240 réponses à ce sujet

[AcidRelic]

Gentleman Moogle wrote...

tallrickruush wrote...

I loved both ME and ME2, and I felt the sequel was an improvement, overall. I would likely have quit playing ME2 far sooner than I did, though, if not for Gibbed's Save Editor allowing me new looks and joyous freedom from planet-scanning.

I like DA:O's story better, and DA2's combat better. What I don't like about DA2 is that the story doesn't really change, regardless of the choices I make. The only real choice comes at the end. Regardless of how my choice affects the game world, it doesn't affect my gaming experience at all.

Maybe the same can be said of many games. How much do ME and ME2 change mid-game, based upon choices made? Maybe not much. But they have much, much better gameplay to keep our attention.

Some people are going to say that choices never matter, that we always wind up in the same place regardless of what happens. And I suppose they're right; but games like ME2, ME1 and DA:O at least give us the ILLUSION of our choices mattering. Yes, we always kill the Archdemon, but how we get there is somewhat different each time, and it always FEELS like the choices we make have an effect, even if they don't. 

DA2 doesn't give us that illusion. Barely anything changes regardless of what you do, and they don't even give us the illusion that something MIGHT have changed, because we're always in the same damn city and we see that nothing ever moves from how it was supposed to go. 

Now, for me, the difference between ME2 and DA2 was the existence of chapter-spanning storyline. Sure, ME2 didn't have the greatest story ever created, but it had a goal, a purpose, and a sense of urgency. DA2, by contrast, starts us out with no story whatsoever beyond "Get monies." In Act 2 we're introduced to a villain... And then the villain is taken away to be replaced in act 3 by ANOTHER villain... Who we've never seen before and have no connection with. 

ME2 felt complete. It was one full story -- how good a story it was I'll leave to the philosophers -- that had a goal, a purpose for your dude to work towards, a bad guy who provided a credible threat, and an ultimate climax that brought all the plot threads to a satisfying conclusion. 

In my opinion, DA2 didn't have any of those. 

OK, good. So it means I'm not alone   It just seemed EVERYWHERE I looked the DA:2 hater was a ME2 hater LOL.

Modifié par AcidRelic, 20 mars 2011 - 11:45 .

[Element Zero]

Gentleman Moogle wrote...

tallrickruush wrote...

I loved both ME and ME2, and I felt the sequel was an improvement, overall. I would likely have quit playing ME2 far sooner than I did, though, if not for Gibbed's Save Editor allowing me new looks and joyous freedom from planet-scanning.

I like DA:O's story better, and DA2's combat better. What I don't like about DA2 is that the story doesn't really change, regardless of the choices I make. The only real choice comes at the end. Regardless of how my choice affects the game world, it doesn't affect my gaming experience at all.

Maybe the same can be said of many games. How much do ME and ME2 change mid-game, based upon choices made? Maybe not much. But they have much, much better gameplay to keep our attention.

Some people are going to say that choices never matter, that we always wind up in the same place regardless of what happens. And I suppose they're right; but games like ME2, ME1 and DA:O at least give us the ILLUSION of our choices mattering. Yes, we always kill the Archdemon, but how we get there is somewhat different each time, and it always FEELS like the choices we make have an effect, even if they don't. 

DA2 doesn't give us that illusion. Barely anything changes regardless of what you do, and they don't even give us the illusion that something MIGHT have changed, because we're always in the same damn city and we see that nothing ever moves from how it was supposed to go. 

Now, for me, the difference between ME2 and DA2 was the existence of chapter-spanning storyline. Sure, ME2 didn't have the greatest story ever created, but it had a goal, a purpose, and a sense of urgency. DA2, by contrast, starts us out with no story whatsoever beyond "Get monies." In Act 2 we're introduced to a villain... And then the villain is taken away to be replaced in act 3 by ANOTHER villain... Who we've never seen before and have no connection with. 

ME2 felt complete. It was one full story -- how good a story it was I'll leave to the philosophers -- that had a goal, a purpose for your dude to work towards, a bad guy who provided a credible threat, and an ultimate climax that brought all the plot threads to a satisfying conclusion. 

In my opinion, DA2 didn't have any of those. 

