by end of Act 2 without being asocial. Granted.... this particular play through started off with snarky Hawke and has devolved into hard lined Hawke since Mom.

#1650
syllogi

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Ha, on my first playthrough, there was that bug associated with Isabela and Sebastian's friendship bonus talents...so I used the bugged conversation with Elthina to insult her a few dozen times in Sebastian's presence, and maxed Rivalry with him that way. Patches fixed both of those things, though, so I had to step a little more carefully when I was siding with the Templars and trying to gain rivalry with him.

I do think that it's easy to gain rivalry with Sebastian without being a jerk to him, which is why I don't have a problem doing it. For some reason I much prefer the dialogue with Fenris on the rivalry path, also. It felt reaaaaaally bad rivaling Isabela, and with Merrill it's like kicking a puppy. I'm glad we don't have to insult Sebastian in order to disagree with him.