Well said.

I think I might pop ME2 back in and finish up my in-progress Soldier. I've purchased an amazingly kick-ass TV since I last played, and have yet to play a game with high-level graphics since doing so. I may wait an extra week, or so, before purchasing Top Spin 4.

[Deylar]

Metaliban wrote...
I found myself saving and turning it off for a day everytime I did 2 or 3 side quests as I just couldn't face the same cave/mansion/alley again. It would be a real immersion killer if there was anything immersive left about this game after 2 or 3 mindnumbing fetch quests that attempt to pad this carcass of a game out.

I liked Sebastians DLC.

Only because the place underneath that one place, was the only unique place I had ever been in.

[DrGulag]

I already wrote this elsewhere but I have so many problems with this game.

How is it that in almost every single Bioware installment before Dragon Age 2 we had the ability to impact the world around us and the ending of the game would change depending on our choices? But now it doesn't matter who you support, not one bit. One tragedy after another isn't the core problem here but that you can't do anything about it.

What's the replay value people? What can I do differently? 

What happened to gameplay? What happened to stealing, creating potions, collecting resources and having a connection with the world around us?

Where is the possibility to lie, intimidate and charm during conversations? Isn't that what roleplaying has been all about in the previous releases? You dont even need to read your own lines in DA2 (nor can you). Just choose one option from *calm*, *joke* or *angry*. Talking yourself out from a bad spot isn't really an option if the game has already decided what is going to happen. So yes, I am blaming the dialogue wheel for the fact that romances have devolved into *press heart symbol to have h0t s3x* and other nonsense.

What happened to being able to choose your own race. What's the point of having racism towards elves if you cant even play one anymore and experience it?

Customizing the armor of your companions might not seem like a big deal to many people since we are forced to use the best armor sets anyway and sell all the junk. But it does look completely stupid to have some pirate woman in a prostitute uniform fighting against a dragon. This is something I expect to see from square and Final Fantasy, not Bioware.

This game does its job as a linear adventure hack'n'slasher but I didnt dish out 60 bucks for a mediocre Diablo. Just one year ago Bioware put square on blast by stating that "Final Fantasy XIII is not an RPG yadayada". And here we are now....I hope CD Projekt stays silent and walks the walk with Witcher 2, because the dev-team needs a reality check.

But other than it was pretty great.

Modifié par DrGulag, 21 mars 2011 - 12:22 .

[Deylar]

DrGulag wrote...

I already wrote this elsewhere but I have so many problems with this game.

How is it that in almost every single Bioware installment before Dragon Age 2 we had the ability to impact the world around us and the ending of the game would change depending on our choices? But now it doesn't matter who you support, not one bit. One tragedy after another isn't the core problem here but that you can't do anything about it.

What's the replay value people? What can I do differently? 

What happened to gameplay? What happened to stealing, creating potions, collecting resources and having a connection with the world around us?

Where is the possibility to lie, intimidate and charm during conversations? Isn't that what roleplaying has been all about in the previous releases? You dont even need to read your own lines in DA2 (nor can you). Just choose one option from *calm*, *joke* or *angry*. Talking yourself out from a bad spot isn't really an option if the game has already decided what is going to happen. So yes, I am blaming the dialogue wheel for the fact that romances have devolved into *press heart symbol to have h0t s3x* and other nonsense.

What happened to being able to choose your own race. What's the point of having racism towards elves if you cant even play one anymore and experience it?

Customizing the armor of your companions might not seem like a big deal to many people since we are forced to use the best armor sets anyway and sell all the junk. But it does look completely stupid to have some pirate woman in a prostitute uniform fighting against a dragon. This is something I expect to see from square and Final Fantasy, not Bioware.

This game does its job as a linear adventure hack'n'slasher but I didnt dish out 60 bucks for a mediocre Diablo. Just one year ago Bioware put square on blast by stating that "Final Fantasy XIII is not an RPG yadayada". And here we are now....I hope CD Projekt stays silent and walks the walk with Witcher 2, because the dev-team needs a reality check.

But other than it was pretty great.

Agreed with your points.

[rflandy]

Not going to read 7 pages but just going to answer OP's question. 

I also got "disenchanted" we'll say.. in Act 3.  I think the end of Act 2 almost felt like the endgame since you knew it was going to go down in Act 1 and 2..and then it just keeps going sorta.

Part of the problem for me too was I felt like I was on rails the whole game, which made me reinstall DAO and get as many visual effects mods as possible and have a blast

I'll finish DA2 eventually but if anything is just made me appreciate the genius that DAO was even more.

[Browncoat1984]

I do that with a lot of games actually, I get bored and go to something else then a few months later I'll go back. I think the only games in recent memory that I didn't do that with are Fallout 3 and Mass Effect 2.

[neppakyo]

I dislike DA2, and love ME1 and ME2

Just glad to see its not just me forcing myself to play through it DA2

[Aumata]

DrGulag wrote...

I already wrote this elsewhere but I have so many problems with this game.

How is it that in almost every single Bioware installment before Dragon Age 2 we had the ability to impact the world around us and the ending of the game would change depending on our choices? But now it doesn't matter who you support, not one bit. One tragedy after another isn't the core problem here but that you can't do anything about it.

What's the replay value people? What can I do differently? 

What happened to gameplay? What happened to stealing, creating potions, collecting resources and having a connection with the world around us?

Where is the possibility to lie, intimidate and charm during conversations? Isn't that what roleplaying has been all about in the previous releases? You dont even need to read your own lines in DA2 (nor can you). Just choose one option from *calm*, *joke* or *angry*. Talking yourself out from a bad spot isn't really an option if the game has already decided what is going to happen. So yes, I am blaming the dialogue wheel for the fact that romances have devolved into *press heart symbol to have h0t s3x* and other nonsense.

What happened to being able to choose your own race. What's the point of having racism towards elves if you cant even play one anymore and experience it?

Customizing the armor of your companions might not seem like a big deal to many people since we are forced to use the best armor sets anyway and sell all the junk. But it does look completely stupid to have some pirate woman in a prostitute uniform fighting against a dragon. This is something I expect to see from square and Final Fantasy, not Bioware.

This game does its job as a linear adventure hack'n'slasher but I didnt dish out 60 bucks for a mediocre Diablo. Just one year ago Bioware put square on blast by stating that "Final Fantasy XIII is not an RPG yadayada". And here we are now....I hope CD Projekt stays silent and walks the walk with Witcher 2, because the dev-team needs a reality check.

But other than it was pretty great.

Console player here.  Yeah I have to agree with you.  I like the story and the combat of DA2.  But there are so many problems, that the game was rush and wasn't made with their heart put  in.  I would gladly wait another year for the game to come out polish.  So many ideas with this game but nearly all fall flat.  To give a good comparison,  Nearly all of bioware games I have played has had me playing non-stop.  DA:O I pissed my brother off because I was playing his game to death.  But DA2 has me going on and off.  I'm in act 2 right now, but their is alot of fetch quest, in the same reuse enviroment.  I had it since the game came out and haven't beaten it yet.

[neppakyo]

Does anyone else miss the finish moves from DA:O? Like a stab through the gut, a spin to chop the head off? And ofcourse the slo mo ogre and dragon finishers.

[DariusKalera]

neppakyo wrote...

Does anyone else miss the finish moves from DA:O? Like a stab through the gut, a spin to chop the head off? And ofcourse the slo mo ogre and dragon finishers.

Yeppers. 

[Cody211282]

neppakyo wrote...

Does anyone else miss the finish moves from DA:O? Like a stab through the gut, a spin to chop the head off? And ofcourse the slo mo ogre and dragon finishers.

I do, but we had them replaced by the FO3 entire body explosions. Feels really cheap and out of place for most the attacks.

[Zhijn]

DariusKalera wrote...

neppakyo wrote...

Does anyone else miss the finish moves from DA:O? Like a stab through the gut, a spin to chop the head off? And ofcourse the slo mo ogre and dragon finishers.

Yeppers. 

Me aswell! Why they go remove that. =(

Was fun to pause just at the right moment when something awesome actually did happen!. Now they all just explode. oO

[neppakyo]

*sigh* body explosions.. as a rogue.. from bloody DAGGERS! Where's my cool looking longswords?

Haven't touched DA2 in two days, been going through DA:O again, combat's a little slow (and refreshing! Isometric camera, and easier view over the battlefield!), but I prefer the animations for it over DA2, and they *block* attacks! Nothing quite like hearing the *ting* of my dual wielder blocking an incoming longsword attack.

[mxw10000]

I'm kinda in the same boat as a lot of the folks that have posted here. I started a warrior first off, cause I thought that it looked more fun and visceral than in DA:O. I got through into act 2 a ways, and then just didn't want to continue anymore. So I started over with a mage. I think that playing as a mage is really the only way to experience this storyline with any type of attactment.
.

I play RPG's more for a decent story and intruiging characters than for gameplay sometimes. At the very least, story is most important to me in a game. It is an escape. I liked the story in the first game. Especially the human nobel and city elf origin stories. I like what they did there, and wove the origin stories into the rest of the game. I don't feel the same level of attactment here.

I do believe that they fixed the combat by quite a bit, Battles flow a lot better now, although they can sometimes flow too quickly for my abilities (but then that is what casual difficulty mode is for). I sit in the camp that says they fixed the UI and overall gameplay, but now at the expense of good story telling. They made the same mistake here that they did in ME1: Recycling eviroments. Did they forget all the crap they got for doing that in the first place? Why repeat that mistake? I was able to forgive it there because the universe and story they had crafted was so unique and compelling I didn't really mind. DA2 is not that way with it's story at all. The overall plot just seems too disjointed. I think I can see what they were trying to do, but it didn't work. A number of reviews I have read have said that the story kinda peaks at act 2, and then goes downhill from there. From my playthrough, I would have to agree. I just don't think that I will be playing this one again for a while. Any DLC will have to be extrodinarily great for me to purchase any of it. I'm talking Shadow Broker from ME2 level great. And that is one of their best to date in my mind. There are too many other games hitting in the next few months to do buy anything other.

This is all just my Opinion, so feel free to disagree, I just don't like the way they told the tale here.

[Asenkah]

Pre-ordered as well and picked up on release day. Still haven't finished it. Act1 one kept me pretty involved despite the mass of useless fetch and return quests, but once I hit Act2 I really have a hard time finding the motivation to fire it up for more than 30 min to an hour at a time. I've been in Act2 for over a week now and hope Act3 is short so I can wrap it up and move on to other titles in my backlog.

[Cody211282]

Asenkah wrote...

Pre-ordered as well and picked up on release day. Still haven't finished it. Act1 one kept me pretty involved despite the mass of useless fetch and return quests, but once I hit Act2 I really have a hard time finding the motivation to fire it up for more than 30 min to an hour at a time. I've been in Act2 for over a week now and hope Act3 is short so I can wrap it up and move on to other titles in my backlog.

Sadly Act 2 is the strongest in the game, act 3 is probably the worst and feels rushed.

[neppakyo]

Cody211282 wrote...

Asenkah wrote...

Pre-ordered as well and picked up on release day. Still haven't finished it. Act1 one kept me pretty involved despite the mass of useless fetch and return quests, but once I hit Act2 I really have a hard time finding the motivation to fire it up for more than 30 min to an hour at a time. I've been in Act2 for over a week now and hope Act3 is short so I can wrap it up and move on to other titles in my backlog.

Sadly Act 2 is the strongest in the game, act 3 is probably the worst and feels rushed.

I found Act 1 to be dreadfully boring. Act 3 had some excitment, maybe not much story..

[Asenkah]

neppakyo wrote...

Cody211282 wrote...

Asenkah wrote...

Pre-ordered as well and picked up on release day. Still haven't finished it. Act1 one kept me pretty involved despite the mass of useless fetch and return quests, but once I hit Act2 I really have a hard time finding the motivation to fire it up for more than 30 min to an hour at a time. I've been in Act2 for over a week now and hope Act3 is short so I can wrap it up and move on to other titles in my backlog.

Sadly Act 2 is the strongest in the game, act 3 is probably the worst and feels rushed.

I found Act 1 to be dreadfully boring. Act 3 had some excitment, maybe not much story..

I think Act1 kept me entertained for a while because it was all new. Getting to Kirkwall, learning what the city was about, family, pickicing up companions, etc. However they really don't evolve or change throughout Act1 or in Act2 so it just feels flat and one note.

As a side note, the waves of mobs per encounter really aren't helping matters either in making me want to play. Also there is no hope of seeing something new visually either which I think also has had an effect.

Modifié par Asenkah, 21 mars 2011 - 06:27 .

[Lycidas]

I did not even make it out of act 1 yet and I don't know if I ever will.

[neppakyo]

Asenkah wrote...

neppakyo wrote...

Cody211282 wrote...

Asenkah wrote...

Pre-ordered as well and picked up on release day. Still haven't finished it. Act1 one kept me pretty involved despite the mass of useless fetch and return quests, but once I hit Act2 I really have a hard time finding the motivation to fire it up for more than 30 min to an hour at a time. I've been in Act2 for over a week now and hope Act3 is short so I can wrap it up and move on to other titles in my backlog.

Sadly Act 2 is the strongest in the game, act 3 is probably the worst and feels rushed.

I found Act 1 to be dreadfully boring. Act 3 had some excitment, maybe not much story..

I think Act1 kept me entertained for a while because it was all new. Getting to Kirkwall, learning what the city was about, family, pickicing up companions, etc. However they really don't evolve or change throughout Act1 or in Act2 so it just feels flat and one note.

As a side note, the waves of mobs per encounter really aren't helping matters either in making me want to play. Also there is no hope of seeing something new visually either which I think also has had an effect.

The first time was fine, everything was new as you said.. but doing act 1, 3 or more times.. ugh, I rather repeat the mage origin 20 times in DA:O

Still say balance the combat from DA:O and DA2, keep the DA:O animations and finish moves.. don't make it as quick as DA2 and no waves upon waves of enemies..

[Painronamic]

Gentleman Moogle wrote...

 So yeah, I'm one of those folks who pre-ordered it. I'm a bioware fandude, not gonna lie. I've loved Bioware since BG1, and I've got all their games (Yes, even Jade Empire). For the most part, when I start a Bioware game, I play it straight through to the finish. 

DA2 though... I swear, I tried. I got through act 2, got half-way through act 3... And realized, about fourty hours in, that I just didn't care anymore. 

Don't get me wrong, I loved the characters, enjoyed the combat... But, there just wasn't any THERE there, y'know? There was no sense of over-arching plotline, no sense of accomplishment in anything, there wasn't even a proper villain. Even the choices I was supposed to make didn't really seem to make a whole lot of difference in anything. 

Even as I write this, I'm trying to think back over what my favorite plot point was... And I'm having trouble remembering what the plot points were. Okay, I take it back, there was one absolutely awesome scene at the end of act 2 where you have a verbal showdown with the Qunari leader. But, other than that... Everything's kinda forgettable and isolated 'cause there wasn't any main story to speak of. 

So yeah, halfway through act three, I just stopped playing. Haven't really had the desire to go pick it up again, either, because I just don't really care. Don't care about the plot, don't care about the characters... Am I the only one who's had this kinda reaction to the game? I'm kinda bummed about it, truth be told. I really really wanted to love this game. 

Got through Act 1 and simply stopped caring - I even uninstalled every single EA game on my EA download manager list.  I admire your tenacity in getting till half way through the third act.

[Kurzan]

I got through to the start of Act 3, and just quit playing for the rest of the week. The end of act 2 was so incredibly lacklustre, and I was so bored with running the same areas repeatedly that I just couldn't be bothered to keep going. I managed to clear the rest of the game yesterday, and the ending is good. The biggest issue is the framed narrative. It kills the story by chopping it all up.

[patcheeboy]

yeah i stopped after a day, really hoping i build up some enthusiasm about finishing it, bioware games are so awesome usually and DA:O is my favouritest game ever, why does this have to be so mega un-awesome?
urghh i hope i get excited about it at some stage
dissapointment....

[KLUME777]

Yes, ive been going slower and slower on this game as i simply can't be bothered to play. It is no where near as fun and engaging as DAO was